Meet The Press "Reproductive Rights & Role of Women in Society"

"The Two Kates face off" was in Russert's intro. Two authors will discuss, after Schumer and Cornyn R-Texas finish soft-pedaling the Culture of Corruption in the first segment.

The "Anti-Feminist turns into Feminist" thread shows once again that these subjects get a lot of posts-- but it's usually swatting at the flies buzzing their bullshit, just unbelievable (!) ignorant, sexist comments DESIGNED TO SHIFT ATTENTION FROM ACTUAL SUBJECTS.

So far this OP has no subject whatsoever, so the flies can't muck it up.

Cornyn just said he won't give back the money he received from Abramoff.

Happy viewing! :hi: :popcorn:

edit: Kate Obern "Women Who Make The World Worse" and Kate Michelman "Of Liberty and Justice For All"

This is EXCELLENT folks. Kate Michelman is very clearly making the simple points that all Dems and liberals need to understand.

Read the transcript. Will add link later. Michelman is so well spoken and says that Democrats need to not back away from their values by trying to be appeasers. "The conservatives didn't do that."

"in the Constitution"?

Russert asks Cornyn:

Don't the American people have the right to hear Alito just say he doesn't agree with the right to abortion, but he will uphold judicial precedent OR say that he does NOT find the right to abortion in the Constitution....

He's a right wing nut politician with an agenda who has bided his time playing judge. As he will continue to do if confirmed.
Though that brings up a good point... Just SAY it Alito, Just say it, let us know what you think the constitution covers and what it doesn't. Give us a few examples. A few dissenting opinions. (often an interesting read, no?)

And thanks for the heads up on the show:hi:

Cornyn immediately went for the standard "he won't bring his personal views to bear on the law of the land blahde blahde blah........"

Russert points out that Alito has already stated what he believes the law says about the issue-- so why not tell the people?

Glad you got to see it. :hi:

and has had a career spew this horse shit? Isn't she just a tad feminist? Hypocrite, of course!

Hateful bitch has a interview on this book on The National Review...

http://www.nationalreview.com/interrogatory/obeirne200512290819.asp

I'll never get that mind set. Just send her back 150 years so she can be a god-fearing, child-bearing housekeeping wife, without the right to vote, or the right to a voice. At least not a voice that isn't laughed at, or condemned as "unwomanly" or "sinful" Same shit, centuries later.
And she's a fucking lawyer? Maybe she thinks women having the opportunity to go to law school magically happened. The equality fairy tapped her magic wand and let women into law school, med school, police departments, upper management, etc.
you know *poof*. Not due to hard work and mind boggling sacrifice by feminists through the ages, of course.

"Maybe she thinks women having the opportunity...magically happened. The equality fairy tapped her magic wand and let women into law school, med school, police departments, upper management, etc. you know *poof*. Not due to hard work and mind boggling sacrifice by feminists through the ages, of course."

I'm gonna look for the link

BTW, here the Meet the Press transcipt for any interested;http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10721401/

O'B:
"When Kate complains that since 1995, 400 abortion restrictions have been enacted across the country, when they complain what what they call pro-choice politicians run the White House and Congress, have the majority in Congress, it seems they believe some strange alchemy has delivered these political wins on the part of voters who supposedly support their agenda. But they haven’t because the democratic process would see the Roe v. Wade abortion on demand for nine months regime quite cut back at the hands of voters."

MS. MICHELMAN: Could I speak to this “abortion on demand”?  I have to comment about this because I hear it over and over and over again. First of all, I ran a Planned Parenthood affiliate for years. I have been with women who have faced the decision about whether or not to have an abortion. I have never heard a woman demand to have an abortion. I think that that language reveals the lack of respect that those who oppose abortion have for women who face crises. We’ve got to get rid of that language.

Excuse me isnotwasm I'm gonna yell here:

"WE'VE GOT TO GET RID OF THAT LANGUAGE"!!!

Got that DU? Language matters. Could DU and Dems NOT use Pugspeak "Abortion on Demand"? :think: :bounce:

Pretty Please? :eyes:

And that was a great turn she did "I have never heard a woman demand to have an abortion" Right back at them. And then there is this little gem:

MS. MICHELMAN: Well, I think that the conservative movement has spent a lot of years denigrating, demonizing feminism, and the word has received a lot of flak for—interesting—for a simple belief in the social, political and economic equality of the sexes. I mean, that’s what feminism was and is about and continues to be important in addressing the inequities in society that exist for women. And I don’t think feminism is dead. I do agree that the word has been so demonized that many young women don’t identify with the word, but interestingly enough, the irony is that even though some young women don’t identify with the label feminism—actually, they’re rejecting all kinds of labels today—they fully embrace the ideals that feminism set forth; you know, equal opportunity, equal education, equal pay, reproductive freedom and choice, the right to determine the course of one’s life. That is what feminism was really about. And...

MS. O’BEIRNE: I endorse all of those goals. I endorse the equal opportunity. I endorse the equal pay. Discrimination in pay, of course, has been outlawed since 1963 and education since 1972. Those are the phony goals.

She endorses them, yet calls them phony? Make up her mind somebody
Anyway, gotta go to work!:hug:

"Abortion On Demand": "That language shows the lack of respect for women who are facing crises"

Michelman is AWESOME. Former President of NARAL

Reproductive Privacy That's what it's all about. I think we're turning the corner on the issue, about time.

She, like her brethren, has no philosophy about anything except being on top of the power pile. Since she is apparently a physical female, she gets fascist points for attacking other women (feminists).

None of this matters to O'Beirn. All that matters is using every available tool, including language and her gender, to be in the group of power. O'Beirn doesn't give a shit about ANYTHING except how much power she is able to wield.

With O'Beirne, like Limbaugh and Hannity and Noonan -- and all of them -- there is no there there; just a power grab.

it was good to see discussion b/w two articulate women panelists. Need more of that. :thumbsup: That in itself (visibility) would help heal sexism and bent perceptions.

She is a blow-up doll filled with hot-air fascist propaganda. O'Beirne is NOT interested in "discussion."

Like all the neo-cons, O'Beirne is only interested in winning and promoting sexism is a proven way that neo-cons "win."

I find it unfortunate that you thought that that phony corporate construct a legitimate 'discussion.' Rather than heal sexism, that episode did just the opposite. :thumbsdown: :thumbsdown: :thumbsdown:

Does this make any sense to you?:
Tim, they’re the kind of women who—apropos our discussion this morning—hype the phony gender gap in order to intimidate politicians. They’re the kind of women who claim to celebrate women’s choices when it comes to family and career, but they only think there’s one responsible choice, which is following a male career pattern. People think that feminism is sort of a spent force. And my book makes the point that no, it’s not. The modern women’s movement is enormously influential. Their premises have been widely accepted in our institutions. They engage in social engineering in our schools, trying to—very hostile to little boys and boyhood; have enormous influence on our university campuses. We certainly saw that with the dispute over President Larry Summers at Harvard. And our institutions, I argue, are weaker as a result of these feminist ideologues.

That's just woman-bashing, pure and simple; and it's based on nothing more than a neo-con hate-filled fantasy of 'feminism.' Nothing there worth 'discussing.'

B-)

You're absolutely right. At the same time, it seemed she genuinely believed the "woman-bashing, pure and simple...based on nothing more than a neo-con hate-filled fantasy of 'feminism.' "

It's too bad that she devotes her intelligence to such twisted thinking-- but to me she seemed a little more engaged than a typical RW dittohead.

She was a perverse contrast to the lucid, calm manner of Ms. Michleman. Maybe I enjoyed it because she was practiced at her hateful schtick but no match for Michelman.

but, I can't stand anti-women right-wing shills like O'Beirne.

O'Beirne is a media personality precisely because she sounds so 'scholarly.'

I don't know how Michleman does it. She does always comport herself so calmly. I admire her for that. I couldn't do it. :evilgrin:

"I don't know how Michleman does it. "

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10721401/page/3/


Kate O’Beirne, “Women Who Make the World Worse”; Kate Michelman, “With Liberty and Justice for All.”

MR. RUSSERT: And we are back. Kate Michelman, Kate O’Beirne—the Kates. Welcome both. (If it had been Cheney and Luger, would he have said, "The two Dicks"?)

<>

MR. RUSSERT: What do you think of that philosophy?

MS. MICHELMAN: Well, I think that the conservative movement has spent a lot of years denigrating, demonizing feminism, and the word has received a lot of flak for—interesting—for a simple belief in the social, political and economic equality of the sexes. I mean, that’s what feminism was and is about and continues to be important in addressing the inequities in society that exist for women. And I don’t think feminism is dead. I do agree that the word has been so demonized that many young women don’t identify with the word, but interestingly enough, the irony is that even though some young women don’t identify with the label feminism—actually, they’re rejecting all kinds of labels today—they fully embrace the ideals that feminism set forth; you know, equal opportunity, equal education, equal pay, reproductive freedom and choice, the right to determine the course of one’s life. That is what feminism was really about. And...

<>

MR. RUSSERT: Can you be a pro-life, pro-anti-abortion rights feminist?

MS. MICHELMAN: You can be a feminist and oppose the act of abortion on moral and ethical, religious, on personal grounds; absolutely can be. And, in fact, many people who are pro-choice in terms of their beliefs that the policies of this nation should respect the diversity of views on these issues related to pregnancy and childbearing, abortion, and reproductive matters, that there is a diversity of views and they are informed by one’s values, as they are mine. My personal values informed my decision about abortion. But you can be absolutely anti-abortion, if you will, and pro-choice; believing that women ultimately, not the government, not Dennis Hastert and Tom DeLay and Bill Frist, but women themselves must determine the course of their lives, and central to that determining the course of their lives is determining when and under what circumstances they will become mothers. Because the thing that most women want is to be successful at mothering. And the first ingredient is being able to determine when that time is right and not being forced by the government and by politicians or by judges to bear a child under circumstances of one—not of one’s choosing. So I...

<>

MR. RUSSERT: Are the Democrats changing their vocabulary on abortion, because to Kate’s point, the political—the politics are changing?

MS. MICHELMAN: You know, I think those public comments and that public angsting after the 2004 presidential election was unfortunate because the principle that underlies a pro-choice position are the principles of dignity and privacy for women. Abortion rights and reproductive freedom and choice needs to be seen in the larger context of individual liberties, of women determining the course of their lives and having control over their lives. I think that was unfortunate. I’m reminded of the ‘92 election when President Clinton was elected. The House and the Senate were under control of Democrats. The political pundits were writing the obituary of the right wing and the conservative movement, and you didn’t see the conservatives sort of back away from their values or their principles. They didn’t give up and start publicly talking about changing their language. What they did is they stayed focused on their values and that’s what we need to do. And the right to choose is an ex—the right to choose, the right of the individual woman to be guaranteed, to be free from the government and political interference in making this decision is a right that is embraced by the majority of Americans. There may be different views on the individual act of abortion, but in terms of who should make the decision, whether it’s government and politicians or women, there is universal acceptance that women must make...

MR. RUSSERT: But the Democrats want to recapture control of the Congress and the White House.

MS. MICHELMAN: They do, and they can do it on these principles.

<>

MS. MICHELMAN: Well, I don’t think Roe v. Wade and whether Roe v. Wade is going to be overturned is really the issue. That’s a parlor game inside of Washington. What is at issue is the individual right to privacy and dignity for American women and the issue of who’s going to get to decide the most intimate aspects of our lives. Judge Alito replaces Justice Sandra Day O’Connor, a justice who was the critical and decisive fifth vote that protected women’s legal rights, including their right to reproductive choice, and Judge Alito’s record indicates very clearly that he approaches the law very different from Justice O’Connor, that he will swing the court dangerously and differently against women’s rights and not just our right to reproductive freedom but, you know, our rights to affirmative action.

:hi:

That "child's testicles" one is doing well too!