Why the Dems should not impeach Bush

Here's the scenario: The Dem's win back the Congress this Nov., some on the left scream that the Dem's go for impeachment, but the Dem leadership is too smart for that. The Dem's know they will accomplish more by being magnanimous and trying to end the poisonous atmosphere that has overcome DC since the Gingrich barbarians got elected. After the victory Sen Reid and Rep. Pelosi will meet Bush at the White House and say "look Mr. President we believe it is time to get on with the people's business, so wee will be spending the congress's time getting bills to you for health care reform, a policy for energy independence, reducing the deficit by making the rich pay their fair share, etc, we hope you will ready and willing to work with us on these bills, and not be an obstructionist, of course if you go down that road and make it hard for the congress to do the business of the people, well then I guess well can also use the Congress's time to run oversight hearing on some of the events of the last few years"

Bush will sign some of the most progressive legislation this country has ever seen...

Your last comment....."Bush will sign some of the most progressive legislation this country has ever seen..." makes little sense. I can't imagine Mr. Stubborn signing anything remotely progressive. Stay the course is his motto. If he had been on the Titanic, they would not have even tried to miss the iceberg.

President Bush won't compromise - he sees things in black and white; compromising with people who are wrong would be, well, wrong. He won't do it. He'd rather be impeached.

The right wing loves it's martyrs. He'd probably do ok.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

is on the line, don't be so sure....

you are seriously dreaming..... sorry - but when does the Mafia ever negotiate with their enemies? They don't. Won't happen.

excise the cancer that is plaqueing the white house......there is no working WITH him. You know this.

No way.

doesn't make any sense

Even if the Dems take back both houses in 2006, I doubt they will gain filibuster-proof and veto-proof margins in both houses. Bush won't sign and the bills will die. Bush won't care, and any Repubs in Congress who need to can vote for the bills to cover their butts, safe in the knowledge that the legislation won't pass.

If its between bush signing legislation or the Dem's investigating him for two years he'll sign the bills...

Easier for us to impeach Bush and Cheney after we take Congress, making Pelosi president. Certainly that would result in more progressive legislation passing.

Personally, I don't believe we ought impeach; I don't think it would be politically advantageous, especially if we lose. Still, if we go that way, I'd support a conviction.

Say that again with a straight face this time, I dare ya.

or just the last line?

It made as much sense as the last line. None.

Compromise and negotiate with criminals? You're on your own with that one.

He'd veto everything.

We don't let bank robbers and murderers run free if they promise to be nice.

These criminals must be held accountable for their crimes.

We must show that we will NOT abide or tolerate criminal administrations. Our nation is too important to pussyfoot around.

NO DEALS.

but agree in principle that taking the higher road does more for the Democratic Party in the long run than pushing for what will surely be called a revenge hit for Clinton.

doesn't Lakoff say something like that?

is it true?

and I believe it is. I think people are starting to get fed up with these idiotic hooligans and the more we put our ideas out there (and they could use some smarter selling)the more people will come to our sides. Let them get hoisted on their own pitard's, and pick up the pieces. We need only not give them ammunition and people will come running

Bush and his flying monkeys have committed serious crimes against the people of the United States; he's also violated international law and made a mockery of his oath to defend and uphold the U.S. Constitution. Bush, Cheney, Condie, Rummy, Wolfie, Feith et al should all go to jail. Your plan appears to be to let them pass Go, AND collect $200.

Wish i had some

Thanks for the laugh!!

Don't stop with the Cowardly Narcissist -- keep going until at least 25 of the members of this corrupt and criminal cabal are in prison for life! :grr:

Kill a hundred thousand innocent human beings and get off by autographing a few make-nice bills?? Horse-fucking-shit!

Anything short of life imprisonment for the criminals in this regime is far too little to begin turning back the tide of voracious fascism in this country.

"Voracious fascism" nails it.

I find your characterization of it in those terms interesting to say the least.

Impeachment relating to committing a felony is not screaming and is not coming from only the left -- think of folk like Bob Barr for example.

until after 2006 elections, if and when they control congress, so that potentially Nancy Pelosi could take over the presidency instead of Hastert if both Bush and Cheney were brought down.

But thinking for the good of the country and hearing what is going on now (at least what we think we know is going on now), this administration is so dangerous, I don't want to wait that long, even if strategically it makes more sense. I want to accelerate the investigation now, and find out all the damage that's being done NOW, to hopefully avoid it from being more destructive before we can have the elections late next year. If it truely is destructive, as many of us suspect it is, at some point reasonably minded Republicans (if there are those out there) will choose to help bring him down now, especially if they know doing so might help them survive the coming 2006 election storm, and perhaps in some cases avoid indictments themselves and keep the "pardon card", if a Republican administration can replace the Bush administration.

There are probably a lot of Dems afraid they will get caught in this fire of investigation, indictments, etc. too, and that is what is the most frustrating and troubling part of it. We need some way to keep them honest and serving us instead of serving themselves and those that keep the conspiracy alive. Even though, we might lose some elections in trying to weed out the "poisonous" Dems in the primaries, we in the long run hopefully will do the right thing by cleaning up our government, no matter who's party those remaining in power are a part of.

I tried.

Let me just leave you with this, when you play into the polarization and poisoning of the politics of this country you HELP the Right wing, they strive on the everyman for themselves, fuck the other half of the nation who doesn't agree with me atmosphere in this country now because its is conducive to their ideology, the left needs people to look at society with a sense of community for their vision to resonate, so you wanna play lets fuck over the Republicans, like they do us, you'll only wind up helping them in the end.

Have a nice day DU...

It's justice. Do learn the difference and stop enabling criminals by giving them everything they want. Putting them through the courts is not polarizing or politicizing anything. It's following the law. Something the republikkkans don't appear to understand.

remarkbly like the RNC talking points. When Clinton was impeached for getting a blowjob, Republicans bloviated endlessly about the rule of law--even though, when pressed, they couldn't state clearly which law they thought Clinton had broken. The best they could come up with was possible perjury in a civil deposition--but even the "appearance" of "evasiveness" was somehow sufficient grounds for impeachment. Bush has repeatedly subverted the constitution, taken the nation to war under false pretenses, subverted the electoral process, and presided over the most corrupt administration since Warren G Harding--and you think somehow it's in the Democrats' (let alone the country's) best interest to make nice and play let's-get-along? Frankly, once the enormity of Bushco's criminal excesses becomes common knowledge, the American people would (I hope) find that kind of nudge-nudge-wink-wink politics just as reprehensible as Bushco's abuse of the public trust. Impeach, convcit, imprison--anything less would be a gross failure of justice.

impeachment as the means of removing an unfit or corrupt President, then the only course is too try to impeach.

Conviction requires 2/3 of the Senate, so removal won't happen. We should still move to impeach because it is the "right thing to do."


But if we want to project an image to the public of Democrats as the "Party of Political Calculators," we should follow your plan.

Think of it as a trial. Should a prosecutor refuse to prosecute a criminal because he draws a tough jury?

That is what the demo leadership will want to do. (Remember, Nixon's orchestrated resignation was largely to prevent a change of the party in the White House by impeachment -- a precedent nobody wanted then and reasonable demos probably don't want now.)

But it won't work, because they are not the key players. Such a "grand coalition" would bring outrage from both wings. You have seen some of it here. But the outrage of the right at any capitulation by Bush under those circumstances will make DUers look like timid little mousies. Bush will feel empowered both by the rage from his base and by what he will see as division among the Democrats, and he will defy them. I would not be very surprised if he were to try to regain control of the legislature by prosecuting Demo members and/or finding ways to expell them. (Scotus would support him!) So the Demos are left with an alienated base and nothing to show for it -- Result: Jeb Bush inaugurated in Jan '09.

No, that's a strategy to lose big -- but it MIGHT produce a revolution.

The Dems, who believe in compromise, may make the offer of something short of blackmail (pass this or we impeach), but the other side does not compromise. The Dems, afraid of being the bad guys, will let bad legislation go through, but the other side would rather shut the government down than violate their ideology. Even if the Dems regain congress, the other side will have enough power to bring Washington to a screeching halt -- and they will do that.

If it's in your house or yard get it bagged up and dump it in a proper place in the boonies.

We can never play politics with Bush.

Too smart to uphold the oath of office that they took?

I certainly hope that they are smart enough, and posess enough integrity & love of country & Constitution, to pursue impeachment.



signed,

one of the some on the left


p.s.

let's hope love for country & Constitution, honor, integrity, catch on.

Defy the conventional wisdom at your peril, it seems.

WE return to the rule of law. No BS no quarter. We either throw the idiots in jail or get out the Brown shirts and jack boots.

You don't go into the oval office and throw around empty nefarious threats when you respect the rule of law. Especially if it is someone like George Walker Bush who has a thing for revenge. You nail the son of a bitch hard and fast --- you don't pussy-foot around with the bastard. You stick it to him hard because that's the way he plays the game and he wouldn't do you any differently. George W. Bush is not a politician -- he's a thug. Even more importantly you impeach George W. and company because they broke the law -- not for political reasons. Impeachment is NOT a political tool and that is precisely why it is not a one way process. The fact of the matter is that George W. Bush and his criminal administration decided to go against the laws of the land, and they ought to be made to face justice. Unlike the impeachment of Andrew Johnson and William Jefferson Clinton, the impeachment of George W. Bush will be justified because he did in fact commit both high crimes and misdemeanors.

Not a hope in hell...

Redstone

Or just go ahead and do what must be done? This is a man who is known to seek revenge. The Democrats would be wise to go after him hard and fast.

Me? I'd not play any games and go after the bastard full force because he broke the law. Period.

I think not.

But its not.

The only way to stop the bankrupting, theoacracizing, middle class killing, war mongering, robber baron, aristocratic crap they're trying to shove down our throats is to keep pushing at them hard. They've already demonstrated that they are not a group that compromises. Fuck 'em.

Can you imagine how much media frenzy would be generated by any congress overthrowing any president? Sure it would be convenient for the democrats to topple a republican using impeachment, but if documents surface showing a corrupt presidency, it would be proof that our democracy works and it would certainly overshadow Iraq debacle.

They've been let off the hook time and time again. There's no high road left to take with these criminals. :grr:

We cannot back down just as soon as we start winning. We have to completely throttle them until there is no life left. We cannot allow them to make a comeback like we did when Clinton was elected in 1992.

No high road, this time. Knock them down and keep kicking them until they're dead.

If we have the ability to impeach, we need to. If not now, when? Seriously, if we let them off the hook even a little, it will come back to bite us.

is here today is that they where in the Nixon Administration, the Reagan Administration and the Bush I Administration with the same excuse that something good is going to happen out of these guys. Your thoughts are wishful thinking with their track record.