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masuki bance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:23 AM
Original message
``Obama didn't release us. Why?''
Stuck at Guantánamo, Uighurs demand freedom
A federal judge has ordered the release of 17 Uighurs, Chinese Muslims, from the Guantánamo detention camp. But they're still there, and on Monday they staged a protest for visiting journalists.

GUANTANAMO BAY NAVY BASE, Cuba -- A group of Muslims from China awaiting a court-ordered release staged a self-styled protest inside their prison camp Monday, waving signs demanding their freedom written in crayon on their Pentagon-issued art supplies.

''We are the Uighurs,'' said one sign. ``We are being oppressed in prison though we had been announced innocent.''

Another: ``We need to freedom.''


The U.S. government has for months been seeking a nation to offer asylum to some 17 Uighurs with Chinese citizenship who fear persecution and perhaps torture if they are returned to their communist-controlled homeland.

Attorney General Eric Holder has said he was willing to resettle some in the United States. But some members of Congress have rebelled, casting them as terrorists and creating a deadlock on the future of the men whom a federal judge ordered released from these remote prison camps in October 2008.

Instead, the military moved the men to a small razor-wire ringed compound called Camp Iguana, away from the 220 foreign captives here still held as enemy combatants. As detainees approved for release, they have been receiving increasingly greater liberties -- such as weekly telephone calls, takeout fried chicken and pizza and a wooden hut set aside to serve as a mosque.

...

At one point Monday, one of the Uighur men called out: ``Obama didn't release us. Why?''

Last week, the group approached a visiting TV crew and asked to deliver an oral statement. Guards waved them off, saying that U.S. military censors would destroy any such images.

The U.S. military says it seizes and destroys photos of detainees, even those in which the captives pose for news photographers, under an interpretation of the Geneva Conventions that shields prisoners of war from public humiliation.
...

For example, the military has ordered 20 laptop computers to let the men set up a virtual computer lab and acquire some DVD-driven high technology skills in anticipation of their release.

...

Their lawyers have argued for years that they admire American democracy and deserve to be resettled on U.S. soil. A Lutheran group in the Washington, D.C. area has offered to help, and religious leaders in Tallahassee, have also offered to sponsor three.

''We were an oppressed nation in China,'' said one sign. ``Now we are being oppressed in America for a second time.''

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/nation/story/1077014.html


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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:27 AM
Response to Original message
1. Why? Because nobody wants to take them in.
Edited on Wed Jun-03-09 09:27 AM by redqueen
If Australia won't take them in then I guess they'll be welcomed here.


Oh, and they've been cleared for release for five years.
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NYC_SKP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. didn't you know?
it's our duty as good progressives to try to humiliate and belittle the president at every opportunity?

facts have nothing to do with it.

:eyes:
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:38 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. I suppose it's some folks duty to act shallowly- and mimic the last eight years
Some are actually able to carry out that role quite admirably.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:43 AM
Response to Reply #4
11. Sometimes I just laugh it off...
but this week, with that stupid Scahill piece now making the rounds... when it's so VERY transparent.... Christ.

*sigh*
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peace13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:34 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. There have been offers from communities in the US to take these prisoners.
Empty prisons, jobless Americans and we still can't work this out. The uppity American politicians are too good to take the prisoners that they themselves created. Go figure.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. Prisons? WTF? They're cleared.
I don't know if you're confusing these guys with the prisoners at Gitmo who aren't cleared for release, and should be moved into one of those empty prisons... but these guys are in the clear.

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peace13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #9
20. Yep, confused..thanks. n/t
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Political Heretic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #1
8. That's actually not true. But don't let a good excuse get in the way of the facts.
Not only, as a poster also pointed out below, have several communities in the United States formally offered to take these prisoners in (it was on "one or two" - i.e. all - new stations in case you missed it) but if the United States was serious about wanting to release them in accordance with the courts, it would have no problem pressuring one of several countries into accepting them, or releasing them into the United States.

It's time to stop making excuses for a government hiding behind this bullshit line. It's not about Obama, stuff like this has been going on long before he got there. I wish people at DU would stop feeling like its now their sacred duty to defend anything the government does because Obama is in the Oval office. Not everything that happens has something to do with him, and lots of what happens in our fucked up government is still downright bad.

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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. Apparently we have been trying to get Australia to accept them.
There's already a community there, and reportedly they're just making sure there won't be any chance that China could demand extradition before accepting.

As for offers in American communities to accept them... apparently that offer isn't formal... or it wouldn't still be an issue.
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Jennicut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:48 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. Congress is freaking out here. Hopefully Australia will take them in.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #8
14. Also, please let me know which communities have offered to take the Uighurs...
Edited on Wed Jun-03-09 09:51 AM by redqueen
I'd like to communicate my support for that option to Congress and the WH.

Thanks.
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NYC_SKP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:29 AM
Response to Original message
2. Well, Bush/Cheney also let them conduct protests, and gave them laptops...
:crazy:

So, really, this Obama character is not different at all.

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Uzybone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:30 AM
Response to Original message
3. I feel sorry for them
hopefully we can clear them and all the other detainees ASAP.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #3
22. Yeah, it looks like it's going to take some time though as it already has.
I'm telling you that Bush really left us in a pickle.
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dipsydoodle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
5. Obama didn't release us. Why?
No further comment.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #5
17. Did you read the article?! Hello...it's blatantly clear what the problem is and it's not O. n/t
Edited on Wed Jun-03-09 10:07 AM by vaberella
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Chulanowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #5
30. BECAUSE HE'S NOT SARAH PALIN OMG!!!
She'd know what to do, right, dipsydoodle? Fuck yeah, yoo betcha.
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dipsydoodle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. On what basis do you agree
Edited on Wed Jun-03-09 01:52 PM by dipsydoodle
with the continued incarceration of those who have committed no crime ?

Your answer, if any , needs to to address all such circumstances.
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Chulanowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #31
33. You can have your frame back
These men are still in US custody becuase there is nowhere else to put them. If returned to China, it's a guarantee they will be imprisoned and likely tortured then executed. Any nation that accepts them has to be sure that China will not demand their extradition, and even then, a nation granting amnesty to Uighur separatists faces political and economic blowback from China.

So now these seventeen men are sitting at our little Cuban toehold, because for the moment it is the only place where they are actually safe at the moment.
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Jennicut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 09:46 AM
Response to Original message
12. They want to stay here and not go back to China, the govt. does not want them here
They are stuck until a country takes them in or we decide to take them in. Congress in acting like a bunch of babies. I think Holder needs to do the right thing and let them in here.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #12
19. I don't think Holder has that power alone. Be it the right thing or not...
What we're seeing is a massive shift in how O does things. If Bush was in power he'd ramrod through everyone to get his way. O wants to stay within the confines of the law and follow the laws of the land and the diffusion of power. Doing that is the right thing, however it also fucks him up because we have some seriously untrustworthy people who care more about their "base" than the nation and what's best. Muslim is the enemy for them and at that point anything right goes out the window.
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Fovea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:03 AM
Response to Original message
15. To me, this is so like the period
of western expansion where America was put in a difficult position of breaking treaties with sovereign nations
of native America to aquire the land we'd already pushed them into.

We have this population (small, in this case) and we will have to release them somewhere.
But we know they will not fit in without some serious changes.

These are central Asian steppes horse clans. The rule of law is vendetta, because the region is large and resource poor,
many of the institutions of governance are relegated to individual initiative. *and it's been that way since Timujin*.

Uighurs will require a fair amount of effort to integrate them with 21st Century life in the West.
We made a lot of mistakes with the Hmong, but I think we can do right by these herdsmen.

Send them to Kansas, Oklahoma, Wyoming. These boys can Rodeo, and they don't even know it yet.
Cause when you can survive a game of buszkazi, that bull looks a lot less scary.

Give them a team of Soc. grad students, and some micro capital.

In fact, with only 17 of them, send them to Oakley Kansas and let them work the I-70 tourist trap business loop.
I can see a Uighur restaurant and micro kumiss brewery, a 'wild east' buszkazi show out on the Prairie, poised to sell the cultural
difference to fat Americans rolling through in SUV's.

And they won't feel hemmed in.
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grantcart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #15
27. They can join Uyghur communities in the US

The Uyghurs have an urban presence, more so than the Hmong.

The difficulty in their resettlement is that they are also anti Communist Chinese and the PRC sees their resettlement as a hostile act.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:05 AM
Response to Original message
16. Isn't the proper spelling Uyghurs...I was distracted by the spelling. n/t
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masuki bance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:10 AM
Response to Reply #16
18. You were distracted by the spelling?
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #18
21. Yeah, Uighurs...it's weird to me when I know it as Uyghurs.
However, I did read the article. I have been commenting to posts above.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:13 AM
Response to Original message
23. Hey here's another one... keep in mind, these people have been cleared for over five years.
Uyghur Detainees at Gitmo Compare U.S. to Hitler
America is twice as bad as the Nazis -- that was the harsh accusation by the Chinese Muslims, also known as the Uyghurs, held at Guantanamo Bay.
By Catherine Herridge

FOXNews.com

Monday, June 01, 2009
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/06/01/uyghur-detainees-gitmo-compare-hitler/


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masuki bance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #23
24. "Obama is a communist or a democrat? We have same operation in China."
wow.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. Why are we listening to stuff from Foxnews?! They do have the spelling of Uyghur's right.
I mean FoxNews misles the American people day in and day out with lies and misinformation.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #25
26. deleted
Edited on Wed Jun-03-09 10:40 AM by redqueen
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RememberWellstone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
28. Complex problem
The President is doing the right thing taking his time to get a plan for these prisoners.

We don't want them running the streets anytime soon.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Yes we do.
They're innocent and have been free to go for over five years.
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Dark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-03-09 01:48 PM
Response to Original message
32. "We need to freedom"
OK, that did make me chuckle. I'm going to go sit in a corner now.

(Didn't Obama say he needed four months to figure out what to do with them? It's been four months)
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