If Your Pastor Urges You To Vote Against Obama, Ask Your Pastor Why He Ignores These Biblical Quotes

I wonder since when and how did atheism become tied to liberalism and christianity get tied to the right wing? On the one hand, I've read Ayn Rand who is a strong atheist who is also the virtual matron saint of capitalism. On the other hand, the Bible actually has verses that would be considered liberal, if not leftist:

"If a man shuts his ears to the cry of the poor, he too will cry out and not be answered."

-Proverbs 21:13

"Speak up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all who are destitute. Speak up and judge fairly; defend the rights of the poor and needy."

-Proverbs 31:8-9

"No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money."

-Matthew 6:24

He who mocks the poor shows contempt for their Maker; whoever gloats over disaster will not go unpunished."

-Proverbs 17:5

"He who oppresses the poor to increase his wealth and he who gives gifts to the rich--both come to poverty."

-Proverbs 22:16

"Jesus answered, 'If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.'"

-Matthew 19:21

"He who gives to the poor will lack nothing, but he who closes his eyes to them receives many curses."

-Proverbs 28:27

Sell your possessions and give to the poor. Provide purses for yourselves that will not wear out, a treasure in heaven that will not be exhausted, where no thief comes near and no moth destroys. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

- Luke 12:33,34

Indeed, liberation theology, which the Right Wing Christians consider leftist, is based on this quote from Jesus:

"The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he has anointed me to preach the good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim release to the captives and recovering of sight to the blind, To set at liberty those who are oppressed, to proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord." (Luke 4:18-19)

This is what I don't understand about Priests and Pastors who so readily ignore the income inequality created by the GOP's policies. Instead, they focus on abortion, which is not mentioned in the Bible while turning their back on the poor who are repeated mentioned in the bible.

church, there are tons of them.

and crack down on this. You wanna endorse from the pulpit? OK, then you're paying taxes. Period.

Abortion, infanticide and child abandonment were permitted under Roman law at the time of Jesus1. Surprisingly, abortion is never mentioned in the Bible, despite the fact that it has been practiced throughout recorded human history. However, a number of Bible passages may be relevant. These verses and others are often cited as evidence that a fetus is truly a living human being, and deserving the same protection:

At that time Mary got ready and hurried to a town in the hill country of Judea, where she entered Zechariah's home and greeted Elizabeth. When Elizabeth heard Mary's greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. In a loud voice she exclaimed: "Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the child you will bear! But why am I so favored, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? As soon as the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy. (NIV, Luke 1:39-44)

Now the word of the LORD came to me saying, "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I have appointed you a prophet to the nations." (NAS, Jeremiah 1:4-5)

I will say to God: ... "Your hands shaped me and made me. Will you now turn and destroy me? Remember that you molded me like clay. Will you now turn me to dust again? (NIV, Job 10:2, 8-9)

Several other verses are cited as evidence that a fetus is not a living being. Life is equated with breath throughout the Bible, and this passage seems to suggest that a person is not living until he or she takes a first breath after birth: "The LORD God formed the man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being." (NIV, Genesis 2:7)

This passage from Exodus seems to say that causing death to a fetus is not as serious a crime as causing death to a person: "And if men struggle with each other and strike a woman with child so that she has a miscarriage, yet there is no further injury, he shall surely be fined as the woman's husband may demand of him; and he shall pay as the judges decide. "But if there is any further injury, then you shall appoint as a penalty life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot," (NAS, Exodus 21:22-24)

and for the first time in my life, I started wondering about this. Where does the Catholic Church get this idea that human reproduction is the only issue, and that we have to give up everything else for the benefit of the unborn? Why can't the already born ever be considered? The Catholic church thinks so little of us born people!

and we should suffer, starve, be killed in wars, whatever, as the price for the Repukes maybe, perhaps, just maybe appointing right wing tools to the Supreme Court. And the Supreme court is already made up of a majority of Republican appointees. Yet they urge us a sacrifice everything for this mirage.

The Repukes are not going to miss out on their wedge issue by having Roe v. Wade overturned. If there were going to have done it, they could have by now.

And those same right wingers would twist the bill of rights around until it allowed gitmo and unlimited detention. so we have to give all that up, too. so that maybe in the distant future a few states will be allowed to criminalize abortion.

www.matthew25.org

Matthew 25 Ministry Hub

It's my friend's organization in Iowa, a community group based out of a Methodist Church that works with inner city kids and now also works in flood recovery.

And a good "weapon" in those kinds of situations.

I, however, would probably just flat out tell him/her that he/she has no more a right to tell me how to vote than I would him/her.

Nicely, of course, but that would be what I would do.

Exodus 21:22-24 (New International Version)

22 "If men who are fighting hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman's husband demands and the court allows. 23 life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot,"

The key point is that the bible draws a distinction between a miscarriage, which only required a fine, and a murder, which requires a "life for life." Thus, an unborn embryo or fetus are not "alive."

Ideally, a priest or pastor will not try to dictate how their congregation votes. However, if they do, give them hell.

give her a hug. That is what I did. :)

And I'm finding it extremely difficult to keep my opinions
to myself this election cycle.

I can preach around names, and focus on the issues,
but it is difficult not to name names.

My aunt, who is not my pastor, faces the same struggle with her position.

"terrorist!"

I used to assume that all members of Christian-umbrella churches were bleeding heart, keepers-of-their-brothers, liberal types like me. I really believed that. I really believed that Jesus called his followers to care for the sick and the poor and those less fortunate, and to show love and kindness.

I don't remember how old I was when I came smack up against intolerant and judgmental fundamentalists, but it was quite a shock.

referring to the fruits of the Holy Spirit.

... He was offering a New Covenant. It's like they're just ignoring what He said. Hypocrisy at the very outset.

Let's face it, the term Republican Christian is an oxymoron!

As a Christian it sickens me how hypocritical and disgusting republicans act in the name of God.

Makes perfect sense that those who would listen to their pastors are the same ones who want a "strong leader" who won't require them to think.

not having your money taken by the government to possibly eventually give to the poor.

Sometimes people need a little HELP with their Christianity. lol

I'm not Christian (actually, I'm a Luciferian Satanist) but I've read the Bible straight through in several editions and languages and even if you give the righties abortion and homosexuality (both arguable in context), there's big chunks of Biblical teaching that they ignore. For instance, as you noted, Jesus has quite a lot to say about the poor and the alleviation of poverty. In fact, some of his statements come across as proto-socialist (contrary to popular belief, socialism says nothing about religious belief).

Jesus endorsed church-state seperation ("Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's"), something the Religious Reich are commonly opposed to. Living in an occupied country under military rule, Jesus would have been well aware of the dangers of military adventurism but the right tend to be positively hungry for war.

It's my contention that teh right have created their own religion, which I call Christopublicanism. Unlike other religions which find themselves drawn into politics, Christopublicanism exists directly because of politics, it is a faith which exists to use religious feeling for political ends. In short, they don't want the kingdom of heaven, they want to inherit the earth. While it owes nominal allegiance to Jesus, Christopublicanism selectively edits the Bible (by emphasising or ignoring certain passages) to say what they want it to say. It's a mish-mash philosophy created by combining the nastier parts of the Bible with Ayn Rand, Rush Limbaugh and class resentment. While Jesus is still held to be the messiah, Ronald Reagan is just as exhalted. They have their high priests (Limbaugh, O'Lielly), their devil figure (Clinton , although Obama's getting there) and their chosen scapegoats. If you look closely, it bears some resemblance to the batshit version of Christianity which some of the Nazi party held.

In which it talks about the early Christian LITERALLY "spreading the wealth."

All the believers were one in heart and mind. No one claimed that any of his possessions was his own, but they shared everything they had. With great power the apostles continued to testify to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and much grace was upon them all. There were no needy persons among them. For from time to time those who owned lands or houses sold them, brought the money from the sales and put it at the apostles' feet, and it was distributed to anyone as he had need.

..... if we could get the Republicans to realize that, we'd be ok.

I apparently don't have enough posts to recommend a thread :P but if I did I'd be reccing this one!

It amazes me how people use the bible to defend the GOP, particularly when they are now spreading the redistribution of wealth theme. Nowhere in the bible does it endorse the idea that the rich should just be able to horde their income and wealth. Likewise, the bible also recognizes taxation. If anything, the bible goes way farther than what any Democrat proposes, which is why the church used to condemn campitalism.

"Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God." - Matthew 19:24

"Whatsoever you do to the least of my brothers, that you do unto me." - Mattew 25:40

... and one country BUT you have hundreds of churches to choose from. Tell him you want one with a minister intelligent (and patriotic) enough to understand the lasting value of separation of church and state. Then walk out as loudly as you can.

Me, I am blessed with a Higher Power (Mother Earth) whose church is the great outdoors and whose ministers are tree-frogs. They've never told me to vote for a Rethug yet.

That's pretty clear.

Because I'm sure that since he's decided to forgo his tax-exempt status, that he'll want to start working on those pesky tax returns.

Hey, republi-CONS - you who wrap yourselves around the Bible and the Cross all the time? Anybody home?

Another point that could be raised with your pastor and priest who is stumping for McCain is to ask about the church's prior opposition to a free market. Capitalism was considered immoral. Indeed, if you look at the biblical quotes in my OP, the bible sounds positively leftist. What changed? Since when did Christians begin worshipping Supply Side Jesus?