Declaration of War / Authorization to use Military Force. I am furious.

Am I justified in feeling intolerable anger at our own?

If this administration has been acting as if war was declared, but officially it wasn't - why wasn't this figured out before this? By all our leaders in Washington, our Governors, our State representatives?

Aren't we paying them to keep this straight for us?

I can't believe how everyone is praising Diane Feinstein for bringing this out today and causing Gonzales to not have an answer?

I never believed that this 9-11 crap in Iraq was a war or should have been a war. But I don't count because I don't know the law and evidently did not follow any threads on this at DU or in other places - probably because I was obsessing over other issues.

Now, for the first time we are telling each other that our own leaders did not know what we were operating under?

Please explain to me - just what did the majority of Democrats think we were operating under?

What did the majority of Republicans think we were operating under?

We were operating under an Authorization to use Military Force which:

> does not allow us to throw out the Geneva Convention?
> does not allow us to capture, transfer, imprison, and deny rights to people picked up on the streets of Iraq?
> does not allow this administration to spy on our communications and our banking?

> does not allow all these deaths, dismemberments, destructions, denial of careers, some ruined families, some severely handicapped and dependent mental, physical, spiritual wrecks, some ruined immune systems?

Am I justified in feeling furious anger at our leaders for not knowing what principle we were operating under?

Is there NO ONE taking care of our interests.

2001 - 2006? Is the entire country as stupid as I am?

Recall their paychecks. Kick them out.

Please help me out here.

He has zero concern about our concerns. He's never been there and doesn't care to go there.

report it..out the blame on our so called media..and any american who gave a damn could have known this, the info was readily available..

i posted it over and over when * started the shock and awe..that war was never declared by congress..if you know the constitution..only congress can declare war!

they never did..

kerry said it many times before the bombs started and after..

but our media made sure those statements got very little attention!

kerry also stated many times..that * was supposed to go back to congress after 60 days of going to the UN security council with the authorization of military force

* never went back to congress as he was required to.

fly

Did Congress believe they were giving this admin permission to go to the UN using a Declaration of War or the Authorization to use Military Force? Or something else?

The UN gave this admin an OK believing we were going into Afghanistan? (I throw that in here based on memory).

This admin did not go back to Congress - at all?

This admin pretended that they had declared war even thought they hadn't?

Only Kerry talked about it?

Personally, I don't care that the media didn't pick up on it - that parallels their un-American corporate partnership with the right wing. I don't expect anything from those traitors other than more traitorous acts.

I do expect something from our leaders other than one lone person - Kerry. What the heck went wrong here?

Are our leaders more stupid than I am? By their silence and non-support for Kerry - did they commit a traitorous act against the citizens of the U.S.? And the world?

I say again - recall their paychecks. Kick them out. Keep Kerry. But... why wasn't Kerry's message clear to me? Don't answer - I am stupid.


Our kids, our kids, their kids. I'm so sorry.

enforcers in Congress - why did they go along with this non-legal dictator 'lil concocted venture of PNAC?

Why didn't our Dems in Congress figure out what Kerry was saying and press the issue? Was this all about votes as we thought before.

They don't deserve their office.

Please educate me if I'm wrong.

If I'm right - I want them all out - including Feinstein - all of them should have started analyzing all of this when theee mis-labeled orange suited still human people were picked up and flown to existing and contracted prisons all over the world and flown to them in Lear jets which landed in supposedly peaceful nations for refueling.

They didn't have to wait until the government was stealing our communication and banking data and giving it to Poindexter.

They should have started questioning things when this admin would not allow and investigation of 9-11 other than an investigation of intelligence agencies.

They should have not allowed Homeland Security - and its continually mis-managed jokesters, including the destruction of FEMA and formerly respected government agency.

They should have never voted for the Patriot Act.

They stole billions from us along the way.

All of them should be kicked out.

They are all complicit except Kerry.

Tell me how I'm wrong.

I wish I could recommend more than once. Oh yes, I like what you say
peace
:hi:

> Am I justified in feeling furious anger at our leaders for not knowing what principle we were
> operating under?

Yes.

> Is there NO ONE taking care of our interests.

No. Are you joking? They have their own interests to attend to and only pay attention to us when votes hang in the balance. That goes for the majority of Congressional Dems as well. You can count on one hand the number of Dems whose natural tendency is to know what's going on and stand on principle in defense of this country and its people. The rest become brilliant only when the exertion benefits them.

> 2001 - 2006? Is the entire country as stupid as I am?

Most of the country is less-informed/easier to mislead than you. Only 28-32% of Americans qualify as terminally stupid: Bush**'s base.

Will the Dems take advantage of this and start asking the question at every turn? Are we are are we not officially at war? If not, how can the President's war powers apply? I didn't hear the exchange on one single news station yesterday. Was it reported? Did Keith or Jon Stewart cover it? If not, why not?

Every Dem rep and sentor should watch the exchange and start asking questions. Will they? I doubt it.

EDIT...Let's ask him for more details on it tonight. Mr. Turley would be a good guest to ask about this.

Please sign

-Hoot

They don't seem to get much attention.

-Hoot

that should be in the headlines and a call for action, yet nothing seems to stick. Many people I know are furious, as am I; the system is broken when the minority party has no power, the majority party is comprised of lock-stepped clones, and the media is no longer capable of independant thought...

been legitimately declared since ww2? :shrug:

just askin...

I'm under the impression they've all been police actions

I have to admit. You have lost me.

which Congress abdicates ITS Constitutional duties to *.

Also, the War Powers Act, embedded within the AUMFs prohibits actions based upon untruthful "circumstances" and "situations", in other words fabricated events (WMD searches for fictitious WMDs seems to qualify -- I won't go into LIHOP/MIHOP on 9-11).

unless he gets Condi pregnant. God forbid he should break the cycle of inbreeding.

IWR

United States Senate

In the Senate, the 21 Democrats, one Republican and one Independent who courageously voted their consciences in 2002 against the War in Iraq were:

Daniel Akaka (D-Hawaii)
Jeff Bingaman (D-New Mexico)
Barbara Boxer (D-California)
Robert Byrd (D-West Virginia)
Lincoln Chaffee (R-Rhode Island)
Kent Conrad (D-North Dakota)
Jon Corzine (D-New Jersey)
Mark Dayton (D-Minnesota)
Dick Durbin (D-Illinois)
Russ Feingold (D-Wisconsin)
Bob Graham (D-Florida)
Daniel Inouye (D-Hawaii)
Jim Jeffords (I-Vermont)
Ted Kennedy (D-Massachusetts)
Patrick Leahy (D-Vermont)
Carl Levin (D-Michigan)
Barbara Mikulski (D-Maryland)
Patty Murray (D-Washington)
Jack Reed (D-Rhode Island)
Paul Sarbanes (D-Maryland)
Debbie Stabenow (D-Michigan)
The late Paul Wellstone (D-Minnesota) Ron Wyden (D-Oregon)

United States House of Representatives

Six House Republicans and one independent joined 126 Democratic members of the House of Re
Neil Abercrombie (D-Hawaii)
Tom Allen (D-Maine)
Joe Baca (D-California)
Brian Baird (D-Washington DC)
John Baldacci (D-Maine, now governor of Maine)
Tammy Baldwin (D-Wisconsin)
Gresham Barrett (R-South Carolina)
Xavier Becerra (D-California)
Earl Blumenauer (D-Oregon)
David Bonior (D-Michigan, retired from office)
Robert Brady (D-Pennsylvania)
Corinne Brown (D-Florida)
Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio)
Lois Capps (D-California)
Michael Capuano (D-Massachusetts)
Benjamin Cardin (D-Maryland)
Julia Carson (D-Indiana)
William Clay, Jr. (D-Missouri)
Eva Clayton (D-North Carolina, retired from office)
James Clyburn (D-South Carolina)
Gary Condit (D-California, retired from office)
John Conyers, Jr. (D-Michigan)
Jerry Costello (D-Illinois)
William Coyne (D-Pennsylvania, retired from office)
Elijah Cummings (D-Maryland)
Susan Davis (D-California)
Danny Davis (D-Illinois)
Peter DeFazio (D-Oregon)
Diana DeGette (D-Colorado)
Bill Delahunt (D-Massachusetts)
Rosa DeLauro (D-Connecticut)
John Dingell (D-Michigan)
Lloyd Doggett (D-Texas)
Mike Doyle (D-Pennsylvania)
John Duncan, Jr. (R-Tennessee)
Anna Eshoo (D-California)
Lane Evans (D-Illinois)
Sam Farr (D-California)
Chaka Fattah (D-Pennsylvania)
Bob Filner (D-California)
Barney Frank (D-Massachusetts)
Charles Gonzalez (D-Texas)
Luis Gutierrez (D-Illinois)
Alice Hastings (D-Florida)
Earl Hilliard (D-Alabama, retired from office)
Maurice Hinchey (D-New York)
Ruben Hinojosa (D-Texas)
Rush Holt (D-New Jersey)
Mike Honda (D-California)
Darlene Hooley (D-Oregon)
John Hostettler (R-Indiana)
Amo Houghton (R-New York, retired from office)
Jay Inslee (D-Washington)

whether they have an R or a D realize they have more in common with each other than with the plebes who go about doing the living and dying in far away lands or in the land of the Free...

Politics USED to be a good thing because everyone played by certain rules, obeyed ethics and were committed to serving the interests of ALL people.

It's evolved into a "win at any cost" for power OVER all the people.

It seems almost hopeless, these days. Unless, there is a SERIOUSLY IMPACTFUL move towards accountability and responsibility,...towards applying, equally, the rule of law,...we are lost, lost.

:grr:

:sarcasm:

WHAT exactly ARE a President's "war powers" anyway? They can't possibly include all of the things that Bush and his lackeys have done to date, can they, EVEN IF we are "at war" (which I firmly believe we are NOT)? :wtf:

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