It's not over yet, right???

(jamboi is right, i'm not gonna make this policasista post part 2)

Does this mean it's over? I feel like it is. I feel dead inside, i think i give up.

And this isn't a feel-sorry-for-me post.

It's me, begging someone to point something out that is left to look foward to.

As of today:

Both counties so far in the recount show NO CHANGE.

The election contest (apparently) can't even be HEARD by the court because the electoral college already cast their vote.


what is left?

The Declaration Of Independence requires us to revolt as our patriotic duty.

to go still.

We are, best I can tell, 50% nationally, in some areas reaching 70%... usually social scientists say you see riots about 80%, at 90% all bets are off

2006 isn't that far away..it'll be 2005 in a few weeks. This isn't a battle that is won or lost based on one day (Nov. 2) it's an ongoing fight - every day, on every front, and every 2 years you get to measure your progress. Take a deep breath, grab a strong coffee and get back in there. :yourock:

i dont' even vote in those elections.

and that's all?

i just don't get real into them like Presidential Elections. Maybe i will next time, who knows.

I know you're depressed and I don't blame you but Congress actually has more power than the president. How much can Bush get done if he can't get anything through congress? Just because the election is over doesn't mean that the fight is over.

i just don't get real into them like Presidential Elections. Maybe i will next time, who knows.


I vote in every election; from local dogcatcher to President of the United States - Now let me tell you why. Most importantly is the fact that many (and I mean thousands upon thousands) of people have given their property and their lives to ensure that I have the right to vote. I would be doing them a grave disservice if I only voted when the mood hit me.

Secondly; the elections during the mid-term are VERY important. In order for the Democratic party to regain the majority, we must pick up seats in both the house and senate during the mid-term. It would be nearly impossible to make up the seats necessary to do so in the next Presidential election cycle alone. The President may set the agenda for the nation, but the Congress implements it. Therefore it is vitally important to have control of those bodies.

If you think that only the Presidential election is important, then you need to think again. I'm not trying to get you angry here, I just want you to think about voting at every opportunity.

:)

Millions and millions of people know there was something wrong with this election. Even *'s own party members are starting to come down on him. We may not win this battle, but the war is far from over.

that things will work out for the best. We do know they cheated. The statistical anomolies are more than convincing. We just don't know exactly how. And we don't know if they've already covered all their tracks. It would be incredibly hard for them to get all new ballots made to match with the official tallies not just for president, but for all the offices (they are checking them all right?).

Right now we have witnesses that say a triad employee was messing with the voting machines after the election. We also have a women who was nearly run off the road after signing affidavits for our case. We just need to give it a little more time. Keep the faith Faye.

Only recounting for president.

make "corrections" in the ballots if they don't need to worry to much about the other races.

The Electoral College casting their vote does not in any way undermine the lawsuit.

Please hang in there, things may very well still get interesting.

TO STOP SPREADING DISINFORMATION???????

DID I JUST PLAY INTO HIS GAME?

I am :hi:

The fact is Faye, we have known for some time now that we are fighting a near impossible battle if that battle is to have Kerry inaugurated on Jan 20th. Now let's not be disillusioned, it will take a LOT, miracles included, for that to happen. But we still must TRY, because NOTHING is impossible, and miracles are always bound to happen from time to time.

We do of course have far more we are fighting for than just to overturn this election, and that fight will continue to grow stronger and stronger each day regardless of who is sworn in on Jan 20th.

So all in all, Faye, this changes nothing. We know how hard the first stage is and don't need other posters cramming it down our throats with the only intention to weaken our resolve. But Faye, do not let your resolve be weakened. The battle is as tough now as yesterday, but our fight is still as just as it was yesterday and is today. We are strong enough, smart enough, and able enough to accomplish what we seek, but we need to keep sticking together.

The roads ahead are rocky and full of danger. Thank God DU is full of those with the courage to travel down that road rather then take the fork in the road with the sign reading "Ignorance Is Bliss, Status Quo This Way!"

We choose the road less traveled by.

Keep the Faith

Like, "Let's review where we're at." or some such. Otherwise it attracts the wrong sort like a magnet.

...and life will go on.

I think the story about the guy who went in and messed with the tabulator in Columbus is the beginning. I think things are going to unravel from there.

People keep making references to Watergate, and how it was a third level burglary that started that. I think this might be the key. (Keeping fingers crossed).

the truth will come out. It will come out too late? probably if 2000 is any indication.

But you can't give up on reform

as Mr. Cobb pointed out yesterday for weeks. Meanwhile, they had ample time to tamper with the records.
This tainted recount effort has to change into an investigation effort.
Witnesses are coming forward, we have to support and protect them, so they can talk to Conyers.

But just look at the things that are happening here...

- Recounts
- Lawsuits
- Hearings
- Research, Research, Research
- KO
- etc...

And some of it is directly a result of the work of the members of this forum!

We might not win the war, but we will be victorious in many battles!

But we will win the war.

Keep the Faith

Why are you asking is it over it it just began?

BTW: Check out the plans reid has for next year.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1070876

Use his office address so he'll read it as a constituent and then apologize at the end of the letter, saying he now represents us all.

He is planning on investigating *. Tell him to start with the Conyers hearings. It will make you feel better! :hug:

Here's his address:

http://reid.senate.gov/email_form.cfm

This is the other Dem who will be on the committee:

Senator Dorgan

http://dorgan.senate.gov/contactme/contact.cfm

how ironic would it be that something similar happened in this election.

some things are by fate...for the JFK's, sometimes it scares me.
well i hope this fate is his, but not the rest :-(

(if you get what i'm saying :( )

If it is indeed over, then there are some things to look upon for the future that may help cheer you up:

1. BCo has to take responsibility...can't keep pulling out Clinton's name for another 4 years.

2. Pride cometh before the fall...extreme arrogance and lack of critical thinking within the admin. is likely to result in failures.

3. Republican Congress completes the trifecta of OWNERSHIP and responsibility for future failures over the next 4 years.

4. There are some key races in 2006 with real possibilities for Dems. gaining seats. (example)PA has been Dem for for every Pres candidate since 1992 so Santorum is a likely ousting in 2006.

Hope this helps a little. :hug:

so they already had a chance to fix the votes. And the other county we got results from yesterday, was one we weren't expecting to find fraud in. Wait a little longer until we start getting results from the big counties, where 3% amounts to a greater number of votes...it'll be harder for them to fix more votes.

While the lockdown is certainly unusual (does anyone have first hand knowledge of the facts there?), does anyone really believe that the voting records were doctored?

I just looked up the Ohio law on county boards of elections. Every board consists of 4 people. Assuming that the Democratic and Republican candidates for governor consistently receive the most votes in every election, the boards will always be evenly divided with 2 Democrats and 2 Republicans.

Ohio Statute 3501.06. Board of elections; vacancies.

There shall be in each county of the state a board of elections consisting of four qualified electors of the county, who shall be appointed by the secretary of state, as the secretary's representatives, to serve for the term of four years. On the first day of March in even-numbered years the secretary of state shall appoint two of such board members, one of whom shall be from the political party which cast the highest number of votes for the office of governor at the most recent regular state election, and the other shall be from the political party which cast the next highest number of votes for the office of governor at such election. All vacancies filled for unexpired terms and all appointments to new terms shall be made from the political party to which the vacating or outgoing member belonged, unless there is a third political party which cast a greater number of votes in the state at the most recent regular state election for the office of governor than did the party to which the retiring member belonged, in which event the vacancy shall be filled from such third party.

And I just looked at the directory of all boards and every single board has both a Democrat and Republican in the Director and Deputy director positions. Some counties the Dem is the director, other counties the Rep, but both parties are always represented in the board leadership.

So, if fraud, and vote switching, and intentional shorting of machines, and all the other alleged malfeasance was so open and blatant, why isn't someone from that Democratic 50% of all local election officials in the state screaming bloody murder? Surely at least one of them would have known or seen something - don't you think?

Just give you 5 times the Conyers-hearing -

and you're fresh and motivated.

Here is your pill:

rtsp://cspanrm.fplive.net/cspan/project/c04/c04120804_conyers.rm

(open in Real Player)

wait till the celebs know about it!

Nobody can stopp the truth...

we need to work for hand-counted ballots on election night in each polling place. No transporting ballots before counting.

that Cobb made yesterday at the hearing, the counts WOULD come out the same. Thats a big part of the problem...it is all arranged. We need to get out of the instant gratification mode and remind ourselves that this is an involved task with many steps. First and foremost we cannot give up!

I understand how you feel, I fall into the same cloud and have to remind myself that there has been ALOT of progress and there is hope. I try to think of it this way (if it helps you):

A month ago, what realistic hope was there that we would be on the doorstep (with gathering Congressional support) of getting the integrity of the voting system looked into to the extent that it is today?

A month ago, if you mentioned Diebold, ESS and Triad and how asinine/dangerous it was for us to have fallen into their clutches, how many more many people of thought you nuts?

For things to get fixed, they need to be comprehended. Until the country or enough people in power wake the hell up and react to the absurdity of relying on a system of voting that could/would allow undetectable vote manipulation. We have made many steps along this path and need to keep pushing.

It's not over.

(chin up)

and, as far as I'm concerned, that's Jan 20: I do understand your despair (and anyone who's even thinking about 2006/8 if we don't overturn 2004 is, imo, kidding themselves--the current admin is moving fast, fast, fast, to institute as many fascist tactics, policies, strategies, etc -- see my posting of the Pentagon's most recent attempts to deliberately sell LIES to the foreign media)...If we lose this, it IS over for any illusion or trace of "democracy" in this country and I predict total economic collapse w/i 6 months.

But, it's really NOT over till Jan 20 -- till then, *anything is POSSIBLE. But nothing is possible if WE don't stay behind the ball; once we give up, it IS over.

I've basically put my life on hold til Jan 20. If we lose, I will have left the country within 6 months, but I've decided to stick with it till then.

I would not have expected anything out of Warren County. They could have used the lock down to switch out ballots. This fraud will be uncovered in the small counties as small widespread "errors" and "mis-tabulations"

Have some faith in Arnebeck. He said that he had proof. By the way, his lawsuit is viable. It was filed before the electors cast their vote.

Keep the Faith

There will be lots of ups and downs

No Retreat No Surrender

I hope this and all other messages make Faye feel better. I know they are doing that for me!

:hi:

Story finally broke locally in today's St.Paul Pioneer Press. This is the first fraud-related article that I know of to appear in a major newspaper here in Minnesota. Most Minnesotans have been unaware of the fraud issue.

It's an AP story that many DU'ers have memorized by now. But my point is, the word is spreading.

http://www.twincities.com/mld/twincities/news/nation/10409904.htm?1c

(use email address "bugmenot@fuckina.com", password "2bugmenot" to access.)

<SNIP>
The challengers allege unlawful ballots were added to the total and legally cast ballots were altered. Without listing specific evidence, the complaint alleges 130,656 votes for Kerry and John Edwards in 36 counties were somehow switched to count for the Bush-Cheney ticket.

<SNIP>
"While the existence of anomalies could possibly be explained by human error or technical malfunctions, the fact that, in every case in Ohio known to the contesters, the error favored the Bush-Cheney ticket, strongly indicates manipulation or fraud," the challengers said in a court filing.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/12/14/151628/87

Let me know how you feel, hopeful I hope.

This is why there were other DUers upset yesterday who were posting similarly 'depressing' threads. Why is it that you were all over policasista yesterday but are starting the exact same thread today.

The election contest can't be heard by the court because the electoral college already cast their vote...bingo...

That isn't the same as someone who posts reduntantly and infectiously time and time again with nothing BUT depression.

Faye has shown amazing strength each day and is entitled to a down moment. Others have never shown strength even once, and are entitled to be flamed.

thanks everyone. for about 20 minutes i felt it was all doomed.

saddemocrat, the difference is, i knew i could bounce right back with words from others.

Love Ya!

:pals:

:hug:

it ain't over. i don't know about the arneback case and jurisdiction, but this process may take years and our blood sweat and tears. in the end, the repubs will be driven out of our government, packed courts or not.

We need to fight until everyones votes are counted, are traceable, and reflect the will of the person who cast them. It is never over. I will never let these criminals steal democracy from us.

NO voter left behind -- ever, ever, ever again

Faye, we need strong fighters like you in this. The biggest hurdles are yet to come. Be there.

We have only just begun to...NOT get over it!

This didn't work in 2001, but that doesn't mean a similar attempt would not get more traction this time:

Hail Mary Brief

Paging Mr. Boies, paging Mr. Boies...

www.thedeanpeople.org

they are sowing the seed of their own ruin right now as they attempt to hide the election fraud. would have been better for them to let the fraud and errors be found and simply say "wow, we have no idea who did this, better be more careful next time."

the conspiracy of lies involved in a cover up is way more dangerous than the crime itself, witness Watergate.

the best is yet to come! hang in there, make some pop corn and prepare to enjoy a major media circus!

make up for twenty MSM channels that won't cover this story.

It's not over until the carbo-challenged lady sings (whoever that is).

Maybe it's just my meds, but I'm still hopeful.

Keep the faith, Faye.:hi:

...by showing up to make sure that the numbers added up. That is the problem with cover ups. So many loose threads. So many people involved to get cold feet.

And Katherine Blackwell finally broke an actual for sure law on Friday when he ordered public records locked down. As well as going back on his word which he gave on national TV on MSNBC. Once again, the cover up is more dangerous than the crime.

These guys were alive during Watergate. They should have paid attention.

country?

thank you all for the encouragement, it's all i needed.

i think anyone can feel weak at times :-)

my problem was, i was listening to that FAUX LAWYER running around on this board telling us there is no chance, and i was letting the first county recount results get to me. i'm sure there is much more to be said and done - especially seeing now that ARNEBECK WAS ON HANNITY SHOW!!!!!!!!!! what in the f*k!!!??

some ass in another thread who says he's a lawyer basically tried to tell us that it was too late for the court to even HEAR the case.

apparently, he was wrong, and got me all depressed over nothing :eyes: