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Home » Discuss » DU Groups » Religion & Spirituality » Astrology, Spirituality & Alternative Healing Group Donate to DU
 
stellanoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 08:16 AM
Original message
wow
Pluto at the midpoint of the Galactic Center and the Solar Apex and the primary myths of Christianity may have just been shattered.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17336043/

They're doing a press conference today at 11 EST and Neptune will be angular on the MC with Pallas Athena.

Many have talked about Pluto's passage through Sagittarius and the rise of extreme fundamentalism and some have suggested that the falacies of most of the major religions would come to light before Pluto ingresses into Capricorn.

Interesting.

(BTW-Pluto is squaring my Mercury so please excuse my sporatic snarkiness for a while-I'll try to keep it in better check-mea culpa)
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hippiechick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 08:41 AM
Response to Original message
1. Wow is right ...
... Imagine all the fundie heads that will implode if/when they realize that J. was a mortal who wasn't a virgin, who had a wife and kids, and who was just an enlightened pre-hippie guy with some cool ideas ?

:wow:
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stellanoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. LOL I had the same thought.
I thought it was cool how they used statisticians and probability experts to verify their claims.

Then again those sorts of experts are discredited all the time when it comes to election fraud. It'll be interesting to see if they use the same dismissiveness in this case.

hmmmmm
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rumpel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 07:31 PM
Response to Reply #2
16. blasphemy
they'll say...

those darn left wing fringe lunatic scientists must have planted this - it's all political....


:)

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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. I believe it is highly unlikely
that a mass of them will 'realize'. Believing the Bible is infallible, and believing the interpretation(s) it has been given isn't something they will give up easily if at all.
FAITH doesn't rely on evidence or even personal experience. Sadly.
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MorningGlow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
4. Hee!
Edited on Mon Feb-26-07 10:51 AM by MorningGlow
Sorry--I hate to be so snarky too, but the whole premise of Christianity makes me :banghead: .

Seems to me Jesus was a cool dude, though.

This is my favorite "nuke" to the whole divinity thing, from Misquoting Jesus by Bart Ehrman, which discusses how the real "gospels" were altered bit by bit, sometimes on purpose, and other times by careless scribes:

Most manuscripts abbreviate sacred names (the so-called nomina sacra), and that is the case here as well, where the Greek word God (theta-epsilon-omicron-sigma) is abbreviated by two letters, theta and sigma, with a line drawn over the top to indicate that it is an abbreviation. What Wettstein (an early bible researcher) noticed in examining Codex Alexandrinus (an ancient biblical text) was the line over the top had been drawn in a different ink from the surrounding words, and so appeared to be from a later hand (i.e., written by a later scribe). Moreover, the horizontal line in the middle of the first letter, theta, was not actually a part of the letter but was a line that had bled through from the other side of the old vellum. In other words, rather than being the abbreviation for “God” (theta-sigma), the word was actually an omicron and a sigma, a different word altogether, which simply means “who.” The original reading of the manuscript thus did not speak of Christ as “God made manifest in flesh” but of Christ “who was made manifest in the flesh.” According to the ancient testimony of the Codex Alexandrinus, Christ is no longer explicitly called God in this passage.


Sigh. Too bad nobody noticed that special nugget tucked away in an overall very interesting book published in '05.
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stellanoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. that's priceless and precisely why I've said since I was a kid
"who knows"

LOL

thanks
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Chemical Bill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. I like quite a bit of what he writes.
I disagree with a good portion of his "Peter, Paul, and Mary Magdeline", especially about Mary. He gives Paul as an example of a major figure who was not married, to support his contention that Jesus wasn't married. But he doesn't mention that Paul preached only to gentiles (the Jews wouldn't listen?) and had major disagreements with Peter and the rest of the disciples. He (Ehrman) postulates that Peter's name was a nickname (Rock) that showed that Jesus had a sense of humor, as Peter was anything but "rock-steady". But he (Ehrman) is adamant that Mary was named after the town she was born in, which was named after a tower in the area. He misses the idea that Jesus could have nicknamed her "The Tower", and she could have been Mary from Bethany.


Anyway, my latest book about early biblical writings is ... well, I thought it was "The Jesus Legacy" or "The Jesus Lineage" but I can't find either on google so I'll look for the book later. Anyway, I'm convinced that Paul messed up the story totally with his "vision" of Jesus, and we are continuing to pay the price.

Bill
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stellanoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. "paul messed up'"
"wicked understatement."
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Chemical Bill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. Us Cancers can be good at that.
I just choose to ignore that part of my makeup sometimes.

bill
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wickfordbard Donating Member (192 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. wicked, wicked understated
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MorningGlow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. This is the only one of his that I've read
(Well, I'm about 3/4 of the way through.) I picked it up because I'm a firm believer that 2,000 years of "tinkering" with the ancient stories concerning Jesus have really mucked up what he was all about.

Interesting about the nicknames--I think there's a lot of humor in the New Testament that gets lost on us in modern times and after transitions through several languages. (Heck, we don't automatically understand a lot of Shakespeare's verbal humor either and that was only a few hundred years ago--and we're supposed to know his language!) And, of course, people think of Jesus as a stern taskmaster like the God of the Old Testament or above-it-all spiritual being, so..."humor? what humor?"

I agree with you that Paul's vision and subsequent opinions and teachings are at the root of the problems of modern Christianity. I like how some people refer to the Christianity we know as "Paulist".
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Chemical Bill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. I ask some people...
if they are "Christian" or "Paulian".

The book I was looking for is "The Jesus Dynasty" by James D. Tabor. It clearly states that Jesus' brothers were the heads of the movement after his death. Another one, which you might like a lot, is "The Virgin Mary Conspiracy" by Graham Phillips. He goes far into the realm of speculation, but what speculation it is. Have you read Margaret Starbird? She read "Holy Blood, Holy Grail" and set out to disprove it. She wound up converted. Fun stuff.

Bill
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MorningGlow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #10
18. Duly noted!
Jesus Dynasty is now on my list.

I believe I have The Virgin Mary Conspiracy on my bookshelf! Just dug it up from the huge stack next to my bed. I think that will be on my short list. Right now I'm getting back into From Elsewhere, about people who believe they're "ETs", but instead of being "little green men" in human form, it's more about people who have a strong connection to their other lives on other worlds, including the astral plane. Interesting stuff. Seekers like everyone on this board would qualify as these alleged "ETs" (I kind of have a problem with the label).

I haven't read Starbird. I keep meaning to get The Woman with the Alabaster Jar but haven't yet.
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crim son Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #4
19. I looked at a copy at Borders the other day.
Didn't buy it though, because I already know the bible has been doctored and no amount of proof will change the minds of those who most need to see the light.
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Chemical Bill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 03:51 PM
Response to Original message
7. I've read of this find before.
Most people don't remember (or never knew) that the disciples were his brothers and cousins. His next oldest brother would have been responsible for his burial (plus the well being of their mother). The earliest texts make no mention of resurrection, at least those that Paul and his followers couldn't influence. I wouldn't mind if that were well known, but I don't have much hope that this discovery could change the world.

Bill
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crikkett Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 06:16 PM
Response to Original message
13. Ha, the 2nd coming.
Now do we live in 1,000 yrs of peace?
I wonder who's related to Jesus Christ.


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stellanoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-27-07 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #13
21. LOL
Hope so.

Just needed to separate these posts 'cause it read as though I had said "assholes and sycophants" were descended from Christ when I was referring to disingenuous talking heads on the snews last night.
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stellanoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 06:59 PM
Response to Original message
14. assholes and sycophants
Edited on Mon Feb-26-07 07:06 PM by stellanoir
Ughhh

They just did a report on the nightly news. Interviewed a fundie minister speaking of how common the names Mary, and Jesus were. Didn't look at Magdelene's name the name of their son or his brother's really odd nick name. "Scuse me but his name was Yashuah ben Joseph. It made Cameron look like an idiot. Arghhhhh.

Okay turning off the tube and dropping the remote now.
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Rock_Garden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 07:20 PM
Response to Original message
15. Fallacies of the major religions exposed?
That's on my wish list!

I'd be thrilled if they would all remember that tolerance is a virtue.
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stellanoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-26-07 07:36 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. amen to that BIG TIME
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stellanoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-27-07 12:42 PM
Response to Original message
20. on Huff post someone's crying "hoax"
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