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Emillereid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-14-04 03:24 PM
Original message
Anyone know if the people who did the Berkeley study
indicating election fraud ever counter the criticisms mounted against the study? Did they agree with those criticisms? I haven't heard anything and am not sure if I missed something.
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libertypirate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-14-04 03:29 PM
Response to Original message
1. YEP -- They put their names on the study
the one used to refute it from MIT. NO NAMES!

They stand by their work, while others who insist they are wrong will not.
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rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-14-04 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Not true....
The first report from the CalTech project(which lists all who work on it,see the left hand side,http://www.vote.caltech.edu/Election2004.html ) has been amended. They had cited incorrect data previously. I don't know how much this refutes or what(I'm no stat guy) but here's the amended report whcih cites one member as its author.

http://www.vote.caltech.edu/Reports/Addendum_Voting_Machines_Bush_Vote.pdf

"They stand by their work, while others who insist they are wrong will not."

Uhhh the CalTech/MIT voting project is not some evil entity just because they disagree with Berkeley. They've done great work exposing the error rates of ALL voting methodologies, touchscreen/optiscan included. They are working for less spoilage, that is a good thing.

Both parties refer to their work as ongoing(the Berkeley people have added more data) meaning there is more data to crunch.


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godel escher bach Donating Member (55 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-14-04 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. These authors stand by their papers which question Berkeley
A non-fraud explanation for the Berkely result is pointed out by a University of Arizona professor here:

http://www.kieranhealy.org/files/misc/election.pdf

Another author adds another variable to the Berkely study - the Jewish vote - which entirely nullifys the Berkely anomoly. See Here:

http://newmarksdoor.typepad.com/mainblog/2004/11/more_on_the_stu.html

A George Mason University scientist completely debunks Berkely here:

http://elections.gmu.edu/Berkeley.html

This site also makes the case that there are non-fraud related reasons for the results in the Berkely study:

http://rightonthemark.blogspot.com/2004/11/did-democrats-cheat-in-2000.html
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rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-14-04 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. I don't have the capacity to verfiy any of this...
...I just don't see why people are quick to eviscerate the Caltech project.
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berniew1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-14-04 08:01 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. I looked at the study claiming to refute and it wasn't well done
Edited on Tue Dec-14-04 08:07 PM by berniew1
I did a detailed study analyzing the votes in Florida by county, for 2000 and 2004 with registrations by party. It documents that there were very unusual and unexplainable increases for Bush in big touchscreen counties, like Broward, Palm Beach, Hillsboro, Pinenallas, Orange, Sarasota, Indian River, etc.
www.flcv.com/fla04EAS.html
Also systematic voter suppression of Dem voters/minorities, in several of these counties.
I have as much background in statistical studies as these people.
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godel escher bach Donating Member (55 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-14-04 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. I forgot. Wired.com posted a refutation of Berkeley as well n/t
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Helga Scow Stern Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-14-04 03:58 PM
Response to Original message
2. You might try writing Kim Zetter at WiredNews, or you could PM
Eloriel. She might know.

kzetter@wired.com
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rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-14-04 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
4. They have added a bit to the bottom of their study
Edited on Tue Dec-14-04 04:15 PM by rinsd
Google "berkeley election analysis" and it should be the first thing that pops up.

Here's a link: http://ucdata.berkeley.edu/new_web/VOTE2004/election04_WP.pdf

It's on page 9
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Emillereid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-14-04 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. Thanks. It looks like they have indeed addressed some of the
concerns of their detractors -- and the results are still the same. Something is wrong in the state of Florida!
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-14-04 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. And you can download their data in Excel at same URL.
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