Howard Dean lives in another America...Claims you do too

Just heard an interview with Gov. Howard Dean, Democratic National Chairman on the Rachael Maddow show on Air America radio and I'm still shaking. I used to respect this man as being mainstream but something has happened. I don't even know the "Democratic Majority" he speaks of. He claims most Americans don't want to see congress use the power of the purse to force Bush to change course in Iraq. "You can't just turn it off like a spigot. People want to see us gradually withdraw the troops but they don't want to just stop the funding and leave the troops hanging. We might get up to 60 votes to get a withdrawal timetable bill to the president but he would just veto it and then we'd need 67 votes, which is impossible so we won't be able to start getting the troops out of Iraq until we get a Democratic president."

"I'm against impeachment also because we have more important things to do. It's not what the Democratic majority was elected for and it would cause an implosion of the majority because it would be looked at as a political stunt. Look they impeached Clinton for silly reasons, it left a bad taste in their mouths about impeachment and I just don't think the American public wants to go through that again. We would have to prove high crimes and misdemeanors and I just don't think that's what a majority of American people want. They want us to get on with getting things accomplished and passed. The important business like minimum wage."

My God! Even Rachael Maddox was left disappointed and discouraged and expressed it by sayin..."so, can't get out of Iraq till we get a new president, and no impeachment...hmm..."
I am really depressed now because this man is chairman of the Democratic Party. Talk about somebody resigning themselves to conditions as they are. It's like he is seeing another different America than me or most of my democratic friends that he thinks he speaks for or represents. How dare he resign himself to all the soldiers that will die before now and when we get a Democratic president? He says that by pulling the funding the dems will be seen as not supporting the troops when just the opposite is true. We are not abandoning the troops by pulling the funding..we are protecting them. Bush is the one saying give me the money to continue the occupation or I'll just leave the troops out there to die.

Gov. Dean has everything ass backwards. He makes it seem like we can't get enough votes in the Senate to withdraw the troops when actually it should be that the Republicans can't get enough votes in the Senate to continue the occupation. Stopping the funding for the occupation should not be viewed as not supporting the troops, it should be viewed as a refusal to allow them to continue to be killed needlessly. Dean should understand supporting the troops means protecting them not forcing them to die for a failed strategy. If Dean is so willing to just resign himself to conditions as they are until we get a Democratic president then perhaps he should just continue his resignation as Chairman of the Democratic Party because he doesn't speak for this Democrat. And then Dean says, "If we withdraw too quickly then al qaeda could take over Iraq. They could take over the country." Has he secretly joined the Bush camp or has he just not been paying any attention? Al qaeda represents less than 10% of the forces we are fighting in Iraq and it has been widely reported and accepted that the Iraqis(Sunni, Shiites and Kurds) have no tolerance for al qaeda and would throw them out of the country themselves once we get out of the way. Dean was dead serious about al qaeda taking over Iraq if we withdraw too quickly and this shocked Rachel Maddow because like me she was thinking how could this man be so ill informed yet express loudly that he is speaking for what the majority of Americans and Democrats want. It shocked me.

Then there's his views on impeachment. Even Rachel said we must be seeing different polls because impeachment has become a main stream issue and Dean just blew it off as a minority opinion, a waste of time and not really what the American people want. His narrow minded view did include the notion that Bush has corrupted every department and federal agency he's touched but then stops short by saying it would implode the Democratic party because the "majority" would lose seats because they would be seen as just playing dirty politics. Did he forget the constitution he swore to uphold and defend? Is his only concern to be..."how would it look?" He claims the people that want it just want emotional satisfaction and revenge. What has happened to Howard Dean? This administration has all but destroyed our Democracy with their criminal abuse of power. The DoJ is crippled. My god mman this is what we elected the democratic majority to do. Get us out of Iraq and end government corruption with oversight and "accountability". The two most important issues stated from the '06 elections. Only a coward would refuse to fight for something as important as our constitution unless he knew in advance he would win absolutely. Plus Dean, in such a hurry to get on with the "important issues", has avoided true deliberation in this matter. It would remove Cheney so there is no fear of him ever becoming president should something befall Bush. It would tie Bush/Cheney hands enough to prevent them attacking Iran(which they plan to do soon). The amount of corruption presently being hidden behind "executive privilege" could no longer be hidden and once out no one would want to be seen supporting Bush/Cheney or their Iraq policies. Impeachment would do more to end the Iraq occupation than anything attempted by the Democrats so far. There is no downside to impeachment for the Democratic Party...None. Most Democrats I know favor impeachment of Cheney. The votes to indict in the Senate would come after the corruption by Bush and Cheney are exposed in the House for all to see.

Dean thinks and acts like Pelosi...It's just too inconvenient. We should just wait till we get a Democrat elected president. Forget about standing up for the constitution or stopping the outrageous abuses of power. Forget about taking the chance that Bush might die in office, or worse yet be assassinated by terrorists and Cheney becomes president. Forget about the murder of thousands of innocent Iranians that will happen when Bush attacks Iran and you might have prevented it. Forget about it.

I did have a lot of respect for Howard Dean but after listening to his interview today I am sadly disappointed. He definitely is no longer mainstream. He's been too busy to pay attention. He needs to bring integrity back to the Democratic party. We use to be a party that stood for things, like principles and the constitution. I believe we still are that kind of party...at least I hope so.

and perceptive, a fighter, there's no doubt in my mind he's the best man for the job at the DNC!

What's really frustrating is the Democrats are just waiting patiently for 2008...But haven't done one fucking thing about electronic voting machines...no change they will easily hacked all over the country over 90% of precincts have some kind of Diebold & ES&s machines, we are not allowed to see how the software counts 9or doesn't count the votes...And these stupid fucking democrats because they won a few races in 2006 and have a slimmest of slim majority don't even believe it's real nor do they even care...of course it will too late to cry after 2008...If the republicans know they can pull it off even better than in 2004 the stupid idiot Dems will be scratching their heads when they could of been doing something right now and impeaching....

Just like the idiot Dems could of done something about Alito & Roberts before their majority by filibustering but the Dems so fucking frightened when the republicans said they would use the 'nuclear option" get rid of the filibuster and the Dems backed down and just waited for the elections in 2006...now look the republicans steps ahead of the Dems are using filibuster or threatening to constantly...The really dumb & pathetic Dems just keep waiting & and the republicans are five moves ahead of them...just like they are not even thinking about the republican owned voting machines....nor if necessary Bush's "executive order" on May 9th 2007 to be complete dictator if he sees anything he chooses as an emergency. Yes, it is quite maddening that the Dems have no foresight but to wait things out while the republicans will already be five or six moves ahead of them and we have to live with these clowns decisions.

When the Decider admitted to the nation that his administration outed a CIA agent. and thats just 1 of many crimes.

sitting and waiting for the next election...hoping and praying no manipulations by the republicans, who are always four or five steps ahead of them.

I want impeachment NOW!

One Party marking time.... tick, tick, tick.

:grr:

he says what he thinks, then you say what you think he thinks but don't know for sure. that's alot of thinking!

Msongs
www.msongs.com/political-shirts.htm

it makes me very sad. :-(

Dean is right.

It's right here.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/07/18/opinion/polls/main3071073.shtml?source=RSSattr=Politics_3071073

always donate to dnc because of him..please say it isn't so...

loud and clear.

So I guess you need to stop your donations.

:shrug:

I mean they were the first words out of his mouth.

So I don't see why all the faux outrage tonight.

Big diff. In my part of America, he's right.

:hi: :hug:

:hug:

Swamp Rat: One part of DU I'm glad never changes...

Nice try.

MKJ

Man I like that woman. I know she's gay and all but I just really like her...extremely.:evilgillegal codesmilie_remote(':evilgrin:')
illegal codesmilie_remote(':evilgrin:')rin:

More and more of the people who used to have it right now are just rolling over and kowtowing. I can't think of any other reason they'd do this when the public supports it except someone is threatening or blackmailing them with stuff found on the NSA wiretapping.

I have no problem with anything he said.

They want out of Iraq but do not want the funding cut.
There are only two ways out. 67 votes or cut the funding.
The GOO are not going to give us the votes and the
same people who want us out will not agree to anything
they perceive as harming the troops.

Dean recognizes reality.

People want the soldiers taken out safely. Gop has better\
communications and is more focused as a group on making their
points known. The people at this point favor a gradual
wothdrawal.

Dean recognizes reality.

If one follow TV so you know the information the American
people have, it gives a better understanding of why Dean
says the things he does.

He is still the best, IMO

Call for his firing, call for him to leave.

Then let the Republican wing of the party just take over.

Go ahead and demand perfection from everyone.

Do it.

We are fighting not just the WH, but the media is against us as well.

DU is out of control about perfection.

They are having hearings that will lead to impeachment.

Hell with perfection. I'm just stunned he said that about al qaeda taking over Iraq. That's totally a way out of the ballpark statement as in not even a feasible possibility.

... that is, until you consider that the REAL opinion which may not yet show up in any polls that Dean and the Democratic leadership pay attention to. Fellow Democrats, I mean this sincerely... These people do NOT appear to want to leave anytime soon. Are you not putting this together?

And for the very real... VERY real likelihood of this, the group that is going to make their points known are the American people to their legislators, across party lines. The American people are already at that point where we should begin that "gradual withdrawal" of troops. We see the writing on the wall.

I used to think Howard Dean was the best. Now, I just don't know WHAT the fuck to think, but I don't think the same of him, or Nancy Pelosi, or Harry Reid, or John Conyers any more.

I just do not know why they seem to be playing the denial card. They certainly aren't stupid, and neither are we.

...is that they know that if they cut the funding, Bush will fuck the troops like they ain't never been fucked before, and the Dems will take the blame.

Dean ain't going out like that.

after all this same hand was played in '88 and we both know Dukakis was sworn in, right?

Ford is very like Lieberman, chair of the DLC. Simon Rosenberg is head of the New Democrat Network, and he thinks the war was a good idea.

to over ride Bush's veto of everything.

Wow, what a perfect place DU has become. Perfection demanded.

it appears to me. Nothing else makes any sense whatsoever.

Do you guys realize what you are doing?

I voted, didn't I?

Let's do it...come on.

Then see what is left.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1401

I've always liked Dean and that's why I'm so surprised at his comments. Besides we form the parade we put these guys in front of. They are "our" people and they can only guess at what we are thinking if we don't tell them.

It's not republican dogs we are talking about here it is our chosen Democrats and we want them to know who and what we want them to represent.

I don't know why the Senate debate is looked at...by Dems...as we can't get enough votes to begin withdrawing our troops from Iraq,...when it should look like:...the republicans can't get enough votes to continue funding the occupation in Iraq.

Democrats can't even get any plans to withdraw from the pentagon because the pentagon "has not even considered it".

Why so you think they are doing all that? Could it be leading up to more serious stuff?

I trust them as they have worked their butts off this week.

Not one Dem is acceptable any more.

DU is being used to fight against Democrats. Do some searches and see what I mean.

The Democratic party is all about representing the people. We are the party. We tell our "elected" officials how we feel so they can better represent us. They listen too rather than just tell us how we should feel and then cover their ears. They need "our" criticisms and inputs, not the republicans.
A republican can lie, mislead, twist the facts etc. and all the other republicans will cover for him and support him anyway.
Democrats are not like that. If a Democrat misleads, lies, or twists the facts, knowingly or not, other Democrats will not cover for him or support the mis-information but will point it out and ask them to correct it. That's the main difference in the two parties today. Democrats still have integrity.
Democrats invite discussion, and if they are wrong they want to know about it and why. They don't scream louder and close their ears to dissent.

So, madfloridian***get a grip. This is where Democrats come together and if you see a lot of outrage toward some democrat's actions stances and words, it's there to get them to see how the people they represent feel and think toward their actions, stances and words. If they start talking like Bush we tell them. If they aren't doing what we elected them to do we demand answers and action. And guess what...your opinion counts too.
Republicans "tell" you what to think and expect support no matter what they are doing. Which party do you see imploding right now. So I think Democrats have it right and this site is dedicated to expressing Democratic values which include setting some Democrats straight or at least asking them to explain their positions.

Any Democrat is acceptable over any republican because they will listen to their constituents, to dissent and to criticism from another democrat because when they don't we the people don't just support them as in "My country right or wrong" no matter what they do... we call them on it to change or explain themselves.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1426319&mesg_id=1427570

The OP appears to have issues with Maddow. Read the OP again and see if this is flamebait.

Pull your head out of your ass

:popcorn:

:applause:

and realize the dangers of left-deviationism, which he speaks against here, are just as real as the dangers of right-opportunism that he has often warned us against.

None of our Democrats will go with extremism. I think they are building toward impeachment without actually saying the word.

But they will not go along with extremists on either side.

This may surprise you but the recent pew polls and many others show that the majority of the country(and I'm talking by some polls 68-72%) are progressive liberals. Right on down the issue line...abortion rights, stem cell research, health care, taxation, defense spending, Iraq, the military, etc. LIBERAL PROGRESSIVES. One poll stated that congress seems to run about a year and a half behind the people.

The corporate media tries to convince Americans that the majority in America are conservatives...WRONG.

Nothing in this post suggests extremism. Of course the Democratic Congress has asked for a timed withdrawal based on the assessments of the Generals in the field. They are just calling for one to begin...where you found anything extremist in the remarks in this post is just beyond me.

He's evidently been spending too much time there.

Don't you just feel like shaking them and telling them to WAKE THE FUCK UP!!!???

:kick: