Latest

Lobby

Search

Options

Help

Login

Do Democrats Have a Death Wish?

Printer-friendly format

Email this thread to a friend

Bookmark this thread

This topic is archived.

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (01/01/06 through 01/22/2007)

im10ashus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 02:51 PM
Original message

Do Democrats Have a Death Wish?

Do Democrats Have a Death Wish?
by Dave Lindorff Tuesday, May. 30, 2006 at 10:23 AM
dlindorff@yahoo.com

With the people clamoring for impeachment, what kind of leaders would tell them no? Who are these people anyhow: Karl Rove plants?

Do national and congressional Democrats have a death wish?
In the course of flogging my new book, The Case for Impeachment, I’m coming to the conclusion that they must. And that's even before they do something stupid like support the nomination of General Michael Hayden to head the CIA.

Rank-and-file Democrats want--badly want--to see President Bush get impeached. So do independents. I hear it from everyone I meet. It's the rare Democrat or progressive or even independent who says she or he doesn't agree with the idea of impeachment, and even then, it's because such people are misinformed themselves and think that while they personally would love to see Bush get dragged into a big impeachment investigation, the rest of America wouldn't like it to happen.

That seems to be the wrong-headed thinking of the Democratic Party leadership. Both House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) and Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) have vowed that if Democrats retake the House and/or Senate, that there will be no impeachment of the president attempted. Both leaders of the House and Senate election campaigns, Rep. Rahm Emanuel (D-IL) and Sen. Charles Schumer (D-NY) have actively worked to undermine the primary candidacies of aggressive candidates who favor impeachment. These political cowards and sell-outs claim that what the voters want is for Democrats to press ahead in a positive way with their "agenda," forgetting that they really don't have an agenda, and that in any event, whatever bills they pass will simply be cancelled by the president, who will simply issue a "signing statement" invalidating their legislation.

The point, though, is that these sorry leaders are all wrong. The broad mass of the American public wants to be shed of this disastrous administration, and does not want to have to endure two more years of war, deceit, incompetence and politicization of every issue.

cont'd...

http://sf.indymedia.org/news/2006/05/1728579.php

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

derby378

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 02:55 PM
Response to Original message

1. It's time to issue an ultimatum to Democrats on the Hill

If you're not with us, you're against us.

And we want George W. Bush out of the White House.

He can be impeached. Or he can resign in disgrace before we impeach him. But one way or the other, he needs to leave the White House before his second term is up.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Warpy

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #1

4. I've already done that. I've told my senator's office he's lost my vote

and I intend to follow through. I will vote Green. If the Greens fail to get a candidate on the ballot, I will write in my tomcat. I will not vote for a DINO who has stabbed my in the back so many times.

Incumbent Democrats have to earn my vote. He's thrown it away.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Avalux

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #4

7. What will voting Green accomplish?

I understand your anger, but what you're proposing is not the solution. Who is your Senator? You could be me, and be stuck with Cornyn and Hutchison, lol.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

im10ashus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #7

8. Bless your heart.

I have friends in San Antonio who feel the same way. I get Clinton and Schumer. Both DINO's but better than Hutchison ANY day.

:hug:

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Avalux

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #8

13. At least we got rid of DeLay -

I guess anything's possible. I don't even bother calling their offices; the few times I've tried to call Cornyn's all I got was a recording. He doesn't even make public appearances, the pompous ass.

:hi:

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

im10ashus

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #13

14. You know, that is a VERY good point re: DeLay.

We could terminate (pun intended) that a-hole - anything is possible. I never thought I'd see the day. I cringe every time I see Hutchison on a news or talk program because I know she's going to be talking the same RW points as always. She never strays from the memo. 2006 is going to be REAL interesting.

:hi:

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

acmejack

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #13

23. Cornyn doesn't accept e-mail either.

If you write him he doesn't respond, if you get a person they will hang up on you or laugh at you and then hang up. Lamar Smith's folk's are no better, except they are polite, at least. KBH buries you in answers, they don't say anything, but you sure get a lot of form letters.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Warpy

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #7

18. My vote, added to others, will tell the bastard

that we won't be taken for granted any more.

Oh, don't worry, he's assured of stabbing me in the back for another 6 years, the GOP is mounting only token opposition.

He's a moron and hostile to my interests. I won't waste a vote on him.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

in_cog_ni_to

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #4

25. They don't care if they lose our votes. They're the ones in charge.

UNFORTUNATELY.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

redqueen

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 02:56 PM
Response to Original message

2. how many would have to be impeached for things to change, though? n/t

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

RDU Socialist

(290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #2

3. that's what i've been thinking

okay we remove Bush, then we'll have Dick Cheney and a vice president of his choosing essentially. Then we remove Cheney, and we're stuck with whatever right wing lunatic he picked as his second in command, and so on. This isn't like going from Andrew Johnson to Schuyler Colfax, this is like going from Richard Nixon to Teddy Agnew.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

acmejack

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 05:03 PM
Response to Reply #3

24. You mean Spiro-chete?

Or did he have along lost bro, I don't know about?

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Avalux

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:08 PM
Response to Original message

5. Could it be they don't want it to be an election issue?

Get in office, start investigations and that will lead to impeachment. I think it's good strategy to not make impeachment the goal of getting elected; most Americans won't vote for a candidate for that reason and there's other issues that need to be in front.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

RDU Socialist

(290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #5

6. the 1994 republicans didn't run on impeaching clinton

they ran on "reigning his 'ultra-liberal' agenda in" which was total bullshit, but whatever. if they had run on impeachment, they would not have won either house of congress.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

novalib

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #6

12. But 2006 is NOT 1994!

In 1994, the country was at Peace.

We were prosperous.

Things were good.

In 2006, things could not be different!

We are in an unwinnable war.

We were LIED to by an unelected pResident!

We have a MASSIVE Federal Debt!

Things are not just BAD -- THEY ARE TERRIBLE!!

In 1994, the Republicans could not have won both houses of Congress if they had said they would impeach Bill Clinton -- because NO ONE would have voted for the Repukes if they had known that they intended to throw Bill Clinton out of office.

Now, in 2006, the Democrats MUST bring an end to the corrupt, tyrannical, Bush Cabal Regime -- everyone one of them 00 and that means Cheney and Rice, too.

If the Democrats run on that issue, there are MANY MANY people who WILL vote for them! It's s sure way to win back BOTH houses of COngress!!

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

jwirr

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #12

17. All the more reason to run on the issues and leave the

impeachment until we have the votes.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

RDU Socialist

(290 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #12

20. what killed the democrats in 1994 was the fact we didn't turn out

Edited on Tue May-30-06 04:25 PM by RDU Socialist

if we say "we're going to impeach those inbred republican motherfuckers" the republicans, who are really disenchanted with the party and won't turn out as it stands right now, will come out in droves to prevent an impeachment.

in the game of chess you send pawns out first. in this case, our pawns are issues. if we bring out the big guns like changing the government dramatically too early, we'll essentially be trying to do the scholar's mate against gary kasparov, we'll lose major pieces.

edit: i need to read the begining of my run-on sentences so the ending makes sense...

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Marr

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:18 PM
Response to Original message

9. Now wait a minute-

Edited on Tue May-30-06 03:18 PM by Marr

The only comments I've heard from people like Pelosi amounted to 'we are not planning to impeach- we want to investigate'.

And that's a good position. Saying you intend to impeach without doing investigations makes it look like a partisan lynch mob, and worse- it would pass right by an opportunity to expose the corrupt operations these pigs have been running for the last 6 years.

Say we want to investigate, and investigate. Publicly peel back layers of all these sickeningly criminal jobs over the course of months, and then impeach.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

redqueen

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #9

10. Excellent points...

I agree completely. First things first.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

ShortnFiery

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #9

11. They need to "dig in" and "get tough" on the Republicans ...

Edited on Tue May-30-06 03:25 PM by ShortnFiery

This campaign is for *all the marbles.* The debates involved are no longer collegian disputes across the aisle.

It's political WAR! :P

Our illustrious Democratic Representatives should not make the mistake of making nice now.

If your oponent's down, KEEP HIM (HER) DOWN!

If you give any Republican slack, they'll use it to hang YOU with ... learn it, know it, live it! ;) :hi:

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

azmesa207

(327 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #11

15. Voting green or your tomcat

That the sure way to help the Republican keep control of the House and Senate

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

ShortnFiery

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #15

19. Typical " Like us right of center Democrats, or else we don't give a

damn about your liberal asses. Take a hike, you crummy left of centers." The foregoing is a BIG MISTAKE.

Guess what? It is an "Or Else" time. Hopefully to vote in NEW (vice incumbent Democrats). The Democratic Party leadership either begins to *serve the people* before their career or corporate "sugar daddies" OR ELSE we all will lose!

My point: It's beyond time to recognize *the base* - LIBERALS within the Democratic Party. Yes, It's that important and the time is NOW!

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

OneBlueSky

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Wed May-31-06 02:59 AM
Response to Reply #15

26. which resurrects Nader's question "Is there a difference?" . . .

right now, not much . . .

but I remain hopeful that somehow the peoples' voices will be heard above the din of corporate campaign machinery . . . and that candidates who run advocating a liberal/progressive vision will prevail . . .

hopeful, but not optimistic . . .

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

Ksec

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 03:57 PM
Response to Original message

16. The problem I have is the results of an impeachment

We get rid of one crook and get another crook.

Other than that I would have no problem with impeaching him and then hanging him for war crimes.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

ShortnFiery

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #16

21. Impeach them BOTH! They have done more than enough to deserve it. n/t

Edited on Tue May-30-06 04:24 PM by ShortnFiery

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

woodsprite

(1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore

Tue May-30-06 04:23 PM
Response to Original message

22. I think some of them have a "cover my ass" wish.

That's why they follow * whereever he goes.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

DU AdBot (1000+ posts)

Mon May 06th 2024, 09:27 AM
Response to Original message

Advertisements [?]

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (01/01/06 through 01/22/2007)

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators

Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home | Discussion Forums | Journals | Store | Donate

About DU | Contact Us | Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC