My ultrconservative brother

says people without health Insurance should turn off the cable and internet, Use coupons and buy cheaper food, and do research to find the best deal on insurance. Then they would be able to afford it. He has insurance through his work and he thinks people should just quit A job not offering it and get work that does. Just got off the phone with him and my fists are still clenched. I love him and would die for him if it came to that but some times I just want to beat the crap out of him.

i dearly hope he lives to be my age (middle aged and too young for medicare), loses his job, and finds out

at best you can save $400 or so a month by cutting back on cable, internet, and not eating -- you cannot get enough money together to pay a private health insurance bill on top of that

unfortunately the reason fools can be fools is they know they will be bailed out -- you would give your life for him, but you know what, this fascist would not give his life for you in similar circumstance

been there, done that

they are parasites and i'm done w. their breed

I swear the logic of some ultraconservatives is proof the American way of life is suffering.

internet service.

Cant tell you how many "retired" friends of my mom's have to work at Walmart or similar to pay their health insurance. plus they have existing conditions by that age, so those aren't even covered. What a retirement! :woohoo:

Most of these people don't have cable or Internet. Some don't even have phones. They buy cheap food and cut coupons already. Some of them are on food stamps.

Man, I thought my brother was conservative.

tears to his eyes, nothing will... I am a Canadian, and have sort of decent health care, but not nearly what the French have or the Brits. for that mater.

ww

hates his GUTS

I'm a perfectly healthy 35 year old woman with a huge deductible, no rx or maternity coverage, and my premium is $135/mo. My internet and cable are under $100 combined.

until he retires. i take it he thinks that if he does lose his insurance he will have the cash to buy insurance

and then , just eat dirt......I love how Conservatives feel that people are undeserving of a decent life and should wallow in misery while others make fortunes off of your paycheck.:puke:

I talk to him about once every two months and it is always the same thing it starts off nice enough but I always feel that he is rubbing his success in life under my nose. He was reasonable person before he moved to texas.

anything that can be outsourced will be outsourced. I suppose he hates unions too.

he prints fast food boxes. His wife is A highly paid banking professional.

Laugh and say you hope he does not have to find out the hard way. Then take him to see Sicko. Best of luck.

I have a friend that is married with two children. She and her husband have had some minor medical problems in the past, nothing life threatening or serious. The children are healthy. She pays nearly $400 per month for a private policy on her and her family. They have a $6000 deductible per year and no prescription drug coverage. They each can go to one well check per year and the kids each get one extra visit each per year before they have to start paying down the deductible. It's basically catastrophic coverage, yet they still pay close to $400 per month. Ridiculous.

If someone is low income, then they are going to have a very hard time affording those kinds of premiums, let alone paying down a $6000 deductible. The insurance companies are evil.

That $6000 is an ANNUAL cost, so if one of the family members gets a chronic illness (say, severe asthma with lots of ER trips, to pick something not uncommon) they're screwed on an annual basis.

Catastrophic coverage provides the worst, most expensive coverage to the sickest people. Is there a worse idea in health insurance?

Mind you, this guy when first married to my sister (10 years older)
I absolutely Idolized when I was a teen,
He was like the father I never had.
Except, instead of baseball games and fishing trips,
He took me on more acid trips than I can count.
I watched him sweat the draft lottery and student and married deferments
He was a stone cold hippie liberal

(Also note; This "backache" that he refers to is actually Degenerative Disc disease
ith a total of 10 disks completely trashed and causes me to have to live on heavy narcotics
like Fentanyl and Morphine just to be able to get to the grocery store and doctors visits
and that is the only time I ever go out. Also, I'm SSI Disability and if I were to get a job
I would lose my medicaid and all my doctors and meds)

What Happened to this guy?

"Wiley, About a year ago I asked you to stop calling me with your political views. I asked you to stop sending me emails about your political views with links to your liberal crap. Since then you continued to send me emails with liberal crap links, all of which I just immediately deleted. Since then I have not answered the phone when the caller ID showed that it was you calling. Then, the other night I answered the phone to find it was you calling. I was occupied, so I called you back the next morning. I was hoping you just wanted to talk and catch up in a family or old friend way, with no political crap. I had my timer set and started it when you answered. It took you just 37 seconds to launch into your standard political attack at me, which was"am I still fooled by the republican/conservative line, or have I awakened yet". So, you immediately put me on the defensive. There was no longer any chance of an open friendly conversation. You attacked me, so I defended myself and told you how full of blind liberal crap you are. You are a hopeless, extremely naive, lost liberal. You are so helpless that you are way down in a hole and can't see out. You are BLIND BLIND BLIND. If you had your way, this country would fall very apart quickly. You idiot, you bite the hand that feeds you. You want those who have money to support you and your kind while you do nothing but sit on your lazy ass and gripe that the those who have are not doing enough to support those who don't have (all the while you contribute nothing to this country or society). If the rest of us were like you, this country could not exist. You do not at all appreciate that those who have pay almost all of the taxes paid in this country, off of which you exist. On the contrary, you resent that others have wealth and you would have it confiscated and given to the have nots. You want social engineering. You are a socialist. Unfortunately for you, this is not a socialist contry, this is a capitalist country. You work hard to protect your precious little excuse (your backache), so you can justify being lazy and totally irresponsible. In doing so you cast yourself into absolute poverty and have become a ward of the state. And like the blind person you are, you blame outside forces (conservatives) for your problems. Oh sure, you have back pain. But, the truth is that if you wanted to, you could have a desk job or a store clerk job and support yourself. Your back pain would be the same either way. But not you, you just stick your head in the sand and scream bloody murder at those who have.

Your pathetic, mindless dribble will never do anything but convince me that I am right in the way I think, so don't waste your time trying to change me to become a pethetic liberal. By the same token, I am sorry that for have chosen to throw your life away, but I wouldn't waste an eighth of an ounce of my energy trying to change your pathetic view.

I am sorry you got fucked in your early life, but you don't understand that now you just fuck yourself. From now on, Do Not Ever email or call me again if you intend to even mention anything political. If you can'e handle that, good bye!"

Well, what happened is that he makes millions a year now selling Liquor licenses in FL and listens to Rushole every day

thank you for typing all that. Makes me feel less alone.

I think we all have someone we know like that

It's a shame, though

Sad of his email to you. But if I were him, I wouldn't be too proud of the millions I'm making selling liquor licenses.

Just curious...

Unless God Is Money is a religon

Come to think of it

It IS

n/t

...once you know there's no hope of agreement. I mean this.

My last uncle is a dear sweet man, very bright and well-educated -- he's a retired history professor. Unfortunately his politics are two steps to the right of Ghengis Khan. I'm not going to change his mind no matter what I say or do; if I try to, all I will achieve is alienation. I have chosen to never discuss politics with him again.

The point I'm trying to make here is that my uncle, like your brother in law, is NOT George Bush or even, gods forbid, Dick Cheney. If I were actually related to someone like that, then yes, I'd make an explicit break with them. But I'm not. None of my relatives walks the halls of power or makes decisions that harm other human beings.

I have the same policy with my neighbors. Aside from dueling yard signs during political seasons, I don't discuss my politics with the conservatives. Even with the liberals I try not to go too far because nobody else is a political junkie. Around town and such, though, it's amazing who I run into who expresses the need for solidarity and validation -- and believe me, I give it to them.

You and I have DU to come to express our pain and outrage. This will pass. Relatives and neighbors are forever.

Hekate

Oh, wait. That was a Republican Administration. Or maybe like the aftermath of the New Deal. No, that worked out okay. Hmmm. Any guesses on which party and ideology REALLY screws up the country?

People like that are too far gone to even communicate with.

while looking for another job. Ask him to assume that his job went away. He could probably get Cobra coverage, but it is typically a helluva lot of money. Have him assume that he will be out of work for at least six months - and the average Cobra coverage is $600 a month. Can he afford to pull the $3600 out of his accounts? What about the full 12 months allowed?

If he lets his coverage lapse, then when he goes to get covered again, the insurance companies will find anything in his past medical records to deny him full coverage. They'll look for one little knee pain complaint and suddenly that leg is not covered. High blood pressure? Sorry, no longer covered.

He's damned lucky. (So am I, btw, but at least I know better.)

I had to let mine lapse, because they were asking $485 dollars a month for continued coverage, while simultaneously denying all my claims because my policy wasn't in force yet. I was $350 dollars out of pocket monthly for continuing medical expenses at the same time. They still would have been making money off of me, particularly since I doubt they would pay the pharmacy as much as I did for my drugs.

When it came time to choose between the COBRA payments and continuing a medication that allowed me to live a normal life, I opted for the meds. I'm now among the great uninsured. But as a friend of mine put it "If you don't have medical insurance and you get a serious illness, you're screwed. On the other hand, if you have insurance and get a serious illness: you're screwed". He told me that at least a year before "Sicko" came out and proved he was right.

work them for 39 hours so they don't have to give them benefits like health care? If so he is supporting the 'screw people that don't have health care' concept. :dem:

not to get sick, because if he develops a chronic illness, he will not be able to buy health insurance at any cost.

Tell him not to get sick, because if there is any sort of typo or other error on his application to his insurance company now, his policy will be rescinded.

Tell him not to get sick, because everything on the bill will be challenged by the insurance company and many things will simply not be paid if they don't appear on a computer model of a typical case of whatever it is.

Oh, yeah, and tell him he's a damned fool and living in a fool's paradise.

I'm STILL mad at Santa for not bringing me what I wanted last Easter!

:mad:

And I hope that you let him know that his lifestyle can change at anytime. He shouldn't have that attitude because he will never know if he may be in that situation.

They're in permanent BULLY mode

They just overpower you with bullshit

is an asshole..X-police chief.. he doesnt like people.. get over it asshole. f'n dumb ass.. he thinks the Left behind, Dominion stories.. are a book out of the bible.

I intend to print all of these posts and send them to him by snail mail as he will not give me his E-mail address. If we make one conservative have A rational thought today this was A good day

Thats
just
weird

:tinfoilhat:

never got any reply to anything. quit sending him anything.

I always wondered what turns people into sadists. What makes people enjoy seeing others suffering. Are these the same people that pulled the wings off flies when they were little?

I kid you not. He did that and worse. His favorite thing was drop-kicking frogs.

Stay out of his way as much as you can. :(

I bet he is fine with his health insurance, but still has big medical bills. It happens.

be him someday if his wife pulls his head out of her butt.

I have one of them too. At least he's finally woken up -- he's now sort of a Feingold/Edwards Republican.

Companies would be able to make more profit if they didn't have to provide health care coverage. My friend who owns a small office supply store doesn't know about health insurance, he knows how to sell pens and desks and paper. Health care costs are hindering companies in a competitive globalized marketplace. Just look at the auto industry. Detroit adds $1,500 per car because of health car costs. It is time health care is taken off the backs of businesses, so they can do what they do best: make a profit.

Try that argument with your brother and see what he says.

Once your health starts to go or if you have a sick child, even with insurance the bills mount up very rapidly.

You might want to print this out and send it to him, if he is a Christian as I suspect it just might have an impact. Don't email a link, holding paper in your hand is far more emotionally engaging.


http://www.buzzflash.com/contributors/03/09/17_franken.html

My b-i-l was 5 months away from 60, worked at his job for 24 years without one sick day, and got laid off a few weeks ago. No one is immune.
He sounds cocky and immature, and clueless. What does he do?

He works in A factory that makes those stupid cardboard boxes fast food comes in. His wife is A low level executive in A small texas bank.Oh he's 42. forgot to add that.

Dual Income No Kids ?

No kids would definitely explain it, particularly if they are in good health now.

worked at his job for 24 years without one sick day, and got laid off a few weeks ago. No one is immune.
He sounds cocky and immature, and clueless. What does he do?"

that first part sounds like my father who worked his halfway decent job all of his life and he too built up vacation and sicktime. he did manage to use up that time prior to his wanting to retire, but the day before he was going to put the papers in, he died. now, at the risk of sounding cruel at least he didn't have to live with a disability or anything like that even though i miss him so and want him here. it would be greedy of myself to wish upon my father a dissability or pains just to have him here with me. now, my mother who along with my brother claim to be democrats, but they have the attitudes of republicons and vote for republicons. (the misspelling is deliberate btw) one thing my father told me when i turned of voting age 30+ years ago was never vote for a republicon. he said don't vote if you have to, but don't vote for any republicons. i do know what he meant now and he was wise and my voting started in the 90s. i never voted for a republicon and vow to never do so.
as to cocky, immature, and clueless, add to that greedy and judgememntal and you've got every f'ing republicon nailed. most republicons are total hypocrites. as for religion, that is to improve oneself to go to heaven and not for ammunition in judging everybody else to say you're going to hell if you aren't like or do like they want in their judgements. my mother and brother are both like this unfortunately. i nearly lost my life 3 times recently and became dissabled and they did blame me for it all, while my brother (and my grown son too it seems) say poor me(meaning themselves) to each other about themselves while i sat on my deathbed many times. my eyes opened and was spared death, but this was my fault and i should support my lazy brother who loses jobs because of his drug use and my son because he has controlable epilepsy through daily pills, but he says can't work because of it? i too am on daily medication to keep me from death and the doctors have deemed me dissabled as i am too high of a risk for more operations that i need, but i am ignored by them(my supposed family) as my problem according to them is i "brought it on myself"? as quoted by my mother for my peritonitis, burst appendix, 2 failed hernia operations, and one ulcer that ate through an artery, while working full time for just over minumum wage with no health insurance. this also doesn't count the recovery times that i went without getting a paycheck, but they all have it worse than i?
sorry for the rant as what i say here doesn't even come close to the entire picture of their hypocrisy. in parabols, it would be like them saying, 'my nose is stuffed' while mine is bleeding or their saying, 'their foot hurts' while talking to somebody who lost theirs due to gangrene. or some businessmen saying you're poor because we(the businessmen) can't afford paying you much because of all the taxes and bills we have to pay on your behalf. these are the kind of assholes republicons and many in my family who claim to be democrats are. i did not bring any of this on myself and wish i could go back to my job with good health. at least i know i am not a lazy hypocrite like they are.
it matters not if republicons are subjected to the same circumstances that some of us have gone through as they'll have something else or someone else to blame rather than themselves and the world still revolves around them no matter what. do i blame everybody else for my circumstances? no!!!! if i were like them would be doing so, but i do blame them for being cold and ruthless and in spite of them making religious claims against me, i actually look forward to revelation as evil would then pay for its misdeeds. my own mother said she does not look for that to happen because many will go to hell. i think she was thinking of herself as usual.

your brother sounds like the typical cold, ignorant conservative (they are in everyone's family tree somewhere): he won't understand or truly care UNTIL IT HAPPENS TO HIM.

:thumbsup: :kick: And it's nice to see you. :loveya:

:hi:

I feel very close to you all, certainly closer than to my brother. I haven't been here long but I feel as if I have found A home. I don't have A lot of friends here in florida as I tend to be kind of A political crank. But here on DU maybe once in A while something I say may be appreciated rather than just irritating. You've helped make this carpenter A little less angry. I will send your posts to my brother, I don't think it will change his mind, but it will certainly make me feel better. Love you all.

And a belated welcome to DU! :hi:

the insurance company leaves this state.

The conversion insurance they have offered us is $1.369.69 for three people with lesser benefits.

I'm afraid that droping cable and internet would only give me $80 more per month to spend... Not gonna be enough to buy me insurance then.

I can go through my husband's work to get insurance, but that is going to cost $900, though the benefits are better. But still $80 ain't gonna do much to pay the premium.

My job doesn't offer insurance...

He retired at brig. gen. pension total desk jockey. He made his living off the taxpayer teat. I love him and am proud he is my brother. He does not live in the real world as far as health and finance. It is very hard to research anything or apply for a job without Internet connection. OK, I guess you can go to the library if you have the transport. It is just getting more difficult to even operate or survive without the technology. Your brother has unrealistic views for sure.

and that liquid shit is thicker than blood, too.

perhaps you can see that i've never held much stock in that old saying about family above all. and i also firmly believe you can choose your own family. but some people cannot live or think or love beyond that tribal/clan concept. c'est la vie. i'm just glad i don't have your problems.

but i guess in some way it is admirable to love this brother of yours. and supposedly noble that you stand by him even though it sounds like he wouldn't stand by you, considering he's already voting to hurt you and yours. perhaps there's a reward at the end of all this masochistic, unappreciated devotion. i really do hope there is one for you, for your sake. may your love accomplish something that only a swift kick to the ass and bash on the head seem to accomplish on this personality type. maybe you'll beat the odds and he'll see the light.
:hug:

With people like your brother is that they adopt those attitudes because they either have an inability to empathize (feel for others) or they are afraid to feel for others. Feelings hurt. It's hard to see another in distress.

Much easier to turn their back and utter some useless advice about clipping coupons and getting rid of the Internet. Blame the victim.



Cher

If everybody started wanting business to pay for health care, just think what would happen to the cost of goods. Workers wanting everything is what causes inflation and businesses to fold.

See what he says when you turn the minimum wage argument around on him.

I'd love to see how well that research goes turning off the internet. Of course, you'd probably have to spring for a paper to get the coupons and spend every waking moment not working clipping them. Then this "cheaper food" angle has me intrigued since they only typically publish coupons for the brand names. If I'm missing a trick here, please, tell me.

And that's just our portion. Believe me, Mr. H isn't retiring for awhile.

I had an interesting conversation with the Physician's Asst at my allergist's office last week. What with all the smoke and ash in the air from the 200,000 acre Zaca Fire I'm sure they've been extra-busy with the lung-impaired lately, but this was a routine visit for me.

He said to me, as he wrote up my new prescriptions, that he hesitated to write in a diagnosis of asthma because if I ever had to change medical plans I wouldn't be able to get insurance. I snorted and said that at this point in life I have so many pre-existing conditions I'm pretty well screwed. I didn't even mention Mr. H's ulcerative colitis, now in remission, but I'm quite certain that wouldn't get covered under a new policy either.

"Have you seen Sicko yet?" I asked.

"No", he said, "I live it."

So officially I'm using my inhaler for a "cough". It's a hell of a system we have here in this country, where a medical person hesitates to write the true diagnosis of an ailment for fear of doing more harm than good.

And I'm sick of saying how "lucky" I feel for having good insurance, when we are paying through the nose for an ever-shifting ever-diminishing array of "benefits" that could vanish like the morning dew with one stroke of bad luck, such as my husband's department being eliminated. We're okay, but we don't feel secure.

The fact that so many people in this country have it SO MUCH WORSE despite all THEIR hard work is sickening too. It's a scandal, a shame, a sin, a blot on our nation's name.

Your brother should maybe check with his Personnel Department -- or read his pay stub -- to find out how much his company is paying in for his family each month, and ask himself how long he could pay that sum out of pocket by eliminating cable tv.

Hekate

It's scary- that little sermon of his could
have come from my bro.

I too, love him but I sure as hell can't discuss
ANYTHING that has to do with politics ( he's also ultra conservative).

It's tough- I too have been ready to tear into him on many occasions.
But I think " what's the point?" He's never going to get it.

Hint- he gave O'Reilly's book to our mom for Christmas!!
:puke:

You have my empathy.

:hug:

I bet he'd think twice before making a dumbass comment like that.

People who can't afford insurance should also live under an old bridge. Some people are so darn stupid and have no realistic view of the world.

I'm sure you can write a better one next time.

extremely angry at the time of writing. Family can drive anyone crazy.

i just don't talk to my oldest brother anymore though i do love him dearly. the last time we spoke he told me that we were in iraq because of 911. that was upwards of a year ago, i think.

i really doubt if you're my brother but it is true that my younger brother is a carpenter, one who knows the truth. :)

who was so glad after 911 that Bush was in the White House because "Al Gore would have wanted to plant a tree and gather around it and sing" in response to 911.

His life has taken such a terrible downturn financially, and he's gotten himself so irreparably in debt by using credit cards for things like rent and food, that he's on the verge of bankruptcy ... except that, thanks to his repuke heroes, bankruptcy is no longer an option.