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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-02-09 08:37 AM
Original message
Separation of Church and Delusions
Edited on Tue Jun-02-09 08:39 AM by L. Coyote
It seems there are forces at work, employing the Western culture
custom of religion for the sake of political divisiveness.
The tool employed seems to be promoting delusional thinking.

Religion is easy prey to this tactic, being based on belief,
in essence a form of delusion in its own right, but benign.
The forces at work now are promoting violence and hatred,
using religion to gain political power and control.

At some point it will be necessary to fix this problem by
separating religion and the dark delusions of religious believers.

We allow people to have delusions in Western culture, even enshrining
the custom in the Constitution of the United States, in the "One Nation under God"
motto and "In God We Trust", Congressional chaplains, prayers at events, etc.

When is enough too much? When do we call delusional thinking just that?
When do we see that this delusional thinking is the same no matter if it
is a Christian fundamentalist in Kansas or a Muslim fundamentalist elsewhere?
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patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-02-09 08:40 AM
Response to Original message
1. Now. And no one has to become atheist unless it just really does suit them. What we need is a little
humility when it comes to whatever it is that we are refering to when we use the word "God".
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-02-09 08:44 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Humility in defining what humans are is also in short supply
Humans are not the epitome of a creator.
We seem to be an aberration threatening all life!
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patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-02-09 08:53 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. My point exactly. I've been running around this board and others for years using the word
Blasphemy. People think I'm a little cracked. But in terms of the very religious systems that generate "believers" there's a whole hell of a lot of Blaspheming going on. I use the word to point to their OWN belief systems and how little they understand themselves.

American Exceptionalism is BLASPHEMY!

and someone needs to tell Sarah Palin et al.
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L. Coyote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-02-09 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. My mantra to make the same point is "Manifest Destiny = Century of Genocide"
Edited on Tue Jun-02-09 09:05 AM by L. Coyote
One religious tribe's "destiny" was another Peoples' extinction.

When religious nations commit crimes, God is always invoked as justification.
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patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-02-09 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. I respect that point about Genocide. It IS the logical application of the principles at work in many
Edited on Tue Jun-02-09 09:15 AM by patrice
ideologies.

I live in a red state, their hard-headed adherence to what they claim is absolute truth, should NEVER be under-estimated.

I also personally know and have known for a long time a career military person, retired now, whose entire life has been signed, sealed and delivered to him on a silver platter, which he sees as proof of the validity and righteousness of his racist and absolutely fascist beliefs. Indeed, though the man has never been in combat himself, he regularly and LOUDLY celebrates his "Warrior" Clan and it's willingness to engage in a Final Solution.
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sutz12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-02-09 08:46 AM
Response to Original message
3. Not all of the voices in their heads is God talking to them
:shrug:
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UnrepentantUnitarian Donating Member (887 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-02-09 08:52 AM
Response to Original message
4. Even in the choosing of slogans, they pick and choose...
Edited on Tue Jun-02-09 08:53 AM by UnrepentantUnitarian
"E pluribus Unum" (out of many, one) is ignored completely. Instead, they talk of secession and instead of a "unity" that actually embraces diversity, they push a "uniformity" of belief that has no concern for diversity. Talk about treasonous, unpatriotic rhetoric...!
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patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-02-09 08:56 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. We ARE at a cognitive evolution crossroads. Regressive traits are insuring our Extinction and
there are numerous ways that End could come on us if we don't evolve cognitively.
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zipplewrath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-02-09 09:04 AM
Response to Original message
7. Politics and religion
Religion and politics have always been intertwined. The only reason we have the establishment clause is because at that time they had lived through and experienced multiple uses of religion as a basis for oppression. There was a move to limit catholics access to governmental office because of a concern of the influence of the Vatican in American government. (It was removed from consideration). That was a political cocern, not a religious one. And the predominate political use of religion has been to pit one group against another, even within a singular society. Truth is, the authors and backers of the establishment clause were basically baptists who were concerned about the northern puritans and anglicans. It is no worse now than it has ever been, and not nearly as bad as it has been at other times. Which unfortunately is not the same as saying that it is not deplorable.
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