Missouri

Has Missouri actually been called yet?

It was very close, Obama 49.6% and McNut 49.8% or something like that, if I remember.

I believe there was a 6,000 vote margin, and the percentages are so close, I would imagine that it qualifies for a statewide recount in Missouri.

Yes? No?

On par with us getting Indiana and Virginia, was us getting North Carolina, an amazing thing.

Independent and his Green Party ran McKinney. With their votes, Obama would have won the state. Then again, maybe McCain could say the same about Barr and the Constitution Party. I did not check that.

I am all for abolishing the monopoly of the 2-party system, and make our elections more democratic.

Abolish the winner-take-all electoral college, and let the candidate that wins the most votes be the President.

Nader and the Greens take votes SOLELY off Democratic candidates....therefore they are to be DESPISED and spat at.

Stop defending the Nader and Green fuckheads, they are as much the enemies of the Democratic Party as the Republicans are.

Real democracy means proportional representation, expanding the House, and abolishing the Electoral College.

By taking 1-2% of the vote and throwing races to the party of the Dominionist Theocracy nutjobs.

I don't support proportional representation, neither does the MAJORITY support proportional representation and I don't support abolishing the Electoral College.

What you saw on Tuesday was REAL democracy in action.

:eyes:

I will NEVER support anyone who stands in the WAY of Democrats getting elected.

It's as simple as that.

Al From supported neocon adventurism abroad and totalitarian measures at home.

I support the Constitution!

Ya Commie! :P

Just because I'm a DLCer doesn't mean I support 100% of what the DLC supports, I was against going into Iraq from day one, and I believe that the majority of the troops should be withdrawn from Iraq by Summer 2009....I'm anti-Patriot Act.

So I'm nobody's rubberstamp, I'm an independent thinker.

You support the Constitution....whatever.

Fellow traveler! :-)

Viva Obama!

:)

And yes Viva Obama!

:toast:

See, as I've said for a long time, we agree on more things than some people would think.

:toast:

I wish some people would get that through their thick skulls.

The more you bitch about this the more you confirm what third party voters charge; The Democrats and Republicans alike think they are OWED votes just for existing.

Sorry that it bothers you when people have more than two choices. This is a Democracy first and formost. That's how it works.

if there was a viable Progressive party in this country.

The way it is, people are left with two choices Democratic or Republican.

I don't agree with everything the Democratic Party does, but I agree with more things than I disagree with, so I'm a Democrat.

If people who disagree with a majority of what the Republican Party does and stands for, their only option is to vote Democratic.

By voting for these minority so-called Progressive Third Parties, who never win one EC vote, nor never win one state, and only get between 1-2% of the vote, seems to me that they are the spoilers and they more often than not allow the Republicans to sneak in narrowly.

How Progressive is it to basically help the Republicans to win? Not very in my humble opinion, it's a classic case of cutting off one's nose to spite one's face.


On Edit: Dammit spelling error

and we are working to pull our party to the left. But if that fails, we have enough members to split away if we choose to do so.

A viable multi-party system is a sign of a healthy democracy. There is no reason for us to continue with only 2 parties. And watching the turmoil in the Republican party this week, I am wondering if there might be some splits on the right coming.

If you look at the new EC map, the Republicans are now a regionalized party, they could be on their way to being a permanent minority.

That's what your not getting. By advancing a set of issues and ideas, running a third party on them allows the people to build up a voting bloc. When an election is close that leaves the parties with a set of issues they can latch onto to tip the scales.

you don't seem to know what real democracy is and you're not making sense at all.

And I make perfect sense.

Merci.

Sorry. :)

I mean I can't be expected to please all of the people all of the time :P

I am only a mere human afterall :)

On Edit: Dammit typing error

And the electoral college needs to go too.

But the Repuke party has been so bad that I haven't even thought of voting third party for Pres and other major contests. The only third party candidate I remember voting for is Marakay Rogers for Atty. Gen. in PA. She's a Libertarian, but was Green before, and I didn't like the Democrat's plan for abolishing parole for violent criminals. It should be taken case by case to give rehabilitation a chance.

Right now, the Democratic Party is the only pathway to progressive ideals. The country won't change overnight.

Is that you, Joe Lieberman?

Probably Nader won't be around in 2012, he's an old man ALREADY.

I don't mind Bob Barr taking votes off McCain....I do mind so-called "Progressives" taking votes off the OFFICIAL Democratic Presidential candidate.

Thank goodness we didn't need Missouri though, Obama/Biden had already wiped the floor with McNut/McNuttier by the time Missouri's polls closed.

There are many areas in the southern part of the state where they voted for Nixon for governor (a white Democrat) and McCain (a white Republican).

And seriously, southern MO is very very racist.

Have HUGE black populations, it looks like the GOTV in those areas was completely on the ball, to the point that Missouri was VERY close.

The fact is Nader got 15,000 votes, thank goodness he was made irrelevant this time, thank goodness that MOST of the FORMER Naderites abandoned him after he fucked it up in 2000 for Vice-President Al Gore....only the hardcore delusional have stuck by Nader and the Green Party fools.

Claire McCaskill proved that in 2006. The cities won't carry an election in the state. Never have.

And I really disagree about Nader because I honestly believe it was the racist voters in the southern rural areas. I have spent way too much time in southern MO. How else can you explain the overwhelming votes for a Democratic governor yet the same areas voting for McCain?

I also don't think the Green Party members are fools. There are quite a few in our peace movement in MO and all the ones I know were totally in the tank for Obama this time. Several of the local Green leaders I know were very active on the Obama campaign. In fact, was the Green Party even on the ballot in MO? I haven't seen them listed in any of the results I have seen.

So I'm going to read up on Southern Missouri.

Was the Green Party on the ballot in Missouri? Nader got 15,000 votes, so he was running in MO.

I recall seeing the logos of the Dems, GOP, Libertarians, and the Constitution Party on the top of the ballot, but not the Greens.

I was in a rush when voting, so I had tunnel vision for the candidates I was planning to vote for, and that list didn't include any Greens.

Nader hasn't represented the Green Party in 8 years though, so it's not clear to me what they have to do with each other.

The Greens nominated Cynthia McKinney. I don't vote in MO so I am not sure about the ballot but I sure haven't seen her name listed in any of the vote counts.

About southern MO - when I read Deliverance and later when I saw the movie I was convinced it could have been filmed in southern MO. There are some great DUers there but boy do they have their work cut out for them. And here in KC, the racism is repulsive, especially in the suburban areas. It's a very divided community. We were talking at work this week and I was amazed by how many of my co-workers said things like "My husband/dad/mom/brother/sister would NEVER vote for a Black man!" And they made these statements in a real matter of fact tone, like they were talking about what they ate for breakfast. And they said it in front of Black people, like everyone knows and accepts the racism here. Made me want to :puke:

were Nader not on the ballot.

It was clear what the stakes were and how close it was in this state. People who voted Nader in Missouri are people that didn't want Obama as their president.

Who didn't want Barack Obama as President....those Nader voters are racist?

would have voted for Obama. Especially in a closely contested swing state.

But the Lt. Gov. race broke a little more towards the GOP than the presidential race did even though Sam Page was a white guy. Moreover, the State House and Senate went to the GOP and I'm guessing all of the Democratic candidates in southern MO were white.

So with the exception of votes for Jay Nixon and Robin Carnahan, most of these folks were voting for white Republicans even when the Democrat was white.

I'm not denying that SOMO is racist. I'm just saying that it's not clear that the results would be much different if Obama were a white guy.

I'm just saying that you can replace the name and face on that sign with Hillary, Edwards, Biden, etc. and it's going to appeal to the same demographic.

Nixon and Carnahan succeeded in flipping some folks in that demographic. Most other Democrats were unsuccessful.

daring to run for office!

how dare they!
burn them at the stake!





but seriously, you're silly.

electoral vote so now the total electoral votes are 365! They also think there's not enough provisional votes for Obama in Mo so they are calling it for McCain. Still:

This brings Obama's haul from Tuesday evening to 365 electoral votes, a similar total to the 370 that Bill Clinton won en route to his first term in 1992. Obama's victory, however, might have more symbolic power than Clinton's because of the success that he has had in flipping formerly ruby-red territories like Indiana, North Carolina and Omaha, Nebraska over to the blue team. Not coincidentally, these are some of the states in which Obama was furthest ahead of McCain in terms of organization and ground game, along with the Mountain West where he won states like Nevada and New Mexico by surprisingly large margins.

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/

Recount in Missouri, but that's probably unlikely as we don't need that states EC votes now.

365 = landslide :)

Gosh that's great about getting an EC vote from Nebraska, I'm still trying to get used to us winning Indiana, Virginia and North Carolina!

The Obama/Biden campaign must go down as one of the best run Presidential campaigns in history, a flawless campaign.

and that's how they will run our government too. Phew, I keep pinching myself and yes I say to self, he, we, America all did a good job!

The best run Presidential campaign in history running against probably the worst run Presidential campaign in history.

Jaysus, dunno what the McNut and McNuttier campaign were smoking, but that was some pretty crazy stuff that they had going down.

but it looks to be a McCain win.

If it's called for him, it's not like we needed that state anyhow.

President Obama came very close to getting Missouri, so there is hope that we can get that state next time, also Missouri elected Jay Nixon Governor, so all isn't bad.

Unlike states such as Oklahoma, that state has TOTALLY lost its way....we even won a few counties in places such as Idaho and Utah....WTF Oklahoma?

Missouri will join us next time for sure.

then this thing about Missouri being a "bellweather" should be jettisoned (as the claim is that MO supposedly called every President since 1904 except Eisenhower or something like that). IMHO, these special "statuses" of states need to go away.

Why don't they just get all the votes and do a recount.

If McCain wins, so be it, but at .2% or something just seems way too close to not re-validate this information.

I'm getting tired of typing and retyping

There's 17,000 uncounted provisional ballots from urban KC and St. Louis

Plus there are around 7000 absentee ballots to be counted. The McCain margin is currently 5,868 votes, razor thin. Even if two thirds of the provisionals are thrown out(which is the average spoilage rate in past elections) there are still the numbers there to eek out an Obama win in this state. Given that we have Robin Carnahan as SoS, she will count every vote possible, have no fear on that score. However we probably won't know for another couple of weeks.

That said, what I really want to know is what the fuck happened in Clay, Jackson and St. Charles counties? These suburban KC and St. Louis counties were supposedly wired for sound by the Obama campaign, yet each one went for McCain. I was particularly wondering about Jackson and Clay, who took a real long time to report last Tuesday night, and where McCain's finally tally didn't reach fifty percent. I think that something strange went on there :shrug:

But we'll see, just give it a couple of weeks.