Assume Judas did not hang himself but sought forgiveness instead. What would happen?

imaginative read of the New Testament, and Judas' role is a great topic toward that end.

Absent evidence that the man betrayed anyone at all, I say he walks.

A fascinating character.

that the experience would impel him in a way more than the other apostles, more even than Paul who, after all, was turned from doing what he thought was the right thing.

Can you imagine believing in Jesus, then doubting, then selling that man out to his death, experiencing sickening despair to the point of suicide, and then receiving forgiveness?

It strikes me as an experience that would propel him far beyond what Paul experienced.

he hadn't committed suicide. After all, if Judas hadn't betrayed Jesus, then he wouldn't have died for our sins and everyone would go to hell.

Saul was a conspirator who actively worked to facilitate murder, by stoning Christians. His case of hysterical blindness was almost certainly a result of a conversion disorder http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hysterical_blindness that was a result of the tremendous guilt he had to bear for assisting the murders and the hatred that caused murder.

Naturally an intelligent moral person who becomes aware of their own treachery are going to be drawn to a metaphysical framework that is going to emphasis a release from guilt and the forgiveness of Grace. All of Pauls' writing center on the critical point of his life experience, achieving release from his deeply felt guilt and reborn into a life of Grace.

The difference is that Judas probably always saw his own actions as a betrayal and never really believed his justifications. Had he really thought that he was acting in a manner that was good then he probably would have effected a similar physical malady and aggressively sought forgiveness for his actions.

I think he agreed cuz he loved Jesus, but then couldn't live with it.

If Judas does not turn in Jesus, Jesus does not get crucified, does not die a martyr's death, and does not redeem all of humanity with his sacrifice. Remember, Judas identified Jesus by kissing him. Then, in grief, hangs himself, without spending a cent of the thirty pieces of silver. By the way, adjust that bounty for inflation, and Judas received the rough equivalent $250,000.00. Not the act of a brutal, hateful, envious man, but of a loving follower. Yet, Judas goes down in history as a turncoat. IMO, he was the greatest of all disciples.

christ did`t die and he was a prophet in a long line of the semite prophets. good as theory as the greek and roman versions. what about the Coptic church? they were never corrupted by paul`s crap.

what would have amounted to "suspended animation" through meditative techniques?

What a pathetic waste of your time.

Or perhaps you get satisfaction out of being obnoxious, a motivation which is understandable, if not socially acceptable. But obnoxiousness is measured in how well you have offended your target. If that be your case, then you have failed with epic proportions. You have doubly wasted your time, as you have offended no one, and even added to the pleasure of my morning.

Thank you rug, and a good day to you, friend!

If so, I apologize.

Would it have deepened and reinforced Christian theology or changed it?

Jesus was real, Judas was real, and that the Gospels give at least a vaguely accurate account of the history of the death of Jesus (that is to say, Judas betrayed Jesus and Jesus was executed as a result, after which point Judas fled and hanged himself/fell dead), then supposing he sought forgiveness, and under the assumption that the other followers of Jesus would have forgiven him, then I think that the Reconciliation (as it may have been remembered) would become a part of the Jesus myth as indelibly important as the Crucifixion and the Resurrection, and likely would have been "dressed up" in later retellings, perhaps with Jesus personally forgiving Judas during the Resurrection, and promising him a seat at his side in Heaven.

I think that it would have given Judas a more prominent role in the Gospels, as his story would be more theologically important; he might appear as a more fully-fleshed secondary character instead of having the mere walk-on-villain role he does.

I'm sure that would have enormous, wide-reaching, unpredictable consequences, as any change to anything in a chaotic system has.

My take is the Apostles' reaction would range from wanting to shun him to wanting to kill him but it would be Mary who would embrace him.

I don't call Christianity a myth but regardless, it is a powerful story with a powerful message.

but rather to mean "a standardized story central to a culture or religion, containing symbolism meant to portray a greater truth about humanity, society, and/or the universe." I think it's unfortunate that people frequently use "myth" as a synonym for "lie" as a way of dismissing religions they do not accept, as that erodes a useful word.

I think if Mary embraced Judas, calming the fury against him, then that would make her even more theologically and culturally important. "Reconciliation" art would probably have become as popular during the Renaissance as Assumption and Annunciation art was, and perhaps in the Eastern rites it would become a frequent subject of icons.

Assuming, of course, that the Christian church still evolved as it did; for all I know that would have led to a fatal early split in Jesus's band of followers, or Judas would have spread the word of the Church much as Paul did, leading to unpredictable and drastic changes.

chief priests and tried to undo what he'd done. He threw the gold back at them. HE (of all the disciples) stated in plain 'aramaic' that Jesus was an innocent man- My own 'take' on the incident is that Judas didn't think that Jesus COULD be 'taken' and killed. Judas had witnessed Jesus performing 'miracles'. He'd managed to elude capture, and it isn't too much of a stretch that he could have answered Pilate's questioning in a way that would have really left no justification for crucifing him.
Peter denied Jesus three times- yet, where do we see that he formally asked for forgiveness?

Killing yourself out of remorse and regret seems like accepting responsibility for your error- at least in my view.

If anyone is going to be forgiven, I'm of the opinion that Judas is one that was/will be.

:shrug:

In the end though he killed himself which suggests he himself did not think he could be forgiven, let alone ask for forgiveness.

that he didn't really stop to think about any future.

sometimes people don't think things through- or very clearly before reacting self-destructivly. It doesn't seem like he chose a method that much of a chance of failure whether it was a noose or a cliff-

The biblical account doesn't give us much in the way of a specific timeline. Judas seemed to be someone who acted kind of implusively. It doesn't seem to me that he sat and thought about his options much..

but this is only my opinion.

thanks

ALL sins have been forgiven. But, Judas died before the Crucifixion/Resurection, or at least before the import was realized.
By taking his own life, he was simply obeying Jewish law, a life for a life.

There's also the salient point when the NT indicates that "Satan entered" into Judas.

At least according to the law in Deuteronomy. Matthew was meticulous in relating the narratives of Judaism and Christianity together in his rendition. My guess is that the author of Matthew would probably agree with your suggested final thoughts of Judas.