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It's more than just Senator Tom Harkin and woo: Christian Science and faith healing in health care

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rd_kent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-20-09 11:17 AM
Original message
It's more than just Senator Tom Harkin and woo: Christian Science and faith healing in health care
Every so often, as the health care reform initiative spearheaded by the Obama Administration wends its way through Congress (or, more precisely, wend their ways through Congress, given that there are multiple bills coming from multiple committees in both Houses), I've warned about various chicanery from woo-friendly legislators trying to legitimize by legislation where they've failed by science various "alternative" medicine practices

-snip-

Most recently, Harkin tried to insert language that would mandate that the government and health insurers pay for quackery, as long as it was from licensed practitioners. Given that some states license naturopaths and even "homeopathic physicians," such an amendment, if it stayed in place, would open the way for paying for all manner of nonscientific quackery.

However, there is another bit of chicanery that legislators are pulling, this time with the Senate version of the bill, that I have been made aware of by Rita Swan of CHILD and Kimball Atwood. This time, the threat is religious, with Senators trying to insert measures into the health care reform initiatives that will pay for "religious" treatments, such as Christian Science prayer. Indeed, one of these, S.1679, entitled Affordable Health Choices Act requires the government or private party insurers to pay for faith-based therapies:

SEC. 3103. PROGRAM DESIGN.

<...>

(D) The essential benefits provided for in subparagraph (A) shall include a requirement that there be non-discrimination in health care in a manner that, with respect to an individual who is eligible for medical or surgical care under a qualified health plan offered through a Gateway, prohibits the Administrator of the Gateway, or a qualified health plan offered through the Gateway, from denying such individual benefits for religious or spiritual health care, except that such religious or spiritual health care shall be an expense eligible for deduction as a medical care expense as determined by Internal Revenue Service Rulings interpreting section 213(d) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 as of January 1, 2009.



http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2009/10/its_more_than_just_harkin_and_woo_christ.php?utm_source=selectfeed&utm_medium=rss
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Do I even NEED to comment on this shit?




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DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-20-09 12:35 PM
Response to Original message
1. Great!!!
Now maybe I can unload all these damned boxes of Eau de toillet Exlixir if got stuck with from a chinzy Ebay seller.



- K&R
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JoeyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-20-09 12:45 PM
Response to Original message
2. This could be a good thing.
I say we have two insurance plans.
The first plan would be a science based medicine plan that pays for hospitals, doctors, and medicine.
The second plan would be the plan of quackery. You can have all the crystal healing, coffee enemas, homeopathy, naturopathy, prayerful chanting you can handle. Neither plan will pay for anything covered in the other plan.
Give it three to five years and there would be absolutely no one in the second plan.

P.S. Given the Christian Science angle, I kept expecting PZ to blow a gasket.
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Celebration Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-20-09 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
3. you must not be familiar with state of Washington
There are very strict guidelines for education for NDs-- Bastyr takes four years post grad. My daughter's PCP is an ND and he is great. It is important for her, his patients and all NDs in that state to be covered (some other states as well). Right now Washington state requires that licensed NDs be covered. She has a few different health issues and she has gotten awesome care from an ND (again, very, very well trained--)
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rd_kent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-20-09 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. I am VERY familiar with ND's in Washington
Edited on Tue Oct-20-09 01:07 PM by rd_kent
My child was delivered at home by an ND midwife. Very smart, intelligent and KNEW the limitations of her capacity as a "doctor". If she were like MOST ND's and homeopathic doctors, we would not have gone NEAR her office.
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Celebration Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-20-09 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. good grief
NDs in Washington are very well trained and educated. I don't know about "homeopaths" Is that some sort of separate license???

My daughter has been sent to medical specialists by her ND when she needs it, which is rarely because he provides such good care. She is also a teacher, and was concerned about one of her students with Crohn's. He charged her for nothing but the herbs/medications and spent an hour with him.

Don't you think your ND/midwife deserves to be reimbursed with insurance?
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rd_kent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-20-09 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. You have mistaken me.
You and I are on the same side here. I guess I could have put it differently when I said she knew her limitations.....she too, would refere my wife to a specialist of needed and she is reimbursed by our insurance.

ND's are not widely accepted (yet) and I DO think they have a place in the medical field. Unfortunately, they are being lumped in with the "religious" types that ARE IN NO WAY doctors (IMO).
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Sal316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-20-09 01:29 PM
Response to Original message
5. Sucking up to big Pharma.
I love the use of scare quotes in this article regarding alternative medicine. The implication that homeopathy and naturopathy are quackery is pathetic.

My family is a naturopathic success story. For years I've suffered with psoriasis and have tried every pharmaceutical treatment on the books, including corticosteroids and immunosuppressants (Enbrel, etc.). The steroids offered some relief, albeit with side effects ranging from increased cholesterol to damage to my adrenal system. These treatments would have to be increased in potency because their effectiveness would lessen over time. When I switched to immunomodulators, I became ultra sensitive to light, to the point where it would be painful to go outside or even have lights on in the house...worse yet, they offered no relief for me.

A year ago, I went to my wife's naturopath, and I'm better than I ever have been. He put me on a natural regimen that altered my stomach chemistry, repaired my adrenals, and a coal tar lotion for the spots. I'm clearer than I ever have been, I'm no longer tired all the time, my cholesterol is down, and my chronic heartburn is a thing of the past.

We've also seen him about my daughter, who is ADD. Instead of sucking down ritalin or derivatives, she's on a regimen that helps her body process certain amino acids that affect her brain chemistry levels. It's worked and she's not a pharmaceutical created zombie. Her brain chemistry is near normal levels for her age, and her ability to focus around the house and in school has vastly improved.

My wife had severe endomitriosis and bleeding, to the point where we spent time in the hospital because of the blood loss. "Real" medicine's only option was a hysterectomy. Instead, my wife went to the naturopath and he put her on a natural estrogen/progesterone regimen that was created specifically for her hormone levels, and she hasn't has a problem since.

Chinese medicine has been around for thousands of years, and herbal/natural remedies DO work and don't carry the magnitude of risky side effects that lab created pharmaceuticals do.

Secondly, you can't criticize Catholics, etc., for refusing to fill contraceptives on religious grounds and then tell religious people they can't have health care because you don't think their way is "real".

I agree that Christian science is misguided, especially for kids, that's not in doubt. However, you can't complain about discrimination by religious folks and then turn around and discriminate against religious folks. That makes one a hypocrite.

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moobu2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-20-09 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. If any given treament is accepted as lagitimate by
the medical community, then I don't have a problem with allowing that treatment to be reimbursed. Otherwise, you open the door for all sorts of quackery and religious healing bullshit etc..
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Desertrose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-20-09 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. My Naturopathic doc is fantastic.
He spent quite a bit of time in allopathic medicine/hospitals before he decided to become a naturopathic doctor.

All I take is an herbal tincture for my high blood pressure and haven't had any problems with it or any side effects.

Why shouldn't we be allowed to get the type of health care we want and that works for us...and why shouldn't it be reimbursed as well??
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