Can we please stop calling Ann Coulter a transexual?

Ann Coulter is a hateful human being and unworthy of being on TV. But I fail to see how our calling her names illustrates her hatefulness. We can't with one face say "shame on this woman for calling Edwards a faggot" and with another face say "Ann the Mann" or "Annie the Tranny". It is hypocritical and transphobic (If that is a word). We are better than her. We can't make that point if we stoop to her level. Address her on the issues.

On edit We should also avoid all the sexist stuff too such as bitch, cunt, and whore. I shouldn't have left it out in the first posting.

Tire of this crap.

I'm pissed. I have had three transsexual friends in my life. They don't need it. They have enough to worry about.

Of all people, Randi Rhodes should know better, as she keeps referring to "Mann" Coulter on her show.

Trillionthed.

but I do think there's a good chance that she used to be a man.

She is hateful, venomous and just plain vile.

Sexual orientation has nothing to do with it.

Sort of like when I and others talk about droopy-faced Lieberman. Is it relevant? No. But it's a humorous observation.

unless you think jokes made at the expense of the GLBT community are funny.

Apply the Baskin-Robbins theory here.

I think something like a sex-change operation on a well-known celebrity* would have been public knowledge.

*What do you call a "celebrity" who is more notorious than celebrated? Anyone?

Anyway, I used to poke fun at her on a fairly regular basis on my own website, but I found it requires so much energy I tired of it after awhile. You see what such negativity does to AC; you can imagine what it does to someone who regularly picks apart her weekly column.

She is a hateful right wing tool.

That's all. Period.

:evilgrin:

:rofl:

I started responding that you are 100% correct. You made the point perfectly that we cannot make fun of trannies if we want to be better than them, but...

Then I started thinking about WHY people call her a tranny and I realized that people are NOT making fun of trannies or saying that Ann Coulter is bad because she is a tranny. They are simply trying to hurt her by saying that she looks like a man. Does that mean they hate men?

What if people said she looked like a fish. Would that mean that everyone that says that hates fish? That they are fish-ophobic?

I am not trying to be obtuse, but I think we need also to be careful of this kind reaction to words we don't like, like "bitch", "fag". Most people that use these words are not homophobes or tranny-phobes.

:popcorn:

You know, people don't ALWAYS have a complete commitment to every issue. Sometimes they want to discuss (this IS a discussion board).

In fact, I am just discussing. Ready to have my current opinion changed or reinforced. I am not MARRIED to anything on this issue, so save the drama.

Just the green flag for the people about to pile on you.

is that using such words instantly makes people believe you mean it in the worst imaginable way. Otherwise why use it? You and many of those who use them think that the word is harmless regardless of meaning, because people shouldn't assign meaning that they don't have direct evidence, or more clear evidence of. ... Right?

:nuke:

like no one makes fun of transgender people--they have had so good for way too long.

:sarcasm:

... If that "splash damage" is not intended, then one much eschew the original terminology.

Going all legalistic boots nothing. There are no linguistic "bills of attainder", to use a somewhat abstract analogy.

I mean, other than saying using fag is homophobic, I can't see any use of that word which isn't homophobic.

now, I call myself a Jew all the time and don't get insulted by it, but it's Borat's own antisemitism that makes it an insult.

Now "fag" is just plain insulting under any circumstances, but calling someone "gay" or "transexual" plays off their own phobias.

I'm not sure I'm buying what I'm saying, just thinking out loud.

...well it is a non homophobic use for the word "fag". (Used as a tiny spot of humor in the 1968 movie: "Salt and Pepper" with Peter Lawford and Sammy Davis Jr.)(if you blinked you missed it btw)
I believe a "fag" is also a small kindling stick for use in starting a fire.


Well you DID ask... (and this IS the DU) :hi:

"Hey, man! Can I bum a fag from you? I'm desparate for a smoke, but I'm all out."

and return to the 40's; 23 skidoo

But they DO have taste!

Seriously, tho, you're over thinking it. This is a thread about respecting people who society tries to run down and abuse. Using a minority as an insult against people we don't like is, well, totally gay inappropriate.

I just read a thread the other day that said that "David Schuster is a whore" -- criticizing a man by labeling him a female who sells sex. Why didn't the poster just call him a gigolo? Because calling him a whore was a double-insult -- he is a woman who sells sex.

The "splash" effect happens when not only is the person being insulted hurt, but so is another group of people -- women, homosexuals, transexuals...

We need to end it.

These days, I never even think of sex workers when someone says "whore"--I think of sellout politicians of both genders.

what everyone else thinks of and whore is even worse than bitch to e. But both are thoroughly unacceptable in a place that is supposed to uphold liberal values, equality, etc. Toward that end, YOU don't get to decide what's acceptable and what isn't.

Or a woman who in fact had been a man at birth?

Why are people using that particular thing to try and hurt her. When she has so many actual faults?

I thought they were sending up WOMEN. My FRIEND said she felt like SHE was the object of a minstrel show. We had a fight over who had the most right to be offended. I'm still not sure who's right. I myself wasn't actually offended, but she sure was.

"we cannot make fun of trannies if we want to be better than them, but..."

Do you realize how offensive even your defense of transsexuals is? That's like saying, "we can't make fun of niggers..." or "we can't make fun of the kikes ..."

Sorry to use such offensive language, but that's pretty much the level of offensiveness of your "defense" of respect for transgendered people.

Or has had a sex change (or whatever) then she is a huge hypocrite (she is that anyway on all other fronts) but to make my point regarding the "Ann the Man" stuff...

Should Ted Haggard's interludes with a male protitute have remained secret and unspoken of,
because it would be homophobic to say that he was a closet homosexual who represented a community who shunned homosexuals?

Of course not--I didn't dislike the man because he chose to have relationships with men, I was disgusted because he was a hypocrite, representing a community that bashes people such as himself.

I don't think that making the observation that Ann Coulter appears to have some physical characteristics of a man, is something that should be a taboo thing--it is an observation and a correct one at that after seeing her again last night, wearing that ridiculous Robert Palmer back up singers type black dress (MS Coulter desperately needs a competent stylist regardless of her true gender)

When I make the observation that Coulter appears to display manly physical characteristics it is not intended to disparage transgendered people--it is simply an observation about Coulter's appearance and potential hypocrisy on sexual/gender issues.

Well said. :)

That intellectually dishonest tripe isn't worth a reasoned response.

yes, "transphobic" is the word. And there seems to be a hell of a lot of it even among DUers.

Attack Coulter for being a repulsive human being, but all the "Mr. Coulter" and "there's a good chance she used to be a man" comments are insulting to transpeople.

Does it make any f'ing difference if she was a man previously or not? NO. What matters is how she conducts herself. Judge her on that. To attack her for her appearance, which some consider "manly", is to attack every good transwoman and transman who are struggling for acceptance. It's unacceptable, and I'm sick of seeing this crap at DU. I call people on it when I see it, but sometimes it's so pervasive, it's depressing.

Get the f* over yourselves. If you're a transphobic bigot, take it to Freeperland. That's where it belongs.

people on the other side? Of what?

And are there Trans-Am-Phobics?

the generally used term for those who are the equivalent of homophobic, but aim their hatred at transgendered people is transphobic. Is the literal meaning of the word accurate? no, of course not, but I guess transgenderphobic was a little long and unwieldy.

Making jokes out of it doesn't make any useful point.

A few citations showing the generally accepted use of the term from a simple Google search:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transphobia
http://www.leics.police.uk/advice/5_support_for_victims/10_homophobic_and_transphobic_hate_crime/
http://www.queensu.ca/humanrights/tap/3discrimination.htm
http://www.transgendersoul.com/article%20tg%20dreams.htm

Especially when tearing down falsehoods and misrepresentations, as is the case with the "phobic/phobe" hysteria.

By the way, for all the people saying that calling her a tranny is disrespectful to actual transgendered people, I'd argue that the gross misuse of the idea of a phobia related to someone else's orientation is disrespectful to people with actual, medically-documented phobias.

So while we're on the PC kick here, let's at least be consistent.

Cheers.

it's my understanding that "phobia" or "phobic" is used because of the understanding that hatred of the "other" is rooted in fear. Fear of what is different. That fear drives the anger and the hate that leads to what are often termed "hate crimes".

And true phobias are medical (psychiatric) conditions. You're talking about a label that was created for political/social purposes. It's not valid.

Linking to Wikipedia as some type of proof that 'transphobia' is a medically-documented disorder is a little absurd. Wiki also has this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%27oh

:shrug:

transphobia is a medically-documented disorder.

I used it, and the other links, as evidence that the term transphobia is in fact in general usage to describe what we were discussing.

I'm a freaking librarian, for (insert name of deity here)'s sake! I know how to use a source. If I'd been trying to provide evidence of a medically-documented disorder, I would have looked for something like the DSM-IV. :eyes: (which, by the way, does NOT consider transphobia, or homophobia, etc. to be true phobias)

Have a good night. I'm outta here. :)

Medical dictionaries include phobias which relate to bigotry and discrimination.

Merriam-Webster's Medical Dictionary - Cite This Source
Main Entry: bitch
Pronunciation: 'bich
Function: noun
: the female of the dog or some other carnivorous mammals

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=bitch

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

:)

:rofl:

It struck me funny all the phobic in this country just are amazing. It is as out of control as the people running this asylum

and that is why I have stayed pretty scarce lately. I don't like any of the name-calling...it is juvenile and we should be better than that.

:hi:

That's why I've never used those type of names against Ann Coulter. If you're reduced to name calling you've lost the argument. And I detest Ann Coulter.

Dissing her as a "tranny" indicates that DU'rs think that transexuals and transvestites are damnable.

It's shallow, like when people diss Micheal Moore's movies because "he's fat!"

Recommended

Seriously!! She's a shrew and a mean, vicious, nasty, ugly, stupid, vile, conceited piece of dirt. No group in the world should have to bear her as their poster child other than Bush & Co.

How amusing is this?

http://www.rememberingourdead.org/

:hi:

Thanks for posting, I haven't seen that link before. And thanks for all you're doing here. I don't have the patience for this ignorance anymore. :hi:

The other is a platypus believe it or not.

just talking about her plays into the media whore's agenda (I know, that's an insult to whores) She's a simple insecure codependent deeply disturbed individual that desperately needs attention to feel vilified in her otherwise pathetic meaningless life. It is no surprise three fiances abandoned her.

or make vile sexist remarks about her? I've actually seen a slight improvement in that kind of treatment (i.e., sexist) of Coulter over the last small amount of time, but this thread demonstrates that the sexism is still here at DU.

Can you not include that in your plea as well?

I and other feminists are forever alerting on posts that we see which are clearly homophobic about Coulter, such as the infamous Ann the Mann term. Actually, that's sexist too. Do you alert on sexist comments you see re her or anyone else?

since they seem not to be removed for those reasons. I should have mentioned the sexists stuff though and did on edit after you pointed out my omission.

(will read it in a second).

HOWEVER, I've had many sexist and homophobic posts re public figures removed. Give it another try. Sexism and racism and homophobia are just as harmful no matter who they're lobbed against. Please.

lots of these folks would be drooling over her....she's white, blond and thin.All the ingredients of the "supposed" American beauty. :shrug:

problem in an old oral pathology book. it's a thyroid condition. hypothyroidism.

Actually, I never made the ranny comments to begin with but insulting Coulter is fun.

And she's not attractive anymore either.

I really liked that name. But if it offends people, I won't use it. Even if she is a...

:)

But I am starting to feel sorry for her. Little bit.

I mean, it's possible, right? Even likely.

of everyone you post about? If its not intended as a slap, what is the intent?

If she were an awesome left-wing progressive person would you care? Probably not. If you did care, you would probably think that her being a transsexual was a positive.

Given that her ideas, her sense of decency and morality are appalling - then we should focus on that - we don't want to associate her negativity with transsexuality.

Kind of like J. Edgar Hoover being a cross-dresser, or Hitler being sexually submissive. It's not a NICE kind of funny--it's certainly not nice to laugh at people because of their sexual orientation--but if anyone deserved to be laughed at for having had a sex-change, it would be Ann Coulter. You know, because of all of her "liberals are girly-men" rhetoric. I'm not suggesting that she has, mind you--but it's certainly within the realm of possibility.

Nobody "deserves" to be laughed at for being transgendered. And you can't laugh at one person for being transgendered without laughing at ALL transgendered people. No matter how "deserving" your direct target.

One would think this rather obvious.

to express said appreciation in public? Would that be okay with you?

On edit: and I think you're wrong about that "laughing at one transsexual equals laughing at all transsexuals" thing. If the transsexual in question is him/herself a fascist bigot/bigotess who derides the GLBT community, and derides non-fascists for alleged sins of gender-confusion, turnabout would indeed be fair play.

I never said you couldn't "appreciate the irony." I never said you "couldn't" do anything, as an absolute matter. Do whatever the hell you want.

but you reserve the right to call me a bigot. Oh, okay.

And I don't think you're a bigot.

I made a simple point, which is that if you laugh at a person, however much you dislike her, based upon her real or perceived or alleged gender identity or sexual orientation, you are implicitly stating that such identity or orientation makes a person lesser, that it is a weakness to be exploited, thereby insulting all others who share the same condition. Whether or not your direct target "deserved" abuse for her own actions is irrelevant.

Which should have been clear from my earlier posts on this thread, starting with the J. Edgar Hoover analogy. My point being that one would not be making fun of him/her because of his/her orientation (whatever that happened to be), but because his/her chromosomes were in conflict with his/her rhetoric. But I can certainly understand why you wouldn't want to go down that road--it's much more nuanced than "you're not allowed to ever mention Ann Coulter's alleged transsexuality in any context," also known as "there are no bad transgendered people." I'm not saying there's anything wrong with transgendered people (there isn't); I'm saying that if Ann Coulter is transgendered, she's a hypocrite and a coward as well as a wingnut idiot--and that fact rightly opens her up (just her, not all transsexuals--obviously) to public ridicule. Not as a transgendered/transsexual person--as a hypocrite. Is that so hard?

I never said there are no bad transgendered people. I said that making fun of a transgendered person's gender identity, whether or not he or she is "bad," is an indirect insult to other transgendered people.

And get real, the ONLY reason people allege that Ann Coulter is transgendered is as a put-down, not because they have real evidence. If, in fact, Ann Coulter is transgendered, of course she is a hypocrite and deserves ridicult. (She's a hypocrite and deserves ridicule for so many reasons!) But calling her "mAnn Coulter," "Ann the Man," "Tranny Annie," etc. or claiming she has an Adam's apple is not ridicule of her hypocrisy, it's using transphobia against her and reinforcing same in the process. Is that so hard?

But you won't hear me defending the "Ann the Man" crowd. Not my tar, not my brush.

Would it be okay to call her a Hebe?

We're not exactly talking circumcision here.

Seriously. I'm at a loss. :shrug:

All I could think of was, "Uhhhh... they're both slurs?" :shrug:

:thumbsup:

Calling a transgendered woman a man is insulting. While not on the level of "nigger," "fag," or "kike (or hebe)," it is still calling her something she is not. Therefore, if it were revealed that Ann Coulter is a post-operative transsexual, calling her "Ann the Man" is insulting her lining up her sexual organs with her gender identity. I am sure you understand why "Annie the Tranny" would be insulting.

which is both a religious and ethnic slur? Other than being an insult, of course. I'm saying the comparison is weak: it's comparing calling a Jew a "hebe" to any other type of insult to anyone. "You're ugly" is an insult of an altogether different order than "you're a hebe." See what I mean?

You wouldn't have to even use a pejorative word.

Suppose everytime someone talked about Barney Frank, they referred to him as "homosexual Barney Frank." Well, it's true, isn't it? Yet it's still meant as an insult. Or how about someone who directed a statement at "that Jew Joe Lieberman?" Any word can be turned into a slur depending upon how it's used (see: "that's so gay").

You get the point.

But I think your analogies are weak. Barney Frank makes no attempt to hide his orientation, and he certainly doesn't pretend to be gloriously straight (not to mention Aryan) out of one side of his face while bashing gay people out of the other--so of course mentioning his orientation every time you spoke his name would serve no rhetorical purpose except as an implied slur. With Joe Lieberman your argument's even more dubious: should we never mention Lieberman's jewishness? Even in conjunction with his ties to AIPAC and his hawkishness on Iraq and now Iran? Look, I admire your desire to shield transgendered people from association with the likes of Ann Coulter, and I agree with you that we ought not to use accusations of transsexuality as a political weapon. But I also think it's not necessarily a good idea to try to completely shut down all discussion of Coulter's gender identity, insofar as it may or may not stand in contradiction to her rhetoric. Know what I'm saying? I just hate it when DU goes all PC, and starts telling everybody what they can and can't say; I guess it's my inner libertarian talking.

When you have some concrete reason to believe that Coulter is actually transgendered (i.e., when we've got a Ted Haggard situation on our hands), then we'll talk. Until then, "discussion" of her gender identity (and let's be honest, it's rarely discussion, but namecalling) amounts to nothing more than speculation for the purpose of ridicule--using transphobia as a political weapon, in your words.

Peace.

It's just not OK.

And now I find out I'm not. My day sucks.

room for you to be another of the biggest idiots, then you truly are a gigantic idiot. Quite possibly the biggest of them all. Does that make you feel better?

:P

</joke attempt>

We gotta do what we do best :P

Everytime "progressives" do this, they only are ridiculing transgendered people, with the implication being that they are unattractive, etc. - something which they probably get enough of already from society.

Coulter is unattractive and emaciated, probably a drug user, but her ugliness comes from within, and is manifested every day in the foul things she says.

I'm pretty sure using the c-word is already banned here, but I don't know if I would go so far as to rule out "bitch" and "whore".

A lof of people simply used bitch as a female counterpart to "asshole". Most women I know use that one.

As for whore, most of us use that one for anyone, male or female, who is a sellout.

It is kind of an insult to sex workers, but I'd like to hear from them before we say you can't call a whored-out shill like say, Christopher Hitchens, a whore.

it's gender-neutral.

The only reason you would need an exclusively female term is if you are trying to use a gender slur. And please don't.

It's not a regular part of my vocabulary - there are much more descriptive words.

Besides, what difference does it really make if an insult is gender-neutral or not?

Men and women are different. They behave differently. Male and female jerks act out in different ways.

Limbaugh is a "Lout", Babs Bush is a "battle-axe"...

Those terms aren't gender-neutral but they sure do hit right on target sometimes.



I think it's reasonable to argue that calling Coulter a "tranny" or her calling Gore a "fag" would be hurtful to a LOT of gays or transgendered people.

Like I said, I wouldn't use that normally, but in a fit of outrage, who knows what I would say.

"what difference does it really make if an insult is race-neutral or not?"

thoughts on that?

You make a good point.

All I can say is, our society has pretty much moved on from using race insults (hopefully), but that's not the case with gender-loaded ones.


Still think calling a person like Coulter a "tranny" is more hurtful than calling her a "bitch".

I wouldn't call her either.



How about "emaciated harpy"?

along with the critique of her body? Harpy is a gender-loaded term, again designed to slur women specifically, to keep them from getting too uppity.

Her body shape is not the problem.

The reason she is emaciated is assumed by many to be either vanity, or a lifestyle of drugs and partying, or both.

And men are hardly immune from ridicule about body shape - Limbaugh, Kucinich, Michael Moore, they all get it too.

Yeah, body insults should have been left on the playground years ago, but I don't see an end to it anytime soon.



I always thought that a "harpy" was a flying demon. I never knew it was gender-specific, just thought it was an annoying, shrieking idiot.

But looking it up I see it was a birdlike monster with the head of a woman. Learn something new every day...

I've called males harpies, too...

let me just say this is both ignorant and heartless. "The reason she is emaciated is assumed by many to be either vanity, or a lifestyle of drugs and partying, or both."

Please find a way to express your feelings about the individual without spewing prejudices against women, against gays, against transgendered people, and against people that don't, for whatever reason, fit your personal standards for being in public with their body weight, which is not your business unless you are her physician.

--is that there are things that sex workers won't do for money.

:toast:

"liberal"

n/t

leave it at that, I say...

And certainly can't say I care much for seeing the term bandied about as if it were an insult.

You have to be human to be transsexual.

While we're trying to be "better than some people", they're steam rolling over us like hot pavement.

The high road can kiss my ass. I say fight fire with fire.

...but I really admire witches and the Wiccan religion.
Perhaps I will in the future refer to her as "it" or "that thing" as I question not only her gender, but whether she is human or not.

you are doing in the name of democracy and liberalism.

No need to insult actual humans.

Hekate

Is that polite or is it disingenuous?
I'm not saying...

Edit: how many times must I correct this post? :)

These Republicans have taught me to hate.

Frankly, she's not worth "debating" on the issues.

As for her being a transexual or not... I don't think she's "transexual". I think Ann Coulter is a conservative man who has channeled his insecurity and misogyny into a weird deranged cartoon character in the vague (VERY vague) shape of a woman. Has nothing to do with actual sexual orientation.

Besides. It's a Republican. Republicans don't have sexual orientations. They reproduce by spores, like a slime mold or athlete's foot.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

The level of ignorance in this thread (and now violence) is shameful.

:sarcasm:


And wishing castration and murder upon somebody, regardless of who they are, is reprehensible.

:kick:

She's not a transexual...she's a human virus.

And the same people just never get it. They think themselves clever. They lob accusations of censorship and humorlessness. I'd like everyone who thinks using such insults is just harmless fun to go watch Boys Don't Cry or read about Gwen Araujo's head being caved in for having the audacity to be a hot chick who happened to be pre-op.

Damn right it's transphobia. If you don't think so, you need to take a long, hard look at yourself and try to have some empathy for once.

The deliberate obtuseness on DU on this issue is disgusting.

Her performance today showed her to be an pathetically ageing teen-rebel-without-a-cause who seems to suffer from a severe coke or meth habit (note the obsessive playing with her hair). Her political opinions are as relevant as Paris Hilton's.

Who cares what tackle she's packing? I, for one, hope NEVER to see it whether it's an inny or an outy. Whichever, it is probably diseased and non-functional, considering the horrendous sexual acts that I'm sure she's engaged in during her life as a sleaze queen.

edit: spelling

NT

Ann Coulter's been kicked out of Jerks, Louts, Assholes and Other Unpleasant People, Inc...
for giving them a bad name.

The church that she allegedly attends stated "She ain't one of ours, man!" or words to that effect.

and I've also chided people for making fun of Rush for being fat... there are plenty of valid things to make fun of. You don't have to stoop to making fun of their appearance or making transphobic (yes it's a word :) ) comments.

some people are considerate and dont like the oppression of minorities.

this is just another way of saying that being transgendered is ugly.

is there any proof that she was ever a man?

just because she is ugly she is not a transgendered person.

she is just ugly.

this is silly.

If she were a liberal I would think she was pretty.

Now I refer to her as Annthrax or better yet - that dumbass shrill.

But your point is very valid! I've met many transsexual/transgenders and all of them were kind, caring people. To negatize transsexualism by using it as a slur is just wrong - we DUers can do better

doesn't even have a belly button.

The sooner we do that the sooner she becomes Ann who?

But I do agree with your statement. It's really insulting to transexuals I imagine. To be linked with that creature? Unfair.

cause she, if there ever was a 'bitch' is one. Guys can be bitchs too. I dont see it as a sexist remark as much as a specific type of mean (not nescessarily pertaining to women).

If only to remove her genitalia as a discussion topic! :puke:

All the Mann Coulter jabs strike me as another version of "retard." C'mon, lefties! She's a right-wing whore, professionally offensive, and that should be slur enough.

to get the reaction of name calling, hair raising and ranting that follows where ever she goes. It isn't about her...it's about taking the focus off of a "bad" news day(s).....and it worked
This "story" smells of Rove. From the number of posts even here on DU..it worked. The Repugs pulled out the "talking head" once again. What could be more despicable than someone poking fun at a woman who is battling cancer, has lost a child and wished her husband had been killed by a terrorist? A vice president who is teetering on the edge by proclaiming he is above the law, is NOT a part of the executive branch and is the puppet-master for the president.
Looks like the ultimate diversion....again. Let's not get distracted by the non "news" but stay focused on what really is going on. What affects us all.
Kinda like the Wizard Of Oz....put on a big spectacular show and, by all means, do NOT pay attention to that man behind the curtain.

but rather to point out her HYPOCRISY. You know, here's a "woman" with a huge adams apple in a little black dress ragging on "fags". Sheesh.

with very prominent adam's apples. It is not a purely male trait. Everyone has one, some women's are more visible than others. Francesca Neri is well known for hers, and she's 100% woman. Unless you have some information that Ann Coulter is a transexual, you can't really call her a hypocrite, and it is insulting to call her a transexual, or question her gender.

However, I do find some hypocricy in someone calling someone a transexual because that person called someone else a faggot. Ignorance on both sides, methinks. You're making attacking someone's gender identity or sexuality a valid source of criticism, which it should never be in politics or society in general.

<<You're making attacking someone's gender identity or sexuality a valid source of criticism>>

How is simply pointing out someone's blatant hypocrisy attacking their gender identity or sexuality? Anyone who has had transgendered or gay friends develops some pretty good 'transdar' and 'gaydar'. I do not criticize anyone for being transgendered or gay, UNLESS they make a good part of their living bashing and undermining other transgendered and gay people.

As an analogy, when people criticised Rev Ted Haggard for preaching against gay rights WHILE having closeted gay sex, were they criticizing him for the gay sex or for the HYPOCRISY?

Haggard was actually having gay sex. You are ASSUMING that Ann Coulter is a man because she doesn't conform to your idea of beauty.

There are millions of men and women, who are either born "too masculine" or "too feminine" that live through hell because people harrass or criticize them because they "look gay" or "look like a man/woman." Just because you have gay or trans friends doesn't make you some kind of mind reader or expert on the matter. To assign these labels to a person based on how they look simpy furthers stereotypes associated with these groups.

If you can come forth with some kind of evidence that Ann Coulter was born a man, then by all means, you can criticize her hypocricy (though I don't recall her ever saying anything anti-trans). But until then, you're just being a sexist bigot.

whatever.

it justifies aLL bigotry.

"justify ALL bigotry"? You're painting with a really broad brush.

that works wonders too.

I know I'm not a bigot, but YOU (who don't know me) think I am, so there's nothing to do but end the discussion. I'm not here to fight with anyone.

Peace.

Or is it "Mandra" Bullock?

chest-burster copyright H.R. Giger

An adam's apple isn't unique to men. Everyone has one. It is more prominent in some women than others (moreso in very thin women, which Coulter is).

Even if Coulter was transgendered (which she is not), I am more appalled at the fact that so many progressives find this a valid source of criticism than by any crap Coulter herself spews.

while apparently being unable to comprehend their meaning.

"No, no, androgynous features only appear on people I disagree with!"

I fucking hate hypocricy.
.

As do quite a few other women.

Some women end up getting surgery (Chondrolaryngoplasty), which exposes them to completely unnecessary medical risks and costs, for a procedure which has no medical benefit at all.

Why do they do this?

Because the world is full of bigoted assholes who think it's their mission in life to interject their unwanted opinion concerning every aspect of women's bodies, and subject them to all amounts of ridicule for not conforming to that bigot's perception of what women are "supposed" to look like.

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Your words are ugly and sexist. Why bring them here? Why bring them anywhere? How does that advance social justice in any way?

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Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

And clearly your personal attacks and vile language were unacceptable; otherwise your posts wouldn't have been deleted.

The misogyny and personal attacks in your posts are unacceptable, and this latest post is another fine example. You didn't like the fact that your posts were deleted, so you attacked the person that you felt alerted on you.

Well, it's not just blonndee alerting on you, it's me as well. Perhaps you'll have a personal attack for me next? I'm male, however, so please save the misogyny for someone else.

:eyes:

How so? Have I attacked you in some way? Have I discounted your opinions based on nothing more than your gender?

Personal attacks are Ann Coulter's style (and any other RW talking head, for that matter), and it's disturbing to see the same on a so-called "progressive" message board. I'm certainly not the "PC police," but you can disagree with someone based on the merits of their argument instead of on their physical characteristics. Your posts above that were deleted were just vile, and you're better than that, which I think was the OP's point.

Funny how you tried to turn this around on me as if I've done something wrong. Nice try, though...

You said this:

"I'm male, however, so please save the misogyny for someone else."

Perhaps I should have phrased my response this way:

"You go ahead and save your PC bullshit for someone else." or "Please do the same thing with your PC bullshit".

Get it? Clear now?


If I want to smear Coulter using misogyny, good luck stopping me. She has wholly earned my sneering contempt, laced for good measure with loads of epithets and profanity.

Better than that? Please; we Dems had better learn to take the gloves off, or we're going to get rolled over, yet again.

I'm more aghast that progressives would rather defend their worst enemy than hit her where it hurts. Taking misogyny out of an attack on Coulter is like taking a knife to a gunfight.

Sorry!
:sarcasm:

:eyes:

Personally, I feel offended at your statement.

And since you are taking away my right to feel "offended" (since you don't consider me "oppressed"), that actually means you are oppressing me.

So...where does that leave us?

Oh, yeah: :eyes:

Great post, dsc.

Here's something I posted over in GLBT a few weeks ago. I would encourage all DUers to educate themselves about transgendered people.

I also want to say that some of the posts in this thread are infuriating and simply monstrous. :banghead:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=221&topic_id=53419&mesg_id=53419

It is insulting to transgender people to make jokes about her sexual identity. She is an awful person. Evil.

:sarcasm:

because I was disgusted before I got through the first paragraph it seems that tranny has been replaced today by calling her all sorts of sexist names AND there are two threads on the greatest page with the same article.

Some days I am sickened by what I read here. How does any of this make us better than who we so unkindly refer to as Repukes or Sheeple? I swear I can't take it here much longer.

I totally agree and had I the stomach to read more I am guessing that somewhere in that article the word tranny came up so the worst anyone can think of to say about this person is that she is all the digusting traits of despicable women and trannys. Lovely isn't it and oh so intelligent :eyes:.

just curious, and i agree with you that we shouldn't trample the Innocent.. in the quest to point out the guilty:shrug: :dilemma:

That term's not sexist so much as it conveys an attitude - like the kind Coulter has. Ann Coulter is the sort of bitch that makes even garden variety bitches say "damn, what a bitch."

I've known some transgendered folk and they have all been lovely people. Ann is a vile human being regardless of her physical gender or gender identity.

...is to beat her, and those who like her, with her own cane. There is nothing more insulting than to call someone something that he despises, say if you were to call Ahmedinejad a Jew, or maybe refer to Dubya as either black or gay.

I'm pretty sure one of the reasons republicans didn't do well last November was because Mark Foley was misbehaving in a way that republican voters don't like. The socially conservative republican base doesn't like atheists, blacks, Muslims, Jews, women who don't "obey" their husbands, sex workers (except to be clients), pot-smokers, people who can't keep a handle on their drinking, east Asians, gays, transsexuals, or just about anything else that doesn't conform to their straight, WASPish, churchy worldview. Therefore, the best terms to use in insulting them and those they admire are the very terms they hate the most.

So whether we like the word or not isn't relevant, if calling Coulter a tranny will make her admirers crazy and herself even crazier.

Keep repeating the memes "Ann Coulter had a sex change" and "George Bush still drinks no matter what he says" or "Dubya used to have a fling with his (male) mentor" enough times -- whether they're true or not -- and some of it will trickle down to the mouthbreathers, where it will stick. This is called playing dirty, but anything is justified if it will keep republicans from being elected. As we know, they're certainly not above such tactics themselves. Fight fire with fire, I say.

I refuse to give up my right to call her a BITCH.

Perhaps if we can make it just as taboo to ban 'DICK' as a malecentric epithet, then I will consider the severely political correct environment and refrain from using the word 'bitch' to describe bitches like Anne Coulter.

I make more subtle distinctions in language than I'm sure the PC goon squad will give me credit for when they descend upon my post and demand it be deleted because it obviously means I hate women.

I call bullshit on that.

I hate 'Bitches', I hate 'Dicks', and I hate 'assholes'. A 'bitch' is a dog or a 'female asshole'. A 'dick' is a penis or a 'male asshole'. Since I find it too clumsy to express my sentiments about her as a 'female asshole', I will say 'bitch' until all other epithets are banned because they obviously insult someone.

As for the OP, I totally agree. Equating Anne Coulter with any group is an insult to them.

So I suppose I owe an apology to the animal lovers out there.

-Dr. E

and leave it at that. She deserves not a nano-second of my time. Any thread that I see with her name in it, gets immediately hidden. :hi:

in bringing up Coulter (like she's doing this very moment), I'm always cringing...