How concerned should dark-skinned minorities be about anglo paranoia?

I had a conversation with an old friend who is very tapped into the Nascar culture and he said that everyone he knows is buying guns and teaching their family members how to shoot in order to prepare. "Prepare for what," I asked. "For when they come to storm our homes," he replied. "Who?," I asked. "Who is coming to storm your house?" "You know," he said. And then his mother responds, "You know, the bombers in Scotland were doctors."

So, they think that because the bombers in Scotland were doctors, they now feel that a line has been crossed. The 9/11 bombers apparently did not hold jobs that crossed this imaginary line that brought them into direct contact with ordinary Americans, but they believe that the Scotland bombers were trying to come over here, to reek havoc on our streets.

So, someone has to ask, at what point should dark-skinned Americans start being concerned about the unreasonable paranoia that was purposefully created and exploited by the White House?

When I was younger and had an office job, I was more light-skinned than I am today. I also went through a period of bad health, and lost my natural tan. Believe me, people responded to me differently when I was light skinned, than now, when I'm out in the garden every day and very tan. It's prejudice, pure and simple.

I'm convinced these people will waste bullets shooting their own shadows.

I don't think the type of people you are describing ever got over the civil rights act, and now the Ayrabs are going to come storm their homes to top it all off!

That's one point of origin, I believe. :shrug:

else.

Making life a living hell for the rest of us.

...to give myself the false illusion that I am younger than I am lol!

History has shown far more white on black violence than black on white. That paranoia and fear of "the other" has been with us forever, and with dark skinned Americans since the Nat Turner Rebellion, and possibly even before that. My Muslim friends who are doctors have been very quiet about their faith, etc, ever since 9-11-01. Hey, even I don't talk about my faith-it was on that date my boss told me point blank that all Muslims should be deported and that he'd never hire one.

say that we should burn down all Muslim churches.

Who is going to take a leadership position to put this genie back in the bottle? Certainly not a Republican.

My experience with people of color is that they have been concerned for 500 years. They are still concerned. And it is unlikely that anything we (anglos) say or do will ease that concern.

Care to elaborate?

500 years, why don't you see them stocking up their gun armory? Is it guilt in the anglo-American culture that has everyone so spooked? The fact that if the shoe were on the other foot, you know you all would resort to violence, so you're expecting everybody to respond the same way?

But I can sense the accusatory tone of your reply. Are you trying to accuse me (anglos) of something? Are you saying that people of color are better at handling the concern? You keep asking questions. I answered them to the best of my ability. Can you answer my questions?

we'll never find out.

Don't you think this is odd? If black Americans have experienced far more conflict at the hands of white Americans, why don't you see them behaving in the same manner as the white Americans that are expressing their angst by stockpiling?

I mean, I've been in the homes of some Republican stockpilers and I know why they're paranoid. They're mean as shit and play dirty in business so it doesn't surprise me that they drive Hummers and own over twenty weapons in their gun rooms, but these are a few and I would hate to paint everyone as these people. I'm just dismayed that the same paranoia is being exhibited by people who don't usually go out of their way to screw people over.

because I believe according to the Federal database of crime statistics that black on black crime far exceeds white on black crime or black on white crime..........

We're talking about how Americans are responding to each other across race lines, and how white Americans are stockpiling because they're visualizing terrorists storming their homes.

Black on black crime usually occurs in high crime areas and is usually drug related.

and I see nothing of what you are talking about........Franky I believe this thread is mostly gossamer and hot air........

Republicans dominate, these insular ideas are prevalent among the residents. Because there is no real diversity to challenge their beliefs. So, when you live in an insular, Republican city, county or state for a few years, please write back. Until then, you really should be listening to those of us who are in these red pools because our concerns are not going to go away, and you're not helping the situation with your limited experience.

one of the 10 reddest counties in America? I was there in May, I posted on this board about how relaxed everyone was and how I hadn't been there in 5 years and was surprised at how racially tolerant the place had gotten............

Again this whole thread is gossamer and hot air and has a reek of racism in it towards whites........I just alerted on the more egregious posts and we'll see what happens......

But if you're so damn sure that your red county can hold up to the test, start a thread. Name the city, brag about how incredibly tolerant it is, and lets see what everybody else thinks about it. We'll start by determining the demographics, then we'll go into the local paper and look at the archives, so go ahead, start the thread and PM me so I can start the research.

And, btw, if your county is 60% mono-culture, then, I would like to hear from someone in the 40% to determine if it was tolerant or not. Wouldn't you?

And I'm not asking you to amend anything......

You are free to say what you wish, as am I free to disagree........It's a neat system we have in America.

You know, everyone has a right to adapt or resist. Whatever they need to do to make it through the day. The oddest person I ever met was at a family wedding. She and I were the only two minorities in the room. She was a black American and my in-law proudly paraded her in front of me and said, "She hates black people. She prefers to be with whites." The woman just sat there with a smile on her face. My in-law proceeded to explain that the woman worked in social welfare, and she hated it when the black kids looked up to her like a role model. Still, the woman did not flinch to contradict her. I think she was ashamed of them. The woman's next job was an international agency that worked with poor blacks in Africa.

So, in sum, there are probably 101 ways that people adjust, or adapt to deal with their own realities. You make 102. Give me the name of the city, and I'll decide for myself how tolerant it is.

when was the election that elected you determiner of tolerant places? How does one become a DTP? Is there an age limit, or can one be a mix half/half racial person like myself?

As for your story, neato, do you also write non-fiction?

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The story is true. I have very racist, Republican relatives. After seventeen years of listening to abusive comments regarding minorities, I stopped going to family gatherings for several years. My experiences are not unique on this newsgroup. That wedding was a necessary get-together after it was well known that I had a problem with their political views, but before Bush's little vision began to implode. The woman was paraded in front of me as if to say that because they found one black woman to agree with their views, it legitimized their racist opinions and proved that mine were wrong.

I predict that you will be used in the same way.

Black community? I'm a middle class white guy in a middle class white neighborhood, in a city with more Hispanics than Blacks. I have occasional contact with Black People, but I can only relate what I've heard them say. And I did that. I sense that there is an underlying strata of paranoia toward White People that is 500 yrs. old. I don't know how they are responding to that because they don't tell me.

One thread. Just ONE thread that discusses whether we of minority bent should be alarmed by the increasing paranoia that we're hearing among anglo-Americans and you're freaking out. How do you think we feel? These people are in our faces bragging about stocking up weapons, and the statistics do support that. How do you think we feel?

Why aren't you asking the Black community. Don't you think they would have a better answer?

If you have a point to make, perhaps you should make it without the enigmatic questions. Try using simple declarative sentences.

You're making absolutely no sense. First, you come on board because you don't like the declarative statements you think I'm making, then I respond by telling you that I don't have the answers, but I do think it's important to ask the question and that's why I'm here. Then you whine that I should *ask* the black community, not you. And then you go back and contradict yourself and tell me to make a declarative sentence.

I'm not here to make conclusions for everyone. I made an observation that I think is important to discuss. Other people, generally, agreed with me. You felt uncomfortable, as well you should. There is a divergence between the way that minorities and anglo-Americans are responding to this terrorist threat. I want to know why. If you have the answer, or even a conjecture, please let us know. If not, then don't fall into the "ME" trap and think that this entire thread is a personal PM to you.

And, btw, thanks for the kick.

They probably should be preparing to defend their homes. But it ain't the dark skinned "they" that should be worrying them. These folks have a lot more to fear from a government that wants to know everything about them and intrude into every facet of their lives than they do about some guy down at the local kwik e mart.

from the time they stepped foot in america. That's why this country seems to be pro-guns, pro-death penalty and favors long term incarceration because of their fear of the "other" people.

vigilance that is happening among the Nascar crowd, for lack of a better definition?

I am much more afraid of physical harm from "law enforcement gone wild" than I am of either my neighbors or the terraists.

And as a NASCAR fan myself - I have to remind that the idea that NASCAR and rasslin fans are all fundie freeper rednecks is just silly. :)

These are ordinary people who I would never define as redneck. I used the term Nascar, because the guy never liked that culture before, but since he connected with his co-workers, his ideas have changed completely, and that's what they watch for fun.

What I was saying is that if I'm worried about my over the top neighbors, I can't picture myself being afraid of more moderate people who are just temporarily misguided.

We had a case right after 911 where way too many people went all hoooie and we ended up the Patriot Act, approval for the building of "secret" concentration camps, and women in hajibs getting harrassed. George Bush himself helped to a stop to the latter and I really do have to give him credit for that (as much I hate to do so).

I see the potential of all sorts of Americans targeting muslims, mosques etc in the US if another terror attack actually happens (not just suspects arrested). But I don't see a case of mass violence against brown people in general. -- the threats I see to brown people in general is much more ingrained in our society and is in no way related to terrorism. I expect whites to attempt to keep me at an economic disadvantage but I never ever think about someone shooting me for being brown.

What a wonderful thought.

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These are people who voted Republican because they own their own business and were attracted by the tax break promises. Everything else has changed them since following Bush's path. You might also keep in mind that some of them have businesses in bad parts of town and can recite personal run-ins that have jaded them, and made them pliable to suggestion.

Anyone easily sucked in by mean-spirited Right Wing propaganda...has the Red Neck gene...imo.
That's what it is. "Oh, I'm scared. Let me go find a nigger to whop on."
There's no excuse for it. We've all been scared.
Lee

At least from my perspective.

There may be lots and lots of whitey excuses for attacking people of color but racism is inexcusable. Period. It's simple, not complicated. THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR RACISM.
Lee

I'm on your side. Racism is racism. But rednecks and the people that are currently acting in this, albeit, racist manner, are two different groups of people. They are, however, mixing at Nascar events, and their ideas are beginning to converge, so you can't tell them apart. But, the latter would never consider themselves a redneck, and neither would I.

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...for perhaps the most ignorant, mean-spirited, hate-filled post I have ever read.

it's clever whenever they can undermine you?

You're the one who's defending a person who described a group as "toothless, dumbfuck, red-necked, inbred, sub zero IQ, racist, xenophobic, bigoted, pale-faced, sociopathic, crap-o-matic, cedar chopper, goat roper, mud fuckers."

I don't know what a third of those terms even mean! Nor do I want to...

Your post number 15 was disgusting............Way to label people.......

...they can hurt like a fist. :rofl:

Yeah because to some identifying racism WHERE IT IS, is much worse than racism itself. :rofl:

Lee

It's also sick and pathetic that you would be so much more appalled and your nose so out of joint about a post against racism than you are ABOUT RACISM ITSELF. That is sick and pathetic. Poor widdle white folks. Jeez.
Lee

as well as the rest of the world, that Anglo paranoia is always a concern.

I think we need to make an issue of "Anglo paranoia," because the Bush Administration has widen a fracture which will define us for generations as two different Americas.

our history is recent -- within a veritable arms length.

that should tell you.

in the case of this immigration history -- we loved that mexicans came here temporarily -- seasonally -- but i guess that we didn't want them to go home again -- because we made it more difficult for them to leave once they got here.

now of course ''we'' hate them.

in the case of arabas, indians and chinese -- we need technically skilled people and we don't produce enough at home -- so our companies pay them to come here.

then ''we'' hate them after they get there.

any way...

we should have learned that with reagan.

"Anglo" is a derogatory term for white people, similar to "gringo". The proper terms would be "white" or "Caucasian".

Secondly, with Bush's approval level as low as it is, he currently has no power to do anything to change how people think. Everyone's seen through his bullshit by now, even most of his conservative base.

Judging America by a handful of right-wing gun nuts is like judging America by the babboon that currently resides in the White House.

Now, let's get on to some real news, shall we?

to those of us who are in the line of fire because there is so much misdirected "anglo paranoia." I hope it's a term that sticks. In the U.S., "anglo" does refer to "white" in a broad sense. Only in Britain is it used in a more specific geographic manner.

"Caucasian" doesn't cut it, because hispanics are caucasians and the people I'm referring to don't ask questions about your race or culture. They judge you based on the color of your skin.

"Gringo" isn't at all what you think it means. It is not just a derogatory term to "white" people, it is specifically a derogatory term to people of North American or British nationality. Which is why I, as an hispanic in America, could be, and have been, referred to as a gringa when I lived in latin America.

Bush may leave with a whimper, but that isn't going to stop the damage he has caused. Someone has got to recognize the increased angst that is occurring in some of the anglo circles and give the "there is nothing to fear, but fear itself," speech.

For those of us who live in red counties or cities or even states, the fact is that this "angst" is spreading, even to Democrats who happen to like Nascar. It's the water-cooler phenomenon.

Which is probably a good thing.

Anglo - a white U.S. citizen or inhabitant of non-Hispanic descent.

It is THE most appropriate definition in this case. Wake up call.

And trust me just because in the US WASPs let us and Italians play golf with them now their attitudes and beliefs have not changed one bit.

So I will use my definition of what they are.

I've been on british newsgroups, so I understood your definition. However, there are two acceptable definitions depending on what forum you happen to be at the time. And I think it was clear that I'm referring to the US.

about others don't change.

a couple of websites, this one being TMZ and comments about Tony Parker and Eva Longoria marrying.

"Canela you hairy ass whore why don't you go to Iraq. We got enough smelly, gang-banging, illegal alien wetbacks dumbing down our country with their exported poverty, without throwing your fugly ass taco breath into the mix. Remember the Alamo true Americans!"
^^ directed at me.

"My brother was married to a mexican but he dumped her after two years when she gained 300 pounds, grew hair on her chin and sat around eating tacos watching Telemundo all day. Now he has a petite pretty white wife and the family is so glad"

is it paranoia or just hate?

But, when, otherwise, sensible people start behaving like rednecks, you know you've got a problem.

message board immaturity..........

This was an effective terrorist tool in my view. Divide and conquer. I was speaking to my husband about this, what a powerful tool racism is, and the fact that these men were well education feeds the paranoia. I work with a well respected surgeon from Pakistan. He's been in the US a long time. I've been wondering if he's felt any backlash? I plan on asking him next time I see him.

(By the way, I had a teacher in Ethnic studies one time who felt what we experience as modern racism can be traced to the defeat of the Spanish Armada and the subsequent wars after. The darker skinned Spaniards vs the white Northern Europeans, and the propaganda used during the conflicts )

In latin America, there was an unspoken hierarchy based on birth. Spaniard, Cuban, Argentinian and everybody else. However, I've spoken on the net with Spaniards who actually live in Spain, overall, seem to be an educated bunch and not much in the domineering business these days. In fact, sounds like they get their share of terrorist activity in their country. They're not immune. We're the ones who allow a president to alter years of conventional wisdom and sit by and allow him to attack the wrong country because we're quacking in our boots.

On the other hand, you have some anglo-Americans who are proud of their Viking heritage and even though they carry their Bibles, they are also fond of telling you that they come from people who killed people.

Paranoia run amok.

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But, since Indians prevailed in that society, it was easier to cut to the truth. The British were in the minority, though they welded more power back then, so it's still a very powerful movie.

And, to repeat a post which was deleted which did not break the rules, I do hope to write a story like Rosewood. In the same vein as Truman Capote's, "In Cold Blood." A non-fiction novel. Which loosely defined, is a story which is mostly true.

:shrug:

There was a NYT article a few months back showing statistics of gun deaths broken down by race, gender, and age. Above the age of 35, I think, the vast majority of white males who die of gunshot wounds are mostly suicides.

Most females and black male gunshot victims die of homicides.

But if those facts hold up, it tells me that someone has gone too far in pushing these people. Maybe if we can examine why they're responding in the manner they are, we can also find some way to cut down on unnecessary stress in this country - for everyone.

white guys mostly kill themselves with their guns.

http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2007/04/21/weekinreview/20070422_MARSH_GRAPHIC.html

I'm just not looking forward to the day where social changes, chaos or upheaval makes it easier for them to turn the gun on others.

Which is basically what has happened with some of these laws which allow you to shoot if you feel threatened in a public area.

My doctor has a dark skinned receptionist....EEEK!!!

By approximately as much paranoia as there has already been for the last thirty years, with an additional 1.5%.

Always been latent racism in this country, always will be. The Doctor's Plot is only an additional excuse that would have been taken regardless of the justification.

"...at what point should dark-skinned Americans start being concerned about the unreasonable paranoia that was purposefully created and exploited by the White House?"

April 15, 1865 when Johnson assumed the Presidency.