I have no hope for impeachment so now what ?

It is a bit disheartening that Sheehan gave up on the peace movement . It is also troubling that the Dems allowed bush his war funding and to hear that even by Sept we may again be lied to about this so called progress in Iraq .

I have thought of writting Al Gore to see what he thinks of a national stike on buying products to kill the corportions control . This seems to me to be the only way to get the war ended and get some control back in the hands of the people .

I just know in my gut that impeachment will not happen and that protests will not work anymore . I have written and called and all I ever get is a mass mailer response which does no good at all .

Does anyone feel that a stop consuming campaign has any legs to stand on of is this just as futile as the rallies ?

Visualize IMPEACHMENT. Then DO something to make it happen.

NGU.

But then I see our Congress in action:

Let's do an experiment. You have nothing to lose. You're not going to get impeachment the way you have done things for the last 4 years, so do it this way and see.

Call War contractor and GOP contributor General Electric Corporation at 203 373 2211 and ask for the public relations department. Then tell the person that you will not buy any General Electric consumer products until the CEO of GE gets George W Bush to end the war and then resign with Cheney.

Let's see if GE wants to lose half their customer base. This works like a referendum on Bush.


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They've become your role models?

:rofl:

NGU.

lol

:loveya:

B-)

NGU.

Thanks.

:loveya:

My pleasure.

NGU.

I wanna be ready like this guy

He will die before the weeks end and not have to worry about camps other than to take up to much space .

He was fat to begin with and he managed to eat his way into a 4F.

I can't tell.

Thanks for that. I needed that image emblazoned in my brain to remind me exactly to whom I have been losing to these past six years. That helps me put things into better perspective.

:sarcasm:

in about a year and half, faster than if he was impeached so I'm not sweating it. :shrug:

In a year and a half , look at the last 18 months and what has happened , not only by our grnad criminals but in other countries as well . And even then what do you expect the new president to do who ever that may be .

I feel most of our government is corrupt already .

All they need is another

and Bush** can invoke all his nice shiny new emergency powers
and politics as we know it in the USA comes to an end.

You do what you can do and it doesn't have to be a mighty and righteous. Are impeachment and a national strike the only things that can be done? It is obvious now to most, or at least I would hope so, that impeachment is not going to happen. Even Gore does not support it and it has little support in Congress. There are enough problems and things to confront without tilting at windmills, plus time is running out. The U.S. is not some little European nation, being over 300 million people and a national consumption strike would not work with out small union membership and sharp political divisions. You'd be lucky to get a small percent of Democrats involved other than us far left Liberals, but if it makes you feel like you are doing something, then go for it. With a good chance of electing a Democrat to the White House and increasing our lead in Congress I don't feel futility about the future. The future is more than the next 18 months.

However the future can be shaped in a bad way in the next 18 months . 18 months is a long time .

I don't share the hope that many do thinking another election will solve things , there are alot of promises made and that's all they are , promises and for political gain only . We will see just how this all pans out in 2009 . We thought Nov 2006 would change alot of the problems but it has not in 6 months . All there is are alot more dead and alot less hope it will stop soon .

What about the future for these people , are they to be forgotten ?

Although the Democrats control Congress, they certainly do not have as much power as many believe. They cannot over-ride a presidential veto without the help from Republicans and they do not have the votes in the Senate to cut off debate. If anybody thinks that cutting off the funds for the war would simply end it, they really need to get in touch with reality. Like Bush is going to say, "Oh my, they cut off the war funding. Well I just give up. We better bring all the troops home tomorrow." The Pentagon has discretionary funds to keep the war going for months and then Bush would simply take money from somewhere else to keep it going. One vote does not a party make or break, there will be another vote in September. For those who want to embrace futility and the notion that nothing is going to turn out ok, well that's your choice.

Oh, and there are many more who are dead and dying, suffering and hurt in this country by healthcare problems, poverty, hunger, and discrimination. They look to their Democratic representatives to help them in their everyday ordinary problems which are not as glamorous as impeachment or the war in Iraq, but are very important to them. Think the Republicans will help them? What about the future of these people, are they to be forgotten?

Lets just say I don't have the faith you have in politicians , I have been around to long and have seen how promises fall away in short time .

The Dems started out with a weak platform called 6 for 06 , first 100 hours , it was a slogan and nothing more , right there at that point I knew we were in trouble .

It to me looked as a joke with all their children brought into the house when here we are dealing with a long line of criminals who have no conscience or reguard for life .


I just don't have any reason to trust politicians .

I heard Al Gore give the reason in an interview. He said that with a year and a half left in bu$h's term (assuming he will leave office in 09) Congress didn't find it worth the cost to the nation.

Now we can either convince the Congress it is worse to leave the regime in power or we can come to the conclusion that it will not happen and focus on something else. Like - Prosecution of every criminal in the regime following their departure from office.

I will leave it there until election over 2008.

I could tell ya what Al Gore would think of it, but if ya want to write him anyway go ahead.

he stops converting republicans into Democrats. Right now he's on track to destroy the republican party as we now know it.

I think the Republicans will do something about Bush, I am not sure what but they will act, I have heard that according to their
internal polling, he's at 18%, they have closed down the RNC phone banking for small donations, Fox News had an article up that we
should not have invaded Iraq, and the Christian Broadcast Network had an article highly critical of Bush. What does this mean?
Disaster for the Republicans unless they regroup. The War is unpopular, the 2 month vacation of the Iraqi Congress is unpopular,
immigration bill is unpopular and Bush, himself is a divider not a uniter. They want money, big business and their base behind
them which is not going to happen unless they regroup. Their best hope is to dump Cheney, bring in a Ford type who will then
become prez after Bush resigns and pardon everybody. Kind of Like Gerald Ford II, this sparkly clean prez, could then run
for prez in 2008 and have a chance of winning.

sending her on all those high-profile trips. Except they all went CondaBadly. Oh well.

Doesn't look like Bush** is going any other way except:

someone like Sen. Gordon Smith (R-OR), it cannot be someone from within Bush bubble or seen as closely allied with him, they would
want someone scandal free

each succeeding generation of these criminal right-wing oligarchs is more aggressively totalitarian than the last. If the rule of law is not asserted forcefully now, it never will be. The "law" will be useless to protect us. The next wave of fascists will be exponentially more evil than this bunch. We are fucked. Our elected representatives are gutless and stand impotent before criminals.

30% of the people in the country identify themselves as Republicans, and the RNC has shut off their requests for small donations,
the real reason is that they have made nobody happy but their corporate fat cats at the expense of everybody else,
I have been reading about Bush's big tax cuts which resulted in an average tax cut for most American of under $20, sometimes
as little as $5.00. But a huge relief to the upper 1-2%, and the cost, oh, 1.4 trillion.

People are never more dangerous than when they have nothing to lose,and at this point that's where this Misadministration stands.

a good politician gives everybody just a little of what they want, that way they come back for more, when the Dems were the
majority $35 million more went to Dem states, now $618 million more goes to Republican states, Bush has given away the store,
his backers, many of whom, threw in 2 million for billions back, have all they want. What incentive do they have to lobby
for him or what he wants, he's given everything away. There's nothing left but a handful of IOUs, who's going to rush
in to pick up the tab.

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lol

lol

seems like a reasonable response to me.

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Like where you see the doom and gloom in what I asked .

Of being a complete jerk .

I was sent a photo of this guys personal mode of transportation .

Bush**: "You aren't supporting the troops!"

Dems:

First, there's the lie that the one supplemental spending bill is somehow the reason our troops are still in Iraq. The 'funding' is actually a mix of Democratic priorities which our party members felt the troops need and deserve while they are in the field. There was zero prospect that Bush was going to stop the deployments just because he was refused the one spending bill. His opposition was cover for his refusal to sign on to an exit date. He didn't give a damn about the money. It's not like Bush was up nights worrying that he'd be forced to end his occupation because he was running out of money. He has plenty of sources of funding to keep our troops mired in Iraq, at least for the period of funding that the bill covers.

Secondly, your posturing against your party - the overwhelming majority of which is still committed to the only relevant part of the veto fight, the timetables - has caused you to ignore and disregard their continued, and active opposition to the occupation and their continued support for legislation containing an exit date. Also there are other points of accountability between now and September, contained in the Democratic spending bill, which you have obligingly cast aside as 'capitulation.' It will only convenience the administration for you and others to continue to characterize them as toothless or irrelevant. It's not like Congress is cast in concrete just because they advanced THEIR funding priorities for our deployed troops in the Democratic spending bill. Their opposition still stands ready to legislate further.

Third, even if you do insist on posturing as if voting for the one supplemental was so enabling, there's still no rational excuse to turn your back on the majority of Democrats still pledged and ready to vote for legislation containing an exit date. If you walk away from that ready mass of anti-occupation Democrats to organize somewhere outside of the system, it is your choice to abandon the legislative battle in Congress, not theirs. They are still ready and willing to vote for what was the crux of the veto fight with Bush; the timetables. Nothing in that one supplemental negates that support for timetables. We don't need a national strike to get that support from the majority of our Democratic legislators. That support is already there and still fighting for an end to the occupation, despite the constant carping and apathy over the one supplemental.

They have allowed themselves to look like part of the fucking war machine. I still don't like it. It was totally confussing to the electorate.

Even though the leadership said from the beginning they wouldn't hold up funding, they still wanted to craft a funding bill with Murtha's priorities and other's to pressure Bush and the republicans to reject timetables at the expense of funds for the troops. Many in our party thought the tactic was part of the 'withholding funding' strategy advocated at the same time by more strident members. It was just not the same fight. That decision to just cut off funds was first rejected in committee in the House before the vote for the second bill. It was also rejected, in large part, with the failure of the McGovern bill to achieve enough votes to pass. The leadership bill which was sent to Bush wasn't as much of a showdown on funding, as it was a challenge on the timetables. The funding was both an answer to the charge that Democrats were abandoning the troops (and a response to the shortfalls under republican rule), and a challenge for Bush to veto funding along with the exit dates.

When Bush showed that he didn't give a damn about the funds, Democrats went ahead and made good on their promise to the troops. The timetables still stand, with republicans opposed and Democrats overwhelmingly in favor. They can be added to any legislation. But, what the Democrats repeatedly rejected was the notion that just sitting on funds that our own party had been saying for years the troops in the field needed was not going to move Bush sufficiently to cause him to end the occupation. That pressure will have to come from elsewhere. The majority of Democrats in this Congress is just not convinced that withholding funds is the most prudent or effective way to cause Bush to end his occupation.

:patriot: carry on. p.s. I love the last sentence, crafty, how that hope springs eternal! :applause:

I try to keep my posts short .

I understand all of what you are saying . The apathy or whatever word describes my feelings , maybe it's loss of trust .

I say this because as a nation we were finally begining to pull out of the muck brought on by Reagan /Bush . I am not going to say I agreed with all Clinton did during his terms . In his defense he had to deal with alot of flack .

Right now since bush jr climbed into our lives there is not one issue he has not touched or destroyed . It's not just the war , it involves the very fabric of this country ranging from the wars , the shreading of the constitution , the down fall of the economy including the tax cuts for the wealthy and the rise in medical costs . This does include ignoring the entire gulf coast after Katrina .

This admin has piled on so much more damage which has brought us back to a point far worse than most people in this country have ever seen .

So now just in order to get back to where we were , imperfect as it was , there is so much that needs to be over come and resolved than it will take generations .

This is the problem I have when all faith is placed in any political party .

Certainly we were headed toward a brick wall before bush but we had a much better chance of steering clear of this than we have now .

When you consider all the issues we now face the starting point becomes blurred when one asks how do we fix this .

I truely believe it will require a change in the way each citizen views these issues and it requires that each take some sort of action to turn this around . We have tried but so far the effort has not been large enough or focused enough . We can't simply rely on the government and policy .

I bring up a general strike because this would approach many issues face on at one time with one effort . Call it a focused effort and unity .

I am against the funding given to bush even if it was not needed it just adds to their power above the pipeline and can be used in ways that can make things even worse .

Six years of this horror certainly people are going to become more and more impatient . I am still surprised that it took this long for many citizens to wake up the little they have and I question their motives for voting Democratic . Was it just the war or was it personal palying it safe for some sort of gain .