Regarding the Christian bashing going on here;

There's been much back-and-forth in the "Religion" section of this board about the Christian bashing that goes on here. I think this topic deserves to be moved into the General Discussion, because it's important to the anti-Bush movement as a whole.

Let me quote lildreamer316's recent well written post on the subject, "About the Religious debate going on": "That being said; those who have lived their life in the faith do not have a CLUE what it's like to be "outside the fold" as it were. EVERYWHERE you go; EVERYONE assumes that you are Christian; and that you believe in the Bible and God; and that you think God is male; etc. etc. etc. AD INFINITUM."

I was raised as a Unitarian Universalist, and I have to say that growing up I NEVER saw my religious beliefs being spread in American pop culture. I was raised to believe in celebrating human diversity, that all faiths ultimately spoke of the same truths, that Hell was a petty revenge fantasy invention of mankind, that the Bible wasn't written "by God" any more than the phone book was, and a lot of other things that "mainstream" America considers simply awful.

I won't eat up a lot of bandwidth discussing my current religious beliefs. (You can go to my personal blog page on the subject if you want, http://godhatesrepublicans.org/featured/article2.html ) But rest assured, they aren't being reinforced in Shrub's "Jesusland" America any more than the beliefs of the average pagan, wiccan, atheist, agnostic, Muslim, Jew, Hindu, Baha'i, Sikh, Humanist, Transhumanist or Buddhist.

Yes, I know that much of DU has a knee-jerk anti-Christian bias because for the last 30 years the Republicans, oligarchs and plutocrats have falsely cloaked themselves as "the Real Christians."

Well, some of us are out there trying to knock these hypocritical scum off their pedestals, so LIGHTEN UP on us. The way some of you carry on, I think that you'd have rejected Martin Luther King, Jimmy Carter and FDR himself for being "preachy."

The point we're making when we post here is that our philosophy has been co-opted by the very people our movement's founder was speaking out against. We're not saying that to convert those of you who are pagan, wiccan, atheist, agnostic, Muslim, Jew, Hindu, Baha'i, Sikh, Humanist, Transhumanist or Buddhist.

Heck, I spend most of my time trying to convert Southern Baptists, neo-Conservatives, NASCAR dads and soccer moms to my way of thinking about the world. I just don't have time to convert people who're already on the right path to begin with. (That's most of you folks.) As the parable of the Good Samaritan points out, it isn't WHAT YOU CALL YOURSELF that matters, IT'S WHAT YOU DO.

I just find it irritating that so many evil scum CALL themselves the same religion I do. That's why I try to clarify the point whenever someone lumps me in with GWBush, just as the average Wiccan tries to clarify it when they get lumped in with The Wicked Witch of the West. Follow me?

For more on this, see my recent post at http://godhatesrepublicans.org/sermons/sermonfive.html .

Now if Christian Democrats truly aren't welcome here, we'll pack up and go, and wish you all good luck. But keep in mind that we're going into the "Heretic Concentration Camps" right along with you if the Republican False Christians turn America into a theocracy. My favorite theologian Dietrich Bonhoeffer was executed by the Nazis along with everyone else who disagreed with their philosophy.

For what it's worth, any Democrats of any faith or no faith are welcome at my message board, http://ghr.hyperboards.com/index.cgi . See you there!

:popcorn:

It seems there can never be just one.

:popcorn:

Why is it always popcorn?!

Must be the powerful corn lobby.

:popcorn:

...damn Cornfucions!

Are you a Unitarian (which is not a christian religion, BTW), Wiccan,
or a Liberal Christian?

I'm getting dizzy. This is what really confused me:
I just find it irritating that so many evil scum CALL themselves the same religion I do.

about religion, but will say that most Americans seem to automatically assume everyone is a 'Christian'. And I grow weary of that.

:rofl: :rofl: :thumbsup:

... to be yet another form of the rampant Christian-Bashing that goes on at DU.

I talk to a lot of people who get turned off by the Right and their obsession with pushing "the Rich Man's Jesus" and the people on the Left making them feel like outcasts for not being Materialists. I do my best to keep them plugging away on poverty issues, social justice, equality and peace and from walking away from the whole mess. But getting people in places like DU to stop lumping them in with Pat Robertson would help a lot. (hint hint)

Hey where you get info
Go away
Dont give us bad name

They were called Pharisees then.

The Parisees were a Jewish sect.

But I'm betting you knew that already. ;)

Just christians not getting the level of deference and admiration they're used to.

being spread in American pop culture?

How easy was it growing up under a rock?

I was raised as a Unitarian Universalist, and I have to say that growing up I NEVER saw my religious beliefs being spread in American pop culture.

Then why the long post about "Christian bashing" and "Christian democrats" not being welcome here, etc. etc.

Are you a UU or a Christian? :shrug:

... are made to feel unwelcome at most Democratic meeting places for being brushed off as Republican trolls, unscientific fools or Rapture-awaiting mouth breathers. Some of the best, most passionate peace advocates and workers for social justice I have known are Mennonites, Quakers, Catholic Workers and other people of faith. That in so many posts here and in other Democratic havens people insist that religion is the enemy is just a slap in the face to these people. Yes, we're supposed to turn the other cheek, but can't we at least also point out "Wait a minute, aren't we on the same side?"

Don't worry, I won't bring this up as a topic again. I just thought if the moderators would let this remain in the General section, some good would come of it. A few people of faith would find these places more welcoming in the future, which would help them stay on the correct path, that sort of thing.

You said "DU has a knee-jerk anti-Christian bias". Who is the basher and who is the bashee?

If you wear your religion like a chip on your shoulder, it will be knocked off. And calling those who disagree "knee-jerk" doesn't help your cause. If you want the rhetoric toned down, perhaps you should set the example.

there are maybe two or three dummies who are insulting, but they are probably 14 and typing in their rooms after supper instead of doing their homework.

This board is huge. To think that in almost 90K individuals you won't have some people with bad manners and inflated egos is unrealistic. The vast majority of folks here state their beliefs and agree to disagree.

As for having to deal with life in a Christian country, I can see how it could be wearing. After all, 80 plus percent of us call ourselves Christian and that's a very large number. It's hard to be a minority in any thing. I know because I am very large and have to deal with a world where restaurant seats are too small, etc. It's a challenge.

You must be looking above the Knees. You dirty ol granny!:)

<< but they are probably 14 and typing in their rooms after supper instead of doing their homework. >>

I'm positively CONVINCED of it!

..also the acceptance for the valid reasons for the mentioned knee-jerk reaction. Please only dispute me on points I actually make, I get enough Straw Man attacks when I go undercover at Free Republic, etc.

"Yes, I know that much of DU has a knee-jerk anti-Christian bias because for the last 30 years the Republicans, oligarchs and plutocrats have falsely cloaked themselves as "the Real Christians.""

Who is Knee-jerk and who is legitimate? Are your critics not qualified to decide which is legitimate criticism and which is knee-jerk? If that is the case, I claim equal right to decide that your criticism is knee-jerk and not legitimate.

I don't understand how you can be critical of others and not expect them to be critical of you.

what happened to Fred? Is he better? Is his wife a lesbian witch now?

He just got fired from the Catholic school he was teaching at for calling everyone else in the school's faith into question. Yes, he's now more Catholic than the Pope, apparently.

His wife hasn't converted to Lesbian Witchcraft, but she has become a Quaker which is probably worse in Fred's eyes.

poor Fred. I fear this will have a difficult ending.

try being a Scientologist. The simple fact is most "Christians" we run into in our daily lives are the ones who breast beat their religion (think gorilla). Those Christians that we run into who are not like that, we have no idea what religion they are and so we take them on their acts alone.

When anyone mentions that they are Christian, we automatically assume they are breast beaters, and tune them out. When some one quotes scripture, we think breast beater. The silent Christians are at fault here because they took so long to stand up to the breast beaters, that now it's difficult to not think breast beater when talking to a Christian. We dismiss Christians because of the breast beaters, the "Christian" talking heads on the TV, because in the end that is what Christianity is advertised as.

The only way that true Christians can get back their good name, is to unite and fight the breast beaters. I see some of that happening, but not enough. You are the silent majority and it's time that you took back your religion or live with the knee jerk reaction when you mention you're a Christian.

zalinda

Especially here; "You are the silent majority and it's time that you took back your religion or live with the knee jerk reaction when you mention you're a Christian."

Most of what I do in my spare time is try to set Republican Pseudo-Christians straight. My eventual hope is that some of these people will go back to their Mega-churches and Republican fundraisers and stand up and ask the assembled masses "Shouldn't we talk a bit about justice for the poor?"

But as I said, DU, and most Democratic discussion groups, tend to lump any Christian in with the Fundies. I usually ask people to use the phrase "Alleged Christian" to describe Fundies by the way to avoid confusion, just as one friend of mine corrects people by saying "They aren't Republicans, they are 'Fascist-Americans'or if you must 'People of Swastika.' "

And while I mostly devote time in real life to correcting these assumptions, to take a break I remind people on line that Wiccans don't live in gingerbread houses, Scientologists don't have UFOs in their back yards, and that the Supply Side Jesus isn't the only one.

Thanks for taking my post seriously and in the spirit it was written BTW.

which is just in bad taste, I have to say I'm pretty tired of the whining. I usually try to be very respectful in my posts. I've never compared God to Santa Claus. I've never called anyone stupid, irrational, or less of a person in virtue of their faith. I've made a very concerted effort not to offend anyone here. All I have done is try to point out inconsistencies or philosophical problems with faith, begin discussions on aspects of morality, and try to gain more perspective on how others think and believe. If you are seriously offended by any individual's post, call them out on it! Let's roleplay:

Me: Believing in God is like believing in the easter bunny or the tooth fairy.
You: I take offense to your characterization of my faith.
Me: I didn't mean to offend. I apologize.

See? That doesn't seem to hard, does it? That's precisely what I do if someone mis-characterizes my position. I don't write a message (littered with links to my personal sites) complaining about how I'm not being treated fairly. I'm getting tired of the complaining on both sides.

Lovely.

"What Really Happened is a Republicans On Line web page." - Michael Rivero
http://tinyurl.com/q3gd6


"Note: This article first appeared as a post written by myself at Free Republic. ..." - Michael Rivero
http://tinyurl.com/m9cwl

Thanks to salvorhardin for the links in the Skeptic forum a few months ago.

You mean the insulting of non-Christians by some Christians here? Or the criticism of Christian beliefs by non-Christians, which ISN'T bashing the believer but the beliefs (which we are NOT required to respect, just their RIGHT to their beliefs)?

has been coopted by those who do not live by the purported values of christ, and hence the backlash. "Christian" doesn't really mean "follower of the Christ." It means "member of a rigid cult trying to take over and control the world."

I realize that there are those that DO try to follow the Christ, but they seem to be mostly silenced. I don't think they ought to be silenced here on DU; I just think that they need to be aware of the taint that comes with the label.

Perhaps a new label is in order, one that doesn't come with the baggage of 2,000 years of religious corruption?