To all the "Dire Drought" people, I apologize for Friday.

I was really pissed off because the #1 suggested solution so far (nationwide) has been huge pipelines from the Great Lakes to the Southeast and Southwest, and since we don't have a pot to piss in up in Michigan anymore, that seemed like insult to injury.

I drive through Detroit and Flint a lot. They used to be great and beautiful cities. What they look like now literally breaks my heart. I got into a "Send our Jobs Back and we'll send you water" groove, forgetting it is the rich stinking power elite that has engineered this so as to have the plants closer to Guadalajara, where they make transmissions and engines instead of Ypsilanti and Willow Run supporting Mack Avenue, Lansing Assembly, and GM Flint.

Not your fault. I wish you all rain.

Hell, better off putting money into research to make sustainable, easily maintained, and affordable desalination plants, and pipe the damn water in from the sea.

As for Flint and Detroit, I wish them a wonderful, high-tech, clean, sustainable, high employment, living wage industry...or ten. They're a big part of our nation's history, and they shouldn't be abandoned.

They're like a lung cancer patient with Stage 4 metastases. If I can stand it, maybe I'll post a slide show. I passed a parking lot to a major decaying factory off of I-475 on Friday. The roof is caved in for about 25% of the building, and the huge parking lot now has a forest of trees at least 7-8 foot tall growing in the cracks.

Every time we drive through Detroit, there's been a new fire, or another building is dark.

And do you know who some of the LOCALS blame for this? The Unions. I'm dyin' up here.

It's a terrible shame.

The once great Motor Wheel factory is now a parking lot filled with metal cubes which were once parts of the building, and the once huge Oldsmobile factory now looks identical to Motor Wheel. For sale signs abound everywhere here, too, some have been up for over two years with no buyers in sight.
Michigan has the worst unemployment rate in America, and now everyone thinks we should just give away the DISAPPEARING Great Lakes, which is the one idea that could just unite Republicans and Democrats in this state as we ALL repeat what our Governor said: "Not just no, but HELL NO!"

Tyler's right, We ARE dying here.

I'm gonna get pooh-poohed for this one:

Al Gore as President. If he just went in to take it on, not worrying about "a Second Term" he might just pull it off.

Never happen.

http://www.weather.com/weather/map/74337?name=index_large_animated

for what its worth I read a story the other day, sorry no link, that said made in america was becoming trendy, I shit you not that thats what it said.;-)

They'd have to tear structures down and start over; it's all been rotting for far too long.

Just keep in mind that the selling of your water will be just one more in a long list of profit making schemes by the extremely rich to get even richer. It's been being planned for decades behind your backs and without the knowledge of those who are currently suffering water shortages.

I've already witnessed it here in Texas on a smaller scale. We fought the sale of our water and lost to a sneaky behind our backs move. With the growth rate here we're destined to have water shortages in the future now. Not to mention the loss of industry that will be caused by the loss of the lakes.

Those who sold our water will be long gone from here by the time we start suffering.

Google T. Boone Pickens and water. He and his company have bought up water rights in many N.Texas communities, forcing them to look elsewhere. His plan is to sell it to the highest bidder, whether it is Dallas or Coca-Cola. Texas has a stupid rule of capture law. You can pump as much water as you want out of the ground, even if it makes your neighbor's well dry up.

We cannot afford to be moving water around from place to place. Arizona, New Mexico and Nevada will have to come up with their own solutions. First, stop putting in giant fountains and canals in the DESERT. And no more golf courses.

the southern mentality(or lack thereof) is what continually puts the type of people into elected office to pass 'right to work' laws.

I have to keep remembering that there are people up HERE who think the reason the jobs left was because of the Unions.

No area of the country is immune from self-delusion.

"No area of the country is immune from self-delusion."

There are morans in the Southeast who seem to think unions are evil. I have never understood this thinking. All I can think is these people are brainwashed.

Appreciate your posting this.

Obviously, you're not a Republican. :-) They NEVER apologize. :silly: but true.

Is there a singer who sings about Detroit and Flint? I kept thinking of "My Hometown" as I read this and I thought, somebody should be writing about this.

Or maybe there are novels.

Watch "Roger and Me." It has gotten much worse since then.

I wish the people of Detroit and Flint prosperity and a quick recovery from their own devastation.

:thumbsup:

If there IS ever an insurrection, places like Flint, Detroit and Pontiac are where it will start.

and I agree with you completely. I just returned from a road trip up to Detroit (the first time in 20 yrs). I drove along I75 into Detroit and then out Grand River to where I had lived out past Greenfield and it was one of the saddest things I have ever seen. All along Grand River buildings were half gutted, burned out, boarded up, windows long gone. Looked like a war zone. i cried most of the drive. Then I drove out to Milford where I lived as an adult. all the farm land long gone and turned into gross developments of row after row of McMansions (4 out of 5 with for sale signs on the lawn or empty or both). Milford, itself had been frosted over with a cartoonish upgrade from being actual authentic "Home town, USA" to a Disney version of home town USA. I cried again. Left Milford at 8pm and drove most of the night to get out of the state and back into Ohio, where I stayed the night. I agree completely. NO one needs to take anything from Michigan now. Too much, way too much has already been taken.

We just surpassed everyone but California in foreclosures: We are now #2 in the nation, and #1 in unemployment.

In the Greater Owosso area (Pop: 25,000) around 800 homes are in various stages of foreclosure. We're dying up here.

The poverty here is scary, and we're all doing what we can to keep our city going. No jobs, though, means many are moving out, and the crap from our "leaders" in Lansing is really getting on everyone's nerves. I'm hearing that people are just pissed that there doesn't seem to be any real leadership, which isn't good for Granholm. *sigh*

Our state is really hurting, and it really feels sometimes like no one cares. They let NOLA drown, and they're letting Michigan die drop by drop.

Every time I drive through, I'm AGHAST. It gets worse so quickly, as do Lansing and Flint. It makes one very bitter.

Flint was a Model City of the 60's, 70's and even some of the 80's. Flint, Pontiac and Detroit survived 1977, and THAT my friends took some doing. This time, however, there is nothing to rebound to in any sort of magnitude that will help.

The last time we drove over there to visit a friend, it was heart-wrenching. Lansing's worse, too, which is saying a lot. Tons of empty business buildings, for sale and for lease signs all over the place, and we have several foreclosure auctions in our area every week (especially family farms, which just breaks my heart).

This area is hurting, but so beautiful.

FIVE MANSIONS, one Federalist (1910), three "Painted Ladies" (1890) and a completely unique "L" shape (1875), one ENTIRE BLOCK INSIDE the city limits of Owosso, between 25k-30k square feet: last price, $800,000.

You would not BELIEVE what you can buy for less than $100K here.

You know things are bad when places like Owosso are doing so badly.

We almost went there for Hubby's residency. I would've loved it up there, but it was too far from his family (we have kids, and his mom's in poor health) and not the right program for what he wanted. I love Marquette. Great town.

from a NYT article this morning.....Seems there are issues all around.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3038134

The rich who located in the southeast to build plants paying 50% or less what they did up here need to fill their pools and water the golf courses.

... there can't possibly be a shortage of "something that literally falls from the sky."

Besides, I'm not going to play the blame game, but why didn't state and local officials send the busses? Are you telling me that people literally can't get out of the way of a drought?




I'm not serious, by the way.

:thumbsup:

Hearing about pipelines to Atlanta for water got me going. I knew people who lost jobs at plants that went South, so it was personal.

It takes one whole hell of a lot to get me fighting, but when you do, I'm like Patton at Bastogne. Deb said to me yesterday, "DAMN Tom, you ARE a fighter aren't you?"

Yes. In the purest sense, and I take no prisoners. This is not a positive character trait.

We've all been there -- writing knee-jerk posts. Few of us ever get around to apologizing, we just hope they'll disappear quickly. Thank you for your follow-up. It's well articulated and kind.:-)

k&r

We ARE that kind of people.

Personally I have a really awful temper, and thinking about our foreclosures and unemployment got me riled.

If the Lakes got pipelined, eventually the St. Mary's, St. Clair, Detroit and Niagra Rivers WOULD go the way of the Colorado, with the lakes dying through stagnancy. It's just Hydrology. The water pumped out of the basin doesn't come back.

it would be greatly appreciated. I live in an "exceptional drought" area. That is worse than "severe drought". Our days are being counted now.

Even if Canada would agree, we would need the consent of Minnesota, Wisconsin, Illinois, Indiana, Ohio, Pennsylvania, New York AND Michigan, and Canada would be crazy to agree: the Great Lakes will drain like a leaky tub if we start pumping them out. Any water sent outside the basin NEVER comes back. Hydrology 101.

I really am sorry. Truly.

I'm not from New Mexico though. I'm in the southeast. We're just looking for answers.

:hug:

It was good of you to admit you were over the top.

I wish Michigan well. My cousin and her MIchigan-born hubby have been living there since the late 60s. In the late 80s I passed through Detroit on my way up to London Ontario for a friend's wedding. And I always wished I could go back and visit instead of passing through. Perhaps one day when I have more money than I do now.

There are about 3 or 4 things left in Detroit worth the effort, but on the whole, the city is circling the drain. The jobs moving out of state killed us once and for all: you can't run a city on 3 casinos and a couple of sports arenas. Detroit is below 1 million and soon will be below 900,000.

And I apologize for saying that we were coming up there to also take your wife, your horses, your first-born, and your Batman comics. We're not, really.

I think that water-pipeline idea is unworkable, anyway. It looks like we'll be getting some rain shortly -- naturally, the place that REALLY needs rain today is southern California. I think Mother Nature has gotten into playing some really nasty practical jokes lately.

They're rioting in Africa
There's strife in Iran
What nature doesn't do to us
Will be done by our fellow man -- The Merry Minuet (Kingston Trio, a long time ago)

The whole world is festering with unhappy souls,
The French hate the Germans, the Germans hate the Poles,
Italians hate Yugoslavs, South Africans hate the Dutch-
AND I DON'T LIKE ANYBODY VERY MUCH.

We're all on our own in this brave new world.

But unless we go with a new "Confederate" model, there's nothing we can do about it.

Does it irk me that they want Lake Michigan to water golf courses in Phoenix? SURE. Fortunately Canada is not crazy enough to go along with that, so the water is fairly safe.

Will we get enough jobs back to fix the state? NOT A PRAYER. You could close ALL of the auto plants in the South and it still wouldn't be enough. Until we invent a new type of "Bolshevik," the "New Romanovs" have won. Our only consolation is that their victory will be short lived; history has proved this to be so. I am pretty sure that we won't like the short term solution though.

This is exactly why a "leftist" movement built on laissez faire capitalism must fail. Not only do the people of Michigan have no good reason to extend any help to Georgia or New Mexico, we are direct competitors who only hurt our own economic standing by assisting other regions.

So Georgia's comparative advantage is "right to work" laws and cheap standard of living? Well Michigan's is water.

This "Capitalism is GREAT and equals AMERICAN FREEDOM" bullshit is just what the rich pigs have used to strip us of our share of the nation's wealth and resources, as surely as if the entire country was a conglomeration of third world nations.

Now that they own the MEDIA as well, I don't know what will stop them until they have taken it all, or until we rise and STOP THEM.

We got three drops this morning. Literally. Three drops.

I think the pipeline idea is ridiculous. We need to learn to live with what the world gives us. We still have people in Charlotte who are watering their lawns, for chrissakes. I drove over the Catawba river Saturday and there are docks sitting on dry ground. People are crazy.

I just keep praying for rain and conserving water every way I can think of. I got pissed over your comments, but now that you explain, I understand where they came from.

Peace.

I'm down here in Charlotte and I was surprised to find myself seething a bit about your post all weekend. Really weird, because I'm not much of a seether.
Doubly weird because of the peaceful feeling I got reading your apology.

And there's rain in the forecast for Tuesday, so your wish may be having an effect. *crosses fingers* ;)

By bonnie bramlett and eric clapton

The rain is falling through the mist of sorrow that surrounded me.
The sun could never thaw away the the bliss that lays around me.

Let it rain, let it rain,
Let your love rain down on me.
Let it rain, let it rain,
Let it rain, rain, rain.

Sigh.

Apology accepted. Rain and jobs to all the great and beautiful cities and towns.

Bake

Right on a corner: they just pulled back two sets of shutters about 20' wide and opened up.

I sat there eating crawfish etouffee and drinking wine for hours one lazy, warm Saturday night, listening to the river.

Growing up in Kalamazoo (and even later in college) I figured I'd be the 3rd generation to work at the Upjohn Company (vitamins and pharmaceuticals for those unfamiliar with it).

Nope, the Borg-ification of the economy lead not only to the company being bought, no scratch that, *assimilated* by ever larger corporate entities until they (now owned by Pfizer) recently decided to move right out of the state.

I don't know how Michigan will eventually re-invent itself, but if that ever does happen, it's going to be a long, long road back to anything like prosperity.

It's a damn shame.

I am SO TIRED of explaining this to the NUMBNUTS
who blame everything on the UNIONS here in MICHIGAN!

I tell them and tell them that NO NUMBER of CONCESSIONS
can bring parity with workers in the Marianas making
$5.00 per DAY.

Low wage conservatism and the RACE TO TO BOTTOM has
HOLLOWED OUT THE LOWER-MIDDLE CLASS.

Blink, blink....but, but, they had CABINS and
RV's and STUFF....

Pure, unadulterated, STUPID jealousy.

Like a working person should be POOR.

:puke:

I wonder why I bother sometimes.

Its bad enough the Great Lakes region has lost so many jobs to overseas manufacturing. The water needs to stay here so when everyone wises up, they manufacturing base can be restored.

You like our water, come live here and enjoy it. Low cost of living, too.

once you utter it, you are its slave.” ~ Solomon ibn Gabirol