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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 10:48 AM
Original message
poll on Obama and Democrats/liberals: “the first sign that something is going wrong with his base.
Edited on Sun Aug-23-09 10:49 AM by John Q. Citizen
Key Finding from Wash. Post/ABC poll on Obama and Democrats/liberals: “the first sign that something is going wrong with his base.
by Joe Sudbay (DC) on 8/21/2009 05:10:00 PM
http://www.americablog.com/2009/08/key-finding-from-wash-postabc-poll-on.html

Greg Sargent dug a little deeper into the latest Washington Poll/ABC News poll, which was released today. As John noted earlier today, this poll is especially bad for Obama among independents. But, that's not the real story, as far as I'm concerned. Greg learned more from the Post's polling analyst Jennifer Agiesta about the numbers for Democrats and liberals. Those results show a growing problem for Obama with his base, which includes many of us:

The numbers tell the story: In three key cases where Obama has dropped significantly, he’s also dropped by sizable margins among Dems and liberals. Let’s take the major findings driving the discussion today, and compare them with his drop among Dems and libs:

* The WaPo poll found that “49 percent now express confidence that Obama will make the right decisions for the country, down from 60 percent at the 100-day mark in his presidency.”

On that question, among liberals, Obama has dropped a surprising 12 points, from 90% to 78%, in the same time period. Among Dems, he’s dropped eight points, from 90% to 82%.

more....


The article goes with more examples of big percentage drops in different areas among liberals and Democrats. And it make the point that Rahm Emanuel, Jim Messina (and probably Jim Margolis)have wrongly put the focus on the false hope of bi-partisanship instead of enacting the change that people voted for and knew they were voting for. Worth the read.
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polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 10:51 AM
Response to Original message
1. I really hope this wakes the prez up - but don't know at this point if he cares...
...about the base as much as he does pretending to pull off a bunch of "change" legislation, no matter how watered down it all is.
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Politicub Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 10:53 AM
Response to Original message
2. Maybe this will actually help the cause of health care
Hear me out... If these polls says that Obama is losing some liberals, it may cause the middle of the roaders to feel like the health care reform proposal is more moderate -- which may position the single payer option against the public option. \

Like most liberals, I want single payer. But the public option will be a step in the right direction that I could live with.

Of course, I could be wrong... but Obama always seems to be two steps ahead.
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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. The public wants single payer. It's the leaders who want the insurance company donations.
Think about it.

The people showing up yelling at town halls are the people who voted against Obama. They are still against Obama. They don't care if reform is radical, moderate, or conservative, They are against it, period, because they are against Obama.

The people who care about whether it's radical, moderate, or conservative are the lefties. We worked hard, we won, and we want real reform, and we know real reform means a lot less health care industrial dollars flowing to congress and a lot more health care for people.

If there was a way that single payer would insure the Dems get huge contributions and Repos get none then single payer would pass in a couple of weeks.
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justinaforjustice Donating Member (519 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #8
15. Good Post, Thanks for the Clarity. n/t
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meowomon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
3. He lost me when he thew us Gays under the bus
I worked hard to get him elected. I wish I had gone for Hillary now.
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Hello_Kitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #3
29. What do you think would be different under Hillary?
I personally don't think anything would be.
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meowomon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-24-09 12:20 AM
Response to Reply #29
34. I don't know. But I wish I knew.
Edited on Mon Aug-24-09 12:21 AM by meowomon
I regret having worked my ass off for Obama, only to be compared to a pedophile by his Justice Department.
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 10:58 AM
Response to Original message
4. I've been hearing it from my circle of friends
most of whom are more progressive than I, and most of whom supported him in the primaries (I didn't). The whispers of dissatisfaction have been steadily growing and are now being openly discussed.

I truly hope Obama and his inner circle are listening -
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 10:58 AM
Response to Original message
5. People are spinning way too much
Edited on Sun Aug-23-09 10:59 AM by ProSense
into this. From the OP:

On that question, among liberals, Obama has dropped a surprising 12 points, from 90% to 78%, in the same time period. Among Dems, he’s dropped eight points, from 90% to 82%.


Given the nature of the health care debate, that is not huge.
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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. You remind me of the Hillary campaign right after Super Tuesday.
They just couldn't believe that there was a problem, because they really really liked Hillary and they were expecting that she was going to win it.

They perceived the problem as a PR problem. If put in the proper light from the proper perspective, there was no real problem.

I sure hope Obama doesn't go down that road.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:14 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. You remind me of the media. n/t
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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. My point exactly. It's a PR problem as you see it, And that's a recipe for failure.
Ask Hillary how that worked for her?
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 12:33 PM
Response to Reply #13
23. Nonsense
WaPo has Obama's approval at 57%, that's still high by any stretch of the imagination. Obama was elected with the support of both 89% of Democrats and liberals. In the heat of a health care debate, trying to characterize support form 82% of Democrats and 78% of liberals as a sign that there is a real concern that might have lasting consequences is a bit of a stretch. It's not hard to figure out.

People want health care reform, they're concerned that the bill may not include a public option. Some self-identified liberals want single-payer. Those have to be factured in.
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nc4bo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:00 AM
Response to Original message
6. Umm.....yessssssss. D'UH! If we wanted more of the same, there'd be a President 5-plane Mccain
right now and VP Palin doing lines and blowing spit bubbles at Presidential portraits in the White House.

Obama was the candidate for CHANGE WE CAN BELIEVE IN and we meant just that and voted for that in very large numbers.
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Tansy_Gold Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:03 AM
Response to Original message
7. CAN YOU HEAR US NOW????????????????????? n/t
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DKRC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #7
26. OMG
:spray:

That's what we need to do!

We should ALL fax the WH & the gang of 6 til they're swimming in paper saying:

We, the American people, want universal single payer health care!

CAN YOU HEAR US NOW ???????????????????????????
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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
11. Obama promised HCR but left it up to Congress to write the bill. It seems unlikely that a viable HCR
plan will emerge and Obama will be blamed.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
12. Hmmm. Maybe betraying one's genuine supporters in hopes of appeasing enemies
is just not a very good political strategy after all.

Who ever could have imagined such a thing?
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #12
17. He should take on the enemies of the state head-on
Every day, another daily update.

When Pharma threatens an ad campaign against reform,

"I refuse to let 50 million Americans, including children and the most vulnerable, go without health care because the UHC CEO needs a 1/2-billion dollar bonus"

When some psychotic Limbeciles show up to threaten people at town halls,

"If you gun-wavers and Congressional and media terrorists think you're going to threaten us into leaving people without health care, you need to wake up and smell the coffee"

Every day, an appearance to fire back at that day's right-wing menace.

His leadership has been disappointing.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. I don't think he *is* weak, but he is looking weak.
I, too, would like to see a little Harry Truman now and then and a lot less Caspar Milquetoast.
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:34 AM
Response to Original message
14. I am mostly frustrated by his continued pandering to the country's mortal enemies
Coburn, Grassley, Pharma, and Big Media.

He "negotiated" with Pharma to get them to give up 2% of their profits to help the cause. The European health care systems get their drugs at anywhere from 35-50% discount. He refuses to call the Repukes on thier hate- and fear-mongering and violent rhetoric, except in very weak terms. And he refuses to take a firm stance on what sort of reform he wants.

I supported him in the primaries because I was afraid HRC would return to Bill's appeasement of the fascists (triangulation), and that Obama wouldn't. I was wrong.
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tj2001 Donating Member (685 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #14
28. The view of the underside of the bus is intriguing
if you're a bus mechanic
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:40 AM
Response to Original message
16. People sucking up the mediawhore polls like
it wasn't fail pushed..their favorite method.
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nc4bo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. Wish that were 100% true but I don't really think so.
I've talked to quite a few O supporters and they are not happy with 1) Looking forward rather than investigating and prosecuting the entire Bush Admin. and its actions over the past 8 years, 2) bank bailouts and nurturing Wall St. instead of Main St., 3) Marriage Equality and DODT and 4) Election Reform. This health care issue is the icing on the cake because most took it for granted that reform would be steamed rolled through without the bipartisan BS.

People are hurting, losing homes, losing lives and no one wants to attend any Kumbaya campfires and play Monopoly, Poker or Chess.

Not many are interested in holding hands with Republicans unless they are speaking OUR language, not after the hell the previous 8 years put us through.

Until something substantial is done (Public Option), the numbers will continue to decline and the base will erode and fracture at an alarming rate.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Well, I've talked to quite a lot of supporters too who
don't suck in what the coporatemediawhores suck out..and they're are so proud of him.
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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. Then don't worry, be happy!
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. I am happy and you ..don't you
drown in a sea of corporateWhore negative shite ..ya hear.
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nc4bo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #22
27. It has absolutely nothing to do with the whoring media but what they see and feel in the real world.
It's ain't personal, it's realism and frustration.
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 11:59 AM
Response to Original message
20. The reality is WORSE than the polls indicate.
In every PUBLIC poll I give Obama the highest marks possible.
It is only in private and on DU that I express my real opinion.

There are many Liberals who do the same.
My line in the sand is Health Care Reform.

Public Option = Publicly Owned Government Administered alternative to Private Insurance that is available to ALL Americans.
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #20
31. That's my take as well
The actual dynamics going on here aren't being measured in these cheap media polls- and this is particularly true with respect to enthusiasm. Krugman, Greenwald and others wrote about that last week- though any seasoned observer could see it coming miles away.

Let's just hope it's a wake-up call.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 12:11 PM
Response to Original message
21. WTF is Greg moping about ?? President Obama is kicking ass
Them Pubs got shit in their ammo can...

Assley

Backmann

Palin

McCane

Mitt

etc etc

These are the shallow bench bunch...they got shit coming outta their voice boxes
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 05:06 PM
Response to Original message
30. No surprise there...
Edited on Sun Aug-23-09 05:06 PM by depakid
Pander to the right- and you'll lose the progressive base. 2010 is shaping up to look a lot like 1994.

As predicted.

Democrats it seems, never learn.
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 05:52 PM
Response to Original message
32. and no doubt it puts a smile on your face...
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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-23-09 06:53 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. REAL health care reform would put a smile on my face and raise Obama's numbers.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-24-09 12:35 AM
Response to Original message
35. The Reason: BECAUSE THEY HAVEN'T GONE THROUGH WITH A STRONG PUBLIC OPTION
Their poll numbers will return if they just fuck bipartisanship and pass a strong public option. That's what 77% of Americans want.
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