Boom!! Here you go, Cenk talks to Naomi 'Disaster Capitalism' Klein about the current crisis

Run time: 08:35 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Knv9CXZI6hc   Posted on YouTube: September 23, 2008 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: September 23, 2008 By DU Member: ProfessorPlum Views on DU: 4372

 
Most important discussion on any media right now.

:)

looking at things. And she is right.

And the worst is yet to come.....

yup,. we need to put more pressure on Obama/Biden to NOT JUST GO ALONG !
The Dems need to oppose this crap,. bailing out a bunch of corporate banksters when they created the situation is just plain silly,. Now is the time for monetary reform,. the system need to be redesigned.., with out pirates controlling it!,. and now is the time to do it! not just eating the losses, that where created by thieves robbing the nations retirement savings. This money was not 'lost' it was taken! Just because they stacked up a precarious house of cards and are now pulling the bottom out and threatening to light it on fire, does not mean we should be propping up this badly flawed structure! There are many other systems of money we could and should be using,. NOT money as debt. Money as infrastructure investment, and ownership, and wealth creation,. building green energy systems and organic food production,. not weapons systems,. financial manipulations, and pushing war for profits,. either the Dems are. or I should say BECOME! (as they have not been in a long time!) a part of the solution or they are not,. prove it now,. or face the horrible results. Come on people, DEMAND that they do the right thing. NO bail out for the pirate thieving terrorists,. and a yes to real change now! MONETARY REFORM! Re-Define what money represents and how it is created and held,. do this now, of face complete and utter failure, more and worse of the pathetic broken-ass sameness.

to try to get him to rethink things (feel free to copy any or all of them):

Dear ____________:

Sec. Paulson and Chairman Bernanke are asking Congress to provide an additional no-strings-attached bailout of Wall St. for an unspecified amount. That the expansion of the assets to be bought include just about all defaulted loans the large financial institutions are carrying (see Sunday's article on Bloomberg.com-- http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aYXtwpG9mw9g&refer=home) indicates that this is not a situational bailout of some institutions, but a bizarre effort to fix the tanking economy by "trickle down".

All these things--credit cards, student loans, loans in general, are failing because the economy, "Main St.", is failing. Trying to fix it this way will make things immeasurably worse. For the first time in history, there exists the danger that the U.S. economy simply won't be able to afford the debt service on all the country's debt, private and public. The outgrowth of such a crisis would likely include a large devaluation of the dollar. It starts a vicious cycle where the "rescue", while temporarily bailing out investment houses and banks makes the economy worse, so people can't pay back more loans, so more "assets" need rescuing, and so on. In a shockingly short time there will be no way to save the financial institutions, and the money needed for a proper rescue of the economy will be gone. Among the consequences would be the bankruptcy of vital support programs for the elderly and a complete devaluing of their savings.

With the tens of millions of Baby Boomers becoming too old to compete for jobs in a shrinking economy, the country could find millions w/o the means to provide themselves with their basic survival needs. As happened in the crash of the Argentinian economy, formerly middle-class citizens could find themselves homeless and starving.

With these stakes, will Sen. Schumer and Rep. Maloney, co-chairs of the Joint Economic Committee look for a second opinion for a way to proceed that will limit harm to the general populace of the U.S.? Will they consult with the best of the economists who did forsee this crisis, and who do not have strong Wall Street ties, to balance the advice of Paulson and Bernanke who claim not to have seen it coming and are tightly connected to the investment institutions? In particular, will they solicit and heed the advice of Nobel Prizewinning economist Prof. Joseph Stiglitz, see <http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/17/stiglitz.crisis/index.html>; NYU exonomist Dean Baker, see <http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/09/20/progressive_conditions_for_a_b/>; and author and ecomonic analyst Robert Kuttner, see <http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?>? FDR listened to progressive economic advice, despite big money's scorn and even an attempted coup, but a Pres. Obama would not likely be able to prevent a dollar failure if a massive mistake is made before he takes office.

The only feasible way to rescue the financial system, according to the recommendations of the experts listed above is to do the leanest of rescues while 1)re-regulating, 2)restoring taxation on the ultra-wealthy, corporations, and estates, 3)enforcing anti-trust laws against financial institutions "too big to fail", and 4)providing direct help to the people by job creation including support for the manufacturing sector, which would stem the flow of defaults. This is also the only way to prevent the slashing of vital gov't programs like Social Security and public schooling.

Sincerely,

AND

Dear __________,

I am deeply disturbed at hearing Rep. Frank on Countdown describing the "oversight" Congress is proposing for the bailout plan is a board, funded by Congress rather than the Treasury, Fed, or financial institutions, that would be able to "ask" Treasury after the fact what was paid for each asset purchase, and for an explanation of why that was the right price. Neither this board, nor Congress, would have any ability to halt a purchase even if the price is drastically off, or change the individuals making the pricing decisions. We've had eight years of government officials being publicly exposed for wrongdoing and continuing the same actions anyway, in effect saying, "So you (Congress) don't like it and the public doesn't like it, but you can't do anything about it, so we don't care." In light of this history, and Paulson's recently exposed corruption, this is beyond inadequate and into the realm of stage dressing.

Pres. Hoover tried throwing money at the banks to deal with defaults arising from a troubled economy and it failed utterly. More recently Japan tried to cope with a serious recession by doing the same and found it useless. The financial institutions and their employees are as wrong on this as a solution as they were on mortgage-backed securities and derivatives. I also hear that requiring equity rather than asset purchases is no longer being considered; the taxpayers deserve having this reopened, especially in light of the debt too huge to rescue in the form of "credit default swaps".

The only obligation you have is to leave the next President enough money and borrowing power to rescue the economy by other, "New Deal"-style means after this fails. If excess borrowing to finance this moneypit is extreme enough to tank the dollar, the gov't will be broke just when the economy desperately needs help.

Sincerely,

Newt is calling for all the Reaganites to gather and solve this problem.

$9.99

http://cgi.ebay.com/The-Shock-Doctrine-by-Naomi-Klein-2008-Paperback-2day_W0QQitemZ370089335218QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item370089335218&_trkparms=39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A1|240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

Naomi is great as always.

thanks for the PM , Tom

by the way , I am also a Vonnegut fan

But he couldn't live forever.

k & r

!!

:kick:

What exactly will happen if the bailout goes down? Is it as bad as the shrill economic pundits say on CNBC?

Joe Kernan said "The democrats want something for mainstreet, but what they don't understand is that there won't be a main street if this doesn't go through". OK, so how bad will it be? How many banks go down? And what happens to money market funds and people's retirement? These are questions we need specific answers to. At least answers that are as specific as possible.

Impossible to say.

My grandparents survived the depression of the 1930s. Some people didn't. That would happen again - some people will survive, others won't. But that happens in boom times as well. Some people thrive, others struggle to survive (or fail to survive.)

1987 is a year I've read about recently. Something like this is the worst "crash" of the stock market since 1987. I didn't do badly at all in 1987 - barely noticed if the economy was bad. I was an adult then, but didn't have money invested in the market.

When the Soviet Union collapsed in the early 1990s, many people there suffered, some undoubtedly died. But the land still exists, people still live there - it didn'tbecome a black hole of existence in the planet. That may well happen with the US. Empires don't last forever.

If we're smart, we can build a much better nation out of the ashes of this failing empire.

The empire will fall, whether this year, or five years from now, doesn't change that. Practice compassion, that will help to make the fall more endurable. Selfishness will exacerbate the harm.

From the website for the Chris Martenson Crash Course
http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse

I found this comment by Dr. Chris Martenson about the bailout bill:
9/21/08 "Mark my words, this is the largest looting operation ever in the history of the US, and it's all spelled out right in this delightfully brief document that is about to be rammed through a scared Congress and made into law."
http://www.chrismartenson.com/blog/what-latest-bailout-plan-means/5149

and here is someone's reply to Martenson that bluntly says it all:
Submitted by machinehead on Sun, 09/21/2008 - 16:13.
Correcto-mundo, Doctor M. This is bigger than 9/11. Bigger than the Crash of 1987. Probably bigger than the New Deal, which was the greatest expansion of central government ever. Some are calling it the "PATRIOT Act of Finance" in its sublime high-handedness. If this gets done, words such as "capitalism," "democracy," "economic freedom" and "representative government" will no longer apply to the US. I call the new system Kleptofeudalism. Under this system, a one-percenter group of privileged Kleptocrats owns and operates the country. Meanwhile, Worker/Suckers -- the remaining 99% of the population -- serve as their livestock. Worker/Suckers exist only to service the Treasury debt, and breed more Worker/Suckers to keep servicing the debt in generations to come. As in feudal times, class lines will solidify into iron curtains. The chances of your children advancing from Worker/Sucker to Kleptocrat will be virtually nil. This is literally the most radical event which has happened on North American soil since the Declaration of Independence was issued on 4th July 1776. But this is an anti-Revolution, a rollback of liberty, an enslavement. It is a fundamental and irrevocable alteration of our form of government. The only certainty, under the coming tyranny, is that the dollar is doomed to become a weak, Third World currency, which may not even be accepted outside CONUS borders. As refugees from 1930s fascism learned, gold is good. But diamonds may be more concealable and transportable. Frankly, I fear social unrest. If busted plutocrats can loot the Treasury for $700 billion on a whim, why shouldn't the jobless homeless loot stores for clothes and shoes? There is no answer, other than than "the 'law' is only for little people." And such an answer may not be satisfactory. Congratulations on proclaiming -- well in advance -- "The End of Money." Ding ding ding, it's here. Now what?
http://www.chrismartenson.com/blog/what-latest-bailout-plan-means/5149#comment-624

If you do not want to become a Worker/Sucker, please call your Senators and Congressman to vote NO on the bailout bill. If not available, their staff will take your message. Do it NOW!

note: Don't let anyone tell you the passage of this bill will prevent the collapse of the banks. It won't. The bubble we are in is going to burst anyway. Watch the excellent Crash Course videos...
http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse

I think there should be no bailout at all.

I do worry a bit about social unrest resulting from collapse of the empire. Treating others with compassion and kindness is the only option to help minimize the anxiety and desperation that will inflame unrest.

thanks for the video link - I had seen it last night, but when I saw it the post said something about wait until tomorrow because the person was updating the site. So I'll go watch it now. :hi:

a period there, maybe inserting a convincing phrase or two. But it's 100% a neocon idea. Even when the most bought and paid for pundit yaps about how this "bailout" is "socialism", the vision of "socialism" that they're trying to sell us is a neocon abomination. It isn't based in even the smallest kernel of the progressive dialectic. It's a "socialism" which denies the people even a trace of equity.

It's another project being sold purely on stampeding the people with fear.

The world is watching the neocons fleece the USA. We've watched them use the same tactics time and again to push their agenda and we're watching as the USA proves that those tactics will work ALL OF THE TIME.

Well yes something needs be done,. but one thing is for sure; it is not the plan, put forth by the very people that created this event!

The banking system has long been corrupted and misused,. a system created by banksters for their benefit. Money does not have to be the creation of debt,. this is what it has been twisted into by the Banksters and their Pirate Overlords. Monetary reform is the reinventing of the way we, as a people, create and use money,. yes this is a massive change,. just remember that the overlords are proposing an equally massive change,. only their change is not into socialism, as they keep insisting,. it is into fascism! Don't support the creation of a private banker held debt system where unelected pirates control what the people must do., . this broken banking system should die,. and a new system built to replace it,. america must bring its troops home (700 military bases around the world is insanity!) and rebuild itself,. now.

Watch "Money as Debt"; http://video.google.pl/videoplay?docid=-9050474362583451279

:thumbsup:

obviously another reason to scare people into supporting something that could be disastrous. im glad they are taking their time with this and not just rushing out like they did with the war

and she makes a valid criticism of him. I'd add to that all his "present" votes concern me. I hope we don't end up with an appeaser regardless of who gets in as POTUS. Sometimes compromise is needed and sometimes it is not.

Someone is trying to rub their "Sachs" on the forehead of America. I say no thanks.

Classic!

He could use these talking points on every commercial he does. The Halliburton part is really a zinger, because everyone knows how unpopular the "contractors" in Iraq are.

This bailout is a fucking racket.

in office, culminating in this banking crisis and even bigger, impending, derivatives mega-crisis, means that every day they stay in office now puts the US in ever greater peril. They should just hand over the reins of power and go into exile. Without prejudice, however. They could be called back for criminal trials.