I have been lurking for over a year and damn, where did this anger towards our own guy come from? We can focus all this energy towards getting OUR agenda through. Let's stand together against those that willingly choose to obstruct, be obtuse, and just regularly start shit. We cannot go down the the rabbit hole and commit ourselves to do nothingness. Let us band together as we did on November 4th, 2008 and start those emails and phone calls that got our guy in there. What do you say folks?

Sorry for the date screw up.

:shrug:

Yea, it's pretty depressing around here. Even when I come to the board feeling good about something, that gets sucked away pretty quick.

Seriously, I don't need all sunshine and unicorns, but it would be nice to have a place to go where some goofy thing like BIden's daughter's activities or a damn teleprompter story take up 2/3 of the threads on any given day, wouldn't it?

To be fair, today 4 of the 5 were anti-Obama. The other was anti-Cheney.

One of the explanations.

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

They're in deep.

I can see disagreeing with the president on various issues, but namecalling? Is it really going to be that ugly around here?

The primaries were brutal. It felt much, much worse than the '04 primaries.

they'd be close to getting the Utopia they think should be here already after a few months of Obama as President.

The time and energy wasted is that being spent on attacking critics and leftists.

you don't own the left. And you and your pals throw out a plenty of insults and attacks. In other words, your shit does stink.

But that comment sort of makes the guys case for him.

Commenting on the issues and pointing out the policies that seem to come straight out of the DLC is not an insult and it is ony an attack if you disagree with the DLC. Please stop wrining your hands it makes you look entirely disingenuous.

Guess you told me.

He's only been in office 70 days and already we in the middle class have been sold out.

First meme: from before 2006 - we need a majority in Congress or we cannot change the nation's affairs.

Election of 2006 and we got that majority and then it was:
It's no good that we have a majority in Congress, so we have to gain the Presidency.

Now we have the Presidency and it's

1) Give him more time (Well, time is all we have to give Mr Obama - the money he's given to Wall Street will prevent the middle class from ever recovering from the economic collapse)

2) Let's help Mr Obama have the information he needs. Apparently, unless the middle class spends all their time writing to the guy and explaining to him how Paulson, Bernanke, Kashkari Geithner et al are connected to Goldman Sachs, he ain't gonna realize it.

Oh please please please. ENOUGH!!

This is notchange - this is economic sabotage.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Please. Keep it civil.

It seems most of GDP is dedicated to whining that people won't just shut up and take whatever happens.

and from what I see now, would likely have still supported Hillary over him, though Hillary and Obama are both good Democrats. But here are some points to consider:

- Maybe Obama's economic team has some establishment people because they know how we got in and can get us out? This requires Obama showing lots of control

- Maybe training Afghan forces will allow us to leave sooner? Maybe he WILL focus on Al Qaeda, unlike Bush?

- The "small" things he have done are maybe the things he could do soonest?

- Obama might work with the auto industry and won't let them fail

- Obama knows that change won't happen overnight

Of course, there are some things he has done wrong - coming out for moving on on the Bush crimes, ruling out single payer, budgeting more bailout money for banks already, not reducing combat forces in Afghanistan, his stance on DADT, questionable education policies..

I would say that your answer is as good as mine. I am not an economist and am only specualting.

But now that the interview with Galbraith says exactly what I have been saying, and TYT has been saying, and most people with common sense have been saying, I can not hold out the belief that Obama's appointees will be helping the middle class.

As has been demonstrated on several topics here on DU, what the latest Toxic Asset Buyout Plan will do is transfer wealth from the middle and lower classes to the inner circle of bankers. SO if youhappen to be one of those people, it is a great plan. If not, it really sucks, as it willnot only impeded your ability to survive, but that of your kids and their kids. Also, note how Goldman Sachs seems to be on the receiving end again and again. (Sort of a natural evolvement, since Paulson, Kashkari, Bernanke etc are all Goldman Sachs people.)

Anyway here is TYT interview

http://tinyurl.com/dxowh8

There are lots more changes than that needed. I just want to give President Obama a chance since the only way there will be a primary challenger is if Obama does horribly (and that's not what I want,) or some loon like Palin or Jindal could get in.

Posted withURL as last part of my ramble above.

The Toxic Asset Plan is not going to do anything more than give more chickens to the foxes guarding the hen house. Honest. IT is poorly designed, has little regulation of financial instruments that should actually be abolished, etc.

For every 700 Billion bucks we send out to the Masters of the Universe, we need to come up with $ 524 per person in order to keep our households as well off as they were in the beginning of 2007. So already, the average American Household of four needs some $ 12,000 to come in over the next fifteen months, in addition to whatever the income was previously. (Since the economic proposals under Bush and Obama now total about 4.1 Trillion.)

And that is just to offset the inflation from these bad proposals. Then what happens when we actually have to pay the piper and come up with the money to pay back what is being printed up and what will end up being a tax on us the middle class?

Now if you are not of the middle class, and $ 12K is just what you spend on your caviar every year, then keep wishing and hoping.

I can do that.

all that's passed is the stimulus, the 09 budget was finalized and things like equal pay for women was passed.

they can't have sold you out in just 68 days and not based on what they've done. i don't happen to think they've done it and i know for a fact that he's been in office such a short period of time that there hasn't even been time to do anything like what you've said he's done.

The Bailout program under Bush, which both Obama and McCain voted for, and then the new BailOut bills and Stim package total a whopping 4.1 trillion?

In order to keep a household at the same level of economic worth that that household had in 2007, that household will have to increase its income by $ 524 per every 700 billion per person. SO a household of four in the USA will have to increase its worth by about 12K over the next fifteen months, just to stay even, once the inflation hits over the summer.

Watch the Galbraith interview. It will give you a clue how evil or clueless Obama's people are in their various policies and proposals.

http://tinyurl.com/dxowh8

i won't click it until you tell me where it takes me.

here

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=8304816&mesg_id=8305009

Posted here and on YouTube

of his budget.

Until then, toodles.

I am not a major investor, but the retirement account I share with about 100,000 other Oregonians just took a 58% hit in this mess. People around here seem to assume that only rich Wall Street fat cats are invested.

If Obama/Geitner's plan helps stabilize the markets and I receive a tax cut, then maybe some of those losses will recur.

and frankly, I think Obama expects this of us.

We need to speak out loudly for what we want so that he can honestly say to the corporatists in DC that if he doesn't act in our behalf, there will be a mob with pitchforks and torches inside the beltway.

Maybe?


Not...


:hi:

not a fan club. This is suppose to be a serious discussion forum where we discuss/debate the pros/cons of democratic issues. Also, the strengths/weaknesses of our leaders. At least that's what it was in the past. We are all still on the same team, what we are not is sheeple...................

If people want to hear only good things, they should start a fan club!

so they can claim Obama was elected to enact THEIR agenda.

They are the ones starting endless threads about how he's only been in office XX days and how we're not supposed to be question anything he does until he's been in office (fill in the blank) number of days.

Funny how the fact that he's made his intentions crystal clear on a number of fronts - such as defending Bush's torture secrecy policies in court - and his determination to throw all our money at rich bankers while bowing down to the insurance lobby and continuing to discriminate against gays in the military - don't seem to matter to people who would be screaming if BUSH was still in office.

As for the DLCers, what is the difference between the DLC and Obama???

I am speculating that part of the great divide right now on DU is this one: What does it mean to be a Democrat?

Yes, there are people in our government who have a ""D" after their name, but that tells us little.

What matters (To some of us) is this - are their policies progressive and considerate of the quickly shrinking middle class, (Like Wellstone's policies were) or have they sold out to the "New Democratic Party"?

This new Democratic Party so Centrist and "RW" that Nixon would find it hard to consider these people Democrats, or even Republicans. (Don't forget, under Tricky Dick, we had a fairly decent EPA, a fairly decent FDA, etc. The agencies corruption really took place once Reagan took office, when you had a revolving door between Monsanto and the FDA, shutting out the legitimate voices of scientists.)

Obama seems to be being advised that he should model his reign after the Clinton's. But there is a huge difference between his time in office and Bill's -- we now have the internet. If Bill Clinton had had the internet while he was in office, it is possible that the NAFTA loving, tax-on-the-rich-reducing policies he promoted would have earned him a great deal more disapproval than he took, simply because the vast majority of Americans were not able to figure out things the way the internet lets them do nowadays.

Other "Democrats" only care about whether someone has a "D": after their name. So we are obliged, according to these people, to support Di Feinstein, Lieberman, and Geithner, Summers and Rubin, even if these people are just as happy to hand over "The Commons" to the rich as some of the nastier Repugs are.

for anger at him personally.

Most people on DU agree with some of his choices and disagree on others.

Usually these people have felt the same way on the particular issue since long before Obama was even a senator.

Like Gay marriage or and end to all wars.

You cannot expect people to just sit down and shut about things they are passionate about just because a Dem is in the White House.

so they can stir up shit to divide us.

I wasn't originally for Obama, but realized it was important for him to win the election as the Democratic nominee.

He has done some good things, and others seem not so great in my opinion. I keep telling myself he's only been in office for a short time, and he has a real mess on his hands. Do I think he's going to make some mistakes? Yes. Will he try to fix what he can when he realizes his mistake? Yes, I believe he will.

I know that we don't know all there is to know, and perhaps there are facts unknown to us influencing his decisions at this point. I'm willing to give him some time, but he does need to come clean on the double standard with how the government is treating the banks vs. the auto companies. That makes no sense to me at all.

I know that no one person will ever be all things to all people, that's just not possible. I hope as more facts become known, Obama's actions will make more sense.

Obama is one of the most likeable people to ever inhabit the world.

I live with one of the biggest O fans ever. His love for Obama has made me avoid events like the final televised days leading up to the election,because I didn't want to fall under Obama's spell. But when I gave in and went out to the TV room, if Obama was talking, i found myself mesmerized.

However, now that he is in office, and his policies are the exact opposite of what I hoped, I am charged up.

But it is not about hating someone, it is about wanting to have the man I voted for do the right thing. Which included economic policies that will sustain the middle class, not further endanger it. And agricultural policies that will sustain an individual's rights to grow their own seeds, and not find that those seeds are from Monsanto.

I do keep hoping Obama wakes up and starts acting as someone aware of the cahnges that are needed. And someone unafraid to oppose the banking class.

Obama is one of the most likeable people to ever inhabit the world.

I live with one of the biggest O fans ever. His love for Obama has made me avoid events like the final televised days leading up to the election,because I didn't want to fall under Obama's spell. But when I gave in and went out to the TV room, if Obama was talking, i found myself mesmerized.

However, now that he is in office, and his policies are the exact opposite of what I hoped, I am charged up.

But it is not about hating someone, it is about wanting to have the man I voted for do the right thing. Which included economic policies that will sustain the middle class, not further endanger it. And agricultural policies that will sustain an individual's rights to grow their own seeds, and not find that those seeds are from Monsanto.

I do keep hoping Obama wakes up and starts acting as someone aware of the changes that are needed. And someone unafraid to oppose the banking class.

Thank you.

being put forth by the haters. Nobody is telling anybody not to be critical, but spewing the same hate-filled bile that we have been using to describe AWOL for the past 8 years does nothing for intelligent discourse around here.

It's. Not. Fucking. Funny. Any. More.

I could really give a flying fuck what PUMAs like Krugman and Evan Baye think-and when I scroll down the thread list I see half of them about these people-so I just go

I can't change what this board does. If most of the posts here are anti-Obama then maybe this isn't the board for me.

people still talking about who would have been better and all that bullshit.

have been better, but that's irrelevant. The only alternative, ultimately, was McCain. Random subjective favorites used for a beat down on Obama makes no sense - or as you put it more succinctly - bullpuckey. : ).

I check in see the same old negative crap and then I leave. I found some internet games that I'm occupying myself with instead of wasting it here with downers.

So I guess the bored and bitter needed someplace else to go...and apparently this is it.

That's not to say that all people disagreeing with Obama's policies are necessarily *others*, but many of the most hysterical ones probably are.

but at the same time, we cannot show weakness to the other side. Look at us. What are we doing? Willful self-destruction?

Most of them proudly voted for McCain.

As for the other posters who disagree with Obama, they tend to do so in a manner that is not embarrassing for the party.

just as much auto-fellatio among the navel gazers, too.

but I am still damned glad it is Obama in the White House rather than McCain.

Don't you know it's more important to exercise one's first amendment right to free speech than it is to support Democrats on a self-proclaimed Democratic site?

Get with the program!


:sarcasm:

President as he continues a corrupt bailout - throwing taxpayer money to the banksters.

:sarcasm:

Look in the mirror!

I see your post I know since the primaries it's guaranteed to say something ugly about Obama.

You ain't fooln' anyone.

look. The freepers are starting their own BS revolution. We can do the same but in a way that makes the govt. hear us. It's our guy in there now and we can try and get something done that has a significant effect. Not trying to be flamebait for the anti-Obamas, just trying to get us to stop arguing amongst ourselves and do what good citizens do. Effect change.

:rofl:

Please.

sorry for any confusion.

feel the need to agree with me. In the end, we are all in this crap together. Either we do something about it, or sit behind our keyboards like freepers and take shots at each other.

are "invaders"? Funny way you have of saying we're all "in it together." BTW, a lot of those "invaders" have been here longer than you, and me.

Fucking no child left behind bullshit.

"Have we been invaded" implies that there's something in criticism of Obama that makes you think the critics are outsiders coming in and that "real" DUers don't do that. Did you black out and forget typing that?

just trying to open a conversation. If you took it personally, that's on you. Do not try to parse words and make them say what you want them to say.

backing away from what you said or you're a completely incompetent writer. Words mean things. "Invaded" implies "invaders" and if you don't mean what you write don't act shocked when someone thinks you do. Good day.

We're all one team. Except the people who are invading here, harshing your mellow.

A great deal of what Obama has done since taking office, I disagree with in a big way. A lot of the stuff he has deferred doing (e.g. restoring Habeas Corpus) gives me great pause.

DU being invaded. Yeah, we were invaded during the primaries.

saying that people are anti-Obama, or invader's, that's BS! That's totally non-productive. Great mind's do not all think alike, unless, of course, you are a fan club!

that we elected Obama and not mccane. And by a long time DUer with over 60,000 posts.

Regime change.

Chocolate donuts

I foresee a new wave of flame-outs in the coming future and that information would be useful to the mods in their decision to cut such a long-standing member loose.

We annually get the wish we had Kucinich, Nader, or anyone else who doesn't really have to weigh and deliver. Here we are with real choices, finally, health care, I repeat health care, and we have the faint of heart in the Senate and no unity in the grassroots.

http://www.tnr.com/politics/story.html?id=07bd4a20-60a7-44a9-ab92-115eeb62bd92

It's pretty much dead-on to everything you just said.

Thanks for the link!

I also liked it very much.

Thanks.

Otherwise, anyone have recommendations for an actual forum where folks are supportive of the Obama budget and are not trying to argue that Obama is no different from Bush?

President Obama has decided to retain the criminals who got us in the mess, to turn back the clock and fix it.
If obama fails to get the republic party to cooperate, we lose.

However, let's channel that anger constructively.

*Bring our troops home from the Middle East and end the illegal occupation of Iraq and Afghanistan.

*Cut "Defense" spending by 50%

*Remove the age restrictions to MediCare (HR 676)

*Protect SS by removing the cap

*FREE Universal Quality Education through Graduate School for anyone who wants it

*Break up Corporations that are "too big to fail" into manageable pieces

*Level the playing field so that Mom & Pop (small locally owned business) can compete with Big Boxes

*Equal Rights and Equal Protection for everyone...NO exceptions (This means full legal privileges for Gays...and everyone else.)

*Prosecution of the Bush War Criminals

*Re-regulate or Nationalize Banking, Lending, Investment, Transportation, Energy, Communications

* Trade Policies that favor LABOR in America (Yes, some things are worth "protecting")

*Reinstituting and strengthening the Social Programs that protect the the vulnerable.

I don't care which political personality occupies the White House.
I was FOR all of the above BEFORE Obama.
I will be FOR all of the above AFTER Obama.

When our politicians move TOWARD the above, I will praise them.
When they move AWAY from the above, I will OPPOSE them.

Case closed.

I agree. Let's speak out in one unified voice rather than bashing the one guy that can possibly get something done. After 8 years of BS, ENOUGH!

In particular, pay attention to:

"When our politicians move TOWARD the above, I will praise them.
When they move AWAY from the above, I will OPPOSE them."

If we don't criticize Democrats in high office when they aren't doing what they should, we are acting like Republicans. Country before party, not the reverse.

:thumbsup:

I actually like Obama and think he, for the most part, has our best interests at heart. However, I won't deny that I'm very disappointed in much of his foreign and economic policies so far. I will give him some leeway for about a year but after that, I will seriously start pushing him for the true progressive policies that you outlined above.

:yourock: I am bookmarking this thread just for your post. Thank you.

So many responses!

You rock! :yourock:

I was not seeking responses. Just an open conversation with my fellow DU'ers. Forgive my naivete.

Fuck, conversations require responses. I am a total dumbass.

At least you got your post count up!

All I know is there people here who think like I do. Most of the time anyway.

:shrug:

To quote a former Dem president.

Unfortunately, some minds keep working and questioning. Nothing wrong with that.

As we should keep questioning, and pestering. Persistence goes a long way.

We were born to fight one another. The only thing that could bring us together would be if we HAD BEEN invaded.

to criticize... it's a right. But we're infinitely better off than we were for the last 8 years... so the criticism is made with a note of "constructive criticism"

:rofl:

Yes, the evil liberals are here for your precious bodily fluids!!!!11!

for Obama, that every little thing he says and does is heavily scrutinized. I don't ever recall this level of scrutiny for any other president. And part of me thinks some of it is about race. Yes, I said it! Black people having to work against impossible odds that they themselves were not responsible for. The man hasn't been in office 80 days yet, and people are already blaming him and dismissing him as George W. Bush!! HUH??!? What??!?!? But, it has always been like this. During the primaries, the guy got ridiculed for everything he said and did. Meanwhile, the lie that he was treated with "kid gloves" continues to be propagated. Again, part of me is beginning to believe that some of this is about Obama's race, the so-called "Black Tax," and some of it is anger that he's the president. Not that there isn't criticism that isn't warranted, but it becomes a bit tiring and maddening when *everything* this man says and does falls under a microscope.

Hell, we've been begging the mods to add "Obama" to the spelling dictionary and it still hasn't occurred. :(

I think the primaries were revealing in that regard, as has Obama's nascent presidency. Some, whether in the blogosphere or in televised media, have been pushed by the actual fact of Obama in THE driver's seat to the point of saying or writing things that have surprised people who didn't realize they had it in them.

The problem is that no one wants to admit to doing this, or admit to secretly hoping Obama fails because he defeated their preferred candidate, or because he just makes them uneasy, or they resent his general public popularity, or because, because, because.

I'd bet good money that due to the sheer size of this community, the spectrum of attitudes, motivations and predispositions is represented here, including some individuals who harbor personal racist, homophobic, or misogynistic attitudes behind closed doors.

But because everyone must follow the DU rules to some extent to participate here, they'll do what's necessary to fly under the radar.

to answer for Kwame Kilpatrick!!! Completely race-based.

When Bill Clinton said something, we didn't have a way to know much about it. If he said "NAFTA is a good idea," well, then you went along with it, probably. Of course, the internet helped us unite against Bush, but he wasn't about to listen.

Now a citizen can google whatever issue comes up and find out a lot about it. So when Obama uses "Clean coal" as a campaign notion, and that comes on TV, we can find out when he said it, and why he said it. And we can, if we feel coal is not clean, dare to oppose him on it.

with him on. (I supported Kucinich, too, by the way.) My problem is not with people criticizing the president, per say. It's the nitpicking. It's the pettiness. And it's about *everything* he says and does. One day he's doing too much; the next, he's being a bum because he completed NCAA tournament brackets. One day, he's smart and too professorial; the next day, he relies too much on a teleprompter. One day he's too reserved and not jovial enough; the next, he's laughing at the economic crisis.

And as for his plan, I think it's far from perfect, but sadly he is discovering that he has to work within a context of compromise because we have these Blue Dogs and DLCers who are deliberately trying to obstruct everything he is trying to do. I was shocked and very dismayed and disappointed seeing Senators Casey, McCaskill, Mark Udall and Amy Klobachar among the obstructors. I knew that Senator Casey was a Blue Dog, but I had met him in Harrisburg during the primaries and he was such an enthusiastic supporter of Obama; it was like he was mesmerized by him. And now, it seems that he has joined forces with Evan Bayh.

Anyway, that's enough for now...

And his absolute failure of a way to handle it.

I admire him for the radiance he projects, and I could care less if he spends his time picking out puppies for his kid at a breeders, (NOW I will get flamed) or figuring out his next fantasy baseball team. (That is a relaxing and to be encouraged endeavor.)

But continually shovelling trillions into the unaudited likes of AIG is so scary to me that I have no words for it.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

I wonder if Skinner knows.

Anything that flames Obama is sure to gather recs around here.

Only in December there was post that gathered 300 recommendations that accused the gays here of being whiners. I guess we all see what we see though.

Yuck.

There were several at the time. The holidays were rather harsh around here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x7995229#7997942

It certainly was grossly insensitive, but it was probably more in response to the cumulative affect of all the truly petty whining that does go on there (the Rick Warren stuff was 100% legit, to be clear)

Context is everything. Peace.

board blip.

wow - how simple-minded can one person be?

accused gay people of being "whiners" would get 300 recs??

Here is the thread in question - http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=8036794

Is there a single point in this OP where the OP calls gays "whiners?" No. He complains about the din of constant negativity and name-calling that was on this board during the Rick Warren foolishness last year. And it got damn near 350 recs because THAT many people agreed with it.

But I do think the fact that certain folks on this board CONSTANTLY refer to this OP may be getting to the heart of what's really behind all of this Obama-can-do-no-right bullshit.

Same thing occurs when a DUer dares to criticize Krugman or Che or Hugo. It's OK to rip Obama & Co. a new ass hole, but don't dare touch one of their sacred cows. It stinks to high-heaven.

what a lot of us are feeling. I see posters who had nothing but hate for Obama since the primaries who never have anything supportive to say about our Dem Prez but know when to come out of the woodwork and jump through the attack machine like drooling jackals at feeding time in the zoo.

when he's criticized from either side, many people rush to his defense.

People love him. They post pictures of him and his family and gush over him. This is not a bad thing, imo. I participate in the gushing.

And when people do criticize him, they don't bash him. What's bashing? Read any typical thread about Nancy Pelosi or Harry Reid.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x8302987


FUCK OBAMA? Nice..

Equality should be priority #1 for Obama. He hasn't shown one bit that he gives a shit about equality for All Americans.

It really makes a difference.

yes that's bashing you linked to, but it's very out of the ordinary and people really came down on that poster.

That's the first time I've read fuck Obama. Now, take Nancy Pelosi, the thread about her where someone doesn't say "Fuck Pelosi" is the rarity.

I usually find that rule of thirds is pretty good. One third are sincere, one third PUMA's ( PUMA site closed shop recently) and one third Freepers DU has been "freeped" before. The most recent conservative tactic is to play populist-you have to listen to them with a third ear . The other night Arrianna Huffington was on a panel as a liberal (also critical of Geitner) when she said to Connie Mack R -- that she has a hard time taking conservatives who have suddenly started to sound like Upton Sinclair seriously

Does disagreeing with Obama on any given issue automatically make one one of "them" in your book?

Isn't that what you're saying?

I didn't realize we all had to agree exactly with Obama on every issue in order to be a Democrat...

We don't need anyone to chew us up and spit us out, or find nothing but fault...we do a fine job of it ourselves....I swear to god, most days here have gotten so bad, I think twice about coming here...what gets me, is that a lot of the posts are made by names that I have never seen before...and here they have a 1,000 or more posts...gives me an uneasy feeling...makes me wonder if freeper village is here now, instead of where it used to be...sure seems like it..It's ok to dissent...but lately...wow...I kinda figger we otter give the guy a chance, and remember he is much smarter than lots of us are...he doesn't approach problems like you or I would...he has his own unique way...give him at least a year...damn...Remember, Obama was left this mess...he didn't create it....wb

I've hardly been here at all. It's too depressing to even bother with, I don't need such negativism. :-(

Obama still has a chance to show that they don't own him.

every SINGLE OP I've read that insinuates other posters have "invaded" or that DU is being "attacked by trolls" is posted by someone who's been here for a very short amount of time.

Lurking for a whole year huh? Joined up 5 whole months ago? 100something posts?

Pot meet friggin kettle :eyes:

I agree with them, though, that there has been an invasion recently, but the invaders are not progressives who have been on this board since the beginning and who still believe in what were the bedrock principles of our party until a few weeks ago.

:)

The buck stops on Obama's desk, ultimately, because for so long we let the economy run without any goddamned guidance--and there must be someone to blame. The president is the only person with anything remotely resembling the necessary oomph to fix things.

But don't let the general outrage get you down. I believe that Obama has known for a long time that a huge crisis was brewing, and he would have figured out well before the election that he was going to face the harshest criticism of a president in recent memory. And he's up to that part of the job, I think.