Tweety, Libby, Fineman and Cheney - a serious question

Fineman said something like "... and Isikoff can correct me if I'm wrong... we now know that Cheney had the absolute authority to declassify Plame's identity..." (paraphrasing from memory)

NOBODY commented on this! Do we know this??? DO WE?? I keep asking and asking and asking, and I'm still not convinced that we have the answer.

Somebody, anybody, please provide the definitive answer so I can move on to other aspects of this circus.

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(not that I don't trust you and fully believe you -- I just want to see where this has been documented/proven ... and thanks in advance)

Bush did this way early on. It was one of the first things to come out by the Bushies in trying to defend Cheney's reprehensible, unAmerican, traitorous actions.

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I can't find my trigger finger

I'm asking here for a reason, and I'm asking today because what we know today is more than what we knew yesterday.

Also, I am specifically referring to the VP's ability to declassify the covert status of a CIA agent -- not the NIE report info.

as I've bothered to look into.

I didn't bother to read it all, but it makes me wonder if the constitutionalty of executive orders has ever been brought into question, as that's what appears to be at the crux of the issue

and the bottom line that I keep coming to (as I just posted below) is (quoted from one of those links):

"And that would not give them the legal authority to break any laws regarding covert identities."

Don't know who would be the ultimate authority. Probably Torture Boy Gonzalez or Judge Alito :shrug:

kidding :hi:

H2O Man would know...he lives and breath the Plame case.

While I did not hear what is mentioned in the OP, and have no opinion on if it is accurate or not, there has been a significant amount of discussion on if the VP has the authority to declassify other things -- in the Plame scandal, no serious person thinks Cheney could "declassify" Plame's identity, though there is discussion on if he could have declassified the NIE on his own.

People can read the March 10, 2006 memorandum from Harold Relyea, Specialist in American National Government at the Congressional Research Service, to the House Committee on Government Reform. He addresses the questions surrounding the 3-25-03 E.O. 13292, which amended E.O. 12958. It gave the VP "limited declassification authority .... the Vice President is not otherwise authorized to disclose or to direct or to approve the disclosure of security classified information to persons not authorized to receive it."

In other words, Cheney could not authorize the disclosure of parts of the NIE to journalists "on a selective basis." The proof, of course, is in the pudding: anyone reading the Libby grand jury transcripts can see that Cheney had Bush declassify the NIE. Cheney has not claimed he has that authority on his own.

My instant reaction was no you can't. It is an absolute nono to out an agent. What he supposedly had was *'s sayso to declassify parts of the NIE, which did not have Plame's name in it. But nobody on the panel corrected Howard.

I think the answer is still the same, but I wonder if the handwritten memo with "..this Pres" scratched out could be construed as cover for Cheney if it comes down to that?

If Fineman said that Cheney could desclassify a CIA agent - I believe he is wrong.

And, if that is what Cheney did - then it proves that Plame was covert, because they had to desclassify her status. If that were true, I would think there would be much more focus in the investigation about whether Cheney/Bush had the right to insta-declassified anything. If there is a broader investigation - then maybe this is a later piece of the puzzle.

I so wish this trial was televised - the issues are important, and frankly it would be amazing to see Fitzgerald in action.

I keep thinking that a juror will not be able to resolve this issue in favor of Libby:

If Plame was not covert, and her status something that any WH person could easily talk about - wasn't that a potent weapon in the attempted smear against Wilson? Aren't these guys masters at diverting from the substance of an issue to the who, what, when, why stuff? Wouldn't it have been good to bound the media with the fact that the whole investigation by Wilson is suspect because of nepotism - his wife sent him - so we can't even discuss the substance of the report? Why not do that full force - have the press secretaries, the staffers everyone out there. Isn't that their modus operandi?

The fact that this didn't happen suggests strongly that the WH knew they couldn't talk about Plame openly - and that only certain people handled communications to only certain friendly reporters (tools) suggests they knew they were in dangerous territory.

Gonzo will say Ex. Order takes presidence, Congress says NO, SCOTUS to decide!!!!

:shrug:

Usually it's the prez but, this vp can declassify info. However, no one can out an agent of the cia.

and yet, I keep hearing people dismiss the Plame outing by Cheney because he "had the authority" to do so.

Here's the bottom line quote from one of those sites referenced above, that was discussing it:

"And that would not give them the legal authority to break any laws regarding covert identities."

I still think that's the case, and am surprised (no, SHOCKED) when someone like Fineman can get on Hardball and make the comment he did about Cheney having the legal authority to reveal Plame's identity, and have it go unchallenged.

the document related to WMD's - they made a big deal of it at the time. They repeated it ad nasueum to make it look like they were all in the clear. I never did find out what was important in saying this. It certainly wasn't about having power to expose Plame and Brewster-Jennings. It was obfuscation-ops.

Think about it - why would we be in court if he had absolute power.

I believe Fineman knows this precisely so it must be thier new tactic. Obfuscation crap spread. They definitely know what they are doing. It is their loyalists to twist.

Please, someone alert me if Victoria Towensing or Joe DeGenova come out say what Fineman said.

I detest Fineman.

Remember, Wednesday is their dump day = they all get together to learn what the truth twister of the week and week-end will be.

Watch for more to say it.

I detest Finemen. He is their perfect boot licker.

"the Department's investigation into the alleged unauthorized disclosure of a CIA employee's identity,into investigation into the alleged unauthorized disclosure of a CIA employee's identity,"

Link to the original Comey letter appointing Fitzgerald, AFTER the FBI had begun the investigation under Ashcroft:

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/iln/osc/documents/ag_letter_december_30_2003.pdf

When Fitzgerald's authority needed to be clarified, Comey sent another letter spelling out:

"all the authority of the Attorney General with respect to the Department's investigation into the alleged unauthorized disclosure of a CIA employee's identity" is plenary and includes the authority to investigate and prosecute violations of any federal criminal laws related to the underlying alleged unauthorized disclosure, as well as federal crimes committed in the course of, and with intent to interfere with, your investigation, such as perjury, obstruction of justice, destruction of evidence, and intimidation of witnesses; to conduct appeals arising out of the matter being investigated and/or prosecuted; and to pursue administrative remedies and civil sanctions (such as civil contempt) that are within the Attorney General's authority to impose or pursue. Further, my conferral on you of the title of "Special Counsel" in this matter should not be misunderstood to suggest that your position and authorities are defined and limited by 28 CFR Part 600.

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/iln/osc/documents/ag_letter_feburary_06_2004.pdf

If Cheney, even assuming he has that kind of authority, had declassified Plame's identity, that would have been discovered at the outset and any further investigation would not have occurred.

The only question of declassification is surrounding the NIE which has been more than touched upon during the Libby trial. The question of any declassification of Valerie Plame's identity has NOT been raised at all.

Fineman is less than thorough in has reporting, I am not sure whether it is deliberate or merely lazy, both are possible, imo.

In the past few years it has become more and more apparent that these people have installed loopholes through our entire system that more or less guarantee them absolute authority. The senate or the house can't seem to stop them. They ignore the courts. The opinion of the american people doesn't matter, nor of our allies, nor the entire world. What is to stop them in 2008 if they decide that they don't want to relinquish this power?

Bush is the Decider

:mad: