Sin and Shame, how some groups destroy their conscious.

I have heard the argument that you are only in sin when it causes shame. Might sound like a weird doctrine, but many groups teach it. It is literally teaching how to be a sociopath.

I believe that to be a false doctrine. I am not saying what is sin for everyone, nor claiming to be able to judge that. But I believe we have a mind and heart that knows when something is sin, and from that sin is not just ignoring what our heart shows us.

There are some comments in the Bible that can be interpreted to believe if you think you are doing right you are. Even many laws requires intent for many crimes. However the Bible, and many other texts also speaks about doing right, and explains those things. And more importantly we were given a way to know if something is right or wrong, think and feel on it. There is a reason we feel some things are wrong, and a reason most people, that think on it, agree to that. Everyone makes mistakes, my point is that they are not just mistakes because you feel shame about them. In my belief there is more to both society and the way we were meant to be.

Unfortunately there is a large subset of people, they interpret their religion as meaning 'to sin is just to have shame.' That is not a small doctrine, it is in many places. And it has been attributed to causing bad in many things.

Yes if you do not know something is wrong, you could be innocent, but that does not mean pretending like you do not know something is wrong counts. The burning up of ones conscious is a typical teaching point to many 'groups'. If you don't care at all, then suddenly, in their view, you no longer sin, strictly because you are not ashamed. That is the anarchy view of the forces of the supernatural. It is 'do what every you want, as long as it does not bother you.' view of life, followed by, 'learn to not feel'.

If a person believes wearing a hat is a sin, then it is. If a person believes wearing a hat honors God, then it does, because that is the intent. But notice wearing a hat most of the time does not usually hurt other people. Sin also includes actions that go against the heart all people were given. However since people are not perfect, they also have a way to receive forgiveness from sin. In my view, that does not mean they get to decide what sin is by just not caring. There are complexities to it, some people hurt others while acting in love protecting others, in that it becomes more difficult. But people for the most part know when something is wrong.

There are many groups that preach 'do what you want', they almost all use secrecy, they almost all hurt large groups of society. And they almost all believe in 'don't care' as a doctrine.

The fight scene at the end of the movie Angel, had an interesting difficulty with that point.

Angel-"The people that don't care about anything, will never understand the people that do."
Hamilton-"Yea but we won't care"

That is why much of it is so hard, if people believe it is only shame that is sin, they find ways to accept not caring, and from that even having a discussion is difficult, since they don't want to learn a different point of view. They don't need to be explained the other point of view, they actually already know it, they however argue disingenuously, and most of the time they are deceptive in comments.

Because they already know their argument is wrong from a view of what most people think and feel is moral, they just don't care.

...in known history exist, that many of them will do bad things to their fellow humans. Some will feel shame, some will not.

Religion and moral philosophy, as I see it, are pretty much secondary to the human condition, they are as likely to be descriptions or rationalizations of the way things are as they are to be driving forces behind the way things will be. (A big problem I have with religion is that I see too many examples of it being a way to get good people to do bad things, or being a tool of those in power to keep the public under control.)

If you want a better world, establish a stable, thriving economy, ensure personal freedoms, enforce democratically obtained laws fairly and evenly, and work hard at keeping power in check and corruption to a minimum. You won't have a perfect world, but you'll probably get one of the best that humans can achieve.

Worry about "sin" and "shame", how people conceive of those things, whether some people suppress shame or not, and I don't think you'll get anywhere other than perhaps some interesting philosophical musing. You're not too likely to find your way to some new doctrine that will be wildly popular and effectively change the world.

I could go on, but a feeling of shame about wasting too much time here and being late for work compels me to get going. :)

large and small groups of people for their interpretation of God's will when they have been told to judge not and that this God will extract his own vengeance without their help, which is a whole lot more compatible with human nature, but taking hate out out of believing would ruin the fun I guess.

We exist between the past and the future. We have evolved with a heightened sense of reciprocity that relates to events that have happened in the past and prognostications regarding what will happen in the future. We have developed a theory of mind that allows us to prognostigate how others will think, feel and react to any number of variables far beyond the ability of any other organism on the planet (as far as we know).

Shame is regret for a wrong done to another in the past.

Denial is, well, denial of what we know. Knowledge is a compilation of memory. Psychopathy is an illness that is the result of damage to the human ability to learn from our memories and adjust our behavior based on what we know.

Like the man said, "Insanity is trying the same thing over and over and expecting different results."

My wife was relating what their commencement speaker had imparted to the 2009 graduating class.

That, as they went forth into the worth, each one bore some truth within them, truth that would make the world a better place, and that they should all have, as their aspiration and as their responsibility to the world and to their fellow students, living their truth and, even more than that, "being their truth"

"So, how'd that work out for the Unabomber?"

According to what he was arrested for, he used violence and hurt people.

Could you explain what context your Unabomber comment is meant to be?