Hagel is spanking so so bad this morning

cool

details please.

but when she would interupe him because she no liking what he was saying, he would just 'now dammit', well he didn't use dammit but it was implyed, so so bad this is important and you asked me a question and I will answer it.

.... what you are watching or listening to. We're not asking for a transcript.

my bad.
soledad on cnn

the one in the whitehouse.

I don't think I will be voting for hagel in the future but it is good to hear him take on the pResident on the Iraqmire

I do not think that any progressive democrats would advocate "support" for Hagel in terms of financial contributions and/or voting for him. But his vocal opposition to the Bush policy in Iraq is a tool that progressive democrats can use to hammer the administration.

We should remember that Hagel, along with Lugar and Biden, had been proposing an alternative to the Bush-Cheney rush to war in Iraq. It was Dick Gephardt, looking to promote himself as a tough guy in the upcoming primaries, who "derail the bipartison effort." (Hubris; Corn & Isikoff; page 127)

In our efforts to end the war in Iraq, we should never compromise our values. It is unlikely that we are going to agree with Hagel on anything else of significance. But we should be create in using all the resources available to us in our efforts.

Very good points, H2Oman...

Hagel has been an opponent of the misuse of the military as opposed to the war concept itself. He spoke up early and often about this but the corporate media ignored him. Now he's "relevent". And so much the better.

Yep, I wouldn't vote or trust Hagel on any social or economic issue, but taking a page from Arab tradition "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". But, as you point out, it must be within the framework of Iraq and then in good measure. His intersts are in the health of the military and not on how we got into Iraq or that he stands with us on how a draw-down or withdrawl should be accomplished.

The good thing is booooshie has pissed Hagel off so much that now it's "payback time". Just as Liebermann pisses us off no end on Iraq, Hagel has been doing the same on the other side of the fence and now appears to be building a coalition with Smith, Snowe, Sununu, Coleman and Brownback (now there's a snake I truly don't trust) that is our Liebermann nightmare times 10 on their side. Let's sit back and watch the show. As long as boooshie refuses to stand down to even his own party, this rift will get even wider.

I'm sure sitting on the side are Warner and Lugar who will bring the other votes across to prevent any filibuster of any future funding cuts and other resolutions to force boooshie's hand. This "surge" has force the hands of several on that side and the ensuing battles that I'm sure are ahead as the boy blunder continues to "protect his legacy" and try to drag this mess out while his party fractures further.

I always saw Hagel as the anti-McCain...the real renegade who saw the liabilities of boooshie early on and has always planned his future accordingly. booooosh fatigue has settled in big and Hagel may be able to parlay this into emerging as an alternative to McCain in '08 like McCain was the counter to boooshie in '00.

But I still feel there's a third party coming here. The natives on the right are disorganized and very restless.

of the Iraq war, it is frequently said, "No matter how we got into this mess, we need to recognize it is too important to lose." Okay. The #1 reason we will "lose" is because of Bush & Cheney. The truth is that everyone in the nation is not going to become a progressive democrat; however, it is also true that progressive democrats can, by using the tools available, help to turn even our republican relatives and neighbors against the administration's Iraq policy by proper use of Hagel.

More, I must point out that back in November of '06, after the elections, when I advocated that progressive democrats begin to pressure Congress to investigate and impeach Cheney, some people here said that "there will never be enough votes because of the republicans." My firm belief is that we must trust the process. And what we are witnessing today is a process with unlimited opportunities for progressive democrats to transform this nation. We have the tools to do it.

Our biggest problem is how far in the hole we really are. Many want to make up a lot of ground in short time...a wide range of issues and spread ourself out a mile wide and an inch thin. But soon the focus will be almost totally on both Iraq and the mismangement and abuses of this regime. And with it will be opportunities to find common cause with people like Hagel or Specter or even a Cobourn...making alliance where needs to to achieve change. It won't be overnight, but it can be done, and i'm very confident in who we have in the Senate to create those opportunities and exploit the divides to further our goals. We're already seeing it in the House...look at the 124 who jumped across to vote for yesterday's tuition aid bill.

Hagel knows he's grand central in the debate up ahead and I see a lot of common cause with him regarding some key Iraq issues that are very positive. He's definitely the end-run around Lieberman on this issue and his credibility will give cover to others, as it appears it already is doing, to come out against this regime on this issue and hopefully others.

Yep, it's a nuturing process here...and one that has to be used judiciously. Sure...some of this is for partisan purposes. If the Democrats show they're responsive to popular public opinion, they're sure to benefit in '08. But there is also the opening for the first steps in long term change that we both see possible. Just steady as she goes.

Let's hope in a few years, we can reminisce here of the "dark days" and stood strong through the bad times to enjoy the benefits of future good ones.

Cheers...

:toast:

Other than on Iraq, this guy is 100% conservative - very conservative in fact. Hagel's gotten 100% ratings (or close) from a lot of those right wing organizations out there like the Christian Coalition, the Club for Growth, etc.

..... WE have a Lieberman.

he is wrong, wrong, wrong about sooooo many other things - make no mistake, deep down he is a repuke whore - he's just one of the few repuke whores who can see the Iraq war for the disaster it is

why every thread that sounds like people believe he's a good guy and on 'our' (the American people's) side, they need to have his voting record pointed out to them.

no matter how bad he smells.

the words he's spoken in opposition to the Iraq occupation will not be forgotten

on this issue I think he and I are more like than unlike but overall we are as different as light and day. I do also have respect for him because he will take the bull by the horns so to say. he's a fighter for sure

always disagree.

However, in this one arena, in which I agree wholeheartedly with him, he has been articulate and unwavering. We can debate the morality of other platforms he supports, but on the horrific mess that is Iraq, he sees it with a clarity we share. And, he is a powerful speaker against our continued involvement in this bloody debacle.

I wonder about possible presidential ambitions he may harbor. After all, with the weak candidates the repubs are fielding, he has a real chance to be a dark horse candidate and he could be appealing to many Democrats who may not look too far beneath the surface.

We need to keep his voting record front and center, and, in the meantime, be grateful at least one Republican is speaking out loudly and clearly against the insane folly. MKJ

His best chance of winning the nomination is for Iraq to get even worse and become such political poison that people like McCain are unelectable because of it. Then, his speaking out against the war would defuse the Democratic nominee's speaking out against the war - especially if it was somebody like Kerry, Edwards or Clinton. It would even hurt a Gore or Obama in regards to moderates.

He spanked her but good!

Sure, he wants to distance himself from *. When he pauses for breath, he should be asked point-blank whether he's ready to vote to end his dirty, rotten war--and where all this vigor was last year.

if he was still there huh? What they got 8 Repubs againist the President and there are 48? Repubs Senators, what is wrong with these guys, can't they just MOVE ON and do what they are supposed to do, like Protect the Constitution.