How do you cover all the uninsured without a public option?

fucking hate them.

then, aside from the cost of pauper plots, they won't be a tax burden and will self-limit the options required for their maintenance.

That, or they'll just live without coverage and die without care, much as they do today . . .

So what if they can't afford it? Fuck the poor--they aren't big campaign contributors.

A public option, even if it were entirely paid for by the enrollees, would push health insurance rates down, because insurance companies would have to compete for patients with the government-administered (not government-controlled) public health care option. Since the administrative costs, as well as shareholder profits and management bonuses are eliminated, the costs would be much lower. Even if the public option only pulled a few million enrollees away from private insurers, it would reduce insurance demand and drive prices down as a result.

You're screwed. End of story.

They certainly can afford any illness they have. Why should they be forced to buy private health insurance ? By the very nature of their massive fortunes, aren't they de facto covered without private insurance ?

Threatening the freedom of an individual who has the means to self-insure is not the really something I would identify with "the land of the free".

Exactly!

Check out today's Borowitz Report for this timely "news" item....

"In Move to Appease Critics, Obama Promises to Extend Health Care Coverage to Morons"

http://www.borowitzreport.com/

It's been tried before, really. I mean Blue Cross/Blue Shield used to be "non-profit" right? Where has that gotten us.

No, without the public option, the rates for the current day uninsurable will be so high that they won't be able to afford it, thus creating the same problem we have now but without anybody being able to say that it's unavailable.

Massachusetts has a public option with a penalty if you have no insurance, same as proposed in HR 3200. Is everyone in Mass covered ? Nope.

What makes you think everyone in the US will be ?

There is no way to cover everyone unless you just say that there is no insurance to carry and all health care costs are paid by the government. The only way to cover everyone is to have single payer that allows non-citizens to be covered during their time in the country.

That is not going to happen.

The truth is without a public option there just isn't any real meaningful reform in the bill. It can tinker around the edges like not letting insurance companies automatically reject people with preexisting conditions but the for profit insurance companies can still make coverage so expensive for those people that effectively they still can't get health care. I would rather see no bill passed then a bill without a public option and I won't vote for anyone who doesn't support the public option even if they have a D next to their name.

What is worse is that in order to get insurance companies to agree with allowing a private option the bill gives private companies $60 billion a year in subsidies free of charge but now there is no public option so why are they still set to get the $60 billion a year in government hand outs? I say it is better to pass no bill then to pass a horrible bill which doesn't include a public option; no public option means no reform so why pass it?

(Please redirect this somewhere else if I'm posting in the wrong place.)

I’m seeing a meme spreading on a listserv I’m on that I’d like to nip in the bud, or at least know more about.

It appears to have started with the paragraph below from this NYT article: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/27/health/policy/27health.html?_r=4&th=&adxnnl=1&emc=th&adxnnlx=1250533818-CMUZUv+7kMqdcPMSwnwmrg

“Under the House bill and a similar measure approved by the Senate health committee, premium subsidies would be available to families with incomes up to four times the poverty level, or $88,200 for a family of four. With income at that level, a family could be required to pay as much as 12.5 percent of its income in premiums under the Senate bill and 11 percent under the House measure.”

That is being extrapolated to mean that people who make over 400 percent of the Federal Poverty Level will be required to pay 11 or 12.5 percent of their income for health care. I can’t believe that’s anywhere near true.

One guy recounted a conversation with his wife. The insurance she gets through work covers the whole family: “She said we pay $1000 per year for a family of five. I told her that under the Obama plan we'd pay over $10,000 per year.”

I emailed him off-list and asked where he got that figure. He said $10,000 is 10% of her income. He believes her employer will end health insurance coverage if a public option is available (I guess because he believes the bogus Lewin/UHG figure) and the premiums she will have to pay for that public option will be at least 10% of her income. He’s basing that on a “conservative” extrapolation of the percentages in that paragraph above from the NYT. So, he sees his family’s health care going from $1,000 a year, to $10,000 a year if something like the Tri-Committee or Senate HELP bills pass.

So, if anyone has any thoughts on how to respond to this, I’d appreciate it.

I couldn't get onto that link to read the article. However, in lamen terms why wouldn't her employer "end health insurance coverage if a public option is available"? I am begining to believe the exact same thing. I fear my employer will too end the coverage or take the Governments coverage for less $$$. Consequently, I honestly believe that will make it harder and longer for me to see a doctor.

Make them run out of toner and tell them how you feel about health care. Don't let the public option go without a fight. Fax: 202-456-2461. Pass it on. The idea is that you will get more attention by communicating in less conventional ways.

I faxed a handwritten note and discussed some of my own experiences about health care and why I believed it was important to keep the Public Option.

Also, fax your congressmen. The best source I've found for complete contact information without jumping through hoops is the following: http://lac.icsc.org/icsc/home / It's an association for retailers, but the information is as good for us as it is for them. Note that the fax for HHS is there too.

Make it happen!!!

Regarding the Public Option - if it's allowed, won't that force the private insurers to lower there rates so significantly that they won't make a profit - (resulting in more employee's being laid off)? if that's the case, what's stopping the companies who offer insurance coverage to their employers from going go the Government insurance which, I strongly believe, will overcrowd doctor offices and slow down proper/immediate attention for those of us who work and pay for our coverage? I'm all for everyone being covered, but at what cost will those of us who are employed or who employee from getting the bad end of the stick. I'm afraid this isn't as easy as The White House is having it appear. I'm afraid - so please help me to understand the benefits of the Public Option for those of us who employee and are employed with insurance coverage.