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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 03:20 PM
Original message
This is what I was afraid would happen
Edited on Sun Apr-15-07 03:24 PM by politicasista
Backlash.

Even though Imus has been fired, Kerry and Romney should NOT have been used in the same sentence. This is my last post on this issue.


Snip:



Why Imus won’t be fired, despite racial comments
Earl Ofari Hutchinson


The reaction was swift and justifiably angry to radio host Don Imus’s latest racist crack that players on the Rutgers women’s basketball team were “nappy-headed hos.” Imus didn’t step over the line of racial incorrectness — he obliterated it. He then straddled the repentance line with his kind-of-sort-of apology, in which he did not say “I” — only “we.” The careful phrasing turned the “apology” into generic pabulum, and was tantamount to personal absolution.

But even if Imus had made a sincere, heartfelt apology, it wouldn’t amount to much. That’s the standard ploy that shock jocks, GOP big wigs and assorted public personalities employ when they get caught with their racial pants down.

The other reason it’s virtually impossible to permanently muzzle Imus and others that talk race trash is the sphinx-like silence of top politicians, broadcast industry leaders and corporate sponsors.

Ex-Massachusetts governor and current GOP presidential hopeful Mitt Romney and former Democratic presidential candidate Sen. John F. Kerry bantered with Imus on his show in recent weeks. Romney hasn’t uttered a word condemning Imus, and Kerry issued a tepid statement in which he merely branded it “a stupid comment” and praised Imus for owning up to it.

While Kerry and Romney are two of the better-known politicians to recently go on Imus’s show, a steady parade of politicians and personalities have trooped to Imus’s microphones over the years. And not all of them are hard-line GOP conservatives. Sens. Joseph Lieberman and John McCain leaped over each other to get a spot with Imus, and we haven’t a heard a peep from any of them about his remarks.


The problem of the silence, or perfunctory belated criticism, by higher-ups surfaced a few years ago following then-Senate Majority Leader-Designate Trent Lott’s veiled tout of segregation. It touched off a furor, and ultimately Lott stepped down from the post, but it took nearly a week for President Bush to make a stumbling and weak disavowal of him.

The silence from top politicians and industry leaders to public racism was even more deafening a couple of years ago when William Bennett, former Secretary of Education in the Reagan administration, said that aborting black babies could reduce crime. Even as calls were made from the usual circles — almost always blacks and liberal Democrats — for an apology, or his firing from his syndicated national radio show, neither Bush nor any other top GOP leader said a mumbling word about Bennett.

There’s another reason for their silence. Over the last two decades, many Americans have become much too comfortable using code language to bash and denigrate blacks.

The Rutgers ladies attend a solid academic institution, worked hard to get to the top of the basketball heap and have not posed discipline problems — yet vile racial typecasting still made them fair game for ridicule.

The Rev. Al Sharpton, the National Association of Black Journalists and a handful of sports columnists will continue to loudly demand that MSNBC and radio stations give Imus the ax, and they should. But they won’t. There’s simply too much money in racial trash talk, and too much silence from the higher-ups that sends a tacit signal condoning it. That silence is Imus’s ultimate trump card.

BlackNews.com columnist Earl Ofari Hutchinson is an author, political analyst and social issues commentator.


http://www.baystatebanner.com/issues/2007/04/12/opinion04120758.htm
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 03:42 PM
Response to Original message
1. And Gwen Ifill is getting heaped with praise for saying something, but where are
all the YEARS of proBush and proCondi Rice coverage from Ifill in the scheme of what has hurt this country and "enabled' the racist policies from leaders in the WH all these years?

Ifill is Condi's close friend and she had been fully complicit in the last 6 years of pushing the Bush agenda and putting a 'moderate' happy face on Bush's policies.
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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Interesting n/t
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Mass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 04:16 PM
Response to Original message
3. I think a lot of people have been surprised by the strength of the reaction,
including many African-American people. Kerry apparently made a comment early on (much earlier than many), but did not make it public, unfortunately, which makes us unable to know how tepid or not the statement was. Hillary jumped on the bandwagon much later,while apparently, Kerry decided to stay silent (and probably busy on other subjects).

I think that it is way more important for you to know what you think about all this issue (and you have the right to think whatever you think, even if some people are not happy about it) than to worry about comments from columnists, particularly concerning columns that are already obsolete and of poor predictive value: ...Imus was fired... I think the fact that the columnist is so wrong about the resolution of this crisis will largely diminish any other comments he made, which does not necessarily mean that you do not have the right to ask questions about Kerry's reactions, but this should be YOUR questions, not those generated by columnists and reporters (as I tell my son, learn the facts and ask questions, do not let anybody tell you what you think!).
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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Thanks n/t
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
4. That doesn't matter
All Kerry needs to say is that he obviously knew Imus was a curmudgeon, but that he thought he knew where the line was between biting sarcasm and out and out racist slander. He was obviously mistaken. All done.

But noooo, probably in large part due to the responses by supposed progressives, he stays silent. Stupid move, but some folks right in this forum can thank themselves.

Would Imus stand on the streets of Detroit and scream out "nappy head ho's"? No? Because they'd kill him you say?? Then he knew better than to do it on the radio.

That's ALL this is about. If we'd been strong, we could have turned it straight against the same smear machines that attacked Kerry. But nooooo - we let them win again.

We let them slander Sharpton, the first one to say impeach on the air, & Jackson - again. Divide the left - again. Give that middle of the road closet racist a reason to reject Democrats - again.

I'm not pissed because people don't agree with me. I'm pissed because we had the opportunity to have at least a week of constant exposure of the ugly comments made by the rest of the smear machine - and we let the right spin us instead. I am so damned sick of it.

That or the country really does believe all this Sharpton/Jackson/rapper CRAP, even a lot of black people, and doesn't understand that public humiliation is the biggest tool in their arsenal.

NO, nobody made up stuff about Don Imus to publicly ridicule him. He did ALL OF IT himself. He is not the victim, he's the perpetrator. God they have done this so many times, they do it every time. How can people not see him playing the same old tired blame the victim game the right wing always does.

I know I know, but I've known some people around here for nearly 4 years and now I feel like I don't know anybody at all.

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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Exactly. That's all that was needed
"That's ALL this is about. If we'd been strong, we could have turned it straight against the same smear machines that attacked Kerry. But nooooo - we let them win again."

Bingo.
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wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 05:35 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. What is you wanted to see happen? I don't get it. Everyone was
pretty much united in an effort to get out Imus'. The media, Fox News, Sharpton, Jackson. I don't get it. Imus wasn't part of the smear machine that went after Kerry. He was the one place Kerry could turn to to have his say after the "joke".
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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. See post #4
Yes, Kerry could go to Imus after the botched joke, but he told him something like "just shut up" or "be quiet" when he didn't say anything wrong. I think there could have been other morning shows that would have let Kerry have is say. :shrug:
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wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 05:53 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. I don't think Kerry would of felt comfortable on other shows and he most likely felt
he could reach the audience he wanted to reach going on Imus. Also, Imus' comments to Kerry were to in a way help him, it did seen the more he said to defend himself the deeper the media dug. Actually, I was thinking that Imus should have used some of that advise he gave to Kerry. Imus wasn't helping he cause trying to defend himself either, like going on Rev. Sharpton's show. He should have just directed his apology where it needed to be, at the woman on the Rutgers team.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. He was the door to walk through
to put the skids on the rest of the smear machine. To make people aware of the hideously ugly things they say and get a collective voice to rise up and say STOP. NO MORE. ENOUGH.

And YES Wisteria, Imus most certainly joined in on the joke smear.

I cannot for the life of me understand why people are choosing to buy into this blame the black people GARBAGE in favor of a pig like Don Imus.



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wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 07:57 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. I can not take part in making one man the scape goat for all that is wrong with
America. I want to see the smear machine end, just not by using one person to do it. I was never blaming Blacks for Imus' comments but just that the entire culture uses the language and I don't understand why it is ok for one person to use it and not for another. I would love to change the tone of talk radio in this country believe me, I just don't think tagging along with Rev. Sharpton is going to take us there. I would very much imagine that my opinion of Sharpton is much different from yours.
Peace.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. That makes no sense
You can't say you want to see the smear machine ended and then, when someone has the guts to stand up to it, join the right with their "free speech" malarkey. If that's your position, then it was free speech when the swift boaters attacked Kerry and free speech when Hillary piled on with the botched joke. Funny how everybody gets it then, but not when they have to side with African Americans to make the point.

There isn't a thing in the world wrong with Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson except that the right has maligned them beyond all recognition. They've committed no more wrongs than Rush Limbaugh, that's for sure, and yet the same people who dehumanize Sharpton and Jackson adore Limbaugh and O'Reilly. And you're siding with them. Unbelievable to me.
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wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 05:42 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. I really don't know what you expected. That everyone would be united to get Imus?
Mostly everyone at DU was. If it was to get me to unit behind Sharpton to throw the book at Imus for saying something I have heard for years in Black music and movies, than that just wasn't going to happen. As I see it if he is a racist, and I don't think he is, than anyone else who has ever used that term is also racist or sexist. I make judgments as I see them, not based on what others are telling me.
I don't know what type of crusade you expected out of this, but seems to me everyone after Imus got the results they wanted.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. YES, they are racist sexist pigs
Hellooooo???? Where ya' been?????

Is Mick Jagger not a sexist pig with some of his lyrics?? Can people on the 6 o'clock news say the same stuff Mick says?

Jesus christ I do not understand the way you're thinking. I love ya', I really do, but I just do not get it.

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wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #12
17. People on the six o' clock news are in a different genre that Imus or
Jagger. I considered Imus entertainment. I honestly think no one took Imus seriously.
That aside, if I haven't been able to at least give you an idea where I am coming from than I don't know what to say. I don't like listening to insults, but I don't think I have a right to dictate what someone else says as long as it is within the law. I believe everyone is entitled to free speech whether I like what they are saying or not. I also believe that there are other ways to deal with hate speech that don't necessarily divide people and make them dislike each other even more.
Peace.
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wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 05:27 PM
Response to Original message
7. In a months time this will all be forgotten. It is a ridiculous premise anyway to
Edited on Sun Apr-15-07 05:47 PM by wisteria
try and make everyone an accessory to Imus' words. No one is responsible for another's actions and no one has a right to tell someone else how they should behave if it is within the laws of our land. If you continue with the suggestion that all public figures should be responsible for what shows they go on, than why not what extend it ot the movies they watch and what music they listen too.

As for the accusions and shock declared over Imus' words, as someone else said, Imus didn't make up the comments he made, he heard them somewhere else. Instead of going to the source of the problem a long time ago and expressing outrage, everyone ignored these types of comments being freely made in music and spoken as street slang for years. Where has everyones outrage been? It seems to me it is hypocritical to now hang everything on Imus and anyone who was acquainted with him. Frankly, Imus is no more a racist than anyone else who has used this reference.

Oh,and I always thought being progressive didn't mean that when the media and media leaders cry outrage and throw around damaging accusations that we just go along for the ride. I thought that progressive had more to do with free thought and expression and thinking for ourselves. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong.
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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Our Dem politicians should have came out forcefully
Edited on Sun Apr-15-07 06:27 PM by politicasista
Just like they should have done when Kerry was swiftboated twice, but didn't. Otherwise, Kerry and others wouldn't have been accused of putting out a "tepid" response. Their silence is being mistaken as saying that racism and sexism is ok, as long as it is in good taste.

And like it or not, it's on the record that Kerry was a regular on the show, therefore people like this writer are going to ask, have they responded? If so, what did they say? If they don't hear anything, they assume that they are silent and don't care.

It's not fair but that's the way it is.
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cadmium Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. I understand what you're saying. I'm not a 100% in
agreement, but I dont feel like you are wrong either. I actually dont know. Imus is off the air for now and I think deservedly so. I also sometimes enjoyed listening to his show even though they really annoyed me sometimes. If I really thought he was a racist/misogynist as opposed to an old blowhard trying to be outrageous I NEVER would listen for a minute.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. Well now we do know
So what's the problem with calling it like it is. That's what I can't understand.

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cadmium Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-16-07 08:24 AM
Response to Reply #21
22. It has been called like it is.
Imus has a history of racist/misogynist comments -- he made another and got fired. He met with the Rutgers basketball team and they accepted his personal apology. Kerry has been on the show frequently and he issued a statement condemning the remork but didnt join in the pig pile. When the manure was hitting the fan he was on the senate floor blasting the Bush administration and Republicans regarding Iraq. If he did join the pig pile I would think less of him for it. It was pretty obvious to me that Imus was going to lose his job.

Politicalsista was correct from the beginning--I still think htere is room for disagreement on how the issue is handled.

So we disagree on this. For me that is not a catastrophe. Where does that leave us now?
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-16-07 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #22
25. Don't complain about the media
Not anybody. Not ever again. The only way it'll change is if people get fired. But when the opportunity arises to stand up to it, to clean it up overall, people refuse to do it. I do not get it, just don't. Has absolutely nothing to do with Kerry's response, it's fine. He isn't defending the man.
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wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. I wouldn't worry, I am sure Kerry will be just fine. You know he doesn't approve of
Edited on Sun Apr-15-07 08:08 PM by wisteria
racist and sexist talk and he doesn't live his life that way either.

As for Dem's sticking up for other Dem's, unfortunately, I don't see that happening as much as I would like it too. I know it is frustrating.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-16-07 09:25 AM
Response to Reply #14
23. Baloney - What Hillary is doing is OPPORTUNISM of the WORST kind. INSULTING opportunism
If the Democrats clucking loudest now REALLY cared about black people, then where were they when it came time to side with the black communities over the government targeting them with cheap drug dumps? Where were the Dems siding with the black community when Poppy Bush was destroying their communities as a GOVERNMENT ACTION?

Clinton always came down on the side of protecting Poppy Bush and his crimes against the black community.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-16-07 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #23
24. Also, the NJ papers report that they have wanted her to
appear at this seminar on politics and women for about 2 months and she had not said she would until this issue blew up.

As it is she cancelled due to weather. There's major flooding in areas of NJ.
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Inuca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-16-07 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. How bad are things over there?
Did not have time to watch any news today. I don't know what part of NJ you live in, are you OK? I used to live for several years a couple of miles away from Sandy Hook. And by the way, I am obviously sorry for any hardship the nasty weather caused on the east coast, but HRC having to cancel her appearance is a nice silver lining.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-16-07 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. The area around Lodi is supposed to be bad
I live in the area thet Tom Kean's tourist bureau designated the "highlands". Some low lying places have some sitting water, but there's no big problem.
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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. Try telling that to readers of Essence magazine
Who think a Billary/Obama, Obama/Billary ticket is just what this country needs right now.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 03:59 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Try telling Essence magazine readers that they've been swindled and duped.
Because the TRUTH about CIA drugrunning sets Bill up firmly AGAINST the Black community just so he can protect Poppy Bush and his cronies.

And the black community should know that by now - who do they THINK was in the WH in 1996-1998 fer chrissakes.
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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 04:09 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. They do
They are just ready to move on. BTW, Kerry did a cool interview with them back in 2004.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-17-07 04:36 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. They do not. The issue rarely comes up and American Gangster didn't even make the TIMEFRAME
a factor. No one WANTS to state the fact that Bill Clinton FUCKED OVER the black community all over the country just so he could protect Poppy Bush and his crime syndicate that had been running and DUMPING cheap cocaine into their communities for YEARS.

The blacks that were caught dealing their cheap drugs were imprisoned or killed off. What happened to the white guys behind those deals? Bill Clinton MADE SURE they were protected and let off.
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-15-07 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
19. This part of the issue will fade. It will re-appear in the immigration debate
All Democrats are vulnerable in that fight that has been postponed a bit, but not ended. The Imus thing is a 9 day wonder. It points to issues, but is not, in and of itself an issue. This is an issue. If there was a primary challenge next year, I don't think it would come from the left, I think it would come from the right and have to do with all the things that are contained in the immigration debate.

That is what we have to debate and think about. There are a lot of native-born African-Americans in MAssachusetts who want to know why they can't get a job and undocumented workers can. They want to know what the Mass congressional delegation is doing to put a floor under wages and make more jobs available in Massachusetts. They want to know why the New Bedford raid got attention and personal visits from both Senators and some of the House Reps and why they aren't getting those visits. Hard questions about who is in this country, what expensive resources are being used to pay for ancillary services and care and why we aren't shipping people who are here illegally back to their home countries are going to be asked.

This debate will make the Imus flap look like National Brotherhood Week at the UN.

Raid bares deep divide
In New Bedford, hard lines over illegal immigration

By Yvonne Abraham, Globe Staff | April 15, 2007

NEW BEDFORD -- To Cindy Tapper and her friends, gathered on black-upholstered banquettes at Shawmut Diner on a recent morning, the cause of New Bedford's economic woes was laid bare by a March 6 raid on a waterfront leather-goods factory and the arrest of 361 suspected illegal immigrants.

"I have a nephew who works at one of the fish plants," said Tapper, 56, a homemaker who grew up in the developments across the street from the diner.

"Nobody showed up for work for a week after that ICE raid," she said, referring to Immigration and Customs Enforcement. "ICE needs to come to New Bedford and set up shop. The illegal immigrants are using the hospitals as a doctor's office. They're putting a strain on the city of New Bedford."

If you want to know where the illegal immigrants are working, said Tapper's friend David Gould, 47, "look for the bicycles. They're lined up outside all the fish houses."

"There are plenty of empty mills in New Bedford we can make into deportation centers very quickly," said Lynn Kelly, a graphic artist, 40. "That's the business to get into."

For years, illegal immigrants and native-born residents have been living side by side in this city of 94,000. Tensions flared occasionally, but mostly the communities coexisted without incident. But when federal immigration officials threw open the doors to the Michael Bianco plant, they also brought resentments into the open that had been long simmering in this struggling city.

"What this raid did, it forced us to look at the issue of illegal immigration in New Bedford for what it is," said Phil Paleologos, co-owner of Shawmut Diner. "The jobs taken, the services being utilized, the schools and the social services. . . . This raid has pinpointed exactly what the problems are and what needs to be done: Enforcement is the best way."

The raid brought the city's mostly underground illegal immigrant population into sharp relief, making them feel vulnerable and less welcomed. It hardened attitudes toward those immigrants in diners and on the streets. It galvanized immigrants and their advocates, who are now more determined to band together and fight for rights.

More at: http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2007/04/15/raid_bares_deep_divide/


This is a fall-out argument that touches on issues raised, for real, in the Imus thing. It is going to be ugly, ugly, ugly.
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