CPAs; Why would a non-profit organization seek to hide its finances?

This is a meta-discussion about this topic;

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x433908

Why would ANY non-profit that solicits donations from the public delay disclosure of its finances for over a year and then fail to comply with a request for a 990 that was properly requested? Have any of you Accountants or CPAs ever seen this sort of behavior before?

Thanks!

because they can be.

And yeah, I am sure we all have.

Nobody wants their name in the paper -

Doesn't mean they did anything wrong, by the way - but no one needs that kind of attention, either.

Joe

The expenses are all shown, line item. The top officer's salaries are shown, too, if they are over a certain (not that large) amount.

It is possible, too, that they filed an extension on their tax return. That is very common for non-profits. So they might not have it until way after the first due date.

I guarantee you will get it though unless they are really stupid.

They don't want names in the paper, either.

Joe

that two extensions were filed. Proper request for 990 copy was filed (months ago). The legal time limit to comply with providing copies of the filing (final filing date 5/15) to the public is up.

Maybe they are really stupid or.....???

for not complying. They will have to anyway. They are stalling but they are playing with fire. They don't have to give up any donor information with it, but the salaries and expenses will be there.

what DONORS would think of their money going to paying fines up to $10,000 PLUS $5,000 for "willful" noncompliance.

with today's Republican leadership and judges, who, we might ask, will levy such fines?

I haven't dealt with this in a while, but BBV would be allowed to charge a "reasonable" amount for copying and sending the return. So maybe offer to pay these expenses. But I don't see why they couldn't put it in a filed and send by email. I am not sure if reasonable is defined. Again, it has been awhile and things could have changed.

They also have only seven days to request such a fee or they have to provide it for free. And the seven days is expired.

Yes, they had 7 days to inform the requestor of reasonable copying and mailing costs. That deadline is loooong gone.

Sure, they COULD put it in an email, but have not done so.

They COULD post it on their website, but have not done so.

After reading the other thread, is that they are counting the thirty days from May 29, since that is the request that is the only one post 990 filing. That is probably not totally legit, but it might pass as being not willfully denying access to the form. I would suggest sending a certified letter, return receipt requested if you don't hear from them in a couple of weeks.

When I dealt with this the 990 was not required to give out any donor information.

BTW, who do you think is the best non profit that will promote secure voting machines?

they are the best to promote legitimate election reform.

I have so many doubts about this organization, that when she claims to have filed with IRS on 5/15, I have no reason to believe it. Add to that the difficulty of getting a copy of it!

I am not concerned with the donor names, I am concerned with the organization itself.

I cannot see how they can conclude that 5/29 is a date to count from, considering that my original request was acknowledged on 4/3, and again on 4/16.

I suppose they COULD play those games. But I would think that a legitimate non-profit would be pleased to provide information about their organization's finances.

compensating herself from the donations. That's really it, no other reason. Only other thing I can think of is if she co-mingled the donations with her own personal finances and the accountant is having a hell of a time pulling apart everything and accounting for what is actually her compensation as the head of this group or she didn't keep any books at all and just cashed the checks. She might be having a hard time finding an accountant willing to pull her books together out of thin air.

there was that fake accountant, "Tonya Johnson" was it?

Even legit non-profits don't like to see salary info published. Too bad!! Still she knows she has to provide the 990. This is a delaying tactic and it can't last long. If she doesn't respond to the May 29 request, send a certified letter and start calling their board members, and threaten to inform the IRS.

it is now 30 days past their final filing date. I will file an IRS complaint and see no reason at all to regard 5/29 as anything whatever. I am tired of her crap delays.

...that she had commingled, and had no personal checking account at all. Sadly, we cannot now ask Andy to clarify.

The money went into her pocket and she has no way to account for it in a legitimate way.

And when it does, we'll see if it is real, or fake.

Her books are probably a mess. She has received money from people all over the country and probably didn't bother to keep track of it. Her use of those funds is probably questionable too.

I do know I sent her a donation back when she first started out with Andy. I never received any acknowledgment that she had received the donation, which bothered me at the time. Everyone else in the world, even DU, sends a thank you note. Doesn't really mean anything in the grand scheme of things, just made me suspicious of how she was handling the money.

claims that her acountant turned out to be a dirty Diebold spy.

I am free from my self-imposed rule about posting on Bev.

In 2004, Bev invented a fictitious CPA named Sonja Johnson in order to get access to my accounting records, specifically records that had information concerning her royalties, but also had royalty and sales information that Bev herself would not have had legal access to. She then claimed I lied to her about her book sales, claiming the records "proved" I had sold more books than I claimed. She cited the PayPal sales figures to back up this claim, despite the fact that those figures included ALL books I had sold, not just her's. I do not know if this was a deliberate lie on her part, or just her typical cluelessness about matters more complicated than nursery rhymes.

I begin to suspect that Bev's "expert accountant" is Sonja Johnson.

that she lied about the money raised during Randi Rhodes call for donations. Bev claimed a total of something like $25,000... and we saw the credit-card company report showing near $175,000 in FIVE HOURS.

Sadly, he is no longer here to clarify or document that claim.

but it goes something like this:

1) Return due 15th day of 5th month after the end of the Fiscal Year (in this case apparently the FY ends in December, so the return would be due May 15).

2) Automatic extension (you have to file, but the extension is automatically granted) extends that date for another period of time (5 months sticks in my head, but could be more).

3) Second extension (not automatic, but fairly easy to get) for another 2 months

4) Additional extensions which are revued be a revenue officer, and which must have a darn good reason (CPA in hospital, etc.)

The Organization is only required to provide upon request 990's that have been filed.

The penalty for non-criminal non-filing is $75/day. Eventually, it could imperil the 501(c)3 status of the organization as well.

Guidestar will have all 990's after a month or so (free to review).

1) is correct, 5-1/2 months. BBV's was originally due Nov. 15, 2005.

2) correct, except the period is 3 months.

3) another 3 months, bringing the filing date to May 15.

4) correct, the org needn't provide non-existent 990s, such as one for fiscal year 2003-2004, because BBV wasn't a 501c at that time.

5) penalties for non-compliance with a 990 copy request are $20 per day, maximum $10,000, and up to $5,000 for "willful" non-compliance.

Guidestar says they have them after about two months. However, merely sending them to guidestar is not considered compliance. The law is that the organization must provide a copy of 990 within 30 days of a written (email, fax, etc.) request to the requester by email, snail mail or posting on the internet as a pdf file.