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I'd like your help on talking to a moderate right wing friend of mine

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uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 02:27 PM
Original message
I'd like your help on talking to a moderate right wing friend of mine
He asked 2 good questions in regards to health insurance companies...

1.) Why not enforce the anti trade laws that are CURRENTLY on the books? Many HIC's are monopolies in an area and therefore are able to raise rates because there are few if any other companies to go to with lower rates

2.) Why not allow for the purchase of health insurance from other states and regulate the dog snot out of them via federal laws? It would open up more competition if there were more choices.

Thx in advance for any input.
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ayeshahaqqiqa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
1. This still won't stop companies
from refusing to cover people they consider "high risk"--or they will cover but only for a premium that is more than the person can afford.
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uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 02:54 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. What about laws that are inacted that does such? I undertstand that if the Ins Cos wanted to do this
...they already would have so now they are the bad guys but if we had laws that regulated their actions would it meet the goals instead of spending money right now?
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ayeshahaqqiqa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 03:05 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Costs for health care
have to be paid by someone, and if a for-profit company is forced to include "expensive" clients and cannot charge them the higher rates, they will charge everyone more. Or the other thing they will do is deny coverage for lab tests monitoring certain conditions, which they do now. The biggest company in the country refuses to pay for a food allergy lab test we use here at the clinic--and we treat a lot of folks with diseases caused by food intolerance (such as Celiac disease). They also refuse to pay for more than one lipid or TSH test a year, even if a patient has a case of hyperlipidemia or hypothyroidism and the doctor needs to find out if a certain treatment regimen is working.
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uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Hmmm, so a counter point would be even if laws were passed HIC's can still deny
..and people who are dying will have to sue them and under certain admins they'd set the litmus for a successful suite so high it wouldn't be worth it.

Same way with discrimination laws now...

Hmmm, got some good information and even more convinced now that we have to pass at puboption at the least
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abluelady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 02:40 PM
Response to Original message
2. His questions aren't the problem
Does he believe health care is a right or a privilege? Rates are just the tip of the iceberg. The fact that people can be fired from jobs after a claim; the fact that you can be denied for a bogus reason; the fact that claims are denied for no reason--his questions are a distraction.
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uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Of course no to most of your questions, he's a conservative but not against moderate regulation
...that will make sure the playing field is evened by the "free markets" vs the government.

I believe the free market had it's chance and now it's just too damn bad for them
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Hamlette Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. yes, they had their chance, tell him:
1. US pays more for health care than any country on earth but ranks 37th in quality of care (World Health Organization).

2. A higher percentage of people in countries with "socialized" medicine like their system than ppl in the US like our system. PPL coming from Canada for care here is BS (how do they pay for it?) or anecdotal.

3. Studies show care for Vets, Medicare and Tricare provides better care at lower cost than "regular" care. (I found that in an IG report on line last time I needed to answer a republican on this issue. I'm sure you can find it if you want.)

There is no way to enforce anti trust laws in the arena. To keep costs down you need a BIG pool so you can "buy" doctors and hospitals.
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Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 03:09 PM
Response to Original message
7. #2 would create a race to the bottom.
The insurance companies would all incorporate in the one state that could offer them the best deal at the expense of consumers.

The same way the credit card companies are all incorporated in Delaware.

And is your moderate right-wing friend actually advocate MORE GOVERNMENT?
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uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Good point of the first and yes on the second, he's a black Muslim that votes GOP...
...but listens to only right wing sources.

On the health care issue he's paying 700 bucks a month and doesn't realize until I told him that his HIC can still kick him off their roles if something happened to one of his kids or something like that so he's listening to that point.

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Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Put some Thom Hartman, Stephanie Miller, and Joseph Lyles podcasts on a disc for him. n/t
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Mayberry Machiavelli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
11. You still need to eliminate "preexisting condition" exclusion. And insurance tied to employers.
Being "able" to purchase insurance across states etc. is meaningless if you have diabetes, for instance, and no other insurance will take you.

And as long as it's tied to employment it's not a true market at all.
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PretzelWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 05:39 PM
Response to Original message
12. impossible. the nightmare of trying to meet insurance regulations of all the states
would be a sure way to actually raise the adminstrative costs and lower the care we get. Stupid idea.
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PA Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-13-09 06:34 PM
Response to Original message
13. Health insurance industries are already regulated
but usually get a mere slap on the wrist for cheating people out of health care to which they are entitled. The people who are the "regulators" in many states are plants from the very industry they are supposed to regulate , i.e., they are former insurance company executives.

So in the long run it is more profitable to push the envelope and cheat as much as you can if you are in the health insurance game. But for the poor people who are on the receiving end, they pay with their financial security or sometimes their lives.

BTW, tell your friend to take a few HOURS and read his health insurance policy and see if he thinks the insurance company has his health as a priority.
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