Pistons vs. Cavaliers

Detroit in four

The young'uns will get one.

- as

They will give Detroit all they can handle this time.

I think the Cavs are seriously flawed.

Pistons in 5, 6 at most.

have been here many times. Still, Detroit in....6 I guess.

too often, but those of us who lived in Detroit and remember when they were absolutley
horrible, year after year, will never get enough! :)
They were so poorly run the NBA has to force the owner to pay better salaries (Fred Zollner)

Nothing about Cleveland except for LeBron impresses me. I have to give him credit. Even though he didn't score late, he found Donyell Marshall for the deciding 3 point shots down the stretch.

The Cleveland/NJ series was enough to make even a diehard NBA fan like myself cringe. There's no reason that teams should be scoring in the single digits in the second halfs of elimination games. This wasn't suffocating defense. These players couldn't even make open jump shots.

I guess Detroit will win the series. They won't come to play every game, and their lackadasical history may allow Cleveland to extend the series. But when the Pistons realize they have to turn it on, they should handle with ease a very overmatched Cavs squad.

In the West, I'm disappointed that Phoenix is out. While San Antonio may very well have won anyway, the Suns were robbed by the NBA and freak occurrences. I'll have to root for the Jazz to keep it competitive, and I think they will.

I'm ashamed to admit that in the back of my mind, I was hoping that PHX Coach Mike D'Antoni would send out a goon (like 12th man Center Pat Burke) to break Tim Duncan's nose in the final minute of that game. Either that or have someone like Eric Piatkowski or Sean Marks throw a haymaker to Bruce Bowen's groin.

Boo Detroit!

Detroit's D on a whole is much tighter than Jersey's. And everybody saw what happened when LeBron had to leave the game in the 3rd Q last night. If Donyell didn't have a night of nights, Jersey would be still alive.

LeBron's a real good player, but I don't think he can put that team on his back for a whole series.

- as

He took the criticism to heart - and he sreems to have one-upped all superstars who have come before him in one crucial aspect.

After the 49-point game, Detroit clamped down on him hard - and instead of trying to fight through the wall that the Pistons erected around him, he had enough savvy to just pass over that wall.

Smart. Very smart.

I still think SA will roll right over the Cavs, but you gotta give LeBron his due.

Having said that, I was wrong about Clevo-Detroit, so anything can happen. I'll root for the Cavs, because I'm tired of the Spurs winning everything. :)

- as

However, a longer series will subject us to more pissing and moaning from the Pistons' fans that LeBron gets too much attention from the media.

If you call it pissing and moaning to complain that the pre-game of the Pistons' game dealt with LeBron James biting his fingernails (or not!) then I plead guilty. Even the biggest James fan in the world has to realize that the network jumped the shark on that one.

They'll win this series, but enjoy this while you can. The Pistons aren't going to be an immovable obstacle forever (as last night's game showed) and it's only a matter of time before this 43-year curse gets lifted. The Cavs WILL get a title, it's only a matter of a bold move that Ferry needs to get the balls to make, as Paxson chained this team with no first round draft picks for the next two years. Sheed's old ass isn't going to consistently heave up slop like that three last night.

But in the past couple of years, there has been a real shift. Now everyone is all hyped on people who can barely grow beards. I wonder what caused the change? It's very strange to me.

I just don't like Sheed. He's a mouth throwback to Detroit punks like Mahorn and Laimbeer.

all over the press, and they're saying it about the Red Wings, too, even though they are significantly younger than they were back in 2002, last time they won a Cup. I didn't mean it personally, just making an observation. The Pistons aren't all that old. But LeBron is only 22 and some people act as if he's a failure, which is insane!

BTW, when 'Sheed was first on the Pistons, I went to a Pistons/Sonics game in Seattle, and a number of Trailblazer fans had travelled up from Portland just to see him - they loved him. I never saw his appeal till he played for my team, but I've learned to really love the way he plays with his heart on his sleeve. Fans love him.

It's astounding that ANYone criticizes a 22-year-old who averages 27-7-6 for four years running and carries a bunch of effective but inconsistent players on his back night after night. Barkley craps on him. Skip Bayless hates him. Our own guy from the Plain Dealer went over the match-ups and "only had James by a hair" over Prince, as if Tayshaun's even in the same arena as LeBron. If he's so damned horrible, how come the Pistons were on him 2 and 3 like a glove last night? They know what he's capable of dropping on them, just like the Cavs know how hard this series is going to be to get over the hump.

The fact is, that was a good play; you had to go for the win (really, you had to not collapse in the second half, but that's just me). But like so many times before when LeBron does something similar, his teammates brick wide open shots. LeBron should be averaging 10 helps a game if it weren't for the aggravating inconsistency of his teammates.

If there's one thing that can be said about veteran leadership, it's that they know how to close out games and finish the job. This is the one thing that's going to hold the Cavs back, unfortunately. That and a lack of draft picks for two years.

He said that LeBron needs to get more selfish during crunch time, and I agree.

I saw the press conference where LeBron said 'What I did was good basketball. You find the open man and let him take the shot.' It's hard to argue with that - but the man can slice up defenses at will, and he should take advantage of that.

He should look to what guys like Jordan or even Iverson (or even Barkley!) would do in the same situation. Take over the game. You know he's capable of it.

- as

which is why I predicted the sweep.

I grew up with this team in the 70's and would love to see them go all the way. But I don't see it with this group.

Barkley makes a great point.

Yes, he is 22, but he has been in the league for four years. Also, he took the money and he wanted the Jordan jersey so he should be willing to take the criticism; his fans should also be willing to take the criticism. If he did not want to take the criticism he should have gone to college and played there. There are a number of things that he should be doing now that he had been in the league for four years that he is not doing. He need to learn how to put his team on his shoulders during the end of the game. He should be doing that right now. There are moves that he makes during the game that he should not be doing due to the amount of money he make and the hype that goes with him. He and his fans had no problem with him being compared to Jordan and they had no problem with him being called the next Jordan. Now they all should be willing to take the criticism.

There are many players who have done more in less time than he has. Think Tony Parker. I know people will say he had Tim Duncan, but Parker by about the age of 22 had two championship rings while playing in the West. There are a number of others who have done the same.

He's never going to be the next Jordan because the situations aren't even comparable, and until they GET comparable, there is no criticism warranted. I can see if he was losing playoffs while having Michael Redd and/or Carlos Boozer at his side. THEN you can start heaping the venom. But he has NONE of that. LeBron has no Pippen and no consistent night-in, night-out contributors. He doesn't even have a team of four other above-average (not all-star) players that work so consistently well as a team. He only has inconsistent shooters, players who brick wide open jumpers and make ridiculous fundamental mistakes. He also has a coach two years into a head position that seems to have no offensive game-plan other than get LeBron the ball and hope he doesn't get mugged. It's absolutely unfair and preposterous to expect him to carry this team night after night after night. These are professionals. Their job is not to stand around and hope a 22-year-old kid saves their asses. You aren't EVER going to get to that next floor if you DON'T contribute night-in, night-out.

Tony Parker is not even in the same ARENA as LeBron in talent. Granted, having him on your team greatly improves your chances at a title, but again, supporting cast means EVERYTHING. Only Tim Duncan? Really? Here was the 2003 championship roster. Notice that he ALSO had David Robinson, Bruce Bowen, Stephen Jackson, several playoff-tested veterans and one of the most eye-opening foreign players in years. He also had Greg Popovich, PJ Carleisimo and current Cavs coach Mike Brown as coaches. Not to mention they played the Vince Carter-less Nets, not exactly an offensive machine. Yet I think nothing short of complete incompetence couldn't win a title with this roster.

12 Bruce Bowen F 6-7 200 6/14/71 Cal State Fullerton '93 6
10 Speedy Claxton G 5-11 166 5/08/78 Hofstra '00 1
21 Tim Duncan F-C 7-0 260 4/25/76 Wake Forest '97 5
35 Danny Ferry F 6-10 235 10/17/66 Duke '89 12
20 Emanuel Ginobili G 6-6 210 7/28/77 Argentina R
3 Stephen Jackson G-F 6-8 220 4/05/78 Oak Hill (VA) 2
25 Steve Kerr G 6-1 180 9/27/65 Arizona '88 14
9 Tony Parker G 6-2 180 5/17/82 France 1
50 David Robinson C 7-1 250 8/06/65 Navy '87 13
31 Malik Rose F 6-7 255 11/23/74 Drexel '96 6
8 Steve Smith G 6-8 221 3/31/69 Michigan State '91 11
42 Kevin Willis C 7-0 245 9/06/62 Michigan State '84 17

And while we're talking about the greatness of Mr Longoria over LeBron, let's look at his 2005 championship roster. The core of that team (Parker, Ginobli, Duncan and Bowen) which had already won a title, returned, along with clutch shooters Robert Horry and Brent Barry. See, take away even ONE player from that core, and the Pistons would have won the 2005 title.

Is it because of the "gotta have it NOW" attitude that everyone lays on LeBron just because "well, D-Wade already HAS a ring!! If LeBron is so outstanding, why does he not have one"?? Wade was also lucky enough to be blessed with the most dominant center the league has seen in the past two decades and a consistent supporting cast helping those two.

Wade was also lucky enough not to be drafted to possibly the most snake-bitten three-sport city in the past 43 years and counting. People may not think "The Cleveland Curse" matters, but it does. Much of the "Cleveland Curse" is due to one of two things, and sometimes both at the same time. Bad luck or bad owner/management decision making. LeBron not only has to carry a bunch of players with a "who's going to step up tonight" mindset (much of which was assembled due to the latter part of "The Curse" above), he's now expected to carry this lack of a supporting cast to at least the ECF every year against teams with far better cohesion than his. Otherwise, HE'S the failure.

Makes total sense to me.

:eyes:

I was not in any way trying to say Tony Parker was a better player than Lebron James. My point was that other player of the age 22 and younger have done what James has not done. Everyone, or at least many people who support James always bring up that he is only 22. My point was that other people of the same age have done more than James at or before the same age. In addition, he wanted to play in the NBA so he needs to play like he wanted to play in the NBA. He did not have to come to the NBA and take all the money. I think what makes many people criticize him is that when he came into the league many people said he was the next Jordan and/or better than Jordan. I think many people are saying if he is so great why can he not do the things Jordan did. He does not seem to want to put the team on his back when it counts. In game two it seemed to me that he passed up on some things that player like Tony Parker, Kobe Byrant, Carlos Boozer, and other player would have done. That is my problem with James. It is not really that he has not won a title.

On to the point of his teammates being bad, they might not be the best, but they are the reason the team is still in the playoffs. They have been helping James during this playoff run. James has not shoot or scored all that well in these playoffs, but his teammates have stepped up and played better. So it is that that he has terrible teammates.

I know if things had been reversed and Detroit had lost those two close ones, it'd be breaking my heart. I honestly feel for Cavs' fans.

This is going to be a whole series of this sort of thing, down to the last second, grinding it out, games that could go either way.

1) teammate inconsistency. Z, Drew and Hughes = 11 points between them, ZERO in the second half. And against a team that has no strong inside presence.

2) starting the second half off lousy and not finishing games.

At least next year, the Cavs may not have to worry about Detroit doing this to them. Unfortunately, it'll be the Bulls, who will become a younger, more offensively sound Detroit. Year after goddamned year.

They would feel the way I felt about the Red Wings losing all those close games.

Same score as the first game!

Well, GO PISTONS!

These teams are really well matched, game 4 will be of the utmost importance to both.

In any case, though, I think we should petition Gooden to shave that weird patch off the back of his head. Lol, what the hell is up with that?

Gibson, LeBron and Drew were HUGE tonight.

This is fun to watch.

Oh right; Potato's insistence for the first two games to play E-Slow and Hughes for the purpose of saddling Chauncey. Only problem with that strategy is it allows the Detroit D to clog the lane and LeBron because Slow doesn't score and Hughes has been virtually worthless.

Boobie can score and shoot threes. With him out there, Detroit is forced to spread the D, opening up the lane just a tad.

So how is that broom working out?

Cavs lead 3 to 2 and going back home

It's shoved too far up my ass

GO CAVS!

48 Points. 48-9-7.

I love these writers who praise Kobe as the best in the game. UH-uh. Kobe could NEVER pull this off against a veteran team such as this.

If Cleveland chokes on Saturday, they deserve every "curse" slag coming to them.

Only problem is, the Spurs will be well rested for whoever they face.

Go ahead, pile on some more. I'm going to crawl into a cave. I hate when the good guys lose.

And won the next three. :smoke:

If only the refs hadn't given the first two to Detriot. LeBron is going to win the next game as well. What are you doing with the broom trying to sweep away this post so people will forget it?

:rofl:



Like that's ever happened in the history of sports.

May I ask if your misspelling of Detroit is INTENTIONAL? If so, I guess you're a charter member of the Kick 'Em When They're Down Club.............

Boo Detriot! Hurray Good Basketball players! Basketball is probably the worst sport on officials. Every time a player makes a move there is contact of some sort. And there are no standards for foul calling. I'm glad Detriot will not be going to the finals. I don't think I could watch a Sheed/Duncan bug-eyed You're calling a foul on me? series.

However, I do think you need to re-evaluate Rip Hamilton being a "dirty" player. One of his classic moves is to "accidentally" get the way of another player with his body (hips, legs usually) while holding his arms up and away with an incredulous look upon his face. Rodman used to pull the same crud, the intentional unintentionally-appearing entanglement. Rip did it a few times last night.

Now don't get me wrong he's not as dirty as Bruce Bowen who goes out with the intention of injuring other players and causing a reaction in order to get David Stern to help along his favorite player Tim Duncan.

I'm just hoping no more Detriot in the playoffs (Pffft on the Red Rings)

But really, don't trash Detroit. It's had a terrible time of it and it is a once-proud city, dating back to 1701. The riots were an ugly, scarring event and the city has still not recovered. I remember my aunt had to go leave and live with my grandparents when they were happening. It was horrible and frightening and put a permanent gash in what used to be a beautiful city.

the people living in Detroit. Sports "stars" and sports in general are so extraneous to reality which is why I enjoy absurd arguments. So many bleed their teams colors without really realizing how silly that statement truly is...

But the Pistons stink! Go Bulls!

and maybe you'd feel some empathy.

It's not exactly Beacon Hill, you know.

The kids in Detroit (I haven't seen it in a while, but I'm pretty sure it was Detroit - I could be wrong), talking about the burned-out buildings in Iraq?

"We got buildings like that, and we ain't even been in a war."

The sad part, of course, is that they're right.

This is what cracks me up about you here in the sports forum. You always take the smack thrown your way and make it personal.

Oh---my team has the good guys---all the others...well? When you talk smack at my team you're hurting the good people of our city....

It's silly Lisa.

They have had a much better recovery than the city of Detroit. Yes, I defend my own! Would you have it any other way?

Sustained intensity unlike anything you'll see in the West. Those teams other than the Spurs go into long lulls where they get tired and basically agree to exchange uncontested shots for a while.

NBA series are supposed to feature lopsided games based on situational influence. Especially when one team takes a 2-0 lead. It's very common for the team trailing 2-0 to win game 3 handily. Hell, even the Spurs collapsed in game 3 and were trounced.

But this series has had nothing but extremely competitive games. Very admirable. And when one conference has both LeBron James and Dwyane Wade, it's laughable to assert it is overmatched. Superstars dictate outcomes in this sport.

And am I nuts for thinking the Cavs have a legitimate shot to win?

IMO the 2-3-2 format unfairly favors the team with home edge. It's so damn tough to sweep those middle three games. I realize the Heat did it last year but the math favors the opposite.

But I'm having a tough time with this series because I didn't see either game in the regular season. It often can be a shock to the Western team when suddenly they are faced with an opponent who actually plays defense, not pretend defense. I'm hardly shocked San Antonio didn't score very much against the Cavs in the regular season. I think it was 81 and 78. They'll have to make an adjustment but the home court to start the series really aids in that adjustment. The Spurs are the one Western team who can adapt to the physical Eastern style, without crying that it's unfair.

Well, four straight to end it. A lot of my friends who handicap emotion thought Cleveland would win big tonight. Very shocking and deflating for the Pistons to lose a pivotal game 5 at home in double overtime. They probably would have needed to be significantly better than Cleveland to contend on the road tonight. All five games had been very tight, which is draining. Since the teams are close to even, all the emotional factors favored the home side.

Second straight year Detroit loses the Eastern final despite having the home edge. Come to think of it, the Pistons beat Miami in the '05 conference finals when the Heat had the home court. What's that called, a trend?

Why are they waiting until Thursday to start the finals?

DAMN!

Boobie scored 31!!

I think I said that someone other than LeBron would have to step up tonight if they were to beat the Pistons and DAMN if I wasn't right!!

I feel so great right now I can taste it.

And no one expects us to beat the Spurs and no one would be upset if we lost to them.

But does anyone else think we just MIGHT have a chance against them?

Hook 'em, Horns!

And Go, Spurs, Go!

:hi:

:bounce:

SO happy my baby LeBron is going to the finals!

i don't hear any sweeping noises from Detroit... :evilgin:

That's the man-to-man odds.

In game one, Spurs are -7.5 and the total is 180.5.