Geico cavemen offensive?

I had a discussion with a co-worker today and we hit on the Geico cavemen ads.

His take was that the commercial provides a safe outlet for racist, bigoted people to laugh at people that complain about prejudice. He said that while many people would not dare laugh in public at a black person's objection to the "N word," they can safely laugh at the caveman's silly "PC" objections. His feeling was that laughing at those struggles legitimizes oppression.

... I just thought they were mildly funny commercials.... I'll take the roast duck...

What do you guys think?

I like the British-accented gecko, but the caveman campaign is a bore.

is my favorite!

He's an arrogant and smarmy amphibian with a phony Australian accent.

I'd love him more if the neighbor's cat (my buddy for play and treats) brings me back his widdle carcass as a TROPHY gift. Sort of, "Look Mom, I destroyed that nasty gecko, just for you." Now that's love. :loveya: :puke: :loveya:

On Edit: I forgot :sarcasm:

Like Grant Mitchell or Ian or Mark from EastEnders.

Cuppa tea?

:blush: Thanks for making me smart. :hi:

That accent thing can be confusing.

Care for some Gecko filet?

I hate that fucking lizard

if over-analysis does the same thing....

Right on:)

But I guess one can find a Bogey man where ever one chooses to look....

something it isn't.

People need to quit sweating the small stuff. Save their outrage and umbrage for the really important crap.

outrage and umbrage, more than enough to spare a dollop for the small stuff!

come off like jerks - they seem to come across worse to me than the caveman

I also think that one or two of them are a critique of the talking head phenomena. Where the discussion is obviously distorted to the point that you would probably take the opposing side side if they were putting Nixon down. Where the shrillness and over-statement don't win any converts

back against his shrink, it totally points out what a bigot she is.

The commercials are clever, and surprisingly well done. They may not be your cup of tea, but guess what...they're being discussed and analyzed on a message board with hundreds of thousands of viewers. That's all Geico cares about, believe me. The name is out there.

(And actually, I have Geico insurance, and they really are cheap...my rates have gone DOWN the last three billing cycles).

.

Like you, mine has gone DOWN.

for driving too fast for conditions--rear-ended me in a snow storm). I have American Family now. There's a reason Geico is so cheap.

;)

Agreed. He nails her right to the wall.

I hate 99.9% of commercials but I do laugh at the caveman commercials.

I should put her on speaker"

pokes fun at the analyst AND the analyzed...

It's just perfect.

They said I don't have a sense of humor, and that the OSAMA/OBAMA jokes are funny as long as they're on a show they really like.

Now we're analyzing whether caveman jokes are offensive?

This whole place gets offensive sometimes!

.

That your outrage over the question is far more amusing than the commercials...

It was a joke at the expense of morons who would get the two confused.

I guess that's too high a concept for some people to understand, though. :eyes:

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Sadly, they're against DU rules.

You didn't like the joke because you felt it was "drumming the "OSAMA" meme into the public's head." I, and many others, have pointed out to you that the joke was on the person conflating the two - she's regularly depicted as an out-and-out moron and both Carlson and Matthews were openly laughing *at* her after calling her stupid earlier in the segment. It was making people who would conflate the two out to be buffoons worthy of nothing more than open contempt - and you're saying it will make people more likely to conflate the two.

:eyes: indeed.

You went after me personally simply because I have a difference of opinion. WTF is that all about?

.

Thanks for using the correct terminology, I'd appreciate it.

--Cave Man

You cavemen are sooooo sensitive!

.

It's all an act, I'm afraid.

Er, It's a good way to pick up girls.

CAVE girls that is. I don't go in for the skinny blond types.

Well, that is to say, I really think all women are beautiful.

I don't discriminate against physical types, I just feel like
CAVE women can see into my soul.

I'm really all masculine inside and secretly insensitive and brusque. Um, do women like that in a cave man?

--Cave Man

That's funnier than all of 'em put together! Are you using one of them new 'puters that places the writer's emotions, emphasis, nuance and facial expressions? Must be for you to glean such information from three sentences! :rofl: Outrage...you've obviously never read one of my "outrage" posts.

.

constitutes a fair amount of "outrage" - even on my old 'puter....

The poster chose to attack me personally about a difference of opinion over a tv show, when he demonstrated pretty clearly in a later post that he was perfectly capable of getting his point across without resorting to name calling.

In my book, that's acting like a dick. No outrage, although if you want to picture me sitting at my desk with veins popping on my forehead and steam coming out my ears, you go right ahead.

.

By showing the caveman trying to convince psychiatrists, news shows, and business execs that they were discriminating against him, and by the refusal of these establishment figures to understand his objections, they were showing the struggles that victims of discrimination go through.

That's odd, I think they are very clever and barely subtle criticisms or racism in America, your friend thinks the opposite. I guess they can be seen both ways. But the caveman is clearly the sympathetic character in every one of them.

I'm just glad when they stop using that stupid little talking gecko.

There was a feature on the ad company that makes the commercials for Geiko on CBS Sunday Morning last Sunday. They are running three separate campaigns at once: the gecko, the caveman, and the celebrity spokesmen. Each one is aimed at a different segment of the market. The ad agency is out of Virginia, I think.

but maybe if I listened to the geko closer I might find that if one is willing to listen to a geko about insurance...even one with a charming Aussie accent...I might just be stupid enough to like the commercials so much I buy the insurance.

it's cockney/east ender.

I thought the Snickers ad was funny. :shrug:

and made everyone involved look ridiculous

that is my take on it also and remarkably an insurance company is promoting it. Maybe Geico can develop and propose a comprehensive insurance program that does not discriminate against anyone? Also put the Australian accent back there are no geckos in England but there are in Australia.

The later ones have run it into the ground, it seems. I don't see anything offensive in the ad campaign in particular.

I kind of liked the one where they went to dinner with the Geico rep and the one with the psychiatrist.

Otherwise, I don't find them all that amusing and they certainly don't entice me to switch to Geico.

I'm, frankly, a little in love with that main cave-guy. I think he's cool -- hangs out at a singles bar, appears at the airport with his squash racket, sees a shrink for his problems with his mother.

:blush:

Harr!

:rofl:

The one where he is minding his own business, riding the moving sidewalk at the airport, looking at his tickets is a classic as far as I am concerned. There is no talking in the whole commercial, just his facial expressions and body-language (also has a great soundtrack). It is priceless...

I actually think I can recognize the exact spot it was filmed.

Where she is walking through the airport.

*ba-doom*.

Oh, wait...that was probably offensive.

.

"I'm not bad... I'm just built that way."

Sorry...this is a family web site. I can't tell you the punchline.

:hi:

Besides...that's just another caveman stereotype, I'm sure, perpetuated by old tv sitcoms. Really, really old ones.

.

I have to hum along with it every time it comes on.

the line "it's my mother, I'll put her on speaker" got a laugh from both me and my husband. People need ot lighten up.

They're the only commercials I will stop and watch.

the body language of the main cave man is brilliant.

The dude playing the caveman has it so down!

The airport one cracks me up every time and I love that song!

stop talking to each other completely. Since everything can be taken as offensive by someone then we should just revert back to nodding hello ....then again some people would find offense in that as well.

Those commercials just get on my last nerve and the stupid thing rambles on and on and on.

When the caveman says to the therapist that he'll put his mother on speaker-phone? Brilliant!

(And that would be: Ohfergawdssake.)

do you think the creative team that made the first caveman commercial had any idea that the caveman would become a series of commercials?

doubt it. but evidently, enough people like the cavemen.

i like them. they aren't hysterically funny, they just make my smile. i like seeing a new one.

The urbane, sophisticated caveman--indeed, I'll take the roast duck--goes through life seeing nothing but Geico "So easy a caveman can do it" ads. These are clever, intelligent entertainment.

A cell phone rings. "It's my mother. I'll put it on speaker," he says to his analyst who has just shined him on.

Great stuff, there.

The best one? Possibly the ad with Caveman (with squash racket) at the airport on the moving walkway tooling past a Geico Caveman ad. The timing on that ad is perfection. And not one word is spoken during the entire ad.

as the caveman does the double take and walks back on the walkway to check out the ad.

There's always something to remind me....

Sounds like a sofa from Ikea.

My daughter is OBSESSED with them.

http://www.astralwerks.com/royksopp/

I know a handful of people who can't get that song out of their head. At least now they'll know the whole song instead of that one or two lines :P

My 15-year old has their music as her alarm/ringtone, I hear it
every morning/several times, but I don't mind....

The band members are kind of cute and nordic-y!

The expressions and body language of those cavemen are perfect, and they have only a few seconds to deliver while acting past all that makeup.

I love the caveman ads. They're the only ads I watch all the way through every time they come on.

I don't find them offensive.

You can go here and visit his house. You can click on different parts of the house and see how he lives. Click on the cookbook in the kitchen. :)

http://www.cavemanscrib.com/

oops, i clicked on the door with the tie hanging from the knob.


:rofl:

that's great - thanks!

I clicked on the shower in the bathroom and flushed the toilet while he was in the shower. He wasn't very happy with me. :)

Thanks for sharing, that's too funny! :rofl:

it points out that nearly everyone has un-conscious prejudices. I think they are amusing.

Tho I don't really know what they have to do with insurance.

He's the type that thinks African Americans should be rounded up & shipped back to Africa. Only, he wouldn't use the word "African-American" or even "black" (I've never met the guy, but my friends are not one to exaggerate something like this)

But, he was complaining to these guys I know that the commercial is racist against cave men.

Since I'm only vaguely familiar with the commercial, I'd have to say that since this bigoted guy hates it, it must be okay.

I interpreted your post wrong....

He's laid up after major surgery...but the guys were really mocking the bigoted guy over the Geico commercial. I think the guy's point was - if it's okay to be racist against cavemen, why is it not okay for him to be racist against n-------



:argh:

that my buddy was targeting with his comments.

here on DU. I don't want anyone telling me what I can and can't chuckle at, where I can and can't find irony.

The people he appealed to here in the US were always too offended by his comments to give him a chance and realize he was on their side.

As another poster noted, it did the job of getting noticed and people talking about it.

The idea of a metrosexual, educated, sensitive caveman is classic.

BTW, I have GEICO and am very happy with them and their service.

A lot of PC objections should be ridiculed.


edited for clarity

I think they point out the bigotry more than not. And they do a pretty good job at showing what it's like to be the "caveman" (seeing the offensive poster at the airport, having your shrink question why you're upset about it, etc.) I've laughed at all of them.

Plus, I would consider Geico when my insurance cycle is up. Maybe that says something.

They might be neanderthal. But, they live in apartments, lofts and houses. That means they are NOT cavemen.

It's a stupid concept and if it's offensive, it's because it insults my intellgence.
The Professor

I can be offended about then. Therefore, I just get to be entertained. You lose. I win!

Jealous of this dumb bunny now Doc?

perpetually insulted. Doesn't pretty much all advertising insult your intelligence?

I don't blame you, but I do find it amusing.

and the beaver and the sleepless guy. Everyone knows that the beaver should be the one making the coffee.



:rofl:

(ObGD: Neil Boortz once attempted to open a liquor store with that name. Don't sue me!)

of that commercial? Look really closely -- it's an ongoing debate in our house.

I love that commercial

(interesting that they don't mention WHY it's the only sleeping aid with absolutely NO potential for addiction - because it's melatonin, and it works best when your sleep cycle is messed up vs. when it's anxiety or depression or some other reason for not sleeping)

there that I had missed, but since it's filmed from a distance, it's hard to say.

My husband loves the part where Abe is tossing papers (cards?) at the beaver (beaver, muskrat?) "Grow up!" :spray:

rather than a real stovepipe hat, but I could be reading too much into it. I like the beaver/muskrat's attitude.

I still think the figures sitting at the all-night diner have animal heads.....

on a pilgrim. Heh, heh, they were pretty clever trying to recreate the bizarre places that dreams can take us. Also, my apologies to the OP...not trying to hijack Caveman by Abe Lincoln. :)

<teasing> :rofl:

I love the Caveman Commercials! It doesn't make Geico insurance appeal to me any more and I'm happy with USAA, but I love the main caveman's facial expressions. :rofl:

My FAV is where he's walking along a people mover and passes a poster, "So Easy, a Caveman can do it? The look on the guy's face is PRECIOUS. I crack up laughing every time I see that one commercial.

Yeah, I'm a goofy broad but I love that character. :-)

The ad where he's on the talk show just slays me every time, when he responds to the blonde woman saying "sounds like somebody got up on the wrong side of the rock." He doesn't say a word, but his body language is hilarious. And the shrink, where his phone rings, and he says "it's my mother - I'll put in on speaker." mr liberty and I crack up every time.

That gecko annoys the absolute crap out of me, though.

:hide:

:rofl:

And before anyone gets their dander up, that's actually a reference to "A Hard Day's Night" - not anything else!

nt

...Geico is subtley poking fun at.

But let's be real: their main goal is to advertise the ease of having a Geico policy, not to make social commentary.

where he is in the airport and sees the poster. I think they are funny.

I enjoy the humor inherent in portraying the cavemen
as far more 'evolved' than the people running large
corporations & the media.

But I'm sure a RACIST could enjoy the fact that the
cavemen are constantly belittled and never get a break;
the commercials could be seen as mocking those "touchy,
thin-skinned cavemen who can't take a joke".

way they want to, so they give opportunities to interpret them in multiple, different ways and appeal to the broadest audience possible.

the caveman ads - but in the latter, where are the cavewomen?

That gecko was never amusing, but always annoying.

on the people mover moving past a picture of himself. For God's sake, let them chew on the Anna Nicole/Brittany saga for awhile.

Tell 'em to get a life.

:D

just being silly.

In the ads, I mean. Just sayin' :shrug:

:evilgrin:

Well, as much as I "love" any commercials. They're funny on several levels.

I'm also fond of the Capital One Barbarians & hope for a commercial in which they pummel David Spade--another Capital One spokesman.

Watching the barbarians beat the crap out of Spade would be awesome.

Who are these other people telling them to lighten up?

:rofl:

ROFL

Those and the Mac/PC ones are the only commercials I will stop fast-scanning and back up to see while watching something I've recorded.

The objections you mention would never have occurred to me, and I am adequately sensitive.

sulking out on the balcony.

I don't quite get it ... is he mad at the people at the party, or what?

I've been there...

Partially drunk and way too serious in a deep discussion with a friend at a party. Then someone had the unmitigated gall to interrupt and I went for his throat...

... happened a few times in college when I was way too involved with my own importance.

I was actually kind of impressed at the way they captured the moment.

Product A is offensive to group B

Group B decides to Boycott product A

Member of group B breaks the boycott and buys product A anyway

Group B is mad at the wayward member.

Wayward member is mad at group B because they are mad at him.





oyyyyyyyyyy......... I need coffee and an Advil now.

The way he turns it around on the therapist. She wants him to just "lighten up", but when he asks her to place herself in his position, she can not. Thereby proving his point.

"well, that commercial wouldn't make any sense to me."

Note: While there is a pounding beat in the background, the
song is spoken rather than sung

What we're gonna do right here is go back, way back, back into time.
When the only people that existed were troglodytes...cave men...
cave WOMEN!...Neanderthal!...TROGLODYTES...! Let's take the average
cave man at home, listening to his stereo. Sometimes he'd get up,
try to do his thing. He'd begin to move, something like this:
"Dance...dance". When he got tired of dancing alone, he'd look
in the mirror: "Gotta find a woman gotta find a woman gotta find a
woman gotta find a woman". He'd go down to the lake where all the
woman would be swimming or washing clothes or something. He'd look
around and just reach in, and grab one. "Come here...come here".

He'd grab her by the hair. You can't do that today, fellas, cause
it might come off. You'd have a piece of hair in your hand and she'd
be swimming away from you (ha-ha). This one woman just lay there,
wet and frightened. He said: "Move...move". She got up. She was a
big woman. BIG woman. Her name was Bertha. Bertha Butt. She was one
of the Butt sisters. He didn't care. He looked up at her and said:
"Sock it to me sock it to me sock it to me sock it to me sock it to me
sock it to me sock it to me sock it to me!". She looked down on him.
She was ready to crush him, but she began to like him. She said
(falsetto):
"I'll sock it to ya, Daddy". He said: "WHUh?". She said (falsetto):
"I'll sock it to ya, Daddy". You know what he said? He started it
WAY back then. I wouldn't lie to you. When she said (falsetto)
"I'll sock it to ya, Daddy" he said "Right on! Right on! Hotpants! Hotpants! Ugh...ugh...ugh".

UGH...UGH...YEAH!

TROGLODYTE (CAVE MAN)
by Jimmy Castor

Note the appalling misogyny and insensitivity towards cave WOMEN here.

More evidence that "cave man lyrics" are just plain WRONG

The gag was on political correctness and how hypersensitive minorities are.

But the last dozen or so commercials has people sympathizing with the cavemen.

The show being parodied was obviously O'Reilly.

Oh, wait, you mean the ad exec one.

No, I think that was a reference to real-life events in which white people dressed up as Indians were used as mascots and campaign spokesmen, etc.

and the promoters said "I'm sorry, I had no idea you guys were still around" when real-life Native Americans complained. There are still people who think their ancestors successfully killed off all the Indians so they don't need to feel bad about it.

"After all, they are a defeated people", as the homecoming queen of a small North Dakota high school recently said, when asked why the Lakota students were not invited to the homecoming celebration.

"After all, they are a defeated people", as the homecoming queen of a small North Dakota high school recently said, when asked why the Lakota students were not invited to the homecoming celebration.

One argument I heard repeatedly with respect to the recently removed Chief Illiniwek of the U of Illinois was: "They should be happy--if it weren't the chief, nobody would even remember them" :eyes:

cavemen? That one was definitely a dig at being offended.

In fact, all literature, television, movies, music, religion and humor reflect and promote the bigoted, hateful, oppressive attitudes that victimize everyone in our culture except straight white males, who even when they are the targets of hate speech are laughing all the way to the bank. THEY are the real cavemen, aren't they?

We should ban all speech everywhere PREEMPTIVELY, before it has the chance to offend some helpless oppressed person.

sometimes a commercial is just a commercial.

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. :shrug:

They're funny and make fun of racists.

Even a caveman can see that!

I don't regard them as humorous, either. While I'm not a fan of taking offense where none is intended, I'm also not in favor of reducing the whole notion of ethnically demeaning characterizations to a joke. It's my view that those ads are, in some part, indicative of an advertising industry wishing to give itself license to exploit ethnic stereotypes in service to profit. The ads have absolutely nothing to do with GEICO and everything to do with a "public disservice" commercial saying "stop busting our chops for making fun of minorities."

So, I see them as a form of meta-exploitation - anything in service to corporatism.

that you won't join us? Tina's here and we're all getting together? :shrug: :yoiks:

normalize racism and bigotry. I don't think they do.

--Marlena Dietrich

UGGH!! AAAARGHH!

"Aiiiiiii - oh, sweet mystery of Geico, at last I've found you..."

Anyone who is offended just underscores the point of the ad-that we are all way oversensitive.

I think it can be taken different ways, depending on the ads in question, but the "News Show" ad and the "Therapist" ad, in particular, seem to critique the insensitive, rather than the "oversensitive."

I went outside and my car was dead as a doornail. No juice at all. To top it off, when I tried to turn the key back to off, it wouldn't go. Now it's stuck in the ignition in the "on" position. Good thing the battery is already dead. Damned car has power everything, even mirror de-icers. This is why I hate power everything.

Anyway, it got worse...the hood wouldn't unlatch when I went to take the battery out! Suddenly, this silly Geico thread came to mind, and I thought "what the heck, might as well give it a try" and called and talked to a small British lizard. Oh, no, wait...it was a very nice woman with a heavy Southern accent. She put me on hold for a sec and came to inform me that they were sending out a repair truck, no out of pocket to me! She was extremely nice. And like I said in another post, my rate has gone DOWN the last three billings. I like Geico. Cavemen or not.

.

That's pretty good.

Geico commercials other than they're unique, and I only wish more of "mankind" was as intelligent, conscientious and empathic. They're a lot of fun as well. I think that in one way they seem to have an interesting take on evolution: as scientists are now showing that Neanderthal Man's evolution paralleled that of what is considered as Homo Sapiens, the Neanderthal eventually became extinct because they were not as savage, had higher brain functions and were definitely non-aggressive in comparison with HS.

The Geico guys pretty much show that if Neanderthal Man managed to survive, they would be a lot more acceptable in many situations than some of the knuckledraggers we know and despise. :)

My god due some people look into things wayyyyy too deeply. Sheesh.

The joke in that one's not on the caveman, it's on the shrink.

hell I find them mildly offensive, and your friend put the finger of why I find them milady offensive

The point is that the ad pokes fun a a bigoted ad campeign "So easy a caveman could do it". I thought it was rather clever, myself.

Next thing you know someone will be complaining about the Capital One Barbarians setting bad examples for children.

hit the nail on the head.

I think they are mildly funny and I never thought they meant anything particularly deep or insulting and I still don't.
Lee

The cavemens reactions were funny because they were the total opposite from what you would expect, based on my previous cavement predjudices :)

The commericals also show the caveman as intelligent and sophisticated while the people suggesting cavemen are stupid appear to be ignorant.

and watch it all blow up :)

hilarious. The face the caveman makes when the lady says "it sounds like someone woke up on the wrong side of the cave" is priceless! I'm laughing just thinking about it...

I've been amused by the ad campaign. I see it as low-grade satire. The campaigns satirizes our own guilts and neuroses by contrasting them against a neutral non-sequiter.

For example, your co-worker said the campaign is legitimizing oppression against black people. My first instinct was that it directed against the mentally-challenged. My mom's first impression was that it ridiculed the elderly.

Maybe each one of us puts our own, personal sacred-cow into the persona of the caveman and will feel at once both humor and guilt for feeling that humor.

After all, the caveman clearly has a point, and the campaign clearly misrepresents who cavemen are in our society. The people who don't get it, who make comments like "looks like someone got up on the wrong side of the rock" or "that commercial just wouldn't make sense to me" or "we had no idea you guys were still around" are the ones who come off poorly--remarkably similar, in my mind, to those who cried "get over it" or "you're overreacting" during the Biden/Snickers fiascoes. They're the real targets of the commercials, I think.

I think it's a stupid ad campaign, myself.

Perlman played a caveman in QUEST FOR FIRE without make up.

I don't think so. As a mixed-race lifeform on this planet, I've run into similar stuff.

you've run into stuff similar to what the cavemen have to put up with? (Or that you've run into lots of stuff similar to the campaign itself, and so it doesn't really offend you?)

Personally, I think the ad campaign makes fun of people who are insensitive and are blind to their own privilege/insensitivities. I think some of the commercials (esp. the therapist and news show clips) are pretty close to brilliant. :)

Welcome to DU :hi:

much more sophisticated and metrosexual than the so-called more advanced homo sapiens sapiens. So flame me.

for those who are willing to BE instructed, of course.

I do NOT think they're intended to be an outlet for racism.

Personally, I think they drive home how hurtful bigotry can be, without offending anyone since Caveman is not a protected group anywhere. For instance, who can fail to get it that it wouldn't make sense to use therapists in the commercial ("so easy a therapist could do it") because (unlike cavemen) therapists are SMART? Who can fail to get it when the caveman is patronized in the cable-style news show talk segment ("someone got up on the wrong side of the rock")?

I think they're pretty interesting, both in content and concept.

Sometimes people just read in to things too much.

Sit back and enjoy life for awhile.

PC is sort of at issue here, but only in a very broad sense. The entire human practice of stereotyping is highlighted, and the cavemen make a pretty good showing for themselves.

One of the first things I did when viewing them was to mentally replace the cave men with black men, and the word caveman with "nigger". Viciously unsettling, yet one could imagine that sort of thing happening 75 years ago or something.

The cavemen are sympathetic characters, if you take any time to analyze it. Most people don't, so it just comes out as... mildly funny commercials.

One of the first things I did when viewing them was to mentally replace the cave men with black men, and the word caveman with "nigger". Viciously unsettling, yet one could imagine that sort of thing happening 75 years ago or something.

Or, more recently, people being offended by something like, oh, a democratic presidential candidate calling Obama the first mainstream African American candidate who is bright and articulate and clean, etc.--then, when they express frustration at those remarks, other people shouting them down, calling them oversensitive, telling them to get over it, etc. I think the ads are definitely illustrating and critiquing that sort of blindness/insensitivity.

I dunno how I missed it.

And I'm glad that most DUers called "bullshit" on that commercial being actually offensive.

they are designed to appeal to the individualists among us, those who don't quite fit the mold, those with flexibility and imagination (ie. those who could easily imagine switching their insurance company).

The Gekko and the cavemen have in common that they are both funny offbeat renegade characters, mildly naughty in an endearing kind of way. They reflect a psychological profile that lots of Americans can identify with or laugh at. They touch our sense of the ridiculous. That sassy little lizard with attitude and the crabby urbane caveman...got your attention didn't they?

Be different. Go with the company that has no fixed address.:)