Why Doesn't Kerry Fight?

This is so f'ing disappointing to me. There were some "questionable" precinct returns, to be sure. For instance:

Franklin County, OH: Gahanna 1-B Precinct
638 TOTAL BALLOTS CAST

US Senator:
Fingerhut (D) - 167 votes
Voinovich (R) - 300 votes

US President:
Kerry (D) - 260 votes
Bush (R) - 4,258 votes

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/4/224812/643

Does this crap at least merit a 2nd look? Why are we always the rollover party? No wonder people don't think we'd defend the country. I really thought Kerry had more stones than this.

are keeping cards close to their chests ...but I don't really know anymore...

-----------------------------------------------------------
FIGHT! Take this country back one town and state at a time!
http://www.geocities.com/greenpartyvoter/electionreform.htm

he is being considered for the DNC chair?

He was supposed to lose. He was just fulfilling his role in the grand Architect's design.

Besides, it was because of black box voting that he came out of nowhere to in the Dem nomination. Look it up. Gephardt demanded a recount in Iowas and was told it wasn't possible as there was no paper trail.

Ironic, eh?

Why doesn't he fight?

Figure it out.

Hey, there's a silver lining in it for Kerry - his taxes are going down.

...the more it appears that Kerry still stood a good chance of winning if he had just held out for the count, the more I believe that Skull and Bones IS the answer. Hell, I MADE myself LIKE Kerry. I FORCED myself to BELIEVE that he WAS the BEST for the party and I WORKED MY ASS OFF to get him elected. And for him to come out like a little pussy and concede before all the votes were in....Ummhmmmm No, No...it has to be more than that.

And you know what, Terry McAuliffe needs to take a looooonnnngggg vacation overseas somewhere because it was he, who convinced us to accept Kerry over Dean, saying that Kerry was more "electable." I personally nominate him as the most detested man in the Democratic Party right now. So to my way of thinking, McAuliffe is on the Republican dole also. As well as that totally incompetent mary Beth Cahill and Joe "the Loser" Lockhart.

That is why I am advocating that we ABSOLUTELY KNOW who our next Democratic Party leader is - from every strand of hair on his head, to the number of corns on his feet. EVERYTHING - who he/she went to school with, what his/her resume looks like, what credentials he/she has for the job, what are his families political ties, and most importantly - what record of fighting for Democratic ideals does he/she have?

They can call me anything they want. I just want my democracy back.

Kerry should answer soon.

He owes his constituents, not the other way around.

And still very stange how quickly the Dean to Kerry shift was tipped by corporate media.

itzamirakul wrote:

...the more it appears that Kerry still stood a good chance of winning if he had just held out for the count, the more I believe that Skull and Bones IS the answer.

It's the first thing that's made any sense, esp. when you consider the Kerry/Gephardt business mentioned earlier in this thread.

Hell, I MADE myself LIKE Kerry. I FORCED myself to BELIEVE that he WAS the BEST for the party and I WORKED MY ASS OFF to get him elected. And for him to come out like a little pussy and concede before all the votes were in....Ummhmmmm No, No...it has to be more than that.

Same here. First I wanted Dean, then Edwards, and I would've accepted Gephardt too. But when the party seemed to lean toward Kerry, I joined in...no infighting, just dethrone King George, that sort of thing.

And you know what, Terry McAuliffe needs to take a looooonnnngggg vacation overseas somewhere because it was he, who convinced us to accept Kerry over Dean, saying that Kerry was more "electable." I personally nominate him as the most detested man in the Democratic Party right now. So to my way of thinking, McAuliffe is on the Republican dole also. As well as that totally incompetent mary Beth Cahill and Joe "the Loser" Lockhart.

YEAH! I'm sick of them all. Cahill's e-mails were so freakin' annoying...just money, money, money, that's all she talked about. But where's the e-mails saying the money for the legal team would be refunded? (Insert sound of crickets chirping in an eerie silence here.)

That is why I am advocating that we ABSOLUTELY KNOW who our next Democratic Party leader is - from every strand of hair on his head, to the number of corns on his feet. EVERYTHING - who he/she went to school with, what his/her resume looks like, what credentials he/she has for the job, what are his families political ties, and most importantly - what record of fighting for Democratic ideals does he/she have?

Even more importantly...NO SKULL & BONES MEMBERSHIP!!!

I'm beginning to think everything we know is a lie.

neither am I....We can do this...We have to do this...Our Country is calling us out and I for one will not falter. 55, pissed off and tits to the wind for me!

> Howard Dean needs to get into this. He would never have given up.

Howard Dean *WAS* in this; many of you insisted he be thrown out as
"unelectable".

It's kinda late to be thinking that he can save you know.

Atlant

Sorry, but he was retracting stuff on campaign trail faster than Kerry ever did. he found Jebus too - enough with that myth!
So far, the facts are: Gore fought, Kerry folded.

disinformation and innuendo?

Msongs
Riverside CA

2005 Beatles calendars out now
www.msongs.com/gallery_three.htm

almost 4,000 extra votes-well, think about it.


"Friday, November 05, 2004
Jim Woods
THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH

A computer error involving one voting-machine cartridge gave President Bush 3,893 extra votes in a Gahanna precinct.

Franklin County’s unofficial results gave Bush 4,258 votes to Democratic challenger John Kerry’s 260 votes in Precinct 1B, which votes at New Life Church on Stygler Road. Records show only 638 voters cast ballots in that precinct.

Matthew Damschroder, director of the Franklin County Board of Elections, said Bush received 365 votes there.

The remaining 13 voters who cast ballots either voted for other candidates or did not vote for president.

Damschroder said he received some calls yesterday from people who saw the error when reading the list of poll results on the election board’s Web site"
http://www.columbusdispatch.com/election/election-president.php?story=dispatch/2004/11/05/20041105-A6-01.html

One freaking paperless electronic voting machine.
ONE MACHINE!
Almost 4,000 extra votes.
ONE MACHINE!
http://www.columbusdispatch.com/election/election-president.php?story=dispatch/2004/11/05/20041105-A6-01.html

since they didn't bring up Diebold during the campaign, it would look bad now. The decision to concede was made on election night (while legal eagle edwards was speweing "we'll fight - check is in the mail-blah-blah-blah)
For kerry it was a carreer decision. better a senator than labeled a conspiracy theorist (like Gore).
One proof of his motives


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6407226/site/newsweek /
The "Outlandish" McCain Offer. Kerry's courtship of
Senator John McCain to be his running mate was
longer-standing and more intense than previously
reported. As far back as August 2003, Kerry had taken
McCain to breakfast to sound him out to run on a unity
ticket. McCain batted away the idea as not serious,
but Kerry, after he wrapped up the nomination in
March, went back after McCain a half-dozen more times.
"To show just how sincere he was, he made an
outlandish offer," Newsweek's Thomas reports. "If
McCain said yes he would expand the role of vice
president to include secretary of Defense and the
overall control of foreign policy. McCain exclaimed,
'You're out of your mind. I don't even know if it's
constitutional, and it certainly wouldn't sell.'"
Kerry was thwarted and furious. "Why the f--- didn't
he take it? After what the Bush people did to him...'"

I think if the popular vote were closer they would pursue the fraud issue. Is it possible that two million votes were stolen? Because I think that's what they would need to prove to convince people - not just a few decisive counties but a popular win.

give Bush almost 4000 extra votes one machine at the time-don't you think that can add up?
:eyes:

I am aware it was stolen - I am asking if we can prove 2 million stolen votes.

Said Crispin this morning on AAR. Florida has a million counties under the thumb of Jeb Bush and his new Katherine Harris. 5,000 votes here, 4,000 votes there...I think this shit adds up pretty quick.

Only about 130, 000 in OH would be plenty.
We still have an electoral college.

I don't think proving an electoral college win is enough. We would need to prove a popular vote win to convince people. I think this is why Kerry backed off.

When the rules are you need to win electoral college?
When did we decided electoral college doesn't matter anymore?
Did I miss something?
Didn't Bush lost popular vote in 2000?

I think he saw the impossibility of governing the hateful if he fought to win on a technicality without a popular vote victory.

Now if we can SHOW that he was robbed enough to change the balance on the popular vote that would be different.

These are just my guesses on Kerry's reasoning -

Voter fraud, if it was going on, is not "technicality".

I think Kerry backed off because he supports the war in Iraq and he feels that the chimp can support the war as effectively as he can. All through the campaign Kerry supported the war, and although he did point out many of the chimp's lies and mistakes, he knew full well that if he won, most of his supporters would jump on him to oppose and end the war--something he never wanted to do.

If Kerry had fought them in the open and tried to proved fraud, the wingnuts would publically scream all kinds of nastiness to rally their base against Kerry. THEN, even if fraud by the wingnuts WAS proven, their base would never, ever believe it. Not only that, but this would be their rallying cry against not only President Kerry, but every single Democrat from now until the end of time. It is far better to let the investigation take place under the radar. The votes are being counted. Hopefully, the 'problems' are being looked into, as well.

The Electoral Votes are what determines the president. It would have been an even sweeter victory, if Kerry had won the way Bush did--losing the popular vote, and winning the EV.

Why?

Because then people would be screaming for the abolition of the electoral college. Then one state couldn't hold our country hostage anymore.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2004/11/04/election_reactions/
index1.html
"
First of all, this election was definitely rigged. I have no doubt
about it. It's a statistical impossibility that Bush got 8 million more
votes than he got last time. In 2000, he got 15 million votes from
right-wing Christians, and there are approximately 19 million of them
in the country. They were eager to get the other 4 million. That was
pretty much Karl Rove's strategy to get Bush elected.

But given Bush's low popularity ratings and the enormous number of new
voters -- who skewed Democratic -- there is no way in the world that
Bush got 8 million more votes this time. I think it had a lot to do
with the electronic voting machines.

I gotta admit, I was ignorant to the fact that these new voting machines didn't have paper trails. But what democractic politician let that genius idea happen?!

The rug was just pulled out from under us all, people.

I gotta give the other side credit, because they did an amazing job if they did, in fact, cheat at the polls. Which will never know, apparently.

We're just left here holding our balls.

HAHA.

(I'm laughing, but I can't smile.)

Yeah I know I'm posting this yet again...forgive me, I just want to make sure lots of people see this. If I could start a thread, I'd leave it at that, but I've heard even the mods do this to get people's attention, so...

The Ohio Secretary of State, an African-American no less, needs to be told that we demand that Ohio's votes be counted. We can make this protest a little more meaningful by engaging in some Republican style dirty tricks.

Instead of e-mailing or sending letters demanding that the black box voting must be stopped...send FAXES. As the last page of your fax, send a black piece of paper like construction paper, saying this represents the black (hoodie??) you'll be wearing...the black voters who've been disenfranchised...the black representing the death of our right to vote...till our voting system is no longer held hostage by machines. Not only is this color appropriate, but thousands of people sending a black page will DEVOUR fax toner, and this will cause major inconvenience for them. These faxes won't be so easily ignored!

PLEASE help with this protest!! Address your faxed letters of protest to:

J. Kenneth Blackwell
Ohio Secretary of State
Fax: (614) 544-0649

<<Why are we always the rollover party? No wonder people don't think we'd defend the country. I really thought Kerry had more stones than this.>>>

Being nice doesn't help you win votes today. People say "how can the democrats fight the terrorists when they won't even fight the republicans." Americans don't like a dirty fighter but they really loathe someone who won't fight at all. We should have learned that in 88 with dukakis.

:puke:

<<Being nice doesn't help you win votes today. People say "how can the democrats fight the terrorists when they won't even fight the republicans." Americans don't like a dirty fighter but they really loathe someone who won't fight at all. We should have learned that in 88 with dukakis.>>

As President Clinton said, given the choice between "strong and wrong" and "right and weak," voters choose strong and wrong almost every time. Even at that, Kerry could have taken the EVs, thanks to huge anti-Bush sentiment.

I'm glad I'm not the only one here who remembers how Dukakis completely lost his huge lead over Bush 41, by being a wimp. I guess that should teach us never to run anybody from Massachusetts again, if that's the best caliber of candidate they can come up with. Just furthers the stereotype of the weak liberal, which pisses me off because many liberals are strong activists who want to take our country back! :mad:

I mean Kerry dropped us like a hot potato, so quick and unexpected that it made your head spin and what's worse, I think he KNEW that we had absolutely NO DEMOCRATIC LEADERSHIP to fall back on. That's like the parents moving out and leaving the kids in the old house without telling them the new address.

After months of sending me emails EVERDAY for money suddenly since Tuesday I haven't heard a damn word from Terry McAuliffe or Mary Beth Cahill or any of the other democratic fundraising organizations who had their hands so deep in my pockets that I thought a sex act was going on. I bet they are all off somewhere having a ball in the sun on some of that dough.

The minute anyone said "recount," thousands of * operatives were storming the place and no one could do a thing.

Maybe keeping quiet and gathering evidence first is a better idea.

Or who knows, maybe they have rolled over.

Do we want to give the wingnuts a rallying cry? They'd use the media to turn half the country (or more) against us. Even if Kerry proved fraud, no repub would ever accept his legitimacy after they'd spent weeks or months being brainwashed by B*sh thugs. No. The votes are going to be counted, regardless of a concession. Here's hoping there's also a great deal of investigation happening, as well. Some good statisticians would come in mighty handy, along with computer experts. The statisticians could help point us to the most likely precincts where fraud took place. Computer experts could handle investigating the machines.

But, then, I'm a hopeful person.

And I really, really never want to see another mob scene like Florida in 2000. That was ugly -- evil circus ugly -- and the wingnuts are definitely evil people, so this would have been beyond ugly. I think the right call was made.