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CountAllVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 05:52 PM
Original message
Obama says he's been against war from the start
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 06:13 PM by CountAllVotes
I just sent in my absentee ballet and I am no longer "undecided" as I have been for sometime now.

I have always been against the war from the very beginning.

Obama would have voted against the war unlike the other two running against him. He spoke about it in fact (see below for quote).

http://www.globegazette.com/articles/2007/03/22/state/doc4601ff91652a5568475410.txt

So, being Obama was smart enough to see that a vote for this war was not the right thing to do (long before 2003 in fact) he is certainly smart enough to be my next and your next president too!

If it was not for this "war", we would have no "sub-prime" crisis nor massive inflation nor $100 a barrel oil nor constant death and destruction. It would be a better world and America might not be so "hated".

I am ready for this change and I will embrace it!

OBAMA '08! I can hardly wait!!

ON EDIT: My apologies for messing up this thread. My eyesight isn't what it used to be and I think I need new glasses (that I cannot afford of course just like everyone else these days)! I hope Obama has plans to provide health insurance for everyone!



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skipos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 05:53 PM
Response to Original message
1. I wish I could have voted for Obama today. Instead I voted "uncommited"
which is about the same as NOT HILLARY.
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CountAllVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 05:55 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. why could you not vote for Obama?
?

Are you registered as something else? :shrug:
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skipos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. The MI primary is a total mess. See the link in my sig. nt
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bigwillq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. Vote Kucinich in MI!
:bounce:
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skipos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #11
32. I don't want Kucinich to be President
so the best I can do is vote for UNCOMMITTED.
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bigwillq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 05:55 PM
Response to Original message
2. When did Obama vote against the war?
:shrug:

Obama was still a state senator in 2003. What are you talking about?
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. I think Poster is referring to this speech.....
(of course, I can post the speech of the others running)...



Delivered on 26 October 2002 at an anti-war rally

I don’t oppose all wars. And I know that in this crowd today, there is no shortage of patriots, or of patriotism. What I am opposed to is a dumb war. What I am opposed to is a rash war. What I am opposed to is the cynical attempt by Richard Perle and Paul Wolfowitz and other arm-chair, weekend warriors in this Administration to shove their own ideological agendas down our throats, irrespective of the costs in lives lost and in hardships borne.

What I am opposed to is the attempt by political hacks like Karl Rove to distract us from a rise in the uninsured, a rise in the poverty rate, a drop in the median income – to distract us from corporate scandals and a stock market that has just gone through the worst month since the Great Depression.

That’s what I’m opposed to. A dumb war. A rash war. A war based not on reason but on passion, not on principle but on politics.

Now let me be clear – I suffer no illusions about Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal man. A ruthless man. A man who butchers his own people to secure his own power. He has repeatedly defied UN resolutions, thwarted UN inspection teams, developed chemical and biological weapons, and coveted nuclear capacity.

He’s a bad guy. The world, and the Iraqi people, would be better off without him.

But I also know that Saddam poses no imminent and direct threat to the United States, or to his neighbors, that the Iraqi economy is in shambles, that the Iraqi military a fraction of its former strength, and that in concert with the international community he can be contained until, in the way of all petty dictators, he falls away into the dustbin of history.

I know that even a successful war against Iraq will require a US occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences. I know that an invasion of Iraq without a clear rationale and without strong international support will only fan the flames of the Middle East, and encourage the worst, rather than best, impulses of the Arab world, and strengthen the recruitment arm of al-Qaeda.

I am not opposed to all wars. I’m opposed to dumb wars.

So for those of us who seek a more just and secure world for our children, let us send a clear message to the president today. You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s finish the fight with Bin Laden and al-Qaeda, through effective, coordinated intelligence, and a shutting down of the financial networks that support terrorism, and a homeland security program that involves more than color-coded warnings.

You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s fight to make sure that the UN inspectors can do their work, and that we vigorously enforce a non-proliferation treaty, and that former enemies and current allies like Russia safeguard and ultimately eliminate their stores of nuclear material, and that nations like Pakistan and India never use the terrible weapons already in their possession, and that the arms merchants in our own country stop feeding the countless wars that rage across the globe.

You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s fight to make sure our so-called allies in the Middle East, the Saudis and the Egyptians, stop oppressing their own people, and suppressing dissent, and tolerating corruption and inequality, and mismanaging their economies so that their youth grow up without education, without prospects, without hope, the ready recruits of terrorist cells.

You want a fight, President Bush? Let’s fight to wean ourselves off Middle East oil, through an energy policy that doesn’t simply serve the interests of Exxon and Mobil.

Those are the battles that we need to fight. Those are the battles that we willingly join. The battles against ignorance and intolerance. Corruption and greed. Poverty and despair.

The consequences of war are dire, the sacrifices immeasurable. We may have occasion in our lifetime to once again rise up in defense of our freedom, and pay the wages of war. But we ought not – we will not – travel down that hellish path blindly. Nor should we allow those who would march off and pay the ultimate sacrifice, who would prove the full measure of devotion with their blood, to make such an awful sacrifice in vain.
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Barack_Obama's_Iraq_Speech




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CountAllVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. this is the part that did it for me
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 06:18 PM by CountAllVotes
“I prefer not to, you know, state it in the negative. I’m, I think, making an affirmative statement about my judgment when it came to this critical issue,” Obama said.

Obama on Wednesday also pointed to his 2002 speech at an anti-war rally in Chicago, which he said has turned out to be a “fairly accurate assessment of the consequences of invading.”

According to a speech text provided by the campaign, Obama outlined the dangers of military action in Iraq.

“That’s what I’m opposed to,” he said at the time. “A dumb war. A rash war. A war based not on reason but on passion, not on principle but on politics.”

http://www.globegazette.com/articles/2007/03/22/state/doc4601ff91652a5568475410.txt

After reading this story and Obama's claim that he would have voted against the war, I have no doubts now as to who the right person is to end this war and get America back on the right track!

I hope this act is not being ignored because it was what caused me to vote for him. I was leaning towards Edwards but I had reservations. Clinton - I really couldn't go it with her either. Both of them voted YES for the war; Obama could not at the time but he came out and spoke against in in 2002.

We'll see I guess but yeah, Obama was against the war in 2003! That is the most important thing to me.
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bigwillq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Then you need to change
your original message. Obama didn't vote for or against the IWR but he certainly voted to fund it.
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golddigger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:05 PM
Response to Reply #7
15. Ok, now I stand by my snarky post!
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golddigger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #5
12. Please accept my apology for the snarky remark.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:05 PM
Response to Reply #5
14. Plus he's got good political instinct......
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 06:06 PM by FrenchieCat
Unlike some others.

Example:

Barack gave his 8 pt. ahead Victory speech in Iowa with an audience vibrant and energized, like one wouldn't believe.

Hillary gave her 3rd place speech in Iowa with sober crowd who fit exactly the mantra, "old boss, meet the new boss"

MSM mentioned it as not the best clinton idea.

Barack gives his 2.5% loss conceding speech in NH. Again, wonderfully done.

Hillary gives her (was at a 20 pt advantage for a year) victory speech. Guess what? New backdrop. Words like yes we can change, blah, blah....words harvested from both Obama and Edwards.

What's the difference between the two?

One's an original fresh thinker with good sound judgement that comes naturally,
The other one....not so much.

One's a leader
The other follows.

It really is that simple.

:hi:
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #14
21. So vote for the televangelist who can best sway you?
Vote for the speech???? It's only simple if ...well, some people can't cope with complex. Women know instinctively about complexity. Men do tend to like things reduced to simple.

But it's not a simple world with simple problems. It's a complex word with very complicated problems. I think I'll vote for someone who gets that.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:17 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. You are talking about the man from Hope who preached
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:30 PM
Response to Reply #23
35. Oh, so Obama is COPYING Bill Clinton?
Well, everyone should have a role model.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #35
38. No....Bill had real hope.....
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 06:46 PM by FrenchieCat
Obama, has false hope.

Not everyone's hopes are equal.

There lies the difference according to the Clinton campaign. :sarcasm:
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CountAllVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:44 PM
Response to Reply #38
39. how do you know?
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 06:45 PM by CountAllVotes
It is Obama's feeling, not yours, not mine, not anyone's but his. He cares to share his hope and his optimism with the world.

What is wrong with this? In fact, if anything, we need more of this, HOPE.

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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:45 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. I was being sarcastic.....I'll add that emoticon.....
I agree with you!
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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:24 PM
Response to Reply #21
30. Televangelists?
You mean the guys who pretend to cry to gain sympathy?

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bigwillq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. Nice speech
but if Obama thinks war is so bad, why does Obama continue to fund it? :shrug:
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golddigger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Another uninformed voter...
casting his vote.:shrug:
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #2
36. He SAID he would NOT HAVE had he been there.
And we absolutely believe him (*cough* PRESENT *cough*) because the canny home buyer never lies.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:02 PM
Response to Original message
9. He did not "vote against it." He opposed it, but he wasn't in the Senate, thus, he did not vote.
I hope that his stated intent is sufficient for you, and you weren't basing your support on a vote that did not happen.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:08 PM
Response to Reply #9
17. It isn't simply the votes that counted......
it was a question of who would even speak out.

Those who did, where ever they were, got it right.

Those who sat when they could have stood, got it wrong.

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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #17
28. I'm not about to interpret this voter's 'feelings'--he/she said that the reason for voting for BO
was an "antiwar vote" that never happened.

My statement was what it was--I hope the voter can live with the fact that there was no vote, and the candidate 'said' he didn't like the war.

Others here have pointed out that BO is funding a war he says he doesn't like. That's just fact, and the voter can take it onboard or ignore it.

The voter didn't do any research, apparently, before voting. It was an uninformed selection. Hopefully BO's 'general' philosophies are close enough to the voter's to make up for that failure to vet the candidate.
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CountAllVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. I researched Obama enough to know ...
that I prefer him to Hillary. Edwards doesn't have a chance.

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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:29 PM
Response to Reply #31
33. In that case, you'll be happy with your choice even though you got your facts wrong. NT
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helderheid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:03 PM
Response to Original message
13. Obama voted against the war? He wasn't in the Senate to make that vote and has voted to fund it
ever since.
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CountAllVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. he was against the war
see corrected comments ...

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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. Don't mind them......
You chose an excellent candidate.

An original thinker who knows how to organize and knows how to lead
taking our cues.

I hope for a new day in America soon.

We are in dire need of it.

Peace!
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helderheid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #16
26. I wish he didn't continue to vote to fund it. That said, he's my 2nd choice.
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CountAllVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #26
29. Obama would not have had this decision to make
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 06:23 PM by CountAllVotes
if the "war" had never happened he'd not need to worry about voting to continue to fund it.

I'm not talking about his votes to fund the war. That is a whole other thing IMO. It is sort of a damned if you do and damned if you don't sort of an issue.

Had we no troops to support because enough people in the Senate had voted against it to begin with, this would therefore not be an issue.

WHAT IF THERE WAS A WAR AND NOBODY CAME?



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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:12 PM
Response to Original message
19. Good for you.
I think it's a shame that anybody who pretends to be against the war would even consider otherwise.

I think people who voted for the IWR should be facing prison time, not the most powerful office in the world.
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bigwillq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. What about those who consistently vote
to fund the war? :shrug:
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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. Them too.
Fortunately, Obama does not consistently vote to fund the war.

:shrug:
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golddigger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. Chirp! Chirp! Chirp!
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Didereaux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:18 PM
Response to Original message
24. He has voted YAY fro every single war funding bill...that seems to negate any opposition to war
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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:30 PM
Response to Reply #24
34. Wrong again.
He voted Nay on H.R. 2206 and refuses to vote for any funding that does not have a discrete withdrawal plan.

And that confirms his opposition to the war.
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:20 PM
Response to Original message
27. What did Obama do re: Iran?
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 06:22 PM by WinkyDink
"Obama skipped the vote to campaign in New Hampshire but issued a statement that day saying he would have voted no."
http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:LnCUMOTvfiIJ:apnews.myway.com/article/20071012/D8S7DA5O0.html+obama+iran+vote&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=9&gl=us

He talks swell.
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unc70 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:33 PM
Response to Reply #27
37. Obama absent on Iran (K-L), speech inspires us to believe he opposed
and

Obama opposed the Iraq war before he voted to continue it.

and

Obama sees US special ops operations in Iraq continuing indefinitely, even through the end of his first term. It is all about the meaning of "combat"; he apparently defines it so that Green Berets, Seals, etc. are not "combat" (while I think they are extreme combat).


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