Time to Sue the DNC and Kerry for Breach of Contract?

I gave to a legal fund repersented as being for the the express purpose of making sure that all the votes were counted.

All Americans are stakeholders in this process, and all those who donated to the Legal Fund have a reasonable expectation that those funds be used to facilitate efforts to fight election fraud.

With the wildly uneven availability of voting machines, the misdirection of voters, the votes for Democrats that wound up in other tallies, pollworkers who say that fewer votes were cast than show up on the SOS website, there are more than enough irregularities to justitify that we demand the funds that were raised presumably to fight court challanges so we could get the votes counted be used to get the votes counted.

The scilence of the Dems has been remarked on here.
I have been listening with amazement to silence or "Move-On Folks" from the Democratic National Committee, Kerry, Edwards, Dean, Al Sharpton, Clark, Hillary Clinton, Jessie Jackson, and various spokesman . The only thing that I can figure is that the Thugs have some dear member of each famliy held hostage.

I like Kerry, and I think he would be an outstanding President. If the only way to get the votes counted is to sue to get Kerry to preform, then that is what we must do.
They can't call Kerry a sore looser if he is compelled by suit to do due diligence in this matter.

ic

Tearing us apart, or making our "leadership" step up and lead?

Not monatary damages.

We want them to quit playing Rover and FIGHT!!

These guys sold us down the river.

We are now, indeed, living in a one-party state.

The Democratic party is the Alan Colmes of the GOP/Hannity show.

The democratic party is simply there for the show. To give the illusion.

Nader was way ahead of all of us. He was right.

We need a new party and we need new leaders.

The Democratic party is dead. Long live the new party, whatever it is

Got any ideas?

I'm bad with titles. I have no idea what to call it.

All I care about is truth. How about The Truth Party?

Soon enough, there will only be the GOP!

There is no legal cause of action, not to mention that it would be a really dumb political move.

The e-mail solitications for the Legal Fund have the weight of a contract in the hands of a good lawyer.

Anyone who donated has standing.

I don't remember that one from law school. There is no cause of action -- to suggest there is would make it impossible for a political campaign or other organization ever to request donations if doing so would create an enforceable promise to perform. Solicitations for donations from the general public don't create a contract. Period.

If one solicits money under false pretenses there is a word for that.

I gave them money for a very specific purpose. AND I WANT IT USED FOR THAT PURPOSE!!!

Besides the message this would give to the world, we really don't know what Kerry and the DNC are doing, and we don't know how they are spending the donations.

I personally would rather give Kerry the benefit of the doubt.

:think:

Leadership is do what they need to do to get the vote counted.

do you have a link for the fund? :shrug:

Dear Elizabeth,

We've got to spend every dollar as carefully and wisely as we can between now and November. And as we learned in Florida in 2000, we have to expect the unexpected on and after Election Day. That's why I'm writing to ask for your immediate help on a very special project.

Election Day is several weeks away, but our campaign is already considering our options should John Kerry or George Bush pursue a recount like the famous Florida ballot dispute in 2000. That year, the Bush campaign raised more than $14 million in the Florida crisis, compared to Al Gore's campaign, which raised $3.2 million. We can never again be outspent 4-to-1 in such a critical situation.

Help us get a head start funding our recount efforts:

https://contribute.johnkerry.com

Our campaign is asking the Federal Election Commission whether we could use our GELAC fund to pay the expenses associated with a recount effort. We are optimistic that the FEC will rule by the end of the month. But we can't wait. We need to begin raising funds now.

Your GELAC contribution will also help in other vital and even more immediate ways. It can free up more of the limited public funds we have available to buy media, support candidate travel, and pay for direct contact with voters. Here's how it works. The law allows candidates like John Kerry, who accept public financing, to raise private contributions to cover legal, accounting, and related administrative costs. Without sufficient GELAC funds, we would have to divert portions of our public financing allotment to cover those costs.

That's a step we simply can't afford to take.

Contribute to our critical GELAC fund here:

https://contribute.johnkerry.com

I urge you to help us raise the maximum for GELAC. That way, we can spend our entire general election budget on the things that matter the most. That's our goal. Please act today to help us meet it.

Thank you,

Mary Beth Cahill
Campaign Manager







Paid for by Kerry-Edwards 2004 General Election Legal and Accounting Compliance Fund.




We apologize if you received this message in error. Click here to unsubscribe from our mailing list.

Contributions or gifts to Kerry-Edwards 2004 General Election Legal and Accounting Compliance Fund are not deductible for federal income tax purposes. Federal law requires us to use our best efforts to collect and report the name, mailing address, occupation and name of employer of individuals whose contributions exceed $200 in an election cycle.

Contributions to the Kerry-Edwards 2004 General Election Legal and Accounting Compliance Fund will be used solely for legal and accounting services to ensure compliance with Federal law. Federal law prohibits private contributions to the candidates' general election account.

Kerry-Edwards 2004, P.O. Box 34640, Washington DC, 20043, U.S.A.

now that you mention it, how they managed to keep Sharpton in line this time?!!!! Afraid that as Gore said before the blacks would take the brunt of abuse in a damaging useless cause? Something is up or they are just believing all they read in the coporate newspapers.


I say wait and see. Encouraging the Dems to vote against lawsuit damages with the Bush agenda might be counter productive at this stage.

I think many that are silent now have flunked the Democratic test- big time. I hope not all, but we WILL see.

for re-election in 1972.

But there's been a lot more crime in this election!

The crimes can't be proven fast enough to make a difference in this election, but they will be a factor on down the road.

If the DNC is doing what they can to investigate and study relevent laws, they better level with us.

I think they better fight to save Democracy NOW, it won't get any easier as this kamikazee regime goes on.

that we need someone to step and take some leadership now, this fight is too difficult without some one to articulate this message. No one is going to do it for us, and if Kerry can't or won't, we need to look for someone who will. In fact, it's out of loyalty to Kerry that we would bring suit.

Now Backwell if he has his way will send the tallys in by carrier snail.

the election was over and certified. ACtually, if he had let the Watergate burglers take the fall and did not try to stonewall their prosecution, he was in no danger of impeachment. And actual impeachment never happened, it was coming and Nixon resigned in anticipation of it.

The Younger Thugs in Congress are for the most part partners in Bush's crimes. Getting an impeachment out of them won't be easy.

in a criminal case. On behalf of his client who was being prosecuted for murder, he introduced a motion that the client, a 24 year old man, killed his victim in self-defense. The victim was 14 years old, she had been kidnapped, and of course she fought back as best she could.

I'm just saying the idea of bringing any kind of suit against John Kerry or the DNC is on that level of absurdity.

I thought I was beyond being shocked at the level of disparagement towards Kerry, but this just takes the cake.

:wtf:

http://www.archives.gov/federal_register/electoral_college/provisions.html

Kerry needs to have a reasonable basis for stopping the certification of Ohio Republican Electors, or those will be the legal electors for the purpose of the election, then our only hope would be the protocal for objection laid out in Section 15, which amounts to the congress electing the President with each state having one vote. Not good.

get him to ACT.

backlash from people who aren't reading these posts, from his party, etc. This would also allow him to immediately spend his time working on the pressing issues without having to screw around with so much politics. I don't know if it's fault individually, or the system, that makes this so difficult. But this might help that.

John Kerry is an attorney. He will avail himself of all remedies at his disposal. Should we hamstring him by causing a potential conflict of interest? I think not.

The entire situation is too complex. I do give John Kerry the benefit of the doubt and would not ever be part of any class action suit which put me in an antagonistic position towards the candidate that I believe won this election.

Also, by the time your lawsuit was filed and acted upon, when you consider the delaying tactics the DNC would engage, you'll be looking back at the year 2004 as a distant memory. Legal wheels in such situations turn very slowly. Look at the crap that Ohio is throwing out as obstacles at the thought of a mere recount.

Peace.

And and emergency hearings are done all the time.

Plus it need not be a Class Action suit, unless one REALLY wanted to file for consequent damages. Which is not my plan.

I want to take a positive, productive approach. Any kind of lawsuit or legal action can be extremely draining, physically and financially. I just don't see a winning position for either side.

Worse, it will hand ammunition to the Repubs who consider Dems to be overly litigious. Have you actually discussed this case with an attorney whose specialty encompasses the sort of action you are contemplating?

If you go forward with this, I think the media will have an absolute field day with the idea of Kerry's "disgruntled supporters" suing the DNC and Kerry, I honestly do. And make no mistake, you will be labeled as "Kerry's jilted lovers" by the media.

Just my fair warning to someone whose heart I know is in the right place.

We should get it spent on recounts.
Pay for the Recount and get Ohio to get on with it.

As for what they may call me, bring it on, can't be a worse alternative than the death, destruction, environmental rape, job loss, packing of the Supream Court, and the prospect of another stolen election in 2006 will cause.

I'm like you this takes the cake! These people have totally lost it around here. Hell they havn't even finished counting the damn votes for the first time there's going to be a recount but haow the hell do you have a recount when the first count hasn't been finished. By law they have until Dec 6 to get the first count finished. Yeah it sucks yes it would be nice if they would move a little faster but it don't matter how long they take as long as they get it done by Dec 6. There is not one damn thing that Kerry, Glibs, or anyone else can do to change that it's the law. Yes Kerry conceded so fucking what there is nothing leagally binding about it. And oh my god Kerry's got all that money and not giving it to Bev at BBV oh what a crime. Get fuckin real he's is not allowed to give campaign funds to a private organization. Oh hell Kerry sitting on his ass doing nothig oh my god. Do any of you have the proof he is doing nothing I mean real proof not some damn article from a paper, or something some right wing nut in the media has said, I mean real proof. I seriously doubt you do no more than I have proof he is. Anyone here work for Kerry and got a way yo prove you do so you can varify that he is doing nothing. I seriously fuckin doubt that either because if you worked for the man you wouldn't be sitting here making the dumbass remarks you are. This man knows what the hell he is doing he don't need a bunch of armchair monday night quarterbacks telling him what to do and how to do. If all you people are so damn smart and know how to do everything and can do it so much better why the hell are you sitting on your A$$ behind a computer screen playing god, judge, and jury instead why wasn't it you that was off your A$$ and ran for president? Why aren't you a senator? Give me a fuckin break. Why don't you go buy a can of raid and spray it down your pants and kill off the fuckin ants and give it a rest already. Damn things don't happen overnight, there is a process that has to be followed, laws that has to be abided by, and there is more than one way to do things. Because Kerry hasn't took a running dive off the damn cliff to suit those who don't have patience doesn't mean he isn't doing anything. The shit is getting so deep around here even having your damn boots on isn't going to help. It keep's going people are going to drown in it.

Do you understand US code Title 3 section 5?

The electors chosen on Dec 6 ARE the electors that will elect the president.
On DEC 6 there will not BE any more time.

Yes we can challange.
US Code Title 3,Section 15, At that point it will take millions in the streets to sway congress NOT to re-appoint shrub.

I said that I seriously doubt you had proof that he wasn't doing anything no more than I have proof he does. So there is your answer NO I don't have proof he is. Now you answer mine do you have proof he isn't? And like I said real proof not some article, something some right wing nut said on TV, or your retoric I mean real proof. Again I seriously doubt it. Because you would have to be working for the man to know exactly what he is doing. And we can tell you don't work for him that is quite obvious by your dumbass remarks. I never said anything about you couldn't challenge anything. But if you think trying sue will solve all your problems go for. That is the most ridiculous shit yet. I have never seen so many people that think they know it all and can do everything so much better the canidates themselves. Again since you are so smart, know how to do everything better, and could do it so much better why didn't you run for president? Why are you not a senator? Since you are such a know it all better than the other guy person why is it you are sitting on you a$$ behind a computer screen trying to be god, judge, and jury? Oh I forgot you are the type that thinks eating your own, playing the blame game, making threats, and doing armchair monday night quarter backing will save the world.

to save the world.

I can not prove that Kerry is doing nothing, other than to say that no suits or briefs have been filed in Ohio in his name, that I know of. Nothing with Kerry as a plainiff comes up on a docket search.



I have limited resources and gave all I could to the DNC and then some. They have 10 times the resources because we gave them the resources.

we need to get Him/them to get serious about fighting this thing.

And while I understand your frustration, Fighting me is not going to get it done either.

........My arguing with you isn't getting the job done either. But my point is suing is not the answer either. That is cutting your nose off to spite your face. Eating your own will not solve anything. I think you have to wait till the first count is finished before you start screaming. I am in no way sayin Kerry shouldn't step up to the plate but the results of the first count need to be finished first. He has until Dec.12 or 13 (can't remember which one for sure I would have to check) to do something. I know that don't sound like a long time but all he has to do is come out say he is unconceding and that will put a halt to this election until everything gets done. To be honest I look for him to do it between the 8th-10th. The reason I say this it is Wed. - Fri. and I think he will do it late in the week. But again I can't say for sure what he will do and when. I will have to see. But from what I know about Kerry I strongly feel he will he hasn't quit fighting.

Million to One Shot

Before Dec 6 the guy with the most votes counted gets certifed electors. After Dec 6 it gets REALLY MESSY.

the link is to the Constitutional section, Ammendments and US Code governing the election is upthread.

It will help nothing, and is akin to eating your own.
Kerry/Edwards must have an excellent reason for not filing
lawsuits at this time. I don't know what their reasons are,
but believe me they have good reasons. They are in the know
far more than me or you or anyone else at DU.

Let me know if I am wrong, but no one has actually seen them trying to help get axcess to the central Tabulators or the internals of the Opti-Scan software.

And CaseOhio, the Ohio Democratic party and GLIb are doing the heavy lifting on getting a recount in Ohio.

A recount that the DNC has money sitting in the bank for, if we can get them to spend it.

if the Democratic Party can't beat George Bush, the worst president ever, a gangster, a liar, a murderer and a war criminal ....

Well then they can't beat anybody. They couldn't beat a dead man.

So they're done. Toast. I'm through with them. They're either completely 100% stupid and incompetent, or else they're in bed with the GOP and they sold us down the river.

Either way I want NOTHING to do with them. Ever again.

bite off your nose to spite your face.

The legal burdens that have to be shifted mount with every day.

Go read the US Code Title 3, posted elseware in this thread.

Lets do whatever it takes to "Get the Ball Rolling".

This is an interesting angle: thinking outside the box. I'm too busy cooking late tonight, but I'm coming back to read all the responses both pro & con. I've wondered the same thing: What!? do the thugs have some dear member of each family held hostage? Thanks for the thoughts.

I have to say this is the most STUPID idea I've heard in a long time! Tell me - do you beat your spouse or child while telling them it's for their own good? You want a money back guarantee on everything in life? Let's make it simple, you bet on a horse race ... you don't kick the crap out of the horse or throw the jockey to the ground before the damn judges make the final call? How much did you donate, maybe we can pass around a collection plate for you so you won't feel so cheated. But if the horse comes up a winner, you better line your butt back up against the "looser" horses. No claiming it's your horse after the race is done! BTW - Most horses don't win first time on the track, their owners know they have to invest time, MONEY, training & faith in them to nail the big one!

okay /rant off! unless I hear one more crybaby 'donater' tonight!:spank: :cry:

asking for an expedited canvass, or a concurrent recount, which would be expensive since only poll workers are allowed to handle ballots, it would mean Ohio hireing extra assistances.

The Democratic party has enough in the legal fund to pay for that, the GLib don't.

--it wasn't a "gamble"--the money was not donated to make Kerry a winner but to fund whatever legal and other processes were needed to initiate and follow through a "fair counting of the votes"--it wasn't a "gamble," it was expressed specifically in a letter soliciting donations as having a specific purpose. And so far Kerry appears to be laughing all the way to the bank. I will NEVER vote for him or for any Democratic Party candidate ever again in my life.

Did it ever occur to the asylum here that after the recount there are still potential legal battles that will probably be in the wings? Or as you said "fund whatever legal and other processes were needed to initiate and follow through ...". Sure, sue your candidate, whining about 'I want & I want it now' - throw unneeded funds into the recount already funded (which has to wait for the (FIRST COUNT - duh!?) Then, when the *ush machine gears up to challenge everything that comes out of that recount, you can scream about how they pissed away the money, why didn't they save some for the legal battles?!

As far as this isn't about a horserace or a gamble - it sure as hell is! Quit beating on your jockey before the race is called. The recounts & the aftermath are all a part of it - t'aint all neat & tidy like the playground. All I'm seeing with all this screaming & threats are a bunch of back seat drivers - if you didn't trust him why did you contribute to him? If you don't trust him now, don't contribute again. Walk away, sign up on the republican team, I'm SURE they spend your donations there according to your every desire.

BTW - if you do go GOP, be sure to use the same crap on them too, please! Sue, baby - sue!

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

And Blackwell and Co. are trying to have the recounts stopped as being frivilious, because the GLibs can't win.

Only Kerry or Edwards can overcome this arguement.

I get http:page not found.

My feelings exactly! I donated lots of money to the DNC to help elect Dems to office. I don't feel that my money was wisely used if it was used at all. Why is John Kerry keeping my money? For a future run for the Senate of Mass. I am very UNHAPPY over this entire affair.
As the old saying goes "Trick Me Once Shame on You"
"Trick Me Twice Shame on Me".

:toast: :toast: :beer: :hi:

for funds in case Kerry needed to make a legal challenge. I expect him to use the funds now to make that challenge. If he doesn't he can kiss any future support for him on my part good-bye. I won't ever ride such a wimpy donkey again!

I am part of a Democratic club in a fairly conservation part of CA -- and I have to admit that a lot of the people in the club were always more progressive that Kerry and for most, Kerry was not our first choice. But we backed him with everything we had nonetheless. I think I speak for the majority that if Kerry doesn't show some backbone and challenge this election, he need not apply again for our support.

I have a hard time sitting back while someone tells me they "know better than me." So, when exactly IS Kerry supposed to take some visible action? Seems to me rallying his supporters and taking action against the injustices in the election have to move to the forefront.

I HOPE he knows better than me, but there's an awful lot of good stuff that comes off this forum from these types of discussions that can be put to good us in these efforts - after all it's everyone's effort - not just Kerry's or the democrats! Blind loyalty is really not very well advised when we are under assault as we are.

I'll go along with that

Maybe we should sue to get our money back

Frustrated.

Luckily I was broke at the time he sent around this appeal or I might have fallen for his bullshit too and sent some. I agree with you completely and would be ready to sue too, for solicitation of money under false pretenses. "Charitable" organizations get shut down all the time for this offense. The man is a wimp, no doubt about it. Nobody can convince me he is "secretly" fighting the election results, or doing it "under the radar"--and even if that were true, it just shows general lack of balls--whatsamatter, afraid to come out and fight openly??

I see people trying to "read the tea leaves" of every Kerry speech or announcement since the election, searching for that "hidden message"--please! a real "leader" would have the balls to address this issue openly and the talent and charisma to rally the people into a resistance of the election fraud that happened. But he's got his cushy Senate job back so what does he care? The people fell for his line of crapola, that's apparently all that matters.

Kerry was NOT my candidate, in fact he was no. 8 of the 9, just above Lieberman. The man was forced down my throat and now does not have the cajones to stand up to the most transparently evil and cheatingest, most dishonest, arrogant, and unqualified "president" the country has ever seen.

I've had it up to here with the Democratic Party and their "electable" loser candidates. I will never send them another dime and will never vote for anyone they run for office. Count me in on a people's 3rd party.

So flame me, like I care.

Each week is producing results...we're making more headway then if the media was to jump in on this with their op-eds..especially FOX-Limbaugh-Hannity BS.

By Jan 6th this thing will be exploded wide open or it won't...it's quite that simple. Bev Harris?...I love ya babe!

Why don't some of you get of your lazy asses and protest like they are over in the Ukraine?...or do you have to be from New York to get it together???