JASON LEOPOLD-E-MAILS SHOW LIBBY,ROVE HADLEY & BOLTON ALL TOOK PART!

Details Emerge in Latest Plame Emails
By Jason Leopold
t r u t h o u t | Investigative Report

Wednesday 01 March 2006


..............

The emails from Cheney's office that were turned over to Fitzgerald earlier this month were written by senior aides and sent to various officials at the State Department, the National Security Council, and the Office of the President. The emails were written as early as March 2003 - four months before Plame Wilson's cover was blown in a report written by conservative columnist Robert Novak. The contents of the emails are said to be damning, according to sources close to the investigation who are familiar with their substance. The emails are said to implicate Cheney in a months-long effort to discredit Wilson - a fact that Cheney did not disclose when he was interviewed by federal investigators in early 2004, these sources said.

The emails also show I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, Cheney's former chief of staff who was indicted in October on five counts of perjury, obstruction of justice, and lying to investigators related to his role in the leak, Deputy White House Chief of Staff Karl Rove, and then-Deputy National Security Adviser Stephen Hadley, as well as former Under Secretary of State for Arms Control John Bolton and other top officials in the vice president's office also took part in discussions about ways in which the administration could respond to Wilson's public criticism about the Bush administration's use of intelligence that claimed Iraq tried to purchase uranium from Niger.
.....................

Witnesses who work or worked at the CIA, the National Security Council, and the State Department who have been interviewed in the case, and some of who are cooperating with the probe, said they told Fitzgerald that they had received or sent emails to senior aides in Vice President Cheney's office, the State Department and the National Security Council as early as March 2003 about Joseph Wilson.

Other emails show that in mid-June 2003 these officials had sent emails that mentioned "Valerie Wilson" - not Valerie Plame - and her employment with the CIA, sources close to the leak investigation said.

One email about Wilson and his wife is said to have been sent by Libby to an unknown senior individual at the National Security Council in early June 2003, after Libby was told by Marc Grossman, then Under Secretary of State for Political Affairs, that Wilson's wife worked for the CIA and that Grossman's colleagues told him that Plame Wilson was involved in organizing Wilson's trip to Niger in February 2002 to investigate whether Iraq had tried to purchase uranium from the African country.

..........................

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/030106J.shtml

That sumbitch deserves an orange jumpsuit.

I was waiting for his name.

Woo hoo!!!

There was simply no way he wasn't;t involved.

They have been damned by their arrogance. They were home free on this, because there is no crime in checking into Wilson, but they in their usual take no prisoners mode had to go too far and then lie about it.

up in this also.

Now why would he do that?:sarcasm:

little eyes would be enough to remind her to keep the secrets OR ELSE.

for MONTHS, after a year of research.. it's all there at http://www.takebackthemedia.com

While you're investigating all this have a look at our Libby Fundraising Parody site, done in conjunction with Buzzflash called the "Libby Defense Fund" at: http://libbydefensefund.com/index.htm

We're actually DIVERTING money from Libby to "Gold Star Mother's" and "Doctors without Borders" instead, good american patriotic organizations to donate to.. I made the site myself, hope you like and spread the word, it's the Lead Story on Buzzflash.com right now..

:yourock:

Reading article now - you made my day!!!

:nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke::nuke:

And the walls, come tumblin down, tumblin on down...

Musta' missed it earlier. (How could I have?!) Just read the article and looking thru the comments now, thanks.

:popcorn:

Please we need an

IN

So what happens next?

as always

Fitz must be cooking up some nice indictments

"Remarkably, other than a brief citation buried inside an Associated Press story, Friday's development about the White House's "discovery" of the 250 pages of emails was not covered by any major news media."

LOL! Exactly! Friday night news dump cycle... rinse, repeat!

Thanks kpete! You have been awesome on posting these stories! :applause:

the Briefings.

So, the hearings happen and this bombshell goes off - they found how many pages? 250 pages of emails that had been 'missing'?! The big story should be: are these the equivalent of the missing 18 min of Watergate tapes? Where'd they come from? Who's involved with the archiving? Fitz knows about 'missing' emails - how?!

Instead, it gets buried in one or two sentences, and the slant of the AP story is "Libby isn't getting the documents he requested". Yes, that's part of the story, but if I was reporting this it would have been the kind of "holy shit!" moment Woodward had when he went to the hearing on the Watergate burglars!

Whoever wrote this story for AP did so as to not attract attention to what happened Friday night... Nothing to see! Move along people!

I'm glad Jason is covering this. He's doing an excellent job...

when bits and pieces were coming out, also look at when this happened(not the story but when the emails were turned over) - I think it was the same weekend as the Shooting

was involved in handing them over (according to a story earlier this week, I believe), so what had to be done to threaten the right people to release these emails? This administration hasn't blinked in refusing to hand over documents that freakin courts have ordered them to! One suspects that some really key players know that Fitz has a scarey solid hand, or they would call his bluff. Sending poor Judy to jail may be paying off here, perhaps.

The other question is, how deep/complicit are those who were hiding these gems? There was a "cleansing period" at the WH when the criminals were put on notice that records would be collected. Apparently, this is when these 250 emails were tucked away.

Methinks Fitz threatened Gonzo with Obstruction.

the emails automatically get backed up at some government site (NSA?). Someone there "leaked" that all they had to do was show up in person and demand the emails, then they would be turned over. Don't know how true this is.

had addressed that possibility if it did in fact exist. It was no mistake that these were not handed over in the first place, so it's got me wondering:
1) Who is giving up the info on the existence of the damning evidence?
2) Is that person cutting his own deal with Fitz or is this a cooperative contact on the inside? And just what else is he talking about?
3) How deep is Gonzo in Obstructing the investigation? I'm sure he, amongst others, knew about those emails.
and
4) Did Cheney lie under oath?

but lying to federal investigators is a crime, too.

In Iran-Contra, Oliver North and his buddies erased emails that he didn't realize were backed up elsewhere. He got caught, too.

sorry

:blush:

current Attorney General.

Fitz casually mentioned at the end that some information appeared to be missing. But he said it in a way to make it appear that he knew how to find it another way. Suddenly the missing email appears.

firedoglake covered the beauty of that letter to libby's lawyers.

That's sweeeeeeeeeet candy.

Damning it is...

written before they were found

This article appears in the February 17, 2006 issue of Executive Intelligence Review.

http://www.larouchepub.com/eirtoc/2006/eirtoc_3307.html
Under Fire for Plame Leak,
Cheney Builds NSA Stone Wall

by Edward Spannaus

Vice President Dick Cheney, visibly and increasingly in the target zone in the criminal investigation of the Valerie Plame obstruction-of-justice case, is desperately trying to orchestrate the coverup around the National Security Agency domestic spying scandal. Informed sources indicate that it was Cheney, not President Bush, who was behind the illegal surveillance of Americans, and thus it is Cheney who is also most vulnerable in this case, if and when the true scope of the spying operation becomes known.

......
Missing e-mails:


In a Jan. 23 letter to Libby's attorneys, special counsel Patrick Fitzgerald revealed that certain e-mails in Cheney's office were missing for parts of 2003—the crucial time period in which operations against former Ambassador Joseph Wilson were launched and conducted out of the Vice President's office. Wilson had been sent to Africa in early 2002 by the CIA to investigate claims that Saddam Hussein had attempted to purchase uranium ore from Niger; he found no evidence to support the story.

In March of 2003, Wilson began speaking out and discrediting the bogus claim, which had been included in President Bush's State of the Union Address that January. Wilson did not publicly acknowledge his CIA Africa trip, until he wrote an op-ed which was published in the New York Times on July 6, 2003. Even before the op-ed, Libby, operating on Cheney's instructions, was telling reporters that Wilson's wife worked for the CIA—with the implication that Wilson's trip to Africa was just a nepotist junket arranged by his wife.

The disclosure that e-mails were deleted from White House computer systems instead of being maintained "through the normal archiving process" (see illustration) is potentially very serious, intelligence sources have told EIR, because it would involve tampering with or disposing a computer hard drive, which is detectable. It evokes images of the missing 18 minutes on President Nixon's Oval Office tape-recordings, or the shredding of documents at the point of the discovery of the Iran-Contra scandal.......

Thanks, rodeodance! Wish we could get the illustration that went with this article... I can't find it at the link...

"The disclosure that e-mails were deleted from White House computer systems instead of being maintained "through the normal archiving process" (see illustration) is potentially very serious, intelligence sources have told EIR, because it would involve tampering with or disposing a computer hard drive, which is detectable. It evokes images of the missing 18 minutes on President Nixon's Oval Office tape-recordings, or the shredding of documents at the point of the discovery of the Iran-Contra scandal."

So, can anyone imagine Cheney or Libby or any of the staff pulling drives out of WH machines? I can't... hell they probably don't even know what they look like! So, what techie did this for them?

They could have used some program like DataEraser, which will overwrite unused portions of a hard drive to completely delete data. I doubt seriously somebody like Cheney would do this himself, though. So there's probably some tech support person who knows what really happened.

In addition, there would (unless the emails were deleted the day they were created) be backups, both on-site and off, that may contain the original emails.

edited to add info about backups

...even with multiple overwrites... It just becomes more expensive and arduous... there was a great thread on that around here a few weeks ago (data destruction/recovery). And the crime labs at the FBI no doubt have excellent recovery experts.

I guess I was thinking if I, a geek, was going to 'tamper', I'd take the whole drive, degauss it and bust it into pieces with a sledgehammer - my bad! :)

You're right though - they probably just had some techie come in and 'wipe' the drive... That won't be good enough. And even thought they said the 'archiving had been failing', I'll bet there are logs of incoming emails and originating ip addresses...

and now this....the "missing" e-mails.

I hope and pray that America will FINALLY start to wake up about republicans. Every time they've gotten solid footing in our government, they screw Americans over and place themselves above the law.

It's a disease. Republicanism. It's a frikkin' disease and a pox on our nation.

:kick::kick::kick:

They've used the same damn playbook for the last three Republican administrations!!

Spying on Americans for blackmail and influence (and I will not be surprised when it's found out that they spied on Kerry and major players in the Democratic party); unchecked corporate theft and graft; war profiteering and long term war machine planning; special black ops... This is more than a silly coincidence! :grr:

A spokesperson for Gonzales did not return numerous calls for comment. But sources close to the investigation said that unnamed senior officials in Cheney's office had deleted some of the emails before Fitzgerald learned of their existence earlier this year, and others never turned them over to Gonzales as requested. Separately, according to people close to Fitzgerald's probe, there are some emails that Gonzales has refused to turn over to Fitzgerald, citing "executive privilege" and "national security."

Who could these unnamed senior officialS in Cheney's office be???

~snip~
The emails from Cheney's office that were turned over to Fitzgerald earlier this month were written by senior aides and sent to various officials at the State Department, the National Security Council, and the Office of the President. The emails were written as early as March 2003 - four months before Plame Wilson's cover was blown in a report written by conservative columnist Robert Novak. The contents of the emails are said to be damning, according to sources close to the investigation who are familiar with their substance. The emails are said to implicate Cheney in a months-long effort to discredit Wilson - a fact that Cheney did not disclose when he was interviewed by federal investigators in early 2004, these sources said.

The emails also show I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, Cheney's former chief of staff who was indicted in October on five counts of perjury, obstruction of justice, and lying to investigators related to his role in the leak, Deputy White House Chief of Staff Karl Rove, and then-Deputy National Security Adviser Stephen Hadley, as well as former Under Secretary of State for Arms Control John Bolton and other top officials in the vice president's office also took part in discussions about ways in which the administration could respond to Wilson's public criticism about the Bush administration's use of intelligence that claimed Iraq tried to purchase uranium from Niger.

other top officials ??? - could this be Rice- After all how could Hadley be involved this deep without his boss knowing???


~snip~

Rove and Libby both testified that they learned about Plame Wilson from reporters - a fact disputed by the emails and witness testimony - and that they were not involved in a campaign to discredit Wilson. Rove remains under scrutiny. Rove's attorney, Robert Luskin, did not return calls for comment.

Hadley's role in the leak is also being closely looked at by Fitzgerald and his staff, sources said, adding that new evidence has surfaced showing that the National Security Adviser played an intimate role in the effort to discredit Wilson and that he may be one of the still unnamed administration officials who spoke to reporters about Plame Wilson's work for the CIA.


This tells me that Cheney, Rove, Hadley and possibly Rice will can get the same charges as Fibby. All of them including Fibby can also get additional OOJ charges, conspiracy, espionage ect..

As H2O Man would say: Things are good

Well, for our side, anyhow.

It is fair to say that, at this time, Theodore V. Wells, Jr. is having to reconsider the strategy that he had hoped to employ in defending that tiny little man known affectionately as "Scooter."

I suggest that DUers interested in the legal documents google:

CR. NO. 05-394 (RBW)

Two things of interest are the 1-20-06 "Joint Status Report Concerning Discovery" (Document #25), and the 1-31-06 "Proposed Order" (Document 32-4). Alert readers will note that the majority of the documents are not public. I would suggest that readers use the Watergate case as their model for study .... and not only because the 1-26-06 "Motion of I. Lewis Libby to Compel Discovery ....." (Document 29-1) uses US v Nixon as part of the foundation of their case, but because we are aware that it was ONLY after the federal courts ruled the administration had to turn over the tapes (i.e., the "smoking gun") that Nixon caved in.

Things are good.

Wonder what Fibby's new strategy will be?

Maybe he should take up singing lessons

:rofl:

seems his only option. That would kill his defense fundraising website in a nanosecond.

:)

that most of his support is from those hoping he will keep his mouth shut. Ted Wells is a heck of a good attorney, though, and he isn't representing anyone but Libby. There is a "downside" to hiring a really good attorney for your guilty-as-sin friend, as the VP is finding out.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x542453
thread title (2-28-06 GD): The Full Disclosure Tucker Carlson Isn't Making (Wow)
Arianna Huffington’s got the scoop on Tucker Carlson’s outrageous conflict of interest in his persistent support of Libby and criticixm of Fitzgerald in his show and on his blog. Excerpt: “…But with all he's had to say about the case, there is one thing that Tucker Carlson has failed to mention: That his father, Richard Carlson, is on the advisory committee of the Libby Legal Defense Trust, the GOP-heavy-hitter-laden group that has so far raised $2 million. Indeed, Richard Carlson was the Early Money Is Like Yeast of Libby defense fund-raisers, having couriered a check to Libby's home the morning he was indicted. And Tucker Carlson's connection to Libby's defense fund isn't just familial. A quick scan of the Libby website shows that Scooter's high-powered pals appreciate the things that Richard's boy is saying….”

:)

there is some anxiety among the WHIGs.

... can't find any direct links. Found a few articles, sites that link all the WH staff, such as http://www.whitehouse.gov/results/leadership/dept_WH.html , but no 'Cheney's staff" listing...

Here are Cheney's aides/staff from here: http://www.thinkprogress.org/leak-scandal
Libby, Mary Matalin, John Hannah, Catherine Martin, Jennifer Millerwise, and David Wurmser

I'd be willing to bet his sticky little fingers are in here somewhere.

beginning? I seem to remember that Fitzgerald threatened them with jail unless they did. Maybe that is where all the information re emails etc. from Cheney's office is coming from?

:woohoo:

:woohoo:


:woohoo:

Wurmser is also supposed to be cooperating but I can not think of an article right now. Remember that some of Leopold's latest articles for 2006 have also been stating that Hadley may be cooperating as well. David Schuster stated in one of his recent reports on Countdown that Fitz is working his way up/ using Fibby as a step to the next step/level of the Pyramid. I see Wurmser and Hannah as lower steps, and then above them I see Hadley and Fibby as the next steps, and then beyond them I see all of WHIG as the next step, and then I see the 3 Amigos(Rove, Rice and Cheney) as the possible last step.

I say possible because there could be another step(s) when you get into the 3 Amigos, 1)is the obvious the Oval Office, 2) is more of a guess as to how far Fitz will take this, when you get Cheney and his office involved in the whole affair you could in any direction you want in DC(like spokes of bicycle wheel radiating from the hub). I hope beyond hopes that in some way Fit's investigation by way of Cheney's office/OSP gets to Rumsfeld. I know that it may be wishful thinking, but in order for us to truly have vindication, all of the players listed above and their cohorts/underlings need to be removed from our government and never allowed back into DC in any way, shape or form.

thats who they were...

Now I wonder why he went to visit Judy miller when she was in jail....

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arianna-huffington/the-judy-file-miller_b_5687.html

But Bolton apparently has a warm spot in his heart for at least one journalist: none other than Judy Miller.

According to a trusted Judy File source, Bolton recently took time out of his busy schedule to pay a jailhouse visit to Judy.

No word on what they talked about.

Maybe they swapped notes on Pat Fitzgerald (Judy: “He really got mad when I wouldn’t tell him what he wanted...” Bolton: “...and they say I’ve got a temper!”(laughter all around))

Fitzgerald never comments on anything. Wondering if he is irked about these details leaking out? Could it harm his case?

Can't hurt his case at all.

Remember that Fitzgerald made the statement about the mysterious missing e-mails in open court. He could have done otherwise.

Cheney's cabal exposed. You just knew Bolton had to be involved somehow.

and no one even commented on it, guess it was because of Friday night, Well well I guess they are commenting now.

Hmm, maybe we should email them? :)

if I emailed K.O. with this, I email him sooo much.

For I while there I thought I was taking crazy pills and making a mountain out of a mole hill.

Jason Leopold's story has just vindicated me of my craziness.:rofl::rofl::rofl: at least in reagrds to this :rofl::rofl::rofl:

No, you aren't crazy... It's just so many scandals are breaking, it's easy to lose track of what you're emailing to who!

These people are just nuts... and they're driving me nuts as well! :D

Present tense? Like they just stumbled over it....or they know what Fitz knows - is that why they are feeling the heat?

slipped under the radar.

I was trying to bring it to people's attention by my post in H2O's thread, and I also posted this on it's own, but don't know where it is at.

I only can find the post at H2O's thread cause that is the one that I have bookmarked.

I knew these emails were BIG!!!

Gonzales refused to turn them over to Fitzgerald. They are in the arena of the federal court now. What changed?

Things are very good.

is why they decided to turn them over. Especially after the comments that Fitz made in his response to Fibby about Fitz's office being aware of several missing emails.

"In an abundance of caution," Fitzgerald's January 23 letter to Libby's defense team states, "we advise you that we have learned that not all email of the Office of the Vice President and the Executive Office of the President for certain time periods in 2003 was preserved through the normal archiving process on the White House computer system."

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/021506J.shtml

Bush has been packing all the courts with cronies. If this comes down to a court ruling forcing the WH to produce emails, will they side with * or the law?

ETA: Or is this so cut and dried legally that they'd have no contention? Or could this be pushed up to the Supreme Court and dropped because Alito helps his buddy *?

Hope this clears up the timeline of the emails, as far as additional ones being sought and gathered through court proceedings I am sure that Fitz is gonna try. It is hard to tell right now, but based on the success of this time I would hate to be on the other side of the table from Fitz.

Two weeks ago, Gonzales was not turning the e-mails over to Fitz. Now Fitz has the e-mails. Did Fitz somehow do an endrun around the Attorney General or did he present him with the possibility of facing a criminal contempt charge or obstruction of justice charge?

Remember this from the OP link:

For one thing, it raises numerous questions: why weren't the emails located in late 2003, when Gonzales enjoined roughly 2,000 White House staffers to turn over any communication about Plame Wilson and her husband, as so ordered by a Justice Department subpoena? Do the emails provide greater insight into the campaign to discredit Wilson and identify the officials who unmasked his wife's undercover CIA status to reporters?

A spokesperson for Gonzales did not return numerous calls for comment.


What does Gonzales have to hide? What kind of hot water could he be in?

maybe around the time of K.O.'s show if my lady will let me.

there is a whole lot more down thread on this stemming out of this conversation


Glad you could make it!!!

GONZALES WATCHU & HOWE
http://www.markfiore.com/animation/defend.html

DUers have expressed concern about Judge Walton. I've said that there was no need to worry. There is something that should be sticking out right now to DUers, but noone seems to be saying it.

Again: Gonzales refused to give the e-mails to investigators. When Mr. Fitzgerald takes the case, he is patient. It reaches the (pre)trial stage for a high-ranking White House official. Both Fitzgerald and the defense attorneys want the e-mails. The judge is overseeing the "discovery" process. The mysterious e-mails are turned over to Fitzgerald.

Always think about what happens behind the scenes. I will assure people that A.G. was not struck by a lightening bolt of conscience. Why did he turn over the e-mails he previously refused to turn over?

I think that the WH may be feeling the heat from these emails in the way OOJ charges, or it could be that Rover/Rice or someone else is cooperating to save their butts ie: throwing Cheney under the bus???

So far this is the only explanation that I have been able to come up with, sorry I am having a hard time looking/thinking elsewhere/in another way.

Please help..

is the first half ....

In Watergate, the executive office ONLY turned over disputed documents when ordered to do so by the court. In this case, over half of the documents are sealed and not available to the public.

All the top people are toast,

I smell singing, deals, resignations, and indictments in the air


Smells like victory


PS - thank you

Total B.S.

According to your timeline, Gonzales knew about the e-mails on February 15. Does he expect us to believe it took him this long to find them?!

Fitz put him on the hot seat. Smells like victory to me too!

isn't it? Either the office of the pResident is colluding to bring Cheney down, or Rove is giving up others to take the heat off him?

in the Watergate case, the executive office only turned over disputed evidence when ordered by a federal court to do so.

"Listen...I'm tired of your chickenshit games! I don't want hints...I need to know what you know."
lol

So, you're thinking Walton either told Gonzalez to cough up the emails, or had a bench order him to do so?

ETA: If he did, then why drag this into April for a decision on the greymailing issue? Why not decide on Friday as to the issue... Unless, this is a way to see what else 'leaks out' with the pressure on?

happening is sealed.

Perhaps the most important line in "Mr. Galloway Goes to Washington" is found on page 45. "In that he was little different to the leaders of most regimes; regime survival is the ultimate priority of most systems -- we just don't know it in our own countries, yet." Reading and re-reading ALL of Jason Leopold's outstanding articles on the White House reactions to the scandal supports that.

The April hearings will concentrate on the reporters. The PDB issue is likely already decided, though Team Libby may be going to the next level with it.

Regime survival is ALL that is on the mind of Cheney and Bush. I also think that they consider their 'reign' to include the years after their administration where they will continue to bask in the wealth of connections and contracts that have been established as a result of their war machine.

When you say the April hearings will concentrate on the reporters, what do you mean? That they will be questioning the validity of the reporers' testimony because they were forced to testify?

a wide net. Many of the reporters they are going after will contest the need for them to violate their confidentiality agreement with their sources. Team Libby is not only calling those journalists that Scooter spoke with. They want to make this case about something other than Scooter's crimes. The judge will allow the media's attorneys to fight to protect their sources. Expect the shit to hit the fan. Expect it to stick to Scooter.

Your blog is awesome, btw, I'm not sure how I missed it before but I'm going to go get coffee and spend some time reading... :)

Since when have they followed the law or Geneva Convention or anything? And why isn't Gonzo's privilege claims holding up?

Wonder if someone in the NSA that's cooperating produced evidence against Gonzo? Then he felt he had no option but to comply?

H20 Man is saying that Walton or a fed bench ordered them to produce evidence, but I kinda feel the same: why would they comply? They've done so many things with impunity. Why follow the law now?

He has been mentioned in several articles as a possible person that is cooperating with the investigation.

Also he has been mentioned in several articles as being one of the main players in the emailing ring of players/WHIG

What if Hadley has been cooperating with Fitz and had copies of one or more emails showing the discussions inside of the WHIG ring?

Fitz then could use this evidence as leverage directly against the WH/Gonzo or go through the court and have a judge order the other emails in relation to the disclosed evidence be released from the WH to Fitz.

If (and I stress if)this is the case then everyone in WHIG should be shitting their pants right now, because these emails will expose them and none of them will be able to hide. You will see pleas, resignations and indictments moving at lightning speed.

Our country is in deep shit... The sooner those 30% behind the * & Pals realize it, the sooner we can fix this disaster...

in the WH - that's got to be obstruction and also implies that something was so incriminating that they had to risk trying to hide it this way. If Hadley and/or someone else had their OWN copies of emails that were scrubbed in the WH, then Gonzo would be under even more pressure to produce them and avoid an obstruction charge, I would think.

...this way."

Yup. I think that's what's going on--"...something was so incriminating...". I'd say something a lot worse than outing Plame and Brewster-Jennings, bad as that is. The Plame/David Kelly theory comes to mind. Something like involvement in outing Kelly to his Brit bosses (which led to his death)? (Complicity in murder?) Or a plan to plant WMDs in Iraq--the ultimate deception? These kinds of things--further crimes--would not likely be spoken of directly in emails, but would be detectable by inference of dates or meetings or intentions (or redactions).

Another possibility: conspiracy to lie to the American people. The American people pretty much know they were lied to, but the actual workings of the conspiracy to lie to them would be shocking--reading the schemes and scams of the people who were cooking up unjustified war. This DOES remind me of the Nixon tapes. By the time the tapes emerged, everybody knew Nixon's people in CREEP had committed a burglary and the White House had tried to cover it up, but hearing the actual words spoken in the Oval Office was nevertheless shocking. Fitzgerald might not have such a big interest in this (he has said that his prosecution is not about whether the war war justified or not, or how it came about), but it WOULD be of interest to the people in the White House who would have been hiding, erasing, altering and/or withholding emails from that period. This is the most "spun" White House we've ever seen. To have their connivance in pushing the war on us--that ended in 2,000+ US soldier deaths, thousands of maimings and tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis slaughtered, and that ended in disaster (the current civil war)--exposed, might be motive for withholding emails.

There is also the matter of the Niger forgeries. Whatever their purpose--and I have my thoughts about that, about why they were such easily detectable forgeries--their ostensible purpose is bad enough (fomenting war on false, concocted info), and there might be tracks to them in the emails, that is, WH involvement in the creation of the forgeries. Or tracks to other efforts to plant information, say, in the NYT. And/or tracks to reprobates like Ghorbanifar and his dirty network. Or...who knows?...tracks to the UAE re the ports deal (which I consider the oddest thing that has ever happened in this junta, perhaps only topped by their whisking the bin Laden family out of the country after 9/11).

One of the initial concerns, when we first heard about these emails is that, given the time that has elapsed, they are doctored items--doctorings with purposes that may not be easy to see. There is Plame/Brewster Jennings, and then there are all the OTHER CRIMES these dirtbags have been involved in (torture, for instance; or getting blackmail material on political or business enemies through domestic spying, etc.) There could be reasons for withholding or messing with WH emails that have nothing to do with Plame/BJ.

My read on this is connected to something I felt strongly about the Plame/BJ outing--that it was conducted in a panic, inspired by something other than the Wilson publication, which they knew was coming. They called at least SIX reporters in one week (July 6-14, 2003) in a seeming rush to get Plame/BJ outed, and were not careful about who might be ultimately implicated. Six journalist witnesses to treason. Why this full court press? Why the rush? Why all this risk? They could have let Wilson's dissent die of 'benign neglect,' in a U.S. newsstream that they clearly control, and found some quieter way to stab him in the back for it. Why do this extremely risky thing, in this way, involving so many top Bushites? And why on earth out Brewster-Jennings (the second outing, on July 22) as a "punishment" of Joe Wilson?

So I think something even worse--or several somethings--are lurking beneath the surface of this affair (related to it, or unrelated). And their behavior around the emails certainly points in that direction.

------------------

For those who aren't familiar with the Plame/David Kelly theory, it's based on the haunting coincidence of dates: Kelly (Brits' chief WMD expert) was also whistleblowing (in England) about bad pre-war WMD intel (May 2003); outed to his bosses in late June; interrogated, a report (to Blair) that he knew something more damaging (July 7); Plame outed July 14; Kelly found dead July 18; his office and computers searched; Brewster-Jennings outed July 22. Also, strong Kelly connection to Judith Miller (to whom he wrote his last email worrying about the "many dark actors playing games"). The theory is that he knew of a Bush junta scheme to plant WMDs in Iraq, and that the scheme was possibly foiled by the BJ counter-proliferation network.

(Note: The Wilson article was published July 6. Blair got the report on Kelly July 7. Could this closeness of dates be masking the real motive for the Plame/BJ outings?)

...there may have been a plan to smuggle WMD into Iraq by Rummy and others, and that it was aborted by Valerie's group. Perhaps they were afraid she'd track it back to them (Rummy etal) and out the admin on not only the war but on transport of WMD? :shrug:

I wish I could remember where I read that... argh! So many scandals! I'll see if I can find some links on that...

Kelly connection with the Plame outing - some of them are PeacePatriot's:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=60048&mesg_id=61108

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=60048&mesg_id=61170

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x65834

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x60048

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5170660

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=5165536&mesg_id=5166669

and on Judith Miller's bizarre high DoD clearance when she was embedded in Iraq in 2003 - was she there to "report" on the "discovered" planted WMDs?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1853828

They are going to throw him overboard. He's a liability. And "loyalty" is a one-way street for George Bush Junior.

the VP felt about the poor bastard he shot in the face. Sorry he was wounded, but more concerned with the cover-up.

ing. Said that of the 34% that approve of *, many are hardcore Cheney supporters and don't want him to go. (Yet, only 18% of public approves of Cheney).

He got them from a source within the administration (who? I don't know) and then forced the White House to "officially" turn them over so their authenticity could not be questioned.

“A CIA employee assigned to provide daily intelligence briefs to the Vice President and Libby has handwritten notes indicating that Libby referred to 'Joe Wilson' and 'Valerie Wilson' by those names in conversation with the briefer on June 14, 2003," Fitzgerald wrote in a recently unsealed brief.” Cont…


Seven officials have testified that Libby raised the CIA spy with them before columnist Robert Novak outed her.Hmmmm...seven officials. Shall we play a game of "Who is pointing the finger at Scooter?" I'm in for Rove in a heartbeat if it saves his butt, but who else has "testified" that Libby raised the issue of Valerie Wilson with them? And who else might he have spoken to that has not yet been asked to give testimony? (WHIG, anyone?)” cont…

“You should see what the white collar crime unit guys can do with a hard drive that has been "wiped." I saw a kiddie porn guy break down in tears at a hearing once just seeing what these folks had reconstructed for me out of a hard drive he tried to burn...literally, burn, as in fire. Imagine what they could do with back-up computer tapes and the like, along with a hard drive and a network as intricate as they must have at the White House.

The FBI doesn't take kindly to people flouting the law. And when those people happen to be public officials who take an oath to uphold the Constitution and the laws in the execution of their public duties...well, let's just say that is doubly offensive. All the more incentive to keep digging until you get to the bottom of the scheme, wouldn't you say?” cont…

http://firedoglake.blogspot.com/

may have more respect for the Constitution than does the congress.

someone respects the constitution.

My guess would be that the VP and staff deleted the emails, Fitz was able to recover them from these hard-drives, and then he compelled them to produce them since he already had them anyway.

in Cheney's office.

Maybe that was all a cover story, I don't know, just saying.

over key documents or supporting outrageous claims by the Prez and VP of "we can do anything, it's in John Yoo's version of the Constitution."

are competing over who gets to play the part of Lady Mac-Bush. They are finding new ways to stab each other and point elsewhere and then the perennial number 2 masterminds, are found with all the evidence pointing to Dick Cheney and the National Security Council.

Fitzgerald may not have much sand left in his eyes now. :popcorn:

:-)

thanks.

of this. I assume that both Matthews and KO are fully aware, and appreciate the significance. I'm hoping that they are able to report on this soon.

How bout others doing the same?

Send to: countdown@msnbc.com Thanks! :)

Those who are in positions of power at MSNBC should be aware that many people are requesting that they cover this.

Pass the potatoes, I am chowing down......

:D

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x514621
thread title (2-24-06 GD): FITZGERALD: WH 'RECENTLY LOCATED' 250 PAGES OF EMAILS IN CIA LEAK
Raw Story reporting on an AP story: “ Special Prosecutor Patrick J. Fitzgerald said in a court hearing Friday that the White House "recently located and turned over" 250 pages of emails from the Office of Vice President Dick Cheney, according to an article filed by the Associated Press Friday evening. The AP article focused primarily on the fact that U.S. District Judge Reggie B. Walton told Vice President's former chief of staff I. Lewis Libby that he was not entitled to know the name of the individual who "outed" CIA officer Valerie Plame Wilson. Libby was told, however, that he could have copies of notes he took during 2003 and 2004 while he served as Cheney's chief of staff. … The newly-turned over emails could indicate that not all information had been divulged when the Justice Department first required the information be delivered. It could, however, also signify that Fitzgerald is seeking additional email correspondence based on information he obtained during the probe.”

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2131403
thread title (2-25-06 LBN): White House 'Discovers’ 250 Emails Related to Plame Leak
Article by Jason Leopold posted at Truthout Friday 24 February 2006. Excerpt: “The emails are said to be explosive, and may prove that Cheney played an active role in the effort to discredit Plame Wilson’s husband, former Ambassador Joseph Wilson, a vocal critic of the Bush administration’s prewar Iraq intelligence, sources close to the investigation said. Sources close to the probe said the White House “discovered” the emails two weeks ago and turned them over to Fitzgerald last week. The sources added that the emails could prove that Cheney lied to FBI investigators when he was interviewed about the leak in early 2004. Cheney said that he was unaware of any effort to discredit Wilson or unmask his wife’s undercover status to reporters.
Hmmm… are they authentic? And is a sign that Cheney is being groomed for dumping and/or scapegoating for all the Bush crimes? “Finding” 250 pages of emails after all this time is obviously a lie.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x192949
thread title (2-25-06 Editorials): White House 'Discovers 250 Emails Related to Plame Leak
Another thread on the Jason Leopold story about the “explosive” 250 pages that implicate Cheney.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x516442
thread title (2-25-06 GD): BREAKING-EMAILS PROOF CHENEY SPEARHEADED EFFORT TO OUT PLAME-JASON LEOPOLD

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x516325
thread title (2-25-06 GD): DC Burning
Great H2O Man thread, starting from “Mississippie Burning” and the parallel with the “discovery” of the 250 pages of WH emails showing that what is buried CAN reappear. H2O Man: “I would recommend watching one of my favorite movies, ‘Mississippi Burning.’ It's about the civil rights activists Schwerner, Goodman, and Chaney being murdered and buried with a bulldozer in racist, violent Mississippi. James Chaney had been tortured. I was reminded of that when reading that in the December 5, 2003 edition of the Financial Times, a senior White House official was quoted as gloating, ‘We have rolled the earthmovers in over this one.’ Miracles do happen: they just take a heck of a lot of hard work. In this case, my friends, the Truth, like Lazarus, has arisen from its place of burial. Things are good.”
The Replies thead is important for its informed discussion of WHY this might have been done by Mr. Fitzgerald, what’s coming, and also the introduction of H2O Man’s good friend Baggins 9.

until the Libby matter is tucked away, one way or the other, and then use it as a wrecking ball against the others. All possible defenses and strategies are being played out here.

... and, that ball is not just out-of-the-park, but headed for orbit ....



Peace.

"DUers have expressed concern about Judge Walton. I've said that there was no need to worry. There is something that should be sticking out right now to DUers, but no one seems to be saying it."

What is it that is obvious but no one will say it? He was appointed by republicans. But he could be apolitical like Fitzgerald.

who are not happy about the administration's obvious disrespect for the rule of law. This includes republicans and conservatives.

There is a reason why the e-mails that Gonzales wouldn't turn over before have been now. The context of the court proceeding is key.

And prosecute them to the fullest extent of the law. No plea bargains, no mercy.

you fall of the steps and we have to drag you to the front lawn?

And bin bolten bruti busted! Wooodamnwhoooo!

Would it were entertaining. Thx for the post.

Perhaps his recess appointment was made to stop the senators' inquiries into the information Bolton sought from NSA on certain individuals. After his recess appointment the line of questioning ended. Was the NSA spying on Plame/Wilson to get dirt to shut them up? This is speculation on my part but seems possible with these thugs. Now if it could be shown the NSA was spying for political gain we'd really see some fireworks.

Thoughts?

Bolton was inquiring about turned over, and Condi intervened, they discovered. Why would she do that? At the time, it made no sense, but now it does!! Had the hearings continued, that would have been brought up again, but Bush used the vacation to by-pass the hearings. When will Bolton be confirmed?

I remember Voinovich crying at those hearings ~ I wonder now why he was reduced to tears when he found himself agreeing with Democrats.

Condi's involved, imo and I also think she was involved in the Forged Niger documents affair ~

Her deputy's involvement becomes more documented. We know she pointed the press towards the "story". We know that she is the consummate team player, even if she's being circumvented and outflanked by her own colleagues, such as Mr. Bolton.

Will her preference for polished lies and masterfully presented half-truths over the actual truth come back to haunt her?


Here's hoping.

as the 3 Amigos in this deal.

Here is more on Rice

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=501914&mesg_id=508795

of how it came to be carefully parsed in the SOTU that "the British government has learned" about the (already debunked!) quest to acquire yellowcake from Africa.

I don't wish ill on any human beings, but for the life of me I feel that Condi has been a chief enabler of what has turned out to be enormous evil.


Given her gifts and opportunities, I don't envy the karma that accrues to the choices she's made.

articles in reporting this story, all of the other major player's names come up in WHIG, why not hers. Even her underling, Hadley's name comes up several times. Something tells me that Fitz is focusing in on Rove, Cheney(which we already know) and Rice(which we suspect).

Oh pure Condi, I feel that she is going to rue the day when Fitz comes a knockin' because by then she will not have any leverage room and will have to serve serious time.

:popcorn:

PS. Man I dislike the 3 Amigos

and her preference for masterfully polished Ferragamo's too. :hi:

All the time.


:hi:

But without hours of therapy, it's gonna be a hard habit to break. Until then, if the shoe fits...buy it while NOLA floods. :eyes:

p.s. And: you're right. If they had at least been Manolo's, I might have cut her some slack.

Mighta been more appropriate.


Heh.

In this case though the shoes definitely fit. And pleeeeze don't acquit. :)

:woohoo::bounce::woohoo:

Periodically, you might be lulled into thinking it's gone away, then he turns the heat up a couple of degrees.

Time for Congress to give Bush permission to take us to war with Iran!

I think that misadministration is basically nuts. You have people like Bolton and Rove committing crimes, and everyone acts like it's nothing. Then you have Bolton actually attacking the UN (where he is supposed to be a rep) about SEX. SEX?? Huh? They're all insane. Literally.

for reminding us of the real problem with the world.

About sex. Plato's retreat was a rather nasty sex club in NYC, in the 80's that Bolton is said to have been a member of.

Oooh, bright shiny objects... Perhaps Ken Starr should have been on retainer for this?

for leading us into an unnecessary war. But with our main stream media being so pathetic we can only keep our fingers crossed and keep pushing in the hope they wake up.

That notion was dropped pretty quick!

has pressure been put on Carville????

from bushco????

does any 'good democrat' have a way to talk to him??? his wife involved in possible treason???....ie, it's know Plame was involved in finding/tracing WMD......some at DU early on suggested this was the REAL reason she was outed and the firm that fronted her work (?Brewster Jennings) had its effectiveness destroyed.......Cheney, it was suggested, didn't want his involvement in WMD technology etc and Iraq discovered

shuffling off now.

Not untill I see a contingent of US Marines hauling them off to Gitmo for treason, will I believe this has any relevance at all.

Sure they're treasonous bastards, we've known this since the beginning. Since october surprise, since the impeachment of a twice elected, well satisfied, highly popular president for specious causes.

I don't want to hear anymore how they broke the law. I want to see them dealt a blow by the same sword they bring down daily on the heads of the helpless and innocent, world wide. It'll have to be a real trial too, no, * can't select the jury.

:kick: