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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 07:01 AM
Original message
Frank Rich: La Cage aux Democrats
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/24/opinion/24rich.html

La Cage aux Democrats

By FRANK RICH
Published: May 23, 2009


THE most potent word in our new president’s lexicon — change — has been heard much less since his inspiring campaign gave way to the hard realities of governing. But on Tuesday night, the irresistible Obama brand made an unexpected and pointed cameo appearance on America’s most popular television show, “American Idol.” In the talent competition’s climactic faceoff, the song picked for one of the two finalists, Adam Lambert, was Sam Cooke’s soul classic, “A Change Is Gonna Come.”

Cooke recorded it in January 1964. Some four months earlier he had been arrested when trying to check into a whites-only motel in Shreveport, La. “It’s been a long, long time coming,” goes the lyric. “But I know a change is gonna come, oh yes it will.” Cooke, who was killed later that same year in a shooting at another motel, in Los Angeles, didn’t live to see his song turn into a civil rights anthem. He could not have imagined how many changes were gonna come, including the election of an African-American president who ran on change some 44 years later.

snip//

“This is a civil rights moment,” Wolfson said, “and Obama has not yet risen to it.” Worse, Obama’s opposition to same-sex marriage is now giving cover to every hard-core opponent of gay rights, from the Miss USA contestant Carrie Prejean to the former Washington mayor Marion Barry, each of whom can claim with nominal justification to share the president’s views.

In reality, they don’t. Obama has long been, as he says, a fierce advocate for gay equality. The Windy City Times has reported that he initially endorsed legalizing same-sex marriage when running for the Illinois State Senate in 1996. The most common rationale for his current passivity is that his plate is too full. But the president has so far shown an impressive inclination both to multitask and to argue passionately for bedrock American principles when he wants to. Relegating fundamental constitutional rights to the bottom of the pile until some to-be-determined future seems like a shell game.

As Wolfson reminds us in his book “Why Marriage Matters,” Dr. King addressed such dawdling in 1963. “For years now I have heard the word ‘Wait,’ ” King wrote. “It rings in the ear of every Negro with piercing familiarity. This ‘Wait’ has almost always meant ‘Never.’ ”

The gay civil rights movement has fewer obstacles in its path than did Dr. King’s Herculean mission to overthrow the singular legacy of slavery. That makes it all the more shameful that it has fewer courageous allies in Washington than King did. If “American Idol” can sing out for change on Fox in prime time, it ill becomes Obama, of all presidents, to remain mute in the White House.
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Fovea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 07:26 AM
Response to Original message
1. Real change is hard.
And strains the status quo.
That is what it has to do.
But you don't have to quote Langston Hughes to know what happens when a group
of people are reflexively repressed for too long, with a expectation of the oppressors that oppression is the natural and right way.
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cwydro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 08:30 AM
Response to Original message
2. Good column.
I read that and came to DU immediately to see if someone had posted it.

Thanks.
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 08:32 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Yes, it is good, and I so hope the prez reads it. nt
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 08:52 AM
Response to Original message
4. The President has been in office for 4 months
He can't fix the damage done over the last 30 years in such a short time. He may just have other problems that take priority like say the financial crisis, two wars, global climate change, our broken education system, Healthcare just to name a few. People should stop harping on all the things he's not doing and be more patient before passing judgement. If he had been in office 4 years then it would be justified to critize. Remember JFK didn't come out in full support for the civil right movement until June of 1963.
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lunatica Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. In other words, as Frank Rich quotes, "wait"
Everything else is so much more important than civil rights.

Like it would take so much time and trouble to make civil rights equal for everybody, right?

:sarcasm:
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 09:24 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. As the saying goes "Rome wasn't built in a day"
Edited on Sun May-24-09 09:26 AM by JamesA1102
The problem is that too many on the left want the President to change everything in a day like impatient little children. They also forget that the President needs the support of Congress on these issues since he is not a dictator and right now there is not the political will in Congress to do so.
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cwydro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 09:58 AM
Response to Reply #4
10. He could end the military policy
with a signature.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. No he can't
DADT is Federal law. It has to be repealed by Congress.
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Baby Snooks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. Yes he can....
And I'm tired of people saying he can't. He could change a lot of things with a pen. And an executive order.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. You are misinformed
DADT is Federal law. It would take an act of Congress to repeal it.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #17
26. No, the poster is right: he could stop DADT with a signature
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Only his signature on a bill that had been passed by Congress
DADT is Federal law. It would take an act of Congress to repeal it.

Damn I thought liberals were better informed than conservative but it would appear not.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 08:24 AM
Response to Reply #28
46. No, he could stop it now -- this is a FAC T
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 08:37 AM
Response to Reply #46
54. No he can't
And just repeating that over and over again is not going to make it true.
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #4
13. This is the 21st century, and Western Europe is way ahead of us on LGBT rights
Heck, even Cuba and Israel are way ahead of us on LGBT rights.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. That's not the point.
The point is that President Obama has only been in office for 4 months. He can't wave a magic wand any change everything overnight.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. Not wand. A pen. nt
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. Only after an act of Congress nt
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #21
27. Hiding.
As you have to know having read this a hundred times here on DU, he can effect enforcement changes now. Then he can push for the law to change.

But of course, all those uppity gay people should just wait until......
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #29
32. Just an excuse.
Read up on your constitution. Three branches. The one he controls is the executive, the one that enforces the laws. It is within his power to enforce with diligence or with discretion. History is rife with examples. Read it. Learn it.

Look, I know he's a great guy. I know that many got into politics just to follow him. But I also know politics when I see it. He is just deciding not to waste political capital on this issue.

Doesn't sound like it's high on your priority list either. So just sit there calling people liars and telling people to wait. It tells us much.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #32
35. He's not a dictator
Like it or not DADT is a Federal law, he just can't violate it at will. That would be grounds for impeachment. Read your constitution.

And there are a lot of people lying about this for political purposes. President Obama has been in office for 4 months yet some people expect him to change everything overnight. And sorry there are far more pressing priorities at the moment including the economy, Healthcare reform, Climate change, etc. If he were to expend his political capitol now on DADT is would not only fail but it would derail the rest of his agenda like it did Clinton's in 1993.

All I'm saying is give the guy a chance. Give him time to fix the economy and Healthcare; then he'll have more than enough political capitol to push through the repeal of DADT and DOMA easily.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. You are uninformed.
Read your constitution.

You keep calling people liars when you disagree with them. (I see you did it again below.) So weak. So telling of the fact that you are ignorant of how government works and seek to hide that fact with a lot of bluster.

The point is you are wrong about the thing you are calling people a liar over.

You give your real reasons in the last two paragraphs. You would rather everyone just let him keep on doing what he's doing because of who he is. Well, he is the president. My president. I want him to act on this issue. (Straight Guy here. Three grand-kids and a loving wife who also voted for Obama and wants him to make good on this.) I'm going to have my say. You can call everyone a liar and bleat about things you don't know about, but in this country we get to do that. Telling the president what we want is exactly what he has asked us to do. He's not some helpless little thing who needs someone screaming to "Leave him alone". He asked for the job. We gave it to him.

Your solution is to wait. Just wait. Read the OP and see what that means. And if you knew anything about politics you would know that a president's political capital diminishes the longer he is in office, not the other way around.

So go back into your cheerleader stance and you wait. Wait until 2010 when we will need that kind of help again.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. No I'm not
DADT is Federal law. That is a fact. The President cannot overturn it by Executive fiat. That is also a fact. And anyone who says different is either misinformed or a liar whether I point it out or not.

And I never said as you put it that I "would rather everyone just let him keep on doing what he's doing because of who he is". That's just putting words in my mouth and proves your intellectual dishonesty.

But you are right my solution is to wait because the President needs to build up more political capitol by attending to more pressing problems that affect far more Americans. I'm sorry of you don't like my approach but in the end it will have a greater chance of success.

BTW I know a little bit about politics since I have worked on both local and national campaigns for over 25 years. And what you say about Presidents and their political capitol wasn't true of FDR or JFK or even Clinton who left office with the highest approval rating of a two term President in history despite having been impeached.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 07:30 AM
Response to Reply #39
44. A babe in the woods.
If you truly have the experience you mention, you know this moment. You speak of a simple world, one that lacks complications or subtleties. You keep hiding behind the law that is DADT the same way the homophobes in the military do. There are laws that are never enforced. If you have any political or legislative or historical awareness you know this.

Taking you at your word that you are politically aware, we are left with the only reason for your wanting delay on this. That would be that these issues don't matter to you. I would hope that you lack the prejudice of the legislatives and talk show hosts who also think this matter should be ignored. I would hope that is is just a matter of lack of sympathy or lack of concern rather than animus that makes the plight and suffering of so many trivial to you.

So. Now we can see that our exchanges are not about laws or politics. Plainly, we disagree about the whether gays and lesbians deserve equal treatment. To me, it is a tenet as vital as was the civil rights issues of the sixties that I marched and demonstrated for. Back then, there were people in the Democratic party that told Dr. King to wait. Told the demonstrators that they were getting in the way of important things. Those "Democrats" weren't having their rights denied, so they wanted only issues that touched them to be dealt with. They thought that things were good enough for "those" people and that "those" people ought to just keep quiet and stop being so uppity.

Glad to see where you stand.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 08:35 AM
Response to Reply #44
51. Oh Please!!!
Save the self-rightous indignation for someone else. And stop putting words in my mouth. That only proves you to be a liar.

You're the one that's being naive. If the President tried to push through the repeal of DADT or DOMA through Congress right now they would fail and he would expend most of his political capitol that he needs to pass Heatlhcare reform, Climate change legislation, etc. Which is exactly what happened in 1993 to Bill Clinton. I beleive in learning from history so as to avoid making the same mistakes. You are obviously too blinded by your ideology to see that.

All I'm saying is that let the President fix the econmy and get stuff like Healtcare through first. Then he'll have the political capitol to easily have both DADT and DOMA repealed by Congress. It's a better political strategy whether you care to admit so or not.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 10:31 PM
Response to Reply #51
63. Indignant all right.
Save your homophobia for your next tea party. Your penchant for calling people liar is going to get you bounced. Easy to do from a keyboard in your mom's basement. Coward.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 11:42 PM
Response to Reply #63
66. Oh and calling me a homophob and a coward
is apparently OK? Strange set of standards you have.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 06:43 AM
Response to Reply #66
70. Whiner.
And a bad speller too.

Look, dude. You want to call names when you are faced with trying to defend a defenseless position then be prepared to take a little flak. At least I have standards. Don't whine when you get back what you dish out.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 08:35 AM
Response to Reply #70
72. Yeah but you definitely lose the moral high ground.
As well as denying reality.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #72
77. So you've fallen back on "oh yeah" as an argument?
Where is the moral high ground in denying people their rights? Where is the moral high ground in saying that if I disagree with you I am a liar.

We've been having a little fun here sharing your posts. Half vote you as a neophyte who sees politics as American Idol and jumped on the band wagon. The rest write you off as just somewhere between insensitive to other's plight and out and out homophobe.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 10:55 AM
Response to Reply #77
80. Oh Yeah is a good arguement
Edited on Tue May-26-09 10:57 AM by JamesA1102
Especially when dealing with someone who resorts to namecalling and bully tactics when confronted with facts and logic and those who don't march in 100% ideological lockstep with them.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #80
84. Now you're just talking to the mirror.
How pathetic. The gang here just voted. To be mean, I won't tell you how you fared. (Psst. It wasn't good.)
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #84
85. Give the gang my love.
Guess I don't get a vote. So much for democracy! LOL!
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #85
91. You wouldn't want their love.
Many are gay, and we know how you feel about "them".
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #91
94. "All you need is love" nt
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 09:14 PM
Response to Reply #29
33. He can suspend the firings with one signature. You are woefully underinformed.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #33
36. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 12:17 AM
Response to Reply #36
41. Here. Read and pipe down. You're embarrassing yourself.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 12:19 AM
Response to Reply #41
42. ******* crickets *******
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 06:19 AM
Response to Reply #41
43. Here you read this:
Specifically the beginning of the last paragraph which states: "Obama can't unilaterally undo "Don't Ask, Don't Tell." Congress has to repeal said the policy."

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/promise/293/call-for-repeal-of-dont-ask-dont-tell-policy/
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #43
45. Yep,
You are using the words of the military homophobes to excuse action. He admits to not even seeking to change the law or trying to mitigate its effects. He agrees with the law and supports it. Clinton was forced into just this kind of stance by the same old guard military thinking. It is shameful that he bowed to them. We hope that Obama feels forced to this position. Better were he to have the courage and political will to do what he can for those afflicted now. Bigotry and prejudice are not limited to issues of skin color.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #45
56. No I am citing facts
And the fact is DADT is Federal law and the President just can't repeal it at will. It is also a fact that he's only been in office for 4 months and is dealing with more problems and bigger problems than President in history. If he were in office for 4 years, you'd have a case. But after only 4 months it is ridiculous to trash him.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 10:29 PM
Response to Reply #56
62. Deliberately obtuse.
Reread all of the posts you have called a liar. Check them and maybe have a friend read them for you. No where do they say that he can repeal DADT. Maybe your friends can explain to you that everyone is telling you how this works. You claim many years in politics, but espouse a view that is limited in experience. How is any problem we have now bigger and more important than the Civil War or the decision to drop the atom bomb or the crash of '29. You talk like a teenager under the influence of the latest fad.

That wave of disagreement crashing over you is the culmination of hordes who really do know what they are talking about.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #62
64. Check out his profile--it tells the story. n/t
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #64
68. And what story would that be? nt
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #62
67. Maybe obtuse but not blinded by ideology.
DADT is Federal law. President Obama can't unilaterally repeal it or suspend it. That is a simple fact whether you accept it or not. And the names you call me or condescending remarks you make or all the words you try to put in my mouth is not going to change that.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 06:16 AM
Response to Reply #67
69. Are you just being silly?
How many times will you say the same thing only to be corrected. Then say it again. Only to be corrected. You are just wrong. Truly, abjectly, blindly, ideologically wrong.

The point isn't repealing the law. But you know that. At least I hope that your obstinate use of a weak defense is because you wish to avoid admitting error. I would hope that your repetition isn't a true representation of your mental capabilities.

So one wonders if such a position reflects deep-seated homophobia or just a rampant, directionless pom-pom personality.


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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 08:38 AM
Response to Reply #69
73. No it is just accepting reality and the facts...
in an objective way and not surrendering the truth to cheap name calling and attacks from a bully who likes to shout others down.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 10:43 AM
Response to Reply #73
76. I was talking about you making up facts
and creating alternative realities.

Again. You call everyone who has a different opinion a liar, then whine when you get called on it.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #76
79. Now that's the pot...
calling the kettle black!!! LOL!!
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #79
83. Whoa. Don't blind us with your deep insight. nt
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 11:18 AM
Response to Reply #83
86. Yeah it's better to be blinded by ideology NT
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #86
92. As opposed to
blowing in the wind of whim, following any line given by your idol.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #92
97. Don't watch Idol
That Simon guy is almost as obnoxious as you.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 10:04 PM
Response to Reply #97
101. How would you know if you don't watch it?
Such a simple mind to trip yourself up in two short lines.

I'm sorry for the subtlety. My reference was to your slavish behavior. You dote on the president without listening to what he has asked you to do. You seek to defend a man who doesn't need it. He will come around. I doubt you will.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #101
102. Because I don't live in a bubble.
I read magazines and the internet, listen to the radio, talk to people even those who don't walk in 100% ideological lockstep with me. It's called keeping an open mind. You should try it sometime.


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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 11:33 PM
Response to Reply #102
105. Missed the message again.
Edited on Tue May-26-09 11:37 PM by Jakes Progress
And I still notice that you haven't been over to tell the couple in the other thread how they should just wait some more, that they should be glad Obama is president and stop worrying about their rights. Easier to just hide out here and dumping your removed-from-the-world platitudes. That thread is about the real world. Giving a shit about other people is what decent people do.

It's called being human. You should try it some time.

Oh, and since you are way too cool for television (missed he whole inauguration did you?) you missed something that would really perk you up on tonight. Lt. Choi was fully drummed out of the service. I guess he can just wait too. He and the men in his unit that wanted him to stay in. He and the soldiers who will die because the Army (and you) would rather lose a gifted interpreter than actually have to do something. Easier to give in. After all, we've got millionaire bankers to save. Your priorities are really evident.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 02:59 AM
Response to Reply #105
107. So did you.
That's what happens when you're so blinded by your ideology that you rather thump your chest in self-rightous indignation, shouting down whomever doesn't agree with you in 100% lockstep and refuse to let go of an arguement you lost two days ago.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 12:00 PM
Response to Reply #107
108. Everybody here is tired
You're not funny any more, just tiresome. Some feel sorry for you and said to leave you alone before you bust a blood vessel in your head or spend all your time thinking of things to say and miss finishing your third period history paper.

So here's my present. You get to go last. Think it all out and have a good go just as if anyone was going to read it. Take your time and try to be witty or profound. It will make you feel good. Make sure to mention more about how having ideals is bad and boast self-righteously about how your not like common people. Also put in how much you love the president and don't want anyone bothering him or Brittney (was that you?) so what if their are wars or people dying or being mistreated. At least you got to prove to Obama that you really, really love him. And don't worry. If the world ever starts denying the rights of self-important kids with computers, some of us will be there to protest your mistreatment.

So long and thanks for all the laughs. I hope you intended some of that to be funny.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #86
93. Try going over here
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #93
95. That is very sad
And I happen to disagree with the courts ruling today.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #95
98. Sure you do.
Shouldn't they just wait. That's what you've been saying here. Go over there and try the crap about how they have to wait for their rights because there are things that matter more to you right now. Tell them they should just shut up and wait.

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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #98
99. No I don't
Never said I was against gay marrige or the repeal of DOMA or DADT for that matter. As most who have experience in politics I'm able to seperate my personal feelings on an issue from my assesment of the political stategy and facts of the matter.

Neophytes tend to get all emotionally involved and blinded by their ideology that they demonize anyone who doesn't agree them 100% in lock step. The same sort of demagoguery and dishonest tactics that Rush and Hannity resort to.
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 10:00 PM
Response to Reply #99
100. Yes.
Why get all ideological over other people's problems. Rush and Hannity are sure to share your opinion that gays and lesbians should shut up and wait.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 10:39 PM
Response to Reply #100
103. Who said it was other peoples problems? nt
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #103
104. You know. The ones you don't care about
trying to fix right now.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-27-09 02:55 AM
Response to Reply #104
106. Yes only you care about others,
Unless they don't agree with you 100% in lockstep, then you demonize and try to bully them. How progressive of you.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 07:41 AM
Response to Reply #67
71. Blind, worshipful, boot-licking sycophancy is an ideology. n/t
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 08:39 AM
Response to Reply #71
74. Yeah I know he's pretty sad. NT
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #74
75. How very clever.
I guess when you have nothing but a pom pom for an argument, playing with other people's post lines seems bright.

Still can't explain why you continue to pretend that you don't get it. F for thinking. A for perseverance.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #75
78. No just have the facts on my side
And as they say the truth will set you free!
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #78
81. Self Delete
Edited on Tue May-26-09 11:06 AM by Jakes Progress
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 11:18 AM
Response to Reply #81
87. Wisest post you've made yet!!! nt
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #78
82. Uh. No you don't.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #82
88. Yes I do. And it is driving you crazy. LOL nt
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #88
89. I ain't goin to crazy cuz
all that's there are dense bricks like you.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #89
96. Weak comeback nt
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 08:30 AM
Response to Reply #43
48. No, he can SUSPEND IT NOW
Sidestep and dance all you want -- you are being willfully ignorant, and to what purpose? To deny Americans civil rights.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 08:36 AM
Response to Reply #48
52. No he can't
I am not the one being willfully ignorant, you are.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 08:25 AM
Response to Reply #36
47. It is against DU rules to call someone a liar
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 08:37 AM
Response to Reply #47
53. And willfully ignorant is allowed? nt
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #53
57. People closely involved with this issue say you're dead wrong
that he can issue an EO to immediately halt the dismissals (in other words, it is within his power as CIC to suspend any investigations).

This would effectively neuter DADT.

Then, down the road, in six months or a year, he can start pushing Congress to repeal the actual statute.

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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 09:30 AM
Response to Reply #57
58. That is one group's legal opinion
Edited on Mon May-25-09 09:31 AM by JamesA1102
That doesn't mean that it would stand up in court. And please don't say that there wouldn't be major court challenges from the right if he were to do that.

And people closely involved are maybe too close and blinded by their ideology.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #58
59. But you, of course, alone of all of humanity, see pure, objective truth, untainted by ideology.
Uh huh.
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #59
60. Not of all humanity
but just some of the posters on this thread.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #4
19. JFK had people - Eleanor Roosevelt, Ralph Bunch, TMarhsall and MLK leaning on him. nt
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. And it still took him 2 & half years to support
civil rights legislation not 4 months.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. We have to lean on the president. nt
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #23
30. Lean on, lobby, compel; yes
Demonize, distort and trash; no. Unfortunately more of the latter goes on here.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #30
49. No one is "demonizing, distorting, or trashing" -- ridiculous strawmen
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JamesA1102 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 08:39 AM
Response to Reply #49
55. Could have fooled me.
When someone is saying that President Obama can unilaterally repeal DADT that is distorting.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
5. I knew Frank Rich was a traitor
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lunatica Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 09:03 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. Traitor to what?
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 02:12 PM
Response to Reply #5
16. He is an enemy of the people. n/t
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Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 09:47 AM
Response to Original message
9. Error: You've already recommended that thread.
Thank you.
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #9
40. Thank you, too.
:hug:
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cwydro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 10:21 AM
Response to Original message
11. K and R.
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snowdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 03:16 PM
Response to Original message
20. "Fierce advocates" do not push DADT down the road.


"In reality, they don’t. Obama has long been, as he says, a fierce advocate for gay equality. "
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Hieronymus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
24. Oh my, Frank Rich will be added to the list, along with Rachel Maddow,
as those unworthy to comment.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Yes, it will soon be Frank Rich's turn under the Hopemobile.
Everybody gets one sooner or later.
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 08:39 PM
Response to Reply #25
31. Not the RICH Wall Street Bankers and members of the Corporate MIC.
They have front row seats.
They will NEVER see the underside of the Hopemobile.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #31
34. I stand corrected. n/t
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-24-09 11:48 PM
Response to Original message
38. Mr. Frank you are so impatient my dear!
Rome wasn't built in a day
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 08:32 AM
Response to Reply #38
50. I'm REALLY sick of the "impatient" meme
I've been hearing it for DECADES.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #50
61. My friend got a new job in January. Everyone wants him to go, like, all out already
He's only five months into the job, and he has a full plate. Why can't people back off?
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Chovexani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-25-09 11:40 PM
Response to Reply #61
65. If I waited 5 months to get my students' financial aid started
I would have been fired.

Just sayin'
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-26-09 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #50
90. sometimes you just have to sit it out until it happens
we are dealing with politicians here
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