Can a Public School Teacher Proselytize Religion

As well as his political, REPUBLICAN leanings?

Well, according to my niece in Maine, there is a teacher telling her gays are bad, and that those who want to read the bible get to take time away from class. When she asked what a Democrat and a Republican was, he told her that Democrats want big government and Republicans want small government. He also said that Republicans stand for the people and Democrats stand for government.

I could go on but I must say I'm pretty damned pissed and wouldn't mind getting his job yanked.

I'd give his name, but I'm not sure if that is against the rules.

As long as it isn't coercive, whats the big deal? Sounds like your niece isn't buying it anyways.

it's inherently coercive. They can say whatever they want as private citizens, not when publicly employed teaching in public schools.

They've been assigned that role: To Teach. And in a students mind, (at least to up to a certain age) means that person is virtually infallible.

The big deal is that her job is a publicly-financed position and, by law, he/she is prohibited from making the comments he/she is making.

She needs to be reported and administration needs to do their job.

Teachers do not have complete freedom of speech. It's about power. If I tell a student she's ugly every day and then she harms herself somehow, wouldn't I be partly responsible? It's about liability, too. If a teacher does something to get the school district sued, that teacher's in the hot seat or fired.

It's easy to forget the power differential. If a teacher tells kids to take time out of class to read the Bible, then what are the rest doing? How is that not coercive on some level?

If he wants to teach a comparative religion course that's well within his rights. But what he's doing is a big no-no. Sad to say that he'll most likely be protected by his local teacher's union.

edit: I'd have him reported to the school board.

a social studies teacher who brings religion into class all the time.

Something needs to be done about this.

but not sure how to go about it.

But before that the principal and school board need to know.

I'm going to talk to my brother, her father and let him know what his daughter is telling me. She's next to me right now actually.

then go to the school board. THEN go to the state board.

I am not sure if this is illegal. Where I teach, it is a violation of board policy and I would imagine that is fairly common.

Do it via email so you have a trail. Send an email to the teacher AND the principal and be sure to CC the superintedent. If you don't get satisfactory results, Email the superintendent directly and be sure to CC the principal and the teacher. Still no results? Email the school board, CC the superintendent, and the principal (and the teacher) and make brief mention of the media. Still no? Email the the state board, CC the school board, superintendent, principal and the heads of the local newsrooms, and the head of your local ACLU chapter.

I've never had any issue go past my local school board. Soon as you mention media they will jump through hoops. Just make sure you attach all emails each time you "ramp up".

the complaint needs to be made to the principle first (chain of command). If the principle is doing his/her job, he/she is required by law to intervene. If you don't get satisfaction at the principle level, take it to the school board. Don't forget, most likely there are other adults who feel the same as you. Don't forget to include them in your actions.

Sure, if the teacher's doing something improper or illegal, he should be fired. But it's good that the union's there to make sure the administration follows the law and the contract as well.

It's one thing to make political comments here and there (though I don't find those appropriate either), but making discriminatory comments against any particular group of people cannot be tolerated and religious proselytizing in a public school is absolutely unacceptable. Both of those things should be grounds for dismissal.

I'm gonna have a chat with my brother about this.

however, as a retired teacher, I know many teachers who did the same b.s. The trouble is, too many children believe anything their teachers tell them. This teacher should be reported to the principal.

And doing nothing about it may lead to this being a norm or acceptable.

as children in the US school system, we are conditioned to believe what the teachers tell us. Few actually encourage critical thinking.

I was at least a junior in high school before I really starting cluing into the fact that teachers were NOT all-knowing - and that it would be a good idea to start thinking critically about what they were telling us.

In my district it is a violation of board policy.

I've heard about this kind of thing going on in other states, but this hits home.

I know ours are posted.

(which makes the First Amendment applicable to all fifty states and U.S. territories) prohibits the government and any entity associated with the government (like public schools) from using those facilities to spread religion of any kind.

Past Supreme Court precedents have included teachers (and/or "outsiders") from conducting compulsory Bible classes in the classrooms during school hours and the same authority figures cannot lead school-sponsored prayer to children. Since public education is compulsory, the children have no choice legally but to be exposed to religious dogma that they cannot challenge or defy without social repercussions. The Rulings have not been so much about prohibition of religion in public schools as much as to prevent children from being discriminated against for protesting against the dissemination of this kind of program.

It was a silly question but I knew someone here could be much more specific regarding public education rules or the law itself.

I know this information as the Establishment Clause was the subject matter of my independent writing project in law school. And I've had the honor of meeting Supreme Court litigants such as Vashti McCollum (Bible class), Roy Torcaso (religious test/notary) and Ed and Ellery Schempp (school prayer).

Then again, I also learned that school districts will do whatever they want until they're sued, especially if it's something that smacks of tradition.

then no. I could see some subjects in social studies where this is relevent but not to the extent he seems to be taking it. The Bible thing may be school policy though. There is a federal court case permitting children to be taken out of school for religious instruction. That may be what is happening here.

but he's gone over the line by infusing his religious views and political leanings on children. This man is extremely biased and should know what he does is wrong. On the other hand, she also feels it is wrong. That's my niece! Lol....

Anyway. She wants me to help her write a paper about John Edwards. And yet I'm a Kuch supporter. Lol.

I can look the law up tomorrow & post it here, but it isn't allowed.

I would call the ACLU on him.

I am a teacher & can tell you that even though it is against the law, it goes on all the time.

Frequently your Social Studies & History teachers are spouting the right's mantra to the kids. I can't help but wonder if this hasn't been part of the "placing of individuals into positions of influence" by the neocons. If a math teacher talks about politics, it doesn't carry as much weight as if the History or Government teacher tells them. The kids think they are "experts" in that field & thus they must be correct.

I had the same thing happen to my children at the school where I teach. They would come home almost daily telling me of the Repuke lies the Govt. teachers were espousing to them (2 different teachers).

Did I do anything? No. Because I would have lost my job (not yet tenured), or been given the assignments from hell.

Thank you, to those who chimed in.

should focus on the subjects that they were hired to teach. In particular, religion is a family matter and should be strictly out of bounds for a public school teacher. That means that the teacher should not even feel free to discuss their personal religious views with the students. It's up to the child's parents to depart whatever religious information that they feel is appropriate.

Your niece would be well within her rights
to take "time away" as well for her own
interests.

If your niece is too young to go up against
this guy herself, her parents should make a
complaint.

Personally, I'd have her tape the jerk.

I don't think that telling students that people who want to read the bible can take time away from class is proselytizing, though. I think it's stupid, but I would check to see if your state or district has a rule or policy allowing that practice before I zeroed in on the teacher.

You can certainly go to the admin and ask that a more appropriate, more neutral response be given to political questions, such as providing them with the official website of each party, and pointing to the "what we stand for" page, instead of offering a personal interpretation.

You can also go to the admin with the "gays are bad" thing, and take it beyond to the school board if necessary.

:eyes:

Uh...no.

his/her opinion and freedom of speech. At the same time, the students are a captive audience and rights also. Close call.

contact the local ACLU. If nothing else, they would have some suggestions on what to do.

I've encountered plenty of teachers that are the same way but in reverse... spreading leftist ideas. Both are wrong.