A Response to "You Lost get over it"

If I lost Because you Cheated, I am well with in my rights to point out the rules of the game. I have to do this to ensure a fair game the next time we play. other wise why should we play at all. If some one wins by cheating, there is no winner.

This is why we need to investigate. If not by this election, then the system must be fixed by the next one. We need Confidence that the leader was chosen by the people. The Blind faith argument does not work. We need Voter Verify-able Paper Trails we need a Non-Partisan Auditing Commission.

This is the only way to be positive that the 14th amendment of our constitution not be violated.

Under the 14th Amendment separate is not equal. I believe the Equal protections act is violated by Splitting the voters into 3 classes. that would be the People who Voted using paper ballots who can have their votes recounted if necessary. The people who voted on Paperless Ballots who's Vote total is gone once the votes are up loaded to the central tabulator. And the "Super Voters" The ones in control of the Central tabulator.

This is why the Press was locked out in Ohio. This is why poll tapes were found in the trash in Florida. These were the Acts of the "Super Voters" they won't let the cameras watch the counting because they don't want to get caught rigging the machine.

And even if It does not help in 04, we better do every thing in our power to make damn sure that the Full bore non partisan auditing system is in place by 06.

If it is not fixed by 08, And If Arnold loses to Hillery the Republicans will scream Fowl, they will challenge in the supreme court that they appointed, And they will "Win" again. By stealing your vote from you The American People.

The Machines need to print on credit card tape. the yellow slip needs to role back into the machine, and the voter should be able to tare off the White copy. we should have a reader machine that can role the tapes quickly, and count the votes via a binary code for each vote. and the machine should total the votes at the bottom of each tape.

Democrats, and Republican, Members of the house, and Senate, Council members, and Legislatures Should all do every thing they can to see that there is no devision. Equal rights for all. For All Humans.

This is not about color unless it is the color of your Blood. The current government is doing everything it can to divide us. Fox news has given us color codes of Red and Blue again it is divide and Conquerer.

I say that if your an American, it matters not what you skin color, or hair color, or eye color, or state color, is. It does not matter what party you favor. Election reform, REAL election reform is a must. If you do not agree then it is you who has killed democracy, and wiped your ass on the Constitution.

There's your bumper sticker. Well said!

the banana republicans never got over nixon getting impeached.
the banana republicans continue to run against jimmy carter and ted kennedy TO THIS DAY.
the banana republicans never got over clinton winning.
twice.

the banana republicans never get over ANYTHING.
why should we, especially, since WE'RE RIGHT!!

Someone in another thread a while back pointed out that giving voters a receipt showing their votes opens the door to vote-buying.

At the very least. The Removal of each tape placed into a Safe Box, Moved by an Armored car to Each towns city hall and kept there for public scrutiny at any point. Kept under lock and key Of corse, But if any Vote Auditing organization made a request to view them That could be done in a relatively short period of time, say the next week day between 9-5 or 9-4 what ever schedule you guys like to keep, that would be fine with us, but I think holding that information hostage any longer then 4 business days after the "Voting Day" (National Holiday) should be considered excessive.

Thats right, National holiday! Smack that in there! That will cut the long line problem down to a small Community gathering where every one does their part to insure that the thing is done right. Hell they should have Barby Q's it will be a fun Community gathering. NO ADVERTISING!!!!!! NO POLITICAL ADD'S NO SPONSOR SHIPS!!!! NO MIND CONTROL ATTEMPTS!!!! Voting day is a day to get away from all or that. Only home town mom and pop vendors allowed. and no one can discuss Political issues. that is an understood rule on Voting Day!!!

http://www.hategun.com/features/getoverit/

Scroll down and click on one of the video links.
This is a very touching anti-war/anti-GWB video.

It is a MUST SEE and pass it on.

Thank You.

Assess the age of the person telling you to get over it. If they are younger ask if they've enlisted yet. If they are older, ask if their children or grandchildren have enlisted yet.

You must be able to explain your position and why you feel that way. I know Iraq affects a lot of what you are saying, but we cannot use that as a talking point because it is viewed on by the right wing as a smack in the face to our troops. granted it is not, but that is how it is associated in their minds. Fox has all ready given then the one line come backs you your response. the issue is Constitutional. And that is the only Argument that matters now. If you continue reminding people of their loved ones who might even be dead as you speak, you will create nothing but hate and disdain for your point of view.

I agree with the opinions you state in the original message. However, in discussing this with anyone from the right, you MIGHT get out the first sentence, and that is all.

Instead, perhaps say "Only those who benefit from an unfair system defend it." If they say it is a fair system, ask them to prove it by supporting investigations of it's problems.

But don't expect to get out a speech. They don't have to attention spans nor the tolerance to allow it.

If we fail to Reform the election system to include audits and voter verifiable paper trails, then why was the 14th amend meant written? or even the constitution for that matter?

The Same thing will happen over and over again. Do not use the argument that We Did not fix it before 04 to prevent us from fixing it after 04. or you are doomed to repeat history, and this Orwellian night mare will continue on.

If there is one thing that you do, one thing that you focus on, Take Democracy back into the hands of the American People.

If you do not do everything you can to insure that the voting system is reformed, then Democracy is dead all ready.

That is what this is about, not sound bytes. I don't care how they debate. I care that the system be fixed. Fix it! Or it will just prove me right when I said when I was younger, "Why should I vote? it does not count any way."

History is filled with people who had the right idea, but were not able to get support. If you cannot convince people this is needed, it won't be done.

The humans must realize what is at stake. this is our right to vote, and every one, all of you should do everything you can to get your rights back.

Kick this till 06, and never forget that we are the masters of the Machine. Not the other way around.

It could not have spelt out more simply and naturally that cheating ignored is cheating condoned, whether in a game or in a national election; and, uncorrected, renders future elections both futile and meaningless.

worldwide doesn't it? universal? i mean everyone knows them.

kicking...:kick:

November 28, 2004

MIAMI -- A newspaper's review of ballots cast in three north Florida counties where registered Democrats heavily outnumber Republicans showed just what officials reported: The counties' voters did on Election Day as they often do, voting for a Republican for president.

The Miami Herald review goes against Internet-fed rumors questioning whether there was a conspiracy against Sen. John Kerry in those counties.

Kerry won in much of South Florida, where voters vote on touch-screen machines that can't be checked.

Reporters for the newspaper went over more than 17,000 optical scan ballots cast in three rural counties mentioned by doubters: Suwannee, Lafayette and Union. All three are overwhelmingly Democratic in registration, but chose President Bush.

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/president/articles/2004/11/28/review_finds_fla_counties_voted_for_bush/

Welcome to DU, and thanks for that informative piece. Now that Florida has shown that it is so open to sharing, I expect that the other local precincts will cooperate with a complete nonpartisan audit of the State.

our right to vote. We must do everything in our power to Standardize the machines with voter verifiable paper trails.

This is the only way the people can have confidence in any elected official. stop thwarting this effort With useless information. I don't care if the election was in fact won fare and square. You can not prove that it was with out Auditing, and with out letting the press see the numbers come in to the central tabulating Machines.

You can not convince us that the Election was Not Manipulated. You need to stand up and Prove through Election Auditing. and Voter Verifiable paper trails at the Machines. the Election Process must be given back to the People, Or Why play the Game at all? Why lie and tell people that their vote matter?

we miss that guy ...

eom

Here's another really good piece, from Chuck Herrin (a Republican "Ethical Hacker") -- share it with all your Republican friends:

Empathy Training for Compassionate Conservatives: Why the Democrats Are Still Whining About the Election (and Why Maybe We Should Be, Too)
http://www.chuckherrin.com/ConservativeEmpathy.htm

Thanks for the link

It's hypothetical scenario is actually a good summary of what's going on, or rather, the reverse is.

They're still counting in Ohio.

A Kick to ex-cape this Orwellian night mare. where no matter what you say it does not really Matter, because some one else is pulling the strings of this massive contraption that we the people have no control over.

Give us our Rights Back! Give them to us Now!

We MUST change the FRAME.

That is the one reason that the Democrats will ever win an election.

That is why they are trying so hard to bury this topic, because they know that if we reform the election by 06 we have a chance of winning. If we do not reform the Election process There Can not be Freedom. It isn't about Our election any more. It has not been about "our" election in a long long time. If you really are a Senator, then stand up reform the election by 06 and give the people back their voice.

We the People of the United States Clam the Right to take back our country.

Kick this If you want your Children to have Rights.

...in 06 or 08 unless we stand up now.

There must be consequence before there is action. (No one puts up a stop light until after a tragedy.)

I'm not a Senator, but I intend to demand that each one of them stand up on Jan. 6 2005, for this election, and disallow the unlawful Ohio, Florida, and any other state's electors that had systemic discrimination of access to polls. Poll-tax-lines (time is money) is unacceptable.

Any state that tolerates it, and does not rememdy the situation for THIS election, does not deserve to participate in the electoral college vote.

It's just that simple.

Together we The People Of the United States Band together with the rest of the world in Our Most Desperate fight to Stop Terrorism, end the pattern of Hatred, And take back our Community for the Common Good of the Many Inhabitance of this Planet.

People who have lost control of your world. The only hope that you have is honest and fair elections because with out a voice, no one is free.

now is not the time to be pleasant...fuck those repug bastards

mess.

Please send this to Michael Moore who, based on his comments tonight on Jay Leno, appears to have sold out. Maybe this will remind him.

I cincerly hope we can make a better world.

I don't always agree with him but he's a smart man, worth reading..

Noam Chomsky: On the 2004 Elections

http://www.infoshop.org/inews/stories.php?story=04/11/29/9366984

-snip-
"On the eve of the 2000 elections, about 75% of the electorate regarded
it as a game played by rich contributors, party managers, and the PR
industry, which trains candidates to project images and produce
meaningless phrases that might win some votes. Very likely, that is why
the population paid little attention to the "stolen election" that
greatly exercised educated sectors. And it is why they are likely to pay
little attention to campaigns about alleged fraud in 2004. If one is
flipping a coin to pick the King, it is of no great concern if the coin
is biased. "

to give the people their choice of who will lead their community.

Why don't you just call it what it is a war on Love.Even if I am stuck in this Machine that could kill me any time it wants to and I can't say a word.

If I die, Every one Vote Third Party. We have to Win as a Species some how. the current people ruining the world do nothing but kill each other. and in my heart I wish we could just love each other. Is that so hard to understand? Why does there always have to be war? can't we live together as a community? I'm sick of all this killing, can we just give it a rest and build a society? can peace prevail for once?

if you give us the right to vote on war. How bout this we don't care who plays your little Air force One Club. and you give us the things we need to survive. You need to let us decide the issues. the people. the only way your gonna do that is by listening to what the people want. I here that is what they want in Ukraine is that right? or is that just more of your Bull shit designed to gag Democracy. what this country was founded on? You don't think this intelligent life form spinning around is big news to some other culture in some other part of the Galaxy? Seriously guys?

Do aliens already exist and have they infarct taken over our government as some sort of stupid reality TV show? I'm really starting to wonder?

Why is it you covered up so quickly Bin Lading's Message that Said Muslims want Peace? His people want this too! this has got to be your talking point. it's the only chance we have. There are a lot of us enlightened People on this planet. and I'm really not sure how much longer they are going to be here, because one of you Fools is going to drop a nuke on some one. as a matter of fact the next news story I herd for the rest of the afternoon was what an actor with a gun? and oh the gun might indicate a threat. Well no du you stupid moron his people are being invaded. the Gun means nothing and yet you pressed that all throughout this after noon.

Please can we stop this madness and put a democracy in place.

Are the Humans not a protected spicies???

Wouldn't that be a kick.

Even Better yet. Oh there is a Terror Warning. watch out terror warning!!!! and then all of the sudden that Magma pool building under Yellowstone Blows its cap. Than Ya, the terrorist would be Mother Earth. The ash from that thing is gonna cover over a 3rd of our planet, Killing a 3rd of our population and We the People of the World are starting to thing that that might be just what you had in mind.

You better kick this because it is getting harder and harder to plow this truth through your Bull shit.

That what you should feel people you should feel shame for letting them fool you again. You are Smarter then they are, Don't you at least want control of what channel we watch? Is that what society has come to?????