agnostics, check in. or not.

;-)

of the unknown.

I don't know.

To me, atheists and theists are similar in that they've both made up their minds about how the universe really ticks, and are thus less open to new evidence that might challenge their worldview.

Still, all ports are harbors but not all harbors are ports. Many things are unknown, but not all of them are knowable in the first place.

Known unknowns

LOL Just kidding!

:-)

but I wish I had some kind of non-religious religion. I can't find anything that works for me.

The closest i came was at a Unitarian church in Little Rock, AK. The church sponsored a group of pro choice people from out of state to defend clinics during the clinic summer sieges. They set up houses for us to stay in, food, transportation, etc. They were wonderful. I didn't get to attend an actual church session but they did have a reception for us and the people were diverse and wonderful. I don't know if all Unitarian churches are like this.

I have given up on the "church" scenario. I would just like to find a group who would like to be "good people". Any suggestions?

when I lived up north still. I got a little freaked out when all the people came up to the New Comer (me) and try to grab me. I felt like I was sucked in. Now Unitarian church for MILES down here in Florida.
I am trying a Presbyterian now and am surprised at how open minded some of the people are, but again I get that creepy crawly feeling - like I'm going to be sucked in. Yuk.
I would love to find a group like you suggest. I spiritual but not religious group of people. Dem orgs is the closest I've found as far as "good People" goes.
I think it's important to have something spiritual. Or to address that part of life.

might I suggest you look outside Christianity altogether? Try something with a meditative tradition such as Buddhism or Yoga. There's a whole wide world of excellent sprititual teachings out there beyond the churches.

sw

I have found this website to be very helpful. It's my favorite message board (besides this one, of course! :)).

Good on you for posting this!

sw

I know there's a lot out there. I would like a community of some kind. A place to bring my kids so that they can learn too. You know what I mean? It has to be open minded though. Maybe someday. I wish there were Quakers around here.

I know the feeling.

It's non-denominational. You can be Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, agnostic, atheist, whatever. They just discuss general spirituality and morals by looking at all different religions. Just a thought. :-)

I look down my nose at agnostics.

Whatever trips your trigger. :shrug:

and quite comfortable with the fact that I don't know all the answers.

You could always organize one.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/agnostic.htm

I actually think of myself as a non-theist. The troubling part of agnosticism involves this statement

"An agnostic is a person who feels that god's existence, the hypothesis, can neither be proved nor disproved, on the basis of current evidence."

As a scientist, I would modify this to support or disprove, proof is saved solely for mathematics and liquor. The whole magical, religious nonsense involving god precludes one from disproving his existence. However, the utter lack of even a smidgen of support makes me discount the whole hypothesis to begin with.

An agnostic seems to accept the hypothesis as valid, but without resolution, and an atheist or non-theist sees the hypothesis as invalid, not worthy of further consideration.

If I am full of shit, please let me know, I think I need an emena ,
:evilgrin:

I don't care much for how that statement is worded either, although it pretty much captures what I think. It's not about "current evidence". I'm not waiting for further evidence to come to light - the nature of the question itself precludes my *ever* knowing the answer.

An agnostic seems to accept the hypothesis as valid, but without resolution, and an atheist or non-theist sees the hypothesis as invalid, not worthy of further consideration.

Nevertheless, the hypothesis is out there and has been since we arose as a species, and you can't disprove it. :7

I Don't Know !!! Proud Agnostic here ^^

really an atheist. ;-) I was raised super-Fundy and remained one till my late 20's. MUCH happier now. Thanks for starting this thread!

:hi:

but with agnostic moments. I hesitate to define myself since there are many in the athiest community who think agnostics are just wishy-washy athiests that can't/won't commit. It's just a label, anyway, and I hate labels. I have never believed there was a god as described by religion and there is no evidence whatsoever in my opinion that there is or ever was a "creator" or "supreme being". As for it being a valid hypothesis, I think it is. But since there is no way to gather evidence that supports/refutes this hypothesis I think it is useless and irrelevant. Having said that, I hope there is an explanation for existence and a purpose to our being, and that we may know it someday, but I don't have a fucking clue and I refuse to just make shit up or say "ok, I'll buy it if that's what everyone else thinks". Not me. I'm fine with not knowing. SO, there's my thought on the matter. Am I hopelessly confused? At least I'm not as confused as my good friends and neighbors who are convinced that there's an invisible man in the sky that watches everything they do and keeps a scorecard to judge them with when they die.

Having said that, I hope there is an explanation for existence and a purpose to our being, and that we may know it someday, but I don't have a fucking clue and I refuse to just make shit up or say "ok, I'll buy it if that's what everyone else thinks". Not me. I'm fine with not knowing.

That's pretty much textbook agnosticism, if you ask me. :shrug:

As to this:

there are many in the athiest community who think agnostics are just wishy-washy athiests that can't/won't commit.

Yes, I know. That's their problem, not mine. :)

I figure I will find out when I am dead ...

Sure. You're a step away from it anyway. :D

:hi:

I believe devoutly in the unknown and unknowable. Or in other words, in a god who isn't there. (Depending on the values you assign to "is" and "there."


In the words of the classic poem:

The other day upon the stair
I saw a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
Oh, how I wish he'd go away!



Or, to put it another way, a god who -- like Heisenberg's cat -- exists and non-exists at the same time.

At this point, all that's gonna change my position is a direct mystical experience of some kind, which I'm actively seeking... although even now I'm definitely open to nontheistic definitions of God, as in "God is everything that is," or "God is that than which any attempt to define something greater would be logically incoherent."

I started to be bothered by the notion that just because I believed in these experiences, it didn't mean they had an origin outside of myself. In fact there is no way to know if any communication we seem to have with the unseen/supernatural originates outside our brain. It still boils down to a leap of faith that we're not temporarily insane in such instances.

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

although probably most would consider me an athiest....

I lean toward atheist though...if there is a higher power, it seems absurd that it would be a big man in the sky sort of being lol

I've always thought death was the greatest proof that god does not exist.

:P

:)

One can not prove that which effects the soul ... grasshoppa' ;)