Conversation with my boss: the rich don't get it.

I am middle-senior management in a small company. I actually earn a pretty good salary. Our company health insurance is near the bottom of the barrel, but the company pays 100%. My boss is a narcissistic hypochondriac who happens to like me. And she is not a mean-spirited person--just insensitive. And frightfully rich with inherited wealth and the sweat off my and my colleagues' backs. Not that I'm complaining. I have a reasonably secure job in a liberal company.

So she comes into my office "complaining" that she is terrified of her bi-annual visit to the periodontist. (I have some medical background, so I'm the office "doctor" among other things). On and on about the periodontist, and antibiotics and her various ailments (she's 70). I offer sympathetic noises on cue.

"How often do you go to the periodontist?" she asks me suddenly.
"E---, I've never been to the periodontist," I answer, "I haven't been to the dentist in two years."
"What?!" (chicken-like noises begin to emanate from her). "You have to go to the dentist!"
"E---, I can't afford to go to the dentist."
"What do you mean you can't afford it! You have to go, that's all."

How do you explain that even on a good salary, sometimes you have to choose between a car repair and the dentist? That SO's needed 2 new hearing aids this year, and neither of these are covered by the insurance, even though they are necessary for him to remain employed in his teaching job? That the insurance doesn't cover daughter's therapy at $150 a pop? That insurance doesn't cover my medication? That we had to have the roof fixed after the noreaster in April? That the driveway is caving in?

Answer: you don't. You lost her at "I can't afford the dentist."

And I'm one of the lucky ones! I have a house! I have insurance! I'm not homeless. I can pinch the pennies so my kid can have therapy.

Now, unfortunately, she's going to hound me about the dentist until I lie to her and say I went. I'll even invent some minor, easily solved problem so she will feel vindicated.

They don't get it. Some are genuinely greedy and monstrous...but most just don't get it. It's like living with Marie Antoinette.

especially the ones who inherited it are clueless about living paycheck to paycheck

You say you make a good salary, so is every penny of that tied up in other expenses?

I have never heard of a dental plan that doesn't cover a routine cleaning every six months.

Good luck.

And that's after the $1000 deductible.

Most people have the option of taking what's offered-no matter how bad, or nothing.

We have cheap health insurance, and I consider myself lucky that my employer pays for it.

If you have ever purchased hearing aids, you will know that they run over $1000 apiece. SO needs 2, not covered by insurance. I don't have that kind of cash lying around, do you? Same with car repairs. I rarely get away with under $500, even for a routine service or tires.

We are struggling with higher gas prices, food prices, rising school/property taxes while trying not to rack up credit card bills...just like plenty of other folks.

What's a dental plan, anyway? The only ones I know of are "discount" schemes: you pay a certain amount every month and this entitles you to discounted dental services. Well, 2/3 of $1500 is still $1000 that I don't have.

As I said before, I am not complaining. From now on I will keep my (soon to be toothless) mouth shut ;-)

Mine cost $2000 apiece.

I am an adjunct lecturer at a large state university, and the hearing aids I have now can't keep up with my progressive hearing loss--besides already being 3 years past their normal lifespan. I only managed to get them in 1994 because my 5 siblings and I each got a small settlement from my father's insurance when he died. My entire share went to pay for the hearing aids--and I had needed them desperately for at least 8 years before I managed to get them!

A hearing test 3 weeks ago showed so much deterioration in my hearing that my current aids cannot be boosted to deal with the extra loss.

I called Vocational Rehabilitative Services, hoping they might help. The man I talked to said that although that is supposedly part of what they do, they can't help me now because they have such a long waiting list and no funds left.

I spoke to the audiologist who did my hearing test. She sid they could work out a monthly payment arrangement, but that I would have to come up with a 50% (i.e., $2000) downpayment first.

I function in class, but not comfortably (and less so each semester), and I have to use awkward workarounds. I pick out students with voices I can understand better than others, and they become my translators.

I race around the room to get closer to students as they speak (I am 57 years old!). It is harder now, since I ruptured my disc in my lower back in February (and another is bulging and also pressing on the nerve root), so I must use a cane and hobble around slowly and painfully. I can't understand a word anyone says in departmental meetings, which greatly limits my ability to participate. (Professors are the worst mumblers in the world!)

I actually have fairly good insurance through the university (though it is nowhere near as good as it was even 4 years ago--each year my monthly payments go up, copays go up, and deductibles go up). But even "good" insurance won't cover hearing aids, and with Baby Boomers aging the way we are--and with younger kids having done even worse damage to their ears with iPods and loud concerts and dance clubs--there is going to be a huge growth in the number of people who desperately need hearing aids to function normally.

My hearing loss is hereditary--not caused by loud music. But others in my age group did blast their ears out with loud music, and we didn't even have iPods. Already I am seeing college kids with obvious hearing loss!

my dental plan from the above is about $180.00 a year. It saved me $3,000 on braces, and the basic checkup was fully covered, as are once a year cleanings. Dental plans aren't as costly as medical insurance by a long, long shot. Believe me, needing a root canal and NOT having any dental insurance can be an extremely painful experience.

Not a dman thing. I had to pay into the system for a year befoore I could get coverage for a cleaning, and they then wouldn't cover that! I also had an extraction, and they wouldn't cover any of it either!

I buy my own insurance. I am self employed and my plan does not provide me a routine checkup. I pay $140.00 per month to Delta dental.

Sheesh! Look at the employment pages of your local paper; there must be hundreds of jobs for you. Take another job and make enough money to go to the dentist.

Or simply go back to college and get an MBA. That'll help you find a good job with benefits.

:sarcasm:

But you're right. Instead of that silly volunteer work I do for the Democratic party, I should use my free time more productively. ;-)

I ran into that kind of incomprehension all the time when I was a grad student (attending on full fellowship, not paying my own way) at an Ivy League school.

Even afterwards, I've encountered formerly wealthy people (those who have lost their fortunes for whatever reason) who have a terrible time understanding that their money is now finite and that there is a difference between wants and needs.

aids which are necessary for him to remain employed. When I was told that they would cost upwards from $1,100 (each), I almost had a hissy fit. I asked if there was any aid available, since there is no way he could pay that much for aids and I'm in debt up to my eyeballs due to my husband's triple bypass last year. The lady at the hearing aid clinic told me told me that Florida's Vocational Rehabilitation would help.

VR will pay for both hearing aids once we go through the process, which takes about 90 days.

It's worth a try for you to check it out.

How do you explain that even on a good salary, sometimes you have to choose between a car repair and the dentist? That SO's needed 2 new hearing aids this year, and neither of these are covered by the insurance, even though they are necessary for him to remain employed in his teaching job? That the insurance doesn't cover daughter's therapy at $150 a pop? That insurance doesn't cover my medication? That we had to have the roof fixed after the noreaster in April? That the driveway is caving in?

I used to work for a Voc Rehab office, and they definitely pay for things like hearing aids that are critical to employment. I know the income guidelines tend to be much more lenient for Voc Rehab services than for other types of "social help".

The next time he comes up for "renewal." Thanks!

but they are out of funds and have a long waiting list. Helping people like me is what they are there for, as the rep I spoke to said, but they can't help us, becuase they don't have the funds. Some states are worse than others, but I have been told that I can't get any help at all.

hearing aids, and if not, are a great resouce for finding aid in acquiring them.

Try talking to your Commission for the Deaf and Hard of Hearing:

KANSAS
Kansas Commission for the Deaf and Hard of Hearing
Exec. Director: Wayne C. Mnich
(913) 296-2874 V/TTY
(800) 432-0698 V/TTY in KS

This link is for financial help for hearing aids:
http://www.atk.ku.edu/hearingaidfunding.htm

A web site with some resouces:
http://www.shhh.org/support/financial.asp

Another financial aid resouce page:
http://www.betterhearing.org/resources/resource.cfm?resourceID=17

Try calling the Kansas State School for the Deaf, they may be able to point you in the right direction.

Ask your public library to help you find resouces.

In the meantime, although they are crude, if your problem is severe enough, you may want to invest $15 in one of those hearing devices that are sold in Walmarts and other such stores on occasion, which magnify sounds. They look like old transistor radios with the ear piece. The work quite well for the price, but are somewhat awkward.

Learn sign language.

he claims never to have taken a single sick day until he was 61 years old. He once told me that he doesn't "believe" in sick days.

He goes on several long vacations every year. He spends money extravagantly. He has no idea what his employees have to go through to make ends meet, or what I deal with as a person with a disability.:(

When she was your age, employers provided insurance that covered your medical expenses with little or no "out-of-pocket". She most likely is not aware of how pitiful your insurance is because her bills are covered by a trust fund or paid by an accountant.

The reality is, Americans got very greedy. Corporations and employers in the past 40 years have trimmed wages and benefits to show healthy bottom lines to investors or to pad their own pockets leaving the hired help to suffer. Most of all those manufacturing, labor union jobs are gone overseas or to Mexico. They are the ones that provided for our healthcare, dentistry, and eye care. Nowadays, if you do have insurance, there is a healthy co-pay or a huge deductible to meet....and that is IF you are lucky enough to have insurance!

Now for the bad news.......it aint getting better, it's getting worse!

Fortunately, I had good insurance (steelworker union) during my growing years (20-40). Both my kids births were covered 100%.
I had all my teeth capped with porcelain-to-gold back in the 80s and have not had a problem since! My wife worked as a dental assistant, and her boss did the work for what the insurance paid. Man, did that work out well!

With todays shrinking wages and benefits, I can see why it is so hard to make it these days. I am retired now and have a very comfortable and secure income. I was lucky to have been born when employers valued employees and the health of their family.
I spend a lot of time helping those not as fortunate as I these days. It may be just a few people's lives I affect, but at least they know someone cares.

I beseech all here who can afford it to reach out and touch someone less fortunate than yourselves. Help them pay a medical or dental bill, send them a gift card for groceries or clothing or school supplies. You will make a friend for life, and when it is all said and done, when we finally take that dirt nap, that IS all that matters. You DID make a difference, and there will be someone who smiles at your funeral and says, "The world will miss this one!"

One of the reasons we never have two nickels to rub together at home (or $ for the dentist) is that we look around...and see so many less fortunate. A dear friend (partially disabled) lost her car--her means of livelihood--in an accident. We stepped in and purchased a secondhand clunker for her so she could at least get to work.

We bought a tank of oil for an elderly neighbor last winter when we found out she kept her house like a meat locker. I gave grocery cards to a co-worker when her husband lost his job.

We try to help our neighbors as much as we can. There but for the grace of...whoever. It could be us. And all I have to complain about is rotting teeth.

--cleaning, checkup, and X-ray's as needed, for a very modest fee. (The college has a dental hygienist program.) I've been using them for my checkups for years.

Maybe something like that is in your area.

There's also a program in my area called New Horizons, IIRC, that does dental work and medical work on a sliding scale basis.

She married her money and I guess she can't remember what it was like to work and pay bills. My husband and I both have good jobs and good health care so we're very lucky. But, like everyone else..we struggle. Two kids in college really takes a chunk out of the budget. But sis thinks we must not manage our money well because we can't afford the vacations she takes.

When people post of desperation in trying to pay off credit cards at usurious rates, some DU'ers chime in about how they've paid off all their credit cards and their mortgage.

Unless you work with people regularly who are trying to make ends meet while paying high medical, education, and various other bills, its hard to understand.

Face it, we've been dealing with inflationary pressure and flat wages for the last few years and its eating up more and more disposable income. Its putting pressure on everyone.

That thread pissed me off to no end. In no way was the OP an invitation for anyone to chime in about how good they were at managing their money, but that didn't keep the SMUG patrol from stepping in.

And interestingly, the same posters who are conservative on other issues seemed to be the quickest to boast about how well-off they are.

the Dem party is a big tent, but sometimes Dems need to be reminded when their values reflect those of the GOP. If they don't understand how people can get in a bind financially, they need to spend some time doing volunteer work or actually getting out and talking to people.

I routinely post about how I won't give the credit card sharks my money. I rarely remember to mention that I've only been able to do that for about 10 years. My husband and I were in a terrible hole when he lost his job, and we didn't come out of it until he started getting Social Security. During the bad times, we defaulted on a lot of credit card debt. Luckily, we were never forced into bankruptcy.

What may sound like smugness in my posts is actually fury at how credit companies steal people blind. But, I'd never, in my lifetime, tell anyone "if you just managed your money well, you'd be fine."

I'm just saying, some of the smug police may be like me, and it's anger you're hearing, not self-congratulation.

I am 34 now,if they were alive they would be 74 and 75, respectively. I don't say that I am relitively debt-free out of smugness..I am lucky, and I was raised to believe that if you didn't have the cash for something; you didn't need it. Of course, as someone else in the thread pointed out, they both worked during a time when the companies paid health benefits almost in full. And they mangaged their money VERY, VERY well..left me with two houses paid off.
I'm trying to keep myself out of the cc thing,but I can certainly understand the need for it in today's family. Again, I am just lucky..kinda.
We do go without a lot of things we could use, sometimes....including dental.

and I've spent most of my life dressing out of thrift shops because of it. What electronics I have were bought on sale, at auction, or as refurbished items. Shoot, even some of them were bought at thrift shops. The largest TV I've ever had is the one I have now, a 20 incher.

I think it comes down to a basic question of reality versus expectations.

My parents were Depression kids who weren't afraid of talking about what their own parents did to get through it. I ended up needing to live solely on my savings for three years. I'm glad I had them to live on.

It's amazing that you were able to live on your savings. In my experience, people who lived through the Depression will be of 2 types: one type can stretch the until the eagle screams, and the other (my father was one of these) can't spend it fast enough because who knows what's going to happen.

There are rough patches... :)

that I pinched pennies so hard she could hear Lincoln complaining. She and her hubby are spenders. I knew my carcass wouldn't last until official retirement.

My dh has one, and it makes paying medical bills much less painful. It's a payroll deduction of pre-tax $$. You need to estimate how much you will spend on medical bills for the next year, and then the pro-rated amount is deducted from each check. You pay the bills, then send in the receipts, and get your money back.

Also, does your spouse carry any coverage through his teaching job? If it is available to him, that would probably ease some of this burden.

But it still doesn't cover hearing aids. Go figure.

We are VERY fortunate to have paid very little out-of-pocket for the gaggle of specialists he's had to see for his relatively rare condition (severe bilateral Meniere's Disease).

Ask your boss to establish a Sec. 125 Flexible Spending Plan. Point out to her that the company will save on Soc Sec and Medicare taxes. Employees will save on those plus income taxes. Nice employee benefit and not expensive to implement.

Elect to contribute what the hearing aids will cost - say $2000. Get the hearing aids early in the year and submit for reimbursement . They have to give you the $2000 right away even if you have not contributed all of it (or any of it) yet. You will have interest free financing of the hearing aids - at less than $40 a week.

You can also finance your dental care that way if you know what you are going to spend in a year. That is the only caution with these plans - it is use it or lose it, so you have to plan carefully.


Good on you for helping your neighbors !

You can get an FSA debit card so you don't even have to put out the cash up front. Just paid for a root canal & crown that way.

reimbursement before you make the contribution - see my other post.

As long as you have incurred the expense, they have to reimburse you. You don't have to have proof of payment of the bill either - just that the medical service was incurred.

I can identify completely with your story. This past weekend, I was visiting at my brother's house. He is an attorney, with a large home, lots of vehicles, no money problems whatsoever. He can't understand why I never got the proper dental work in years past. It doesn't compute with him that we never had dental insurance, and when the 3 kids needed dental work, we found the money for that, but there was never money left over for our own (parents) dental work. So, the kids got the dental/orthodontist work, but we couldn't afford our own.

It didn't compute with me when he told me about going on a vacation with his wife, and at one place they stayed, they had a private chef for dinner 3 nights. I just looked at him blankly. Didn't compute. I am so lucky that I can take modest trips, but they are of the "budget" variety, no private anything. It didn't compute when he told me that he and his son, my nephew, are going to another state to play golf at a resort and have a villa rented for their stay. Just a blank look from me. He doesn't understand my statement, "that just doesn't compute with me."

And yet, he is a very good person....will do anything for anyone. After working long hours, he will go and build ramps at homes for people who are confined to wheel-chairs or cannot manage steps. He has "adopted" many, many children from 3rd world countries, donates to other worthy charities. He is a Republic.

I am so lucky to own a little, bitty house and a dependable, middle-class car and am able to take budget vacations. But, the rich and their values just don't compute with me....
not even in my wildest imaginings. And, I don't compute with them. Oh well.

on my trips to Mexico, my local Mexican friends down there think I am rich. And, to them, I guess I am. I have tried to explain to them that at home, I am not rich by any means. Maybe "rich" is relative?

We are not living in the street. I have a beautiful daughter and a loving SO. We are both healthy enough to hold jobs and maintain our home. We have enough to help others when we can. OK, so I have rotten teeth. So what?

My boss has bags of money...and bags of neurosis to go along with it. I wish I had her budget for Xanax! Then I could afford the dentist!

When I went to Mexico last winter for dental work, they thought I was rich. I kept trying to explain that I really wasn't. I have to go back this winter for more and am trying to save for it. I could not even begin to afford the dental work I need in the US. Which is the reason that I am now going to Mexico regularly to make up for the years of neglect.

where Katharin Hepburn's response to a sister actress having fainted from not eating, "Kay, not eating! How very silly of her!", not knowing that Kay could not afford even one meager meal at the theatrical boarding house. (At least in the movie, Hepburn changes her attitude as she appreciates that others' lives are much different from her privileged background.)

1. She's 70 and chooses not to retire? Good for her.

2. She seems a little obsessive. Maybe feels too much pressure to defy age and keep her teeth.

3. That said, this is the good old USA and for anyone over 16, good teeth are a good, lifelong, business investment. That's something wealthy people with good social standing in the US do understand.

Good teeth are a lifelong investment if you can afford it. As health care costs rise and medical benefits become scarce, its harder to make those "investments". I think the poster is trying to point out that we seem to have reached a "tipping point" in health care.

I don't have dental insurance and pay 1/2 of my regular health insurance. After nearly 20 years without a visit to the dentist, by the grace of who-knows-what-god, was fortunate enough to be found with one cavity. If that can be attributed to anything, it was the braces - and lack of a sweet tooth. Flossing? Maybe once a year. Corn season.

Since then I've been so grateful, the $80 for basic teeth-cleaning doesn't seem like too much to cough up.

I was hoping we could find some understanding and compassion for fellow DU'ers instead of lectures about how they're not living they're lives the "right" way.

You are fortunate to have been born with good teeth. Not all are as lucky.

or sugar. You happen to be blessed with VERY GOOD TEETH. I bet your blood family has good teeth also.

Me? I brush and floss and am at the moment paying $300/month for the bridge and fillings I had done last January. I'm waiting until that bill is paid before I go back and get the $7,000 (approximately) bridge on the bottom that I need.

Or I may just find out where that dentist in Mexico is.

Eldest sister has a bridge. Not sure on my dad's side. Does tartar have any protective qualities? They needed a blaster to get it all.

That's one hell of a bill, you have my sympathies.

cavities. I know their teeth rot out and it is good to have their teeth cleaned but every time I have looked at the pictures of dog teeth in the vet's office it just looks like they are covered with grit and their gums get disease.

I've had my dog's teeth cleaned and the vet has pulled teeth but I never heard "You're dog has cavities"

:shrug:

is how I always describe the old money I've met.

They really have no point of reference on how the rest of us live. They've simply never been without the cushion of a trust fund, investment income, or even just a name that allows them to leverage debt until their inheritances come in. They are utterly unable to conceive of people living in extreme danger of losing everything over dental problems or illness.

You can't educate them, either. They want their surroundings as pleasant as possible and really don't care much about yours. It's not callousness, exactly, just the odd idea that if they are in pleasant surroundings, everybody else is, too.

(I posted this a while back)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=115x95512

I think about the concept of peak oil and how I am preparing for it; What skills am I brushing up on that will help me down the road? Am I building a good network of friends, neighbors and contacts? How is my garden doing and is there any way I could expand it?

All sorts of practical things, like most people.

But there is a whole section of society that will die miserable horrible deaths because of peak oil. I'm convinced of it. It won't be the poor, because the poor have learned how to do with out for so long that their survival instincts are pretty well honed for such a thing. The middle class, will fair okay, but will have to pick up the slack pretty quickly to keep from starving to death.

The modern rich however, have no skills, do nothing for themselves and pray upon society because they believe their social standing is all that is required to get what they want. Peak oil will change that.

This following story proves my point but also made my head explode. And I'm sure yours will too.

A buddy of mine works at an architecture company and is currently doing the MEP (mech, elect, plumb) on a massive house here in texas. When I say massive, I will let you know in a moment, but first let me give you the background on this guy.

He's insanely wealthy. No not rich, not well off, not money bags, but wealthy as in 8 figures a year wealthy.

So anyway, he's moving from his 5,000 square foot house to another house. (I will get into the size in a moment).

He is currently paying $1800 bucks a month in electricity. Yes, you heard me right. Well, he was curious as to why it was so high when his friend who has a similar house only pays $350 a month.

So in walks the energy auditor. He interviews the maid. He inquires as to how many times a week she does a load of laundry. She says, "daily, I do 4 to 5 loads with the dryer of course". What? why so many he asked. She states, "because Mr. so and so, doesn't like to have any dirty laundry laying around the house". Okaaaaaaaaay. then he goes into the kitchen and asks the same maid how many times a week does she use the dishwasher, she replies, "a week? we do 5-6 load daily". Arg. because mr. wealthy doesn't like to have dirty dishes around. (clean freak?)

Next he notices that all the lights in the house were incandescents. The bedroom alone uses 1500 Watts! The owner states that he doesn't like the color of the light that the CFL's give off. Sigh.

then to top it all off, he must keep the A/C at 60 degrees otherwise he can't sleep. 61 is okay 62 maybe, but nothing higher. Oy!!

Okay thinks the auditor, that's a lot of power but it still doesn't add up to 1800 bucks.

He looks around and sees a normal plasma screen tv and makes a comment about it to the maid. Oh she says, you didn't see this. Where upon she opens up the wall behind the tv and reveals a floor to ceiling audio component system. (all on) then she takes him out to the backyard. located there is a 12 x 12 "shed" which houses a full AV system with an on demand library of 800 movies. All the equipment is up and running. Plus a huge A/C window unit that runs 24/7.

Ahhhhhh!!!

it was no wonder this guy is paying as much as he is. And it's only he and his wife that live in the house.

But wait, it gets worse

He is now moving into, hold onto your seats, a 20,000 square foot house. this house has 2 chiller units and 20 hvac units. He hasn't moved into yet, but the month electric bill just from the workers doing the building there is already 2500 a month!!! it's estimated that his monthly electric bills will be in the area of 8 grand!!

Now get this, to make matters worse, he has...this one blinds me...single paned windows. Why you ask? because he had them specially constructed for the house for some stupid ass aesthetic reason. Logic would dictate that one could get the same windows in double pane. no duh, but this fool stood firm on having the single pane.

So the energy auditor informs the contractor that with single panes the sun will cook anyone standing next to them during the day, that they will cause mold and mildew, that they will also cause his monthly electric bill to sky rocket. The contractor informed the auditor that the owner was fully aware of that.

this wealthy guy is why we are in such an energy mess. he is the poster child of waste. he alone probably uses enough electricity to power several homes.

It's stories like these that make me yearn for peak oil to happen sooner.

That story is truly obscene. No, my boss isn't like that. She actually thinks she's "green" because she throws her water bottle into the recycling bin, takes the stairs instead of the elevator, and tells the maid to be sure to ask for paper bags at Whole Foods.

My boss is clueless. The guy in your story is obscene.

variance to build an obscenely huge house in a place where it wasn't allowed for environmental reasons.

His only defense was, "I've got more money than I can spend."

That statement prompted a slew of letters to the Oregonian suggesting charities that he could contribute to.

They believe in an invalid Say's law that supply creates its own demand (not likely !).

When you get them to grasp Keynes's MPC and that demand-side is what grows an economy, not supply-side (where a global economy wastes the money or 'hides it under a mattress' so to speak in bad investments and hidden accounts -- think Enron-style and you get the drift) low velocity money-- they have a Damascus Road epiphany.

They're mostly not bad people, just very misguided. Pray for them.

He hands nephew $50 and tells him to go pick up his dry cleaning. Nephew is thinking "I have enough gas in the tank to get to work til pay day,not a drop more".

health care or lack there of, yet we hardly consider dental health which is so important to overall good health. IMO, having good dental health care could go a long way to prevent many other serious aliments. Not only should we be working for affordable health care for everyone but also affordable dental care.

The rich really don't get it.. at all.

And some of them are very nice and friendly people to know personally.
Yet it's quite bothersome the way they kind of associate with each other
and don't really know the rest of the world.

Sue

problem for her.

"We give you free health insurance. What more do you want?"

They offered one of those discount dental "plans" earlier this year, but I declined because it was $80/month and offered very little in savings at the dentist--and very few participating dentists.

People who are detached from the living-paycheck-to-paycheck level don't understand how there is never enough for extras, and things like routine dental care go into the extra bin unless someone breaks a tooth or is otherwise in pain. Eye exams are in the same category -- if you don't need to pass a vision test at DMV there's no sense spending money on routine exams every year or two. Those old glasses are just fine. When you're having trouble seeing then it's worth spending the money.

Most dental insurance plans do pay for routine cleaning (although I've always had premium co-pays that added up to the cost of two cleanings a year so the insurance didn't do me much good because I have good teeth and gums) and many pay only 50% on the expensive procedures like crowns and root canals --even if the company offered dental insurance you may not be able to afford to have dental work done.

I understand lying to get her off your back but why lie about having a problem solved just to vindicate her? That justs adds to her cluelessness because she then may think that you were avoiding it for some reason other than finances, such as you are afraid of dentistry. Just my two cents.

was like that. Since she was in charge of the company's insurance, and was one of the few people who got it paid for by the company, AND had a million things wrong with her, she naturally picked the best and most expensive insurance available. Then she kept hounding me (who would have to pay for the insurance out of pocket) about how wonderful the insurance was and how I really should sign up for it because it had "all the bells and whistles!" She acted like I was being really cavalier about living without insurance and that I'd be really sorry I didn't take her advice if I got sick.

Finally one day I had enough. She was going on and on about the insurance again and I said "Monica, since you are the accountant I assume you know how much I make. I would like to ask you how you would ever think I could afford $600 a month for insurance on that salary? I can pretty much afford my rent, my bus pass, my utilities and some groceries on what I make. And yes, I *know* the insurance is great insurance and has all the bells and whistles. But if I can't afford it, then it doesn't matter much does it?"

She was so freaking clueless.

situation....the "under insured".

A survey of the health care experiences of 2,905 nationally representative respondents was conducted in May, 2007. We focused on respondents’ experiences of the past 12 months. The population sampled was U.S. residents between the ages of 18 to 64 who were covered by neither Medicare nor Medicaid.

Our findings indicate that there are three tiers of health care consumers in the United States: the adequately-insured, who account for 59% of all Americans in the population sampled; the underinsured, who represent 24% of all Americans sampled; and the uninsured, who comprise 16% of our sample.

From a list of possible complaints about their health plans, respondents were asked to indicate which characterized their plans. Our initial factor analysis identified 6 specific, highly-correlated items that collectively defined our scope of coverage dimension. An additive scale was constructed from these items. We found that at the plateau of two complaints, the health care experiences of insured respondents diverged sharply. Those insured respondents with two or more complaints have been identified as the underinsured. To illustrate the depths of these concerns, 63% of the underinsured indicated their health plan does not adequately cover prescription drug costs.

Our principal finding is that the underinsured represent a large segment of the American population between the ages of 18 to 64: 29% of all persons with health plans, and 24% of the population as a whole. Although the travails of the uninsured have been widely-documented, our observation is that the uninsured represent only one segment of those lacking adequate health insurance. When we add together the uninsured (16%) with the underinsured (24%), we find two-fifths of a nation burdened by health care jitters.

Here is a sample of the experiences of the underinsured in the past 12 months:

56% postponed needed medical care because of costs

33% had to dig deep into their savings to pay medical expenses

34% of those 50+ said decisions about retirement were adversely affected by health care expenses

21% made job-related decisions based _mainly _on health care needs.

27% had outstanding medical debts still owed doctors or hospitals, and 17% were carrying medical debts of $5,000 +

38% postponed home or car maintenance or repairs due to medical expenses

71% indicated they were dissatisfied with their household’s share of out-of-pocket medical expenses

37% said they were at all prepared to financially handle unexpected major medical expenses they might face in the next 12 months.

In short, these data warrant a more expansive discussion about health care policy in the U.S. Recognition of the problems of the 16% who are uninsured acknowledges only part of the story. Respecting the burdens of an additional 24% with inadequate health plans compels a more thorough assessment of what ails the health care system.

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2007/august/consumer_reports_hea.php

Thanks.

just read this: http://www.pbs.org/now/transcript/transcriptNOW218_full.html

I had NASE insurance as well. One emergency set me back $32,000. Thank goodness I owned a home and could borrow on the equity,

What if something happens to me? If I develop a dread disease (read: cancer) or have an accident and can't go to work, I lose the insurance. OK, I have 18 months of COBRA, but I'd have to pay for that out of pocket. I lose the house, the whole ball of wax. SO and I aren't married, and his salary is small, about half of mine, although his insurance is pretty good. We have talked about getting married just so I could be on his insurance *before* something bad happens.

This keeps me up nights, and many other people I know too. No wonder every adult I know takes Xanax.

It is sort of the attitude of a two year old - Even though it happened over thirty years ago, I remember my son asking his grandmother (When she told him that it was unlikely we would own a car until I was out of engineering school) "But what did Mom do with the car, Gram? Did she crash it??"

The rich think that any financial adversity is the result of either drug use or gambling or not properly budgeting. They have no idea how stacked the system is against you - and that was the good old days.

Today the system is not merely stacked against you - it is explosively stacked against you.

:shrug:

I guess I could say "client" but after a year of very rough times - the "clients" are far more likely to tell me what to do then for me to insist on what parameters of the job I would ideally like to carve out.

;-)

I happily remind my employer that I know why *my* friends like me.

that given availability there is no reason why every American family could not afford a Prius. I asked him what planet he was living on. The irony is that even though he can easily afford a Prius he owns two SUVs. :eyes:

see. Even the wealthiest scion of privilege sees abject poverty every single day that they step outside of their houses. They choose to ignore it, just as they choose to deny what anyone with a room temperature IQ and eyes to see must acknowledge.

Giving them a pass because "they're nice", is more a comment on your humanity than their innocence.

If you don't put it off too long, you are less likely to need expensive procedures. You can use your flex spending if it is difficult to come up with the money all at once.
I don't have dental insurance, but now that I know that going to the dentist doesn't mean shelling out a few hundred dollars for a cleaning, I should make an appointment. Last time I went a few years between cleanings, then I did have a few hundred dollars worth of cavities.

My family has conveniently forgotten what happened to me and my family during a serious illness and a 2 yr. treatment. Between what the insurance company would and would not pay for we went from having a little over $40K in savings to seriously considering bankruptcy, and we didn't have an extravagant lifestyle either.

Additionally, our insurance doesn't cover well baby or well child checkups, so those costs aren't applied to the deductible. Dental insurance maxes out at $500.00/yr., doesn't cover X-rays so a dentist can figure out what needs to be done, and one thing that just blows my mind is that they will cover fillings, but not the damned Novocaine! :crazy:

There are many, many people who are more vulnerable to health care costs of all sorts than they realize.