I’m not Gay.

My sister in law asked if I would help her take my nephew and his friends to Elitch Gardens. I’ve always loved amusement parks and it’s been years since I’ve indulged, I naturally said yes!

So how did spending the day with half a dozen eleven year olds convince this queer he isn’t gay? Here’s the short list.

On the ride to the park we saw a car with it’s lights on. It was a cloud free day, and that is gay.

One of the boys brought a brown bag lunch, of course he was gay.

The only rides the kids would go on where the roller coasters, every other ride in the park was gay.

In the park they sell Bat Man and Superman capes, we saw a couple of teenage boys wearing one of each. In the boys eyes this was gay, I’ll reserve judgement on this one, I think nerd or geek would be a better description. Even that’s an unjustified label.

Anyone who’s spent time with a teen, pre-teen kid will know what I’m talking about. If every thing “not cool” is gay. How do we identify ourselves? I’m out to my family, including my nephew (not his friends). In his eyes and his friends, I’m a “cool” uncle, so how can I be gay?

:spank:

Edit: sp

Were pretty gay.

:hi:

Kerrigan perhaps used the term first publically. But what a shock to be a pre-teen and see the world through the eyes of an adult. Amusement Parks are kitchy marketing. Silly, foolish, idiotic, are words that come to mind.. don't know the words the kids are using today.. didn't know they still used the word "gay".

when I wouldn't let him listen to Radio Disney in my car.

Gay "not cool" is very much in the pre-teen vernacular.

is used in a derogatory way. It is definitely meant to slam someone and it begins in elementary school. I've had many long discussions with my kids that I didn't need to have with them (1st, 2nd, and 3rd grades) - what will we tell the children? :sarcasm:. We were beginning the sex ed talks and I found it difficult to try to explain why being gay wasn't or shouldn't be an insult to kids so young that they truly didn't understand sexual behavior or who were most likely too young to know or understand whether or not they were gay along with the kids who were using it as an insult. Made my head spin for sure.

Let him know that you know that kids mean "lame" or "not cool" when they say that. But tell him that it hurts gay people when they hear the same word that describes THEM being used to describe negative things . . . just like if we said everything we didn't like was black, or Jewish, or Catholic.

You can tell him that YOU know that he loves you and doesn't mean anything bad when he and his friends call things "gay." But it still hurts. And he might even be accidentally hurting other people. There could be a kid he knows who could be gay, and just isn't telling anyone yet. Would he want to hurt him?

Anyway, this is basically the talk I had with my nieces. And my other sister had with her kids. And they all SHOULD have known better, you would think -- just like your nephew -- because their grandfather was gay.

Or maybe I misunderstood. Does your nephew use this word, too? Or just his friends?

on his turf and yes he uses the word gay in the derogatory. I'll let him know he SHOULD know better.



:pals:

My nieces CLEARLY had never made the connection. They just weren't thinking. Just parroting the language of the peer group. In fact, one of them tried to convince me that there was NO connection between the word's two meanings. It JUST HAPPENED to be the same word used in different ways.

I didn't come on strong. I just asked them if they had thought about how using the word "gay" like that would sound to a gay person. One of the girls was pretty chagrined, because her best friend's brother was gay, and she never meant to hurt her friend or his brother. I think I opened her eyes.

So it's beyond personal disappointment. It's a cultural thing we all need to be aware of. Next time he does something lame I'll say that's so "sixth grade" and open up a dialog. He's a smart kid, I think he'll get it.

Unless he's in 7th grade in the fall . . .

He and his friend are really good kids! I blame the culture of the Re :puke: and fundies. My nephew and your nieces will stand up for us, because they know us. The world moves forward, just not fast enough.

For all its flaws, in this particular area I think it's been helpful.

When I think back to twenty-five years ago, when my father first came out . . . there really has been a huge transformation. We ARE moving in the right direction, at least, and I think we'll be there by the time this younger group takes over.

and I had a teacher in high school who said "that's so gay" all the time. One day I gave him that speach almost verbatim... he didn't stop. He's a really nice guy, who I know has no ill will toward gay people, but it's especially bad when an authority figure uses it that way and I wish he'd get a clue. But, even in my hick town, most students realized that it was innappropriate and we STILL joke about what a clueless old man Mr. Smith was (name changed for his protection). "The arc of history always bends toward justice." I think that's true. It will get better.

To most kids, the concept of being gay is so foreign. Even the ones who are gay might not know it yet, or might still be battling with the fact.

So when they use the word "gay" to describe something that is not cool, they are trying to better themselves in the eyes of their peers.

I think you should talk to your nephew and explain to him that he is going to have to accept the fact that there are going to gay men in all aspects of society throughout his life. Some may be in the closet and some may not be.

You need to explain that he needs to be more careful using those words because he may be offending people without even trying.

It's not much different than these white kids who use the word "nigger" to greet each other, thinking they are cool. Many of them have no real intention to be racially offensive, but many black people will be offended nonetheless if they heard them.

Also keep in mind that kids that age are still immature and most will grow out of it.

But considering you're the cool uncle and you're openly gay, I'm sure anything you tell him will sink in. Even if it is not noticeable at first.

just tell them it's gay to call everything that ain't cool gay. They'll get it.

But this one is so Phag....

:)

to use the word gay in a derogatory way. I've rarely heard it since I stopped it and spoke up. My kids and their longtime friends will not allow it in their presence.

Thus far, I'm the only gay person I know who *doesn't* take issue with people using the word 'gay' in that fashion. Many words have more than one meaning; we use them every day without any sort of sarcastic confusion.

If you say somebody's hot, do you mean they're attractive or that they have a high temperature?
If, when asked how you're doing, you say that you're fine, does that mean you're well, that you've been ground into small particles, or that you're a fee presented by some agency as punishment for breaking some rule or law?
If you've got a lot of spam in your inbox, do you have a lot of junk email or a delicious ham and pork product?

I'm well aware of the origins of the 'stupid' definition of 'gay'. However, I believe the word has evolved to the point where the 'homosexual' meaning and the 'stupid' meaning no longer have anything to do with each other.

First, "hot" as you use it doesn't have a negative connotation. "Gay" does. "Hot" to describe attractive was developed from someone making you feel as if you were in a hot temperature--sweaty and maybe wanting a cold shower. Same with "stupid" = "gay". It derives specifically from the homosexual meaning of "gay".

Second, "stupid" = "gay" was developed specifically to let people know their distaste for gay people.

Third, we don't, in civilized society, generally allow words like "retarded" in the same context because it denigrates to the developmentally challenged.

I don't allow the term in my classroom any more than I would allow "retarded".

You just punched all kinds of holes in that logic. Bravo! I love the way you think. :thumbsup:

...taught her younger brother and sister to use this word. They came to my home and my then 5 year old nephew saw something on the tv and said that is so gay. Can't tell you how much that pissed me off. I explained to my niece that her teaching the two younger ones that is simply shitting all over me, because she should know better than to use the word gay is such a derogatory way.

Just last weekend I was at my sisters for her 40th b/day party. Anyway I was actually staying somewhere else with a dear friend of mine (female.) Anyway this particular friend gave me a hard time. I walked into my sisters and said "I feel so married today" and my nephew asked me who I was married to so I said to my friend, he looked at me and said, "but you can't be married to her that would make you homosexual." Yet he has seen with me Sapphocrat? I just don't get it.

On edit: typo

I usually just come back with something snappy like, "Yes, but that's its lifestyle, and who are we to criticize?"
The dumb ones won't get it, but any of them who have an IQ over 70 usually will.

That sends kids to the office for using the word "gay" in that way.

they brought this term back as an acceptable label of things they deem bad, unacceptable, silly, boring, dull, whatever--you fill in the blank. Had it not been for their loose use of the term I do think it wouldn't be seen as socially acceptable anymore, much as it's not cool to use certain racial slurs or to call a woman a 'ho, etc. I still don't think it's socially acceptable, but I think more would "get that" and not use it, if they didn't turn on the tv and see it used this way on one of their favorite shows every week.

The fact that they are seen as a show that "pokes fun" of everything and everyone, anyone saying that this is an inappropriate use of the word is seen as being too pc, just not getting it or my favorite "too sensitive." :eyes:

Maybe I'm wrong or off on this one entirely. I just noticed more people saying the word, particularly children and teens, after South Park was on the air a while.

There was a great deal of backlash for Eminem saying the word and using it in this light in his lyrics. South Park did not help to seal the deal that it's wrong for anyone to use it this way--they've just made it worse in my opinion.

because I remember exactly when I heard this terminology for the first time, which was in August of 1986.

But I didn't understand it had made such a comeback until this post.

Why can't you go to a gay bar without it being full of straight teenagers is what I want to know...It seems like in the early nineties with the advent of techno is when all of a sudden the scenester kids discovered that gay bars had the best djs and then all of a damn sudden they were the cool, hip, happening place to be. Drives me nuts. The one I used to go to when I lived in another state would always be crawling with cliques of these kids on the weekend...and since I totally passed I was always having to fend off these boys that were ten years younger than me. It was so obnoxious. I remember one asking me to dance one time and I said I'm gay and he said 'why?'.

It's funny how they copy our fashion and cram into our bars but 'gay' is a term of derision. They protest too much I think.

going to a gay bar for the music and dj's? Geez--can't the gay community have some peace? A place they can go and not have to deal with such stupidity? That sounds obnoxious.

In answer to your question, I seem to recall the history of the use of the word (at least in my lifetime) started in the 80's (to my awareness). The 80's for the gay community seemed to have been like the 40's or even 50's for blacks, in that many in this country were comfortable with using the n word as a term to describe and to insult.

Growing up with a southern woman that was a former english teacher, I always thought gay merely meant happy or fun--like in the dictionary. So it took me a while to catch on that this was not what people meant when they used it. :crazy: So as certifiably clueless, I'm probably not the best one to speak of when it began. LOL!

Thankfully, in the 90's I didn't hear it as much. I recall Gay advocates being vocal and working hard to let the world know, this was not a cool term. The 90's brought the times of more political correctness, so it became more acceptable to not use the term as loosely. That and the fact that Eddie Murphy stopped doing stand-up. ;) (Big gay basher that he was in his stand up routines. Another protesting too much if you ask me... ;) )

Then in the late nineties, here comes South Park. A show with eight year olds talking like adults, about adult issues. Every other sentence out of their animated mouths was,"...dude that is so gay." They seemed to earn a pass (to some) because they have frequently spoke out against homophobia on the show. But to me, are they really? Are they really supporting gay rights if they continue to allow the use of the word gay in this light? I've long suspected one of the creators is closeted, but I could be wrong of course. I don't know him personally.

I don't think so, but it's probably not my call. I wish a glbt group got in their asses about it, because I think it stinks.

:hi:

Why's it always "gay" being used to mean something "uncool?" If they truly did make fun of everyone equally as they say, they'd cycle some different words in there as derogatory terms as well, but it's always gay, gay, gay. I agree, I didn't hear it being used that way until South Park.

I'm in the minority here, but I actually prefer the term homosexual because gay is a lost term by this point, I believe.

...when I thought they were equal opportunity offenders. In most recent seasons, I feel they are far more critical of the left than the right. I own a couple of the earlier seasons, bought them when I still thought they were balanced. :banghead: I feel so stupid for buying into their bullshit.

But anyway, I noticed that in the early seasons (while Clinton was in office)they frequently poke fun at Clinton. They've NEVER criticized bush...not once. They have however defended him--like in their Katrina episode. :puke: