'Scuse Me: While We're All Bickering About Rick Warren, Daschle Is Drafting Health Care Legislation

:( I guess we can't talk about two things on the board anymore.

but the warren issue has been discussed ad nauseum.

I'm sorry some people think the Warren business is a-okay - but I suspect they enjoy flamefests more than discussion of issues.

:kick::kick::kick::kick::kick::kick::kick::kick::kick:

I appreciate you posting this. I think this is an issue that has a great impact on most of us although many may not realize it.

It's dangerous to leave it to the Republicans.

Just sayin.

Detroit is struggling right now with the burden/heavy cost of employer paid health care plans.

Toyota recently decided to locate a plant in Canada rather than in the U.S. because Canada has univeral health coverage.

As more Americans lose their jobs they are forced to pay for unaffordable COBRA health plans.
I believe I also recently read that 25% of the working class who get a cancer diagnosis now do not seek treatment because they do not have any or adequate health care coverage.

Wake up America! We need single-payer universal health coverage now.

:shrug:

that every small misstep get, right here at DU?

He has done nothing for Homeless Veterans. So I hate his fucking ass.



:sarcasm:

I though Obama covered in the Democratic primary why he WOULD NOT initially be pushing for single payer.

What did you hear in the interim that makes you believe he has flipped from single payer?

Single payer health care. Pay for it with the money currently wasted on a ridiculous "defense" budget, and by closing tax loopholes for the rich.

Problem solved.

See how easy that is. :)

Afraid we'll have to move this post to the Lounge where the adults can discuss it.

Of PSH's very wise line in "Charlie Wilson's War," that went along the lines of, "give the press a sex scandal in your left hand and you can park an aircraft carrier under your right and no one will say a word." Very similar to what I said about Lewinski: she wasn't the scandal, she was the distraction.

MSM will give us many distractions where Obama is concerned. As many little ones as they can come up with, while policy gets crafted with no one being the wiser.

I particularly liked PSH's character, and the scene with the bugged bottle of booze. What a lovely distraction we have today eh?

that may fix 25% of what's wrong with our current system. Better than nothing, but it looks like we're going to have to blunder along with what we've got for some more time before we finally wake up and switch to something that actually works.

the line being pushed from the change.gov site.

It is critical to get single payer fee for service into the record, and to also insist that when they toss single payer that they keep the community pool "public plan like Medicare' in the final bill.

Some good things included in the poorer overall concept is community rating. This is huge. It means everyone pays exactly the same amount for the same coverage regardless of any other factors like age, current heath status, geographic location. It will mean that private companies can't cherry pick.

Other good points are minimum uniform coverages mandated by the feds. This way everyone is covered for all the preventative stuff.


All in all there are some very good things in the outline if you are willing to overlook the far elevated costs that are inherent to a patchwork system of over-lapping coverage, under utilized facilities, multiple smaller risk pools and taxpayer subsidized private insurance company profits. I far prefer single payer, but if we must go broke instead of just do the right thing, lets make sure we go broke on a system that at least has some good points in it as well.

I'm referring to the "public option" proposal mentioned above.

I know Obama has said that we are at a stage where public health care can't just be dropped on the country, it has to be introduced gradually.

So, if there were an option on your tax form where you could check "Health Care" and pay for it, and then you'd have it, and millions of people signed up for this, I could see it working, because there would be a large enough pool. And eventually, more and more people would come over to it until the private insurance went away. Am I being too optimistic?

a public option. Both are subsidized on a sliding scale all the way down to free.

In other words, I could choose to pay for private insurance, or choose to pay (via taxes) to join the public plan. If everyone who needed to could do that, could it work?

Some people who choose it wouldn't have to pay for it, because they don't make enough to owe taxes. They could file their tax forms and check the box.

Eventually, more and more people would join it as they see how it works, and abandon their private plans, and the private insurers would go away.

I know it's not really as simple as checking a box, but I'd like to believe we could have something soon for everyone to have health care (though I would of course prefer to simply have single payer and be done with it).

been fleshed out yet.

http://finance.senate.gov/healthreform2009/finalwhitepaper.pdf

here's a link to the Baucus Harkin outline which is consistent in principle with the change.gov outline

http://www.healthcare-now.org/2008/11/ask-kennedy-to-make-it-single-payer/



We adults need "scripted discussions" on this? Seriously? Translates to: Limited results and narrowing expectations.:eyes:

what's passed.

Baucus has already taken the ideological route and declared single payer plan non-grata. we need to demand a fair and open hearing.

We could also use a far more complete single payer bill than 676. It would be good to have two or three competing single payer bills in the hopper to discuss, because single payer can be done a whole number of different ways as I'm sure you know.

We are constantly conceding ground and giving up on urgently needed policies. We want to be able to make a difference across the board. Open hearings should begin happening immediately in 2009. We've always been told we have to accept that it won't pass. It is not formulated or functioning and they purposely leave it in that condition. They pay it no mind- as in they're ignoring it.

The gradual change method is not what we are looking for, as time is of the essence for those who live without health care due to cost alone. It makes for furthering the bad economics beneath it by keeping these re-reformed plans tied through Employers, via some other dude who hides behind the Executive curtain raking workers over the coals and bankrupting families left and right.

People and providers should have the right to participate in Universal Health Care. Those of us who want to participate, should have policies enacted by the soon to be non-capitulating congress to be able to do so. Health Insurance Plans passed-no problem.

Grease up those brains big fella's. Cut ties. Get to work and do something amazing for your citizens.
If Baucus is entitled to having access to Socialized Health Care, we should demand we have it too.

We want to be offered that option right away. Our Elected Officials get this treatment. Why can't we common people?
This is a crisis domestically. It requires aggressive measures to make it work. Congress is perpetually challenged by that oddly enough. Imagine that. They said the same exact things a decade ago.

out single payer bill

We also need to make absiolutely sure that:

Community Rating
a decent basic floor of benefits
and the Public Option

remains in the patchwork multi-payer bill that Baucus will introduce.


Now lets be honest. The Baucus bill (what ever it ends up being) is going to have all the big wigs lined up for it. It's also going to be horrendously expensive and do very little to make health care affordable for the country as a whole, since it will incorporate lots of redundancy, lots of over capacity, and as we saw with the Baucus backed Medicare drug benefit, every provider and every supplier will attempt to jack up prices since it's paid for by the treasury.

In fact, it could very well pass and then fail because it becomes quickly unaffordable. So they will cut benefits and the country will be left with shitty over-priced insurance that doesn't cover what people need.

And then the drum beat will start up that government sponsored health insurance doesn't work. It's so predictable.

So we need to predict it loud and long at these meetings, at hearings at every chance we get.

Some of the assumptions that Baucus uses are pretty flawed. For instance Baucus points to research data that claims Americans with private insurance like their private insurance. Of course the data doesn't include how many Americans even jknow what their insurance covers. My guess is not that many do know. Who sits down and reads that stuff? How many Americans with serious (and costly) illnesses or conditions still like their insurance after they have need to access it? Doesn't say. My guess is that number is way lower than the numbers Baucus is pointing to.

...on Media Consolidation.




"Pragmatic Centrism"!!!....because it's so EASY!
You don't have TO STAND for ANYTHING!