Stolen? Duh. How many others have heard from repubs who voted Kerry?

Saturday night may not be the best night to start this thread, since it's usually slow. But I'd like to hear anecdotal evidence along with the obvious #'s that show just how stolen this election was.

My brother, nieces and nephews live in East Texas and rural Louisiana. We stopped talking politics years ago and I had just told Mom I was going to confront my brother about his religion distorting his logic one more time because I'm so furious over this election.

Guess what. My family called and they are furious. My entire family (southern Baptist, army reserve, conservative values, Bush voters in 2000) voted for Kerry. We're talking towns in Texas and Louisiana with less than 5000 population that are very Republican. So where are the Bush voters?

Didn't think so.

And I'll tell you something else. I think lots of repubs answered exit polls pretending to be dems.

Not bloodly likely

I was canvassing in a working class neighborhood, trying to get out the vote. I had a list of registered democrats but many said they just hadn't gotten around to changing their registration. I don't know how prevalent this was nationally but my heavily democratic district went Bush.

Relations with the man.

Somehow I think folks are less likely to tell you if they think they're gonna get their heads bitten off.

That said, I know several Repubs who went for Kerry or who voted Badnarik as a protest vote. I don't think I know any Dems who went for Bush. Actually I take that back. I do know one--a fairly moderate Dem--who switched to Bush because of 9/11. She's the only one, though.

I do know a couple independents/unaffiliateds who didn't vote in 2000 but went for Bush in this one. Maybe folks like them had an effect.

Bush lost. Pass it on!

to every repug i know that says voter fraud is BS and we just need to accept that our guy lost.

Kerry/Edwards bumperstickers everywhere... i was thinking that Bush would get about 55% of the vote here.

then i voted on a touchscreen.

We need to get it investigated:

The mainstream news media have been spoon fed a new word by Bush/Rove. That word is "evangelical," and they are babbling it excitedly like babes at a day care to the exclusion of some very real issues impacting the Bush Presidency.

The second Bush/Rove pabulum is the Bush "mandate," also being belched along with the evangelical pill. Meanwhile, no one seems to entertain the possibility that the Bush "mandate" may mostly be an Electoral WMD.

That is not to imply that Republican grassroots efforts, moral values, the evangelical vote were important especially in Ohio. No question. Kerry was up against it in a nation voting with its Bible and belly instead of its brain. But, those issues are instantly eclipsed by the following:

1. Electronic (BBV) voting, or any voting method that does not leave a permanent paper trail which can be audited is a felony to democracy.

The legitimacy of democratic elections is predicated upon the electorate's ability to verify election results. To deny the people or any candidate the option of a recount is directly contrary to the democratic principles upon which this nation was founded. Therefore any voting method not leaving a permanent verifiable record should be eradicated forever from the American political landscape.

2. Re: Exit polling, please no more excuses or distortions. Exit polling always correlates within 2% with voting tallies. We need answers, or in the absence thereof, a serious investigation of the following facts:

a. In Election 2004 the only exit polls that did not correlate closely with voting tallies were in states using BBV or a combination of methods including electronic machines. http://www.bluelemur.com/index.php?p=388" WHY?

b. In Election 2004, in every instance where there was significant statistical discrepancy between the exit polls and the voting tallies, George W. Bush was the recipient of additional votes and never John Kerry. WHY?

WI +4B MN +7B NC +9B FL +7B OH +6B CO +4B PA +5B NH +15B
NM +3B


http://www.washingtondispatch.com/spectrum/archives/000715.html
http://ustogether.org/Florida_Election.htm

http://www.michigancityin.com/articles/2004/11/04/news/news02.txt

***The statistical probability of a & b resulting from something other than random chance will be published shortly.

c. "The last wave of national exit polls we received, along with many other subscribers, showed Kerry winning the popular vote by 51 percent to 48 percent." http://nytimes.com/2004/11/05/politics/campaign/05poll.html

If you think that I am screaming fraud, you are missing the point. I submit that these issues should be thoroughly investigated, not in any attempt necessarily to overturn the election, but to pursue the truth which is the mainstay of any democracy and which used to be the heart and soul of news journalism.

I want accountability. We have had four years without any. And so many promised not to roll over. If this is not investigated, then we can canvass and drive voters to the polls kicking and screaming, but we cannot expect to have an honest election again.

time in their lives.

It was very satisfying back then. A week ago.....seems like a long long time ago

my family lives. All dems. You voting dem for the first time would be like me voting repub for the first time. I'm in Kansas and my vote has been lost for years. I imagine you used to feel the same.

We spent so much time in L.A. in my lifetime that it feels more like home than here.

I thank you for the switch, but if these guys don't get back up and fight for this, we all might be looking for a new party altogether.

I still deal with my fundie family from Montana - when I'm there visiting I definitely feel like the California "granola/liberal" and very much the outsider. (I would bet my dad even calls me a "pinko" behind my back. I know he at least thinks it.) They all listen to Rush, O'REilly and Savage. Thank God I broke away from that whole viewpoint!

I was thinking.. WHY would so many Democrats register, as Democrats, and THEN vote for Bush? Makes no sense. With supposed record numbers of new registrations and new voters, do they match up with the result? Or are we to believe that people would register as Democrats, then vote Bush? Makes no sense. I know NOT ONE democrat that voted for Bush.. not one.

I can think of at least 5 of my own family members, all lifelong staunch repugs, that voted for Kerry.

None of this makes sense, none of it.

The rest got suppressed or magically turned into * votes by Diebold hackers.

I keep hearing again and again-in fact I've heard it from Day uno, that the "far left" didn't like Kerry and thus WE didn't turn out our base.

Well, even if the base is "far left" I don't know anybody, Dean supporter on down that didn't vote Kerry here on DU-no matter how much they might have disliked Kerry. The stakes were too too high. We are not that stupid.The unity I saw on this board was very real.

Oh and the only Repulican I know voted for Kerry. But then he's not a fundie, but a money Republican.

or, at least they thought they did.

The lone Republican in my family-my uncle by marriage-voted for Kerry. My former Republucan colleagues voted for Kerry. As for Dems who voted for Bush? Not a one.

Someone mentioned New Voter Dem registrations. This subject should be (and probably soon will) on several threads alone.

I had a whole precinct to myself here in K.C. You cannot imagine the New Voters that were registered. They were noted as such on my list.
Many, many came out. But we had tons of other problems that I'm trying to comprehend still.

I ended up talking to people in many inner city precincts. They registered but never got cards. We were not told where the polling places were until the day before the election. The Board of Elections did not answer these questions and did not return calls.

The Sec. of State Matt Blunt was just elected governor. (Republican)
Some people working on elections have talked to me privately and named some names. So I am ready to do what I can when the fight begins.

But once again, it wasn't just the odd numbers in voting machines, it was disenfranchisement of the African American and poor.

Florida - 4 voters for Kerry that were Bush in 2000
Illinois - 2 voters for Kerry that were Bush in 2000
Michigan - 3 voters for Kerry that were Bush in 2000
1 voter newly registered voted for Kerry
Louisiana - 5 voters for Kerry that were Nader in 2000
2 newly registered voted for Kerry
2 voters for Kerry that were Bush in 2000
2 voters for Kerry that didn't vote in 2000
Totals:
11 people that voted for Bush in 2000 that went Kerry in 2004
5 people that voted for Nader in 2000 that went Kerry in 2004
5 new voters that voted for Kerry

21 Kerry voters that either voted for another candidate in 2000, didn't vote in 2000, or were voting in this election for the first time.

Everyone I know that voted for Gore, voted for Kerry

Election should have not even been close, should have been Kerry big time

Michigan:
1 Nader in 2000 --> Kerry in 2004
1 Bush in 2000 --> Kerry in 2004
alot of 18 year olds for Kerry, but significantly 1 voted for him as a pro-lifer because of Bush's birth control policies.

Rhode Island
2 Nader in 2000 --> Kerry in 2004

I don't know anyone that went from Gore to Kerry.

Colorado
Don't know his 2000 vote, but he was gung-ho and enlisted after 9.11. Now he's wearing an upside down flag on his shirt, pro Kerry.

i know a republican --- live free or die type -- that once read all the ann coulter he could get. now, he listens to franken and democracy now -- so degraded is his respect for conservative media, that he's gone lefty. -- he voted kerry

another republican i know abstained.

one democrat i know voted for bush, but he voted for bush in 2000, so . . . no bigee.

all the rest of the known world of friends and acquaintances i have that i know voted, voted for kerry. but, most of the people i know read, and often read books other than and sometimes in addition to, the bible.

And I don't know a helluva lot of people :)

in my city. They are the least extremist among several right wing talk show hosts on the same station. I'm willing to bet that quite a few moderate Republicans voted for Kerry. If that's the case, then Bush received far more than 8 million new votes in 2004 than in 2000 because he lost some voters from 2000 (provided no Gore voters switched to Bush this time - which seems pretty unlikely).

Just a few I've gathered up this evening, some pretty damned compelling:

Kerry Margins: Paper-ballot and Non-paper ballot states... (by TrutIsAll)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2612492

Take a look at these interesting numbers...... (FL)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2623514
Chart Links:


**WEIRD FL NUMBERS - BRAND NEW**
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x23860#24284
Link to file: http://www.rubberbug.com/temp/FloridaDifferences.htm

New statistics on Florida fraud - please share (Faun Otter)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x27702

Here we Go, Florida Democrat (Candidate) Goes to the FBI
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2620704

Graph of Florida by County by Voting Machine - Change from 2000 to 2004
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=2615219&mesg_id=2615219

Denial, Anger, Action
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=2619207&mesg_id=2619207

Calling all DUers - My husband is a Ph.D. statistician and
(see esp. post #17)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=26421#
DU Home Page (w/Graphs mentioned in opening post of thread): http://www.democraticunderground.com/ or see this thread:

The Exit Polls vs. the Actuals: Who do you believe-CNN or your lying eyes?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2617461

Exit polls analysis versus reported vote count (by Faun Otter)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=11874&mesg_id=11874

In this thread we post all the evidence of vote fraud.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=1333866

New tabulation of voting methods, vendors by population in state.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2617492

Still don't believe they stole it? Look here (by tkmorris)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1333746
table link: http://ustogether.org/Florida_Election.htm

Have Hard Vote Fraud Evidence!? - RESPOND HERE PLZ
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=201&topic_id=1624#1759

A Whole Forum of Various Voting Problems:
Report Voting Problems
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topics&forum=201
Including: According to Florida voter data this election was stolen. PERIOD
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=201x1274


-----------------------------
Election-day footage from Michael Moore: Video the Vote
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x965827
Link: http://www.boingboing.net/2004/11/06/electionday_footage_.html

The statisticians who designed the exit polls
Do they accept that their results were off-base?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x27547

List of links to election articles
http://inn.globalfreepress.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=980

============================

Nader, Cobb and Badnerik to request recounts in NH (Nader) and OH (Cobb and Badnerik):

DU INFO ALERT: Why Recounting in New Hampshire Could Save Democracy
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2617155

Need Some DU Help w/New Hampshire Stuff!!! (URGENT)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=26802&mesg_id=26802

RALPH NADER MAY SAVE THE WORLD!!! (Its NOT Over in NH!) Updated Fri 8:15p
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x25116

Nader requests NH vote recount. (Did we just make a huge blunder?)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=965216

Nader, Cobb and Badnarik may all be willing to look into recounts in
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x26843

I came out of the initial coma on Wednesday.

I printed off just the chart that showed totals of supposed new Bush votes in 2004 that was seperated by Red States, Swing, Blue and had the negative votes from Washington and California.

Everyone I've shown it to is shocked.

I'm an idiot at the computer, but somehow we need to keep these charts kicked and easily available to everyone here. The word is creeping out to mainstream

party affiliations. I do have one friend, West Point graduate and career army, who I know is a registered Republican. We haven't always seen eye-to-eye on events, like the war, but I know that he voted for Kerry in both the Virginia primary and in the general election. Everyone I know voted for Kerry with enthusiasm and are devastated at the results.;(

I live in a red district, but the only people that I know who voted for Bush* are my Freeper mother and brother. When I expressed my distress over the children being maimed and killed in Fallujah, my mother suggested that I go over there and take care of them, so there's, obviously, no hope for them, anyway.:shrug:

Oh, I almost forgot the guy, with the toothpick sticking out of his mouth, who took exception to the Kerry-Edwards buttons on my jacket and the "New Yorkers for Kerry-Edwards" bumper sticker on my car, in the parking lot of my local PetsMart. He stuck out his chest and proclaimed "I'm a Bush* man!" I thought about all the things I wanted to say, and you know that that we have plenty of ammunition. But I knew that this loser was a lost cause, so I just burst out laughing!:D

Since I've been wearing my campaign buttons, people who I barely know, like clerks in stores, or fellow customers, have been coming up to me and saying that they agree and can't wait for the day when Bush* is history.:-(

My jaw dropped when I learned my freeper brother voted Kerry. We're talking a man who's retiring from the Army Reserve this month. A man that volunteered for Vietnam.

I'm sorry you have to deal with your mother's attitude. Where is their compassion? I lived in the Middle East and those people are just that. People. Actually, wonderful, warm and loving people.
These are atrocities occuring in Fallujah right now and I feel exceptionally helpless. I always can count on DU to find sanity.
Thanks.

It's just what we need right now, a coming together and a healing. I don't know what the next weeks will bring, but I haven't given up hope, not yet, anyway. John Kerry and John Edwards are experienced and intelligent men and I trust them, or I wouldn't have voted for them.:-)

If your brother and my West Point friend voted for them, then they have to have projected something very special. Where and why were you in the Middle East? My home forum on DU has been I/P, since the situation there breaks my heart, and Bush* has totally ignored it. After Bill Clinton worked so hard for peace, this bastard just shrugged and said that they would always be enemies there.:grr:

As for my mother's attitude, I've totally given up, though it makes me very sad. She says that my father, who died young, would be ashamed of me, because he supported and was friends with local Republicans. This really hurts, since I know that my Dad would never have been ashamed of me and I cannot imagine that he could possibly have supported this insanity. He was an intelligent man and I could have talked with him. My mother, when I asked her, said that the Palestinians flew into the World Trade Center on 9/11, so go figure? There are people who are like this and they vote.;(

My heart goes out to the people of Fallujah, those who remained, but where would they go? 51% of the Iraqi population is 15 and under, so the greatest threat is for the children. We already killed thousands during the 12 years of sanctions. And many are still sick, now. And we wonder why they hate us. We needed to start over here, but it doesn't look like it's going to happen.;(

So flying was free anywhere in the world. When I'm posting I'm always wondering if people think "what a liar, she says she lived everywhere" lol. Well, I was very fortunate and I did.

My family never used their free passes so when I turned 18 I headed for Cairo by myself. I had been a dancer all my life and I went to study oriental (what people here call belly) dancing. I developed a relationship with a med student and we kept in contact for almost 10 years. He is now back in Syria and I have had no luck finding him. Little info comes from there.

1980 I was too old to travel free, but I got a job as a dancer on a Greek cruise ship for a year. We were in Greece, Turkey, Israel/Palestine and Egypt. We actually were on our way to Egypt when Anwar Sadat was assassinated, which was a huge turning point in Mid-East history.

I can't tell you what a different county Israel was in 1981. There was one bombing during the year we were there. The Arabs and Israels lived together and made it work. It is a beautiful country and my second favorite only to Italy.

I do not recognize the place I see now on TV. We had checkpoints but nothing like this. Tel Aviv might as well be any American city.
I hate all those skyscrapers. The Palestinian situation is a nightmare. Have you seen the docu "Behind The Fence" or "Killing Ground"? I found them on Free Speech and Link TV. The last two weeks of bulldozing breaks my heart. Yet, this is a subject not even Kerry could mention. And I'm sure you know about Vannunu who told the world Israel has nukes, WMD's everything.

Now that I've told you the life story (it's quite complicated) I'll just add that the only reason I have not been overseas since 1990 is because I was diagnosed with MS that year. Things are getting better and I am planning to go next summer.

I ventured into the I/P forum once when I was a newbie non poster
and the discussion was so enraged that I didn't enter. I am quite passionate about Palestine and as a newbie I might have gotten kicked out. Think I will come and take another look now. You are both compassionate and logical to understand the real story of our Arab friends. As they say in Arabic "Man erhabe?" Who's the terrorist?

I certainly believe you, since I have had some interesting experiences, myself, as did my father.:shrug:

My Dad traveled all over the world and he flew TWA! I lost him several years ago, at far too young an age, and have always been grateful that he was able to see all the places in the world that he most wanted to see. This was not just his hobby, but his passion. Every year, he planned a trip, down to the smallest detail, for his vacation. In 1985, he visited Egypt and the Middle East. I will always remember the year, since I had to call him in Cairo, which was not an easy thing to do, to let him know about the death of his younger brother, at age 47. This haunts me, since I had to break that terrible news.;(

My Dad was in Egypt in May of that year, since my uncle died on May 1st, and, in June, they had that terrible hijacking of a TWA flight which went from Rome to Athens to Cairo. They determined that security was breached in Athens, and my Dad followed the news reports closely, saying, when they showed footage of the Athens airport, that he had just been right there and remembered this, etc.
:scared:

This particularly sticks in my mind, since I remember the TIME Magazine cover, a close-up of the hijacker with a gun to the pilot's head. The pilot was Capt. John Testrake, and my Dad had taken that flight.
:scared:

Also, my father visited Jordan on that trip. He flew from Cairo to Amman. Fortunately, he was very friendly, and would chat up anybody. On the flight to Amman, which was still on the tarmac in Cairo, my Dad chatted with the man sitting next to him. My mother, who was with him, complained that all these men, mostly dressed in black, were smoking while the plane was still on the ground. My Dad, trying to be friendly, asked the guy in the next seat if he thought that it would be as hot in Amman as it had been in Cairo. The man replied, "This plane does not go to Amman. This plane goes to Baghdad!" Oops! The first close call! If it hadn't been for my Dad's friendliness, my parents would have ended up in Iraq!!! Yikes!
:scared:

And no, I have never seen either of those films. Thank you. They sound like ones that I should definitely see.:-)

And the Palestinian situation also breaks my heart. I have spent much of my time on DU in I/P, though not lately. There is so much going on, that it is tough to keep up. I know very well how Bush* feels on this issue, and why, but expected more from Kerry. Clinton was just excellent in this, but this is one of the main reasons that Bush* won't touch it. It's a Clinton issue, as are the threats of North Korea and Osama bin Laden. He's just suck a jerk.:grr:

Thanks so much for your post and keep in touch. I was also very ill, but am now better. I am so glad that you are, as well. Yes, you have to exercise care in posting in I/P, but I think that you will learn your way around more quickly than others. The most important thing to remember is that it's okay to criticize the message (though this could provoke whoever posted it), but never the messenger. That is the hard and fast rule on DU, and adhering to this should keep you safe. And being reasonable will make you friends there, as I've discovered.:pals:

Your Dad probably took flight 840 from JFK to Rome. It would change from a 747 to a 727 and then it changed numbers. I used to know the number. It then went to Athens and on to Cairo. Yep, that was my flight.

That flight was also bombed on a return flight from Athens to Rome. I sat next to John Testrake on a flight a few years later. He was a big hero here in K.C.

I have been getting so confused with the BBV posts, I'm spending a lot of time on them. About two hours ago, I just found the Elizabeth Edwards post and then I found the "My name is Stephen.." post. I have reading for hours and I thought I recognized "Rhiannon" (I have two Burmese cats and I'm a cat fanatic") I still didn't get to the bottom of the "my name is" post. I can't believe I haven't seen it until today. It's amazing. I'm going to add my name and try to get contact with others here in K.C. area to hold a house party, but I've been a bad girl. I promised I would not stay on this long tonight. This place is so addictive. I have to make myself go to sleep.

I wondered why your Mom does not have compassion for those in the places she visited? My Dad was like that until I drug him along with me. He stopped stereotyping people after that. You must miss your Dad. I lost mine two years ago.

BTW looks terrible in Fallujah. Those fake military video feeds of them taking the hospital. A few weeks ago they were shooting at the ambulances and now they're going to rescue the hospital. Sickening

Yes, that was the flight that my Dad took, and the whole ensuing hijacking, along with his close call in Cairo, made me aware of how dangerous it can be.
:scared:

Yes, it sure is a small world. I live in a small town in Upstate NY. I was only aware of two other DUers who come from my town, and one of them turned me on to DU. But, in the lead-up to the election, a new DUer invited fellow Upstate New Yorkers to her home to watch a series of political films. It turned out that, not only does she live in my town, but less than a mile away!:o

I'm sure that there are many more like-minded people in your vicinity, since I live in a blue state, but in a red district. Actually, most of NY is red, but we're blue only because of NYC. Democrats just can't win here, no matter how gifted or charismatic or likable that they are.;(

That's totally cool that you met Capt. Testrake! I will always remember his name and that chilling photo. He really was a hero.
:scared:

I'm confused with the BBV stories, as well. I just know that things went really wrong and we should have been prepared for this. Bev Harris, who is a member of this forum, worked so very hard to prevent this and I feel not only angry, for her, but angry that we all had such high hopes and it's turned into a worse mess than 2000.:grr:

No, my mother does not have compassion, neither for me, nor those in the many places that she visited. Any compassion that I have, for both people and animals, I get from my Dad, who had compassion for both. I visited the USSR, shortly before it fell, as part of a peace group with my paternal grandmother. People would ask me about it, but my mother would preempt my answer, since she is Polish, and has no love for Russians. I found it to be the trip of a lifetime, since the people were so kind and welcoming and I found many kindred spirits. They fought WWII on their own land, and experienced incredible hardship, so they are absolutely dedicated to keeping the peace.:-)

My Dad was just great with people, and I know that he got this from my grandmother, since his father also died young. I enjoyed his stories, from his many travels, so much. In China, he spoke with young university students, who would fight over my Dad, since they wanted the chance to talk with him, to practice their English, LOL! And on the return plane trip, from China, my Dad taught the elderly Chinese man, sitting next to him, how to use a knife and fork! And there was the time that he raced all over JFK airport, searching for someone who spoke Spanish, since there was a young man, newly arrived in this country, who was supposed to meet the person who had arrived to pick him up, and he had this person on the phone, but he didn't understand English and his ride didn't understand Spanish. My Dad had many such stories. I miss him terribly and I'm so sorry to hear that you also lost yours.;(

Yes, the Stephen post is truly amazing. I just hope that the Freepers don't discover it, since we've had a rise in the number of disruptors, just now. I also love cats and dogs. I still have my two little dogs, both rescue, but lost my kitty in February, which was especially hard, since she was the one pet who I rescued myself.;(

And here's my beloved Rhiannon:

Puh-leeze....I personally spoke with several Republicans who were voting for Kerry. There was even a group called "Republicans for Kerry" that was active nationwide. I never saw a "Democrats for Bush" organization.

I would love to see those numbers, to see how many dems registered and 'never showed up' at the polls. Of course there would be plenty that would not vote, but Bush* is so hated that people dared 2hour lines or more just to vote his ass out. This moral values bullshit is just that, bullshit. Moral values is what made the country unite against Bush*, because he is as immoral as they come.

Also if anyone has new Dem registration compared with new repub registration that would be interesting.

As for people turning, I know two super ridiculous fundie nuts at work that are pro-bush, but only one was registered to vote. The one that I have talked to more is a real subject of Orwell. She said this to me after admitting there were no WMD, no link to AlQaida and threats concerning Iraq.

Quote:
"Well there is a reason we are there, It's just that they AREN'T ALLOWED TO TELL US THE REAL REASONS for our own good"---
I think she gets a free membership in the Fascism Is Awesome club.

Even in the suburbs where I work 75% of the people were antibush. I even talked to two people there that admitted voting Bush* in 2000 and were extremley pissed and wanted him out now. (one lost his good job, the other graduated from college and said, "then i saw the real world")

There is no way that bush* gained 7+million votes, its FRAUD.


TWL

at my college was very open in his support for Kerry and is screaming "VOTER FRAUD" as loud as he can across the student listserv now.