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avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 01:48 PM
Original message
SF Chronicle: S.F. Zoo visitor saw 2 victims of tiger attack teasing lions

S.F. Zoo visitor saw 2 victims of tiger attack teasing lions
Patricia Yollin, Tanya Schevitz, Kevin Fagan, Chronicle Staff Writers
Thursday, January 3, 2008

(01-02) 22:15 PST San Francisco -- Two victims of a lethal Christmas Day tiger attack were harassing the big cats at the San Francisco Zoo shortly before a 350-pound feline escaped its enclosure and mauled them, a woman told The Chronicle on Wednesday.
The revelation comes as the zoo reopens today, nine days after a visitor was killed and two of his friends were injured by the Siberian tiger, later shot dead by police.
Jennifer Miller, who was at the zoo with her husband and two children that ill-fated Christmas afternoon, said she saw four young men at the big-cat grottos - and three of them were teasing the lions a short time before the tiger's bloody rampage that killed 17-year-old Carlos Sousa Jr.
"The boys, especially the older one, were roaring at them. He was taunting them," the San Francisco woman said. "They were trying to get that lion's attention. ... The lion was bristling, so I just said, 'Come on, let's get out of here' because my kids were disturbed by it."
She said Sousa - whom she later recognized from his photo in the newspaper - was not heckling. The Chronicle contacted Miller after learning that she and her family had seen the young men at the zoo Christmas Day.
Miller, who said she visits the zoo with her relatives every Christmas, said the young men stood out because she has seen mostly families there. Although authorities have said Sousa was accompanied only by San Jose brothers Paul Dhaliwal, 19, and Kulbir Dhaliwal, 23, Miller said four young men were together when she came across them.
Mark Geragos, an attorney speaking on behalf of the Dhaliwals, angrily denied that his clients teased the animals. He also accused the zoo administration and their newly hired crisis spokesman of "peddling unfounded rumors."
"It's unconscionable," he said. "They're doing nothing but a calculated attack on these victims ... when in actuality the zoo security didn't do what they should have been doing after the attack."
Geragos maintains that the brothers ran to the Terrace Cafe after Tatiana escaped and tried for more than 30 minutes to solicit help from zoo employees. He dismissed reports of the victims throwing rocks at the tiger as "just not true."
Miller called the behavior she witnessed by the victims "disturbing."
Her family was looking at the lions when the young men stopped beside them at the big-cat grottos - five outdoor exhibits attached to the Lion House. The young men started roaring at the lions and acting "boisterous" to get their attention, said Miller, who added that she watched the four for five minutes or so a little after 4 p.m.
"It was why we left," she said. "Their behavior was disturbing. They kept doing it."
Sousa refrained from such tactics, Miller said.
"He wasn't roaring. He wasn't taunting them," she recalled. "He kept looking at me apologetically like, 'I'm sorry, I know we are being stupid.' "
When a friend told Miller about the attacks - first reported to 911 dispatchers at 5:07 p.m. - she called police the day after Christmas to tell them what she had seen. She called back Wednesday because she was wondering why news accounts mentioned only three young men.
San Francisco police Inspector Valerie Matthews said investigators had talked to Miller on Wednesday but haven't been able to substantiate yet her account of a fourth person with the victims at the zoo. Authorities have been unable to corroborate reports that the victims taunted the tigers, she said.
"I don't know if what they did was any more than what kindergartners do at the zoo every day," Matthews said.
She said taunting an animal at the zoo is a misdemeanor.
Zoo officials declined Wednesday to specifically say that they suspected taunting in the escape of the tiger.
"Something prompted our tiger to leap over the exhibit," said Manuel Mollinedo, executive director of the zoo, in response to questions during a 13-minute press conference attended by at least 40 media representatives on Wednesday.
Mollinedo said new "Protect the Animals" signs would ask patrons to leave the animals alone, and portable loudspeakers would remind visitors to leave promptly at the 5 p.m. closing time. A hard-wired notification system is also in the offing to alert visitors to any escapes by the creatures that live there.
"Help make the zoo a safe environment," the signs state. "The magnificent animals in the zoo are wild and possess all their natural instincts. You are a guest in their home. Please remember they are sensitive and have feelings. PLEASE don't tap on glass, throw anything into exhibits, make excessive noise, tease or call out to them."
At the news conference, Zoological Society Chairman Nick Podell lavishly praised the beleaguered Mollinedo, who took over at the zoo in February 2004 and was earning $314,038 a year plus $15,702 in benefits and a $9,548 expense account, according to zoo tax documents filed in November. The society operates the zoo, although the land and animals are owned by the city.
Zoo officials said that over the next 30 days they will build a reinforced-glass barrier atop the tiger grotto's dry moat wall. On Tuesday the zoo said the glass wall would be 4 to 5 feet high, bringing the wall height to at least 16.5 feet tall, roughly what is suggested by national standards. However, on Wednesday the zoo said the wall would be at least 19 feet tall and feature viewing holes.
In the days after the fatal mauling, zoo officials gave five different estimates of the moat wall's height before finally conceding the wall was only 12.5 feet tall - 4 feet shorter than national recommendations.
"It will put us in the top end of the spectrum for containment facilities," Mollinedo said.
He remained vague on several other issues. Although he said 20 patrons were at the zoo when the attack occurred, he didn't know how many staff people or security officers were present. He said there will be more employees on duty in the future, although he wasn't sure when that staffing increase would happen. And he didn't know how much the proposed improvements would cost or where the money would come from.
"I'll have to get back to you on that," Mollinedo said more than once.
Mollinedo said his staff acted heroically after the attacks, although he couldn't describe any specific instances. However, zoo employees have told The Chronicle that they were among the first on the scene and led paramedics to Sousa's body while the tiger was still roaming the grounds.
When the zoo reopens, the big cats will be inside the Lion House, which will be closed to the public. Screened fences and barriers will surround the outdoor grotto and Terrace Cafe, sites of the attacks.
Patrons will be able to leave mementos and tributes at the main entrance to both Sousa and the 4-year-old Tatiana, who had mangled her keeper's arm a year earlier.
Also Wednesday, San Francisco police Sgt. Steve Mannina said investigators found an empty vodka bottle in the car that was used by the victims to go to the zoo on Christmas Day. Inspectors haven't concluded the significance of the find, he added.
Mannina also said results of toxicological tests performed on Sousa, who was killed by the tiger, have not been returned yet.
Zoo reopening today
What's happening: The San Francisco Zoo reopens today for the first time since the fatal Christmas Day tiger attack.
What to expect: New signs that forbid animal harassment and loudspeakers that will alert visitors to the park's closing time. The Lion House and big cat exhibit will be closed to the public, as will the Terrace Cafe.
Chronicle staff writers Jaxon Van Derbeken and Steve Rubenstein contributed to this report. E-mail the writers at kfagan@sfchronicle.com, srubenstein@sfchronicle.com, tschevitz@sfchronicle.com and pyollin@sfchronicle.com.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/01/03/MN9TU8AGC.DTL




Tiger victims 'were carrying catapaults'

By Bonnie Malkin and agencies
Last Updated: 4:05pm GMT 03/01/2008

Two brothers who survived an attack by a tiger that escaped from its enclosure at a San Francisco Zoo and killed their friend were reportedly carrying catapaults.
The report in the New York Times has added to speculation that the men may have provoked the Siberian tiger to attack.
An earlier report in the San Francisco Chronicle said that investigators found blood and a shoe inside the tiger enclosure, suggesting that one of the victims may have placed a leg or board over the edge of a 15-feet-wide protective moat to aid the tiger's escape.
The New York Times alleged that an empty bottle of vodka was found in a car used by the men, Kulbir and Amritpal Dhaliwal, and their friend Carlos Sousa Jr, who died from a wound to the throat.
Mark Geragos, a lawyer hired by the Dhaliwal brothers, dismissed reports as "an urban legend."
He said the brothers, who were both mauled in the attack, tried to get help for more than 30 minutes before zoo workers finally called police.
He said the tiger, named Tatiana, escaped around 4:30 pm local time on Christmas Day and attacked Kulbir first before savaging Mr Sousa to death.
The brothers then ran to the zoo café to seek help, but it had locked its doors and they could not get inside.
The brothers then approached a female security guard, who appeared "diffident", the lawyer said.
The four-year-old cat was later shot dead.
However, police logs cast doubt on the brothers' report.
"Zoo personnel dispatch now say there are two males who the zoo thinks ... are 800 (police code for mentally disturbed) and making something up ... but one is in fact bleeding from the back of the head," the police noted at 5:10 p.m.
"They say they were acting crazy..." Mr Geragos said.
"I don't know how one is supposed to act after being attacked by a tiger."
The Dhaliwals are now considering suing the zoo, which has admitted that the moat's 12' 5" wall was almost four feet lower than recommended.
The zoo is scheduled to re-open to the public today. But the remaining tigers will not be on display until an electric fence and surveillance cameras have been installed around their enclosure and the surrounding walls have been raised.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2008/01/03/wtiger103.xml




Very interesting.






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MrScorpio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 01:49 PM
Response to Original message
1. Surprise, surprise, surprise
Can you say, "Darwin Award?"
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avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. It appears to be so.
It looks like there is a more than a foundation to some of the so called rumors.
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sdfernando Donating Member (421 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. I wouldn't say that
If the only one to die was the only one that was NOT teasing the animal (as this witness recounts) then the Darwin would not apply. Tragic event. A beautiful person and a beautiful animal died and the ones that caused it survived. Sometimes I think there is no God.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. early reporting out here said after Tatiana jumped the wall she came at one
of the brothers when Sousa yelled and tried to distract her. thats when she went after him and killed him with a strike across his neck. So it had to do with actions once she was out of the grotto. Sousa was only 17 and trying to save the life of someone. As for whether that someone should have been so lucky, and continues to behave in a less than helpful manner is debatable. a good kid died.
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bullwinkle428 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. The initial reports stated that Tatiana attacked one of the brothers
first, and then Sousa (who was NOT taunting) attempted to distract her in an effort to save one of the Dahliwals, resulting in his death...
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sdfernando Donating Member (421 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 04:00 PM
Response to Reply #10
25. Meant to reply to posting #1
My bad. I meant to reply to posting #1 where it was posited that the victim should get the Darwin Award. Sorry for the confusion.
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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 01:55 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. seriously, I heard neither one of the survivors were talking to investigators
what was our first clue?

What moron would taunt a tiger??
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geardaddy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. In the first account,
it says they were taunting the lion.
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Richard Steele Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #6
19. I think it's very telling when "victims" refuse to cooperate with an investigation.
It really doesn't take a rocket surgeon to figure out
why these 3 were attacked by that tiger.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Richard Steele Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. That's the most pathetically disgusting 'dishonest comparison' I've seen on DU in a long time.
Just when I think it isn't possible to think
any less of you, you prove me wrong.
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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. You just don't like it because I hit the nail on the head.
Too bad for you.
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Richard Steele Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #24
26. I don't like it when your pathetic cries for attention cross the line into offensive libel.
Normally, your childish ashattery is worthy of nothing
more than being ignored. Therefore, I ignore it.

But when you grow so desperate that you begin dishonestly insinuating
that I hold such a disgustingly reprehensible opinion as THAT, you've
gone beyond the bounds of that which I can politely overlook in light
of your cripplingly juvenile fixations.

NO ONE here truly believes that I hold any such opinion; not even you.
To claim that I do is nothing but an insult, and a desperately silly one.
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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 04:18 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. You've really not got any ground to be standing on...
pretending to be offended.

You're blaming the victim pure and simple. You even used quotation marks, as if the kids hadn't really been mauled.

It's pretty disgusting.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 04:27 PM
Response to Reply #19
29. Why do you Victims in quotes? Is the one who was killed a victim or "victim"? Why? nt
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Richard Steele Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Because it seems clear to me that...
...the people who were injured in this situation
were actually the ones responsible for creating it.

I put that word in quotes to indicate that I was using it SARCASTICALLY,
because it greatly annoys me to see people claim that these fellows
were just some innocent zoo-goers who got mauled for no reason.

They were not truly victims, IMHO, just some guys who did something foolish
and suffered a direct (albeit rare and unlikely) consequence of their foolishness.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. Sounds like you are believing NYPost's story, not others saying "rumors"
Or the zoo for not making sure enclosure was safe.

http://cbs5.com/pets/mark.geragos.tiger.2.622097.html
It had been previously reported that slingshots were found among men's possessions following the attack, fueling speculation that the weapons were used to antagonize the tiger. However, SFPD spokesman Steve Mennina says police did not find any slingshots at the scene of the tiger attack.
(clip)
"The bottom line is that you are always going to get kids who taunt the animals. The zoo has a duty to make things safe. The zoo should have made the enclosures safe for all foreseeable users. Not all users of the zoo will be model citizens."
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Richard Steele Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. I don't need to see any articles at all. The "victims'" behavior only tells ONE possible tale.
They purport to be the innocent victims of a random animal attack,
yet when questioned by the cops investigating that attack, they
refuse to answer any questions.

There's just no reason for that, unless they fear that cooperating
would incriminate them.
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caligirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 01:52 PM
Response to Original message
2. MSNBC just aired the story with a local reporter who didn't give the details
as clearly as she should have. she said the witness said there were four people and they were taunting the tiger. But the witness said only the pair of brothers did the taunting. She said Sousa actually apologized for their behavior. What a waste. I feel bad for Sousa and Tatiana, the brothers less so.
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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 01:54 PM
Response to Original message
3. Looks like the zoo's fucked.
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judaspriestess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
7. humans snap on a regular basis and go on a rampage
so why can't a wild animal after being provoked? they most likely taunted her, she snapped and her killer instinct took over. Its unfortunate that the beautiful animal was killed and the teenager lost his life. It was a fatal cocktail with just the right mix of ingredients resulting in a tragedy.

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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 02:11 PM
Response to Original message
11. Taunting LION, friend gets killed by TIGER.
Several things, please edit your post to follow rules 3-4 paragraphs only for copyright thing.
Secondly, the slngshot thing is only a rumor, as was the "blood and shoe inside enclosure", local news says slingshots are only a rumor and the other has been proven false.
Thirdly, taunting a LION and friend gets killed by a TIGER.

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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
12. Mark Geragos has arrived to clear things up
:sarcasm:
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avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. I think a little more of this is in order
:sarcasm:
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
13. Please edit your post to follow the copyright rules of 4 paragraphs.
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niyad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 03:06 PM
Response to Original message
15. maybe it's time to question the whole zoo mentality. I hate seeing animals in cages, no matter
how nice their "habitat".

nearly got kicked out of the san diego wildlife reserve once--every time the docent talked about how endangered one of the species was, I asked who was responsible for hunting it to near extinction.

there are, without a doubt, a great many unanswered questions in this very sad event.
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. On the other hand
people get an understanding of how beautiful these creatures are -- can't compare to TV or photographs -- and it may foster attempts at conservation.

:shrug:
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niyad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. would hope that you are right. however, look at things like this-- sea world, for
example. no doubt those beautiful beings are well cared for. however, whales in their native oceans can live 50 years or so, and they travel hundreds and hundreds of miles in those oceans. in the aquariums, their life span is about 5-10 years, and those tanks are very samll (figures quoted by a docent at the san diego sea world when I was there to see a concert)
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #18
28. Agree, especially when orcas/porpoises are made to perform
cute human tricks. Anyone who enjoys watching that should seek help.

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niyad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #28
33. i HATE seeing any creature made to perform tricks for the amusement of humans.
whether elephants, lions, tigers, or even dogs. the only things my dog was tuaght were things for his safety. "roll over, fetch, etc" were NOT taught.

hate circuses, too, for the same reason. the ONLY circus I will watch is cirque de soleil, which is performance art, not circus.
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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 03:46 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. agree with you 100%
I don't like zoos either. Any of them.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
17. You know, growing up in NYC and going to the Bronx Zoo as a kid...
in the days before the animals had a sort of "habitat", they were in the horrible cages, pacing back and forth from sheer boredom.

One day, I was there with my dad and it was feeding time. I was about 9. The keepers would throw in these huge hunks of meat. If you had never been to feeding time at the tiger cages, it was a truly terrifying view to behold.

Aside from the ear splitting roars of the tigers, those big cats ripped into that meat like it as nothing. Needless to say, although my parents taught me to respect animals, I had never been so scared in my life.

They knew the meat was coming and would throw themselves up against the bars to try and get to it. Seeing a 400+ pound creature with huge teeth and claws do something like that is both awe inspiring and frightening.

It was one of those moment when I was hiding behind my dad, but at the same time, I couldn't take my eyes off of them.

After we left the "tiger house", my dad said to me, "now you see why you aren't supposed to disturb the animals". You bet I did.
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Garbo 2004 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-03-08 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
20. UK Telegraph cites info police have already denied & cites NY Post report, not NYT report.
Edited on Thu Jan-03-08 03:39 PM by Garbo 2004
The New York Post, not the NYT, "broke" the story that slinghots were found, citing a single anonymous source as I recall.

SFPD yesterday said the slingshots claims were "merely a rumor" and denied that slingshots were found. SFPD spokesman did confirm an empty vodka bottle was found in the car.

SFPC also denied days ago that blood and a shoe were found in the tiger enclosure. SFPD said they did find a shoe print on a railing and they were going to compare it to the shoes of the victims.

The Telegraph cobbled together a story from other outlets, but still managed to misidentify a media source and didn't include that the SFPD had already denied some of the claims of previous media reports.
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