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county worker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-24-09 05:55 PM
Original message
Need some advice from the GLBT community please.
Edited on Thu Sep-24-09 06:32 PM by county worker
My sister-in-law is gay. She lives with her partner in a conservative city in CA. She was forced to resign from her job on Monday. She did resign. She was told by her boss and backed up by HR that they were watching her and if she got written up one more time she would be fired and that they would fight to see that she did not get unemployment. Or she could resign now and get some severance and they would not fight her getting unemployment. (You can quit in lieu of discharge and still receive unemployment)

Here is the bigger picture. She has worked for this company (a famous retail clothes store with many outlets through out the country) in their warehouse for about 10 years. She was promoted year after year. She was a manager she even went back to school to get an MBA while working for them.

She got a new male boss about a year ago. For about the last six months he has been writing her up for rule violations. Most of them were chicken shit in my estimation. An example is this. They got some new bar code stickers and the employees were placing them on their shirts to see how they stuck on. One woman’s sticker fell off and my sister-in-law picked it up and stuck it back on the woman’s shirt in the breast area. My sister-in-law got written up for inappropriate touching. About a week later she got a cut while working. She showed it to her shift manager just to be sure she was doing the right thing. He told her to fill out an incident report. They wrote her up because she was not supposed to fill out her own incident report. Another time she shut a line down because someone did something that could cause them to be injured if the line was still running. She got written up because she was supposed to stop the whole shift working and not just part of it.

All these and more since the new boss took charge. These were in real contrast to her past promotions. I feel the new boss knew she was gay and forced her out.

My sister-in-law in not an activist. She is a church goer. She does not make a big point of the fact that she is gay. (She does not tell people but it is kind of obvious) I guess you could say she is not out. (If I am not saying things correctly please forgive me since I am not real up on this.)

I told her that I think she should get a lawyer and sue them for discrimination. She does not want to make anything out of it.

My question. If this were you, what would you do?
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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-24-09 05:58 PM
Response to Original message
1. if she doesnt want to make a big thing of it accept that. she can get unemployment n be done with it
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virgogal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-24-09 06:02 PM
Response to Original message
2. Skip the lawsuit and move on. Life is too short.
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Libertas1776 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-24-09 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
3. Me personally
I would sue the bastards through their nose. But if, like you said, she doesn't want to make a fuss, then take the severance and get the hell out of there.
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BadgerKid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-24-09 08:18 PM
Response to Original message
4. Seems like the new boss is the problem.
Too much of a 180 degree turn. The new boss sounds like an ass, but any discrimination isn't obvious to me. Maybe the boss is just making his mark by controlling others -- maybe he wants her gone. One thought that occurs to me is for your SIL to go over her boss's head somehow. If the company is otherwise pleased with her, she could argue her value to the company (afterall, they helped her get a degree).
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sgsmith Donating Member (305 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-24-09 08:49 PM
Response to Original message
5. Up to her, but...
It might be worthwhile talking to an attorney, or to someone else higher up in corporate HR (if that option is still available).

http://www.hrc.org/issues/transgender/454.htm

California Non-Discrimination Law

Gender identity protected? Yes

California law explicitly prohibits discrimination based on gender identity, appearance and behavior in the areas of employment (public and private), housing, and public accommodations. Furthermore, California law permits employees to dress consistently with their gender identity. Cal Gov Code § 12926 and §12949 (2003); see also AB 14, Civil Rights Act of 2007.

Sexual orientation protected? Yes

California law prohibits discrimination based on sexual orientation in the areas of employment (public and private), housing, and public accommodations. Cal Gov Code § 12920 (2001); Cal Civ Code § 51 (2001); see also AB 14, Civil Rights Act of 2007.

The legal information provided on this page is provided as a courtesy to the public. It is not designed to serve as legal advice. HRC does not warrant that this information is current or comprehensive.
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Smarmie Doofus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-24-09 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
6. The ironic part is she's essentially being penalized for NOT being out.
Edited on Thu Sep-24-09 09:17 PM by Smarmie Doofus
Assuming, of course that her instincts ( and yours) are correct and that her sexual status is what's bugging this creep. She'd have a much better case... seems to me if she were *openly* gay. ( I am not, thank god, a lawyer.)

I'd see an attorney with expertise in this area of the law. Even if she's already resigned. There may be options she is not aware of. Also, they may double cross her on the severance and unemployment.

After she's investigated the legal route, tell her to stop foisting her sexuality on straight people.

( I'm kidding. Seems we really can't win sometimes, can we? )


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foreigncorrespondent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-24-09 09:36 PM
Response to Original message
7. Hard to prove homophobia...
...simply because the new boss never said anything discriminatory, and so you only have pitiful little excuses, and unless you have the the same or similar laws to us here in Australia, you cannot sue for unfair dismissal. But unfair dismissal would be easier to prove in her case, simply because her work record prior to the new boss.

Now me? I would take the story to all the gay mags like The Advocate etc, and without getting yourselves or them in trouble, bring the company down in such a way that everyone would know who they are, without directly calling them out. That way they couldn't sue in return.
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-24-09 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Good idea
I would start with a well written letter to the CEO and go from there . It is an obvious wrongful termination suit, tho not Gay discrimination. A Union would have stopped that kind of abuse.. you can start by letting us know the name of the company. OLD ADVICE ; DOCUMENT EVERYTHING
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imdjh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-24-09 10:25 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Get the lawyer to write the letter, it has an air of menace to it.
I once simply used my attorney's fax machine to send a letter to a company that was trying to screw me out of some cash. Got the check.
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county worker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-25-09 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. I did not know if I should give the name of the company since my sister-in-law
doesn't want to make a big deal of it.

Would giving you the name of the company go against my sister-in-law's wishes? She would not want you to do anything about it.

If you don't make a thing out of it I'll tell you.
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-25-09 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. No big deal
just so as I know not to buy there and I tell two friends and so on, and so on. No bill boards or sit ins
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county worker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-25-09 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #8
17. The company is The Gap and Old Navy
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Meldread Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-25-09 02:02 AM
Response to Original message
10. Hey, County Worker! :)
First of all, I am sad to hear that your sister-in-law is being forced out of her job, and from what you said it sounds like it is over trivial crap. I think it's awful that the company is losing an obviously previously valued employee because of the new boss.

That being said, you didn't outline anything that looked discriminatory. It might have been a subtle type of discrimination, but if it can't be proven I'm not sure how much good a lawsuit would do her. :(

However, if she does feel that she was treated badly due to being a lesbian she should consider consulting with a lawyer. Just to evaluate her options. It never hurts to know your options. Of course, even having a lawyer write a sternly worded letter could elicit some type of compensation or good severance package. Who knows unless you check it out, right?

On the other hand, I also agree with the others who posted here. It has to be something that she feels comfortable with, and it is ultimately her decision. I think what is important right now is just to give her as much support as you can during this period of time. That is important and it is all you can really do. Everything else rests on her shoulders.

Finally, I want to commend you on being such a good sister-in-law. It is always nice to see that there are good people out there looking out for their friends and family.
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county worker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-25-09 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. Thanks for the reply.
Edited on Fri Sep-25-09 11:31 AM by county worker
I am a brother-in-law though. She is my wife's sister. I married into a really good and decent family. My sister-in-law has always been accepted by her parents and siblings just as she is. That runs in the whole family. It benefits me because my wife is accepting like that too. We get along because we let each other be themselves and do not demand that we change for each other.

My in laws are very accepting of me as I am. We are a liberal new age open minded family.

On edit,

My sister-in-law accepts me as I am also. I love her and get love back from her.
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HillbillyBob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-25-09 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #11
18. You seem like a good and kind man Bravo. Rare enough these days.
I live in the South I have had subtle and not so subtle discrimination.
Being the overly sensitive sort..and nosy too, those that have a problem always leave a trail.

First she should talk to a lawyer, second she should speak to former coworkers that she knows will not rat her out for speaking to them (and don't like him either), to see if they have heard anything and would back her up in an employment hearing by the local employment commission.
She should have a letter from her lawyer (I have no idea of what resources there are there, there are little to none in the states I have lived in), but I moved from Alabama to Florida and one day I was at the Federal Courthouse in Fort Lauderdale to update some social security info.
There were branches of federal offices for a bunch of things there.
I happened to be passing by the labor office. I ll try to make it short.
I had been forced to work a bunch of over time, so had the rest of the electrical construction crew, the owners of the company was a guy and his brother a Senator Starr and should have known better than to make us work 6 12hr days and 10 on Sunday, but paid us only for 40 hrs on a state contract with federal funding as part of the cost.
Well the shorten the rest I had kept copies of my time cards and a list of all on the crew. Almost a year later I got a check for 2600$ after tax accounting for almost 3300$. I was let go 2 days before the job was finished and told that I had shown up late. every day. Not true since we had to meet a bus to the job site every day at 6 am 30 miles out of Montgomeray AL. I had witnesses, the owner tried to tell the fed that story of me being late and leaving early, but I had heard comments about that fag etc(that being the least of what he called me).
If she can prove stuff on the new bosses part with collaboration from other employees. Too she has a history with the company, is she close to a big promo or retirement where they would have to pay a pension?
This is not the first I have heard of this company doing stuff like this and letting people go or not giving earned promotions to employees that weren't young or pretty enough. That was in other states and I am in no way saying it is a bad company. Every company has jerks in it..they may not know it.
I don't shop the gap anyway I can't afford it.
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Meldread Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-25-09 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #11
19. My apologies, but it's great that you guys have such a...
...a good extended family as well as obviously a good relationship between yourselves. I think your type of family is what everyone needs for some emotional stability and support during times like this - stick together, and I'm sure she'll pull through.

Again, I wish both her and your entire family the best of luck.

I'm sure since she has her MBA and all her previous good work experience that it'll allow her to swiftly find another (perhaps even better) job. Even if she doesn't want to pursue legal action, it never hurts to try and look for the silver lining. This could be a great opportunity for her, and in time she'll no doubt find a work place where she'll be happy and accepted – not to mention perhaps make more money.

I find that in times like this it always helps to try and look for that silver lining - it has to be there somewhere.
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plantwomyn Donating Member (779 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-25-09 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
13. She may change her mind at a later date.
Edited on Fri Sep-25-09 11:59 AM by plantwomyn
And they may too.
She needs to cover all of her bases and her ass. She should file a states EEO claim. She can withdraw at any time but it starts the documentation going. She only has 45 days to do this. Second, send a registered letter and an email to the Corporate offices requesting a full copy of her personnel file. You never know what this creep wrote in it. It may be the smoking gun. She should try to get co-workers to substantiate her story. Did the co-worker she stuck the tag on file a complaint or did her boss assume it was inappropriate? If she was written up for incidents that are not made CRYSTAL CLEAR in the company manual, all of the write ups can be considered at the bosses discretion and therefore may be discriminatory. Get a statement from her shift manager stating that he instructed her to fill out an incident report. Have any other co-workers ever done what she did that were not given a writeup for it? If so, she has a good case for discrimination. He may just be on of those guys that doesn't like to work with strong women. It's still sex discrimination. Look at all of the angles. Sex, age, race, sexual orientation.
Tell her that getting the documentation doesn't mean she has to litigate. Even an EEO complaint is just that, a complaint. She may change her mind about "making anything out of it" in the future and wish she had documentation of went down. She was to remember that since she worked there so long, she needs to include this company on her resume. Is this "boss" going to be the one answering the phone when she has a perspective employers call for references? BIG PROBLEM!
A good lawyer could get her much better money in that severance package just by hinting at evidence of discrimination.
It's too bad she doesn't have any outrage because of this. It sounds like she has a good case for discrimination but it takes time, dedication and laser beam anger to get through an EEO complaint or any kind of litigation. Unfortunately, it also takes money. When we went to mediation with EEO they paid the lawyers fee when we won, but it takes a bit out of the budget until they pa yup.

The idea about calling the Corporation out is good too. But the stuff I post here is time sensitive and if she even thinks she may want to litigate in the future she's got to set the ground work NOW.
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joeybee12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-25-09 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Good advice...essentially, don't close any avenues at this point...
...she may want to sue later...she may be in shock and when it really sets in, that could turn to anger.
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-25-09 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #14
20. Let's see if they follow thru
with the unemployment
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-25-09 02:44 PM
Response to Original message
15. It's much harder now that she's resigned.
If she were to sue, it would all come back to "If you were right in what you were doing, why did you quit?" I'd say move on while you have the chance for a good recc from someone.
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