We'll pay for illegal aliens but in the same (expensive) way as always.

They'll show up to the emergency room seriously ill and they'll be treated anyway. Then we will all get that bill by way of other medical bills we pay.

If I don't pay it directly that means it doesn't cost anything (Republican world view).

job, home and car and living at uncle Al's house and paying for the part-time minimum wage worker who does not have insurance and is sicker than a fucking dog but needs medications...
We pay for them all. but let us focus on a small number of "illegal aliens"

yes, that is a healthy debate!

about the cost-saving potential of prevention, however, are overreaching. Studies have concluded that preventing illness can in some cases save money but in other cases can add to health care costs.3 For example, screening costs will exceed the savings from avoided treatment in cases in which only a very small fraction of the population would have become ill in the absence of preventive measures. Preventive measures that do not save money may or may not represent cost-effective care (i.e., good value for the resources expended). Whether any preventive measure saves money or is a reasonable investment despite adding to costs depends entirely on the particular intervention and the specific population in question. For example, drugs used to treat high cholesterol yield much greater value for the money if the targeted population is at high risk for coronary heart disease, and the efficiency of cancer screening can depend heavily on both the frequency of the screening and the level of cancer risk in the screened population.4

The focus on prevention as a key source of cost savings in health care also sidesteps the question of whether such measures are generally more promising and efficient than the treatment of existing conditions. Researchers have found that although high-technology treatments for existing conditions can

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/358/7/661

I could have gone to a doctor dozens of times for what was spent that one single time in the emergency room after I had a seizure (total bill $14,000).

Just my ambulance ride was $2200 dollars (how many visits to a GP would that get?)

I gave a link for the other side of the argument.

That's my impression.

If there were options for people other than really expensive and well equipped ERs we'd save a shitload of money.

I'd love to hear how.

that you are looking at huge gains, just from the population who IS entering with a heart attack, or advanced cancer, so much can be saved. Once the person with cancer gets through the emergency room he goes to the hospital...and then what is the cost of cancer treatment across six months? At this point we are literally talking easily over $100,000.

Nothing.

http://politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/sep/09/barack-obama/obama-says-preventive-care-saves-money-it-doesnt/

Of my three doctors every one says it would have saved their paitients big time.

Just declare them all legal. Poof! No more problem!

All people who live in this country have the same needs. Whether or not they have "documentation". Declare everyone fully legal (including health care AND voting rights). It's the only humane thing to do.

Our planet, our country, any country, just can not sustain unending growth.

If granting amnesty and citizenship to everyone here wouldn't result in an increase in the rate of immigration I'd be fine with it.

:patriot:

One pattern that anthropologists (and I am one) always see in all countries is that moving people into a middle class (not necessarily like the American's middle class)quickly reduces births per family to replacement (2.2 approx).

A permanent underclass seems to have been created and little has been done by either party to address it in a significant way.

I can't help but think that it's because of the incredibly cheap labor provided.

Because of emergency rooms. What a load of horsecrap. The only thing Ronald Reagan said in his life that made any sense was quoting Heinlein: There ain't no such thing as a free lunch.

But for us the bill is either $1,400 total (preventive care) or $23,000 in the emergency room.

Right now the Republicans prefer the $23,000 option.

the emergency room as primary care. I can see no way that method would be less expensive than covering people and if it is then McCain was right about ER's being a reasonable way to deal with all uncovered people.

I see no argument that one uncovered person would be cheaper to cover but another would be less expensive to cope with by referring them to the ER. One or the other is bogus.

There's just no thought involved, much less heart. Strangely enough I can almost understand the heartlessness better than the brainlessness.

National ID cards? Prove citizenship at the ER door or no entry? Refuse to treat foreign students, foreign tourists, just in case they're "illegals"? Refuse to treat anyone with a foreign accent?

Where's their plan, if any? I know the HC bill has an acceptable plan for emergencies in it or it wouldn't have gotten any Dem support -- but the way the Cons keep yammering on about this issue I begin to think they just want to deliberately let people die in the hospital parking lot rather than treat the "wrong" people.

Hekate

based on comments that I've read and heard and conversations that I've had.