Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

A top GOPer in Florida is alarmed that a secret deal protects CSX from liability.

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 12:03 AM
Original message
A top GOPer in Florida is alarmed that a secret deal protects CSX from liability.
And puts the liability on the state instead.

Florida Representative Dennis Ross said today that he was very alarmed in learning more details about a "secret" deal believed to have been brokered by Jeb Bush. Ross said many lawmakers knew little about this deal.

CSX offered protection from lawsuits in railway freight accidents

LAKELAND | A behind-the-scenes agreement worked out between a Florida agency and CSX Transportation would protect the railroad from liability for accidents on tracks it is selling to the state for a proposed commuter rail line, The Ledger has learned.

..."Bartow lawyer John Frost recently completed a study of the proposed law, which is waiting to be filed but has no legislator's name attached yet. The law would grant the railroad company extraordinary protection even if it is at fault, he said.

According to Ledger sources, documents from the Florida Department of Transportation indicate that for at least three years the DOT and CSX negotiated the deal for the commuter rail system that soon will be reviewed by the Legislature.


Frost did not name his client. Here is Ross's reaction to this deal.

Rep. Dennis Ross, R-Lakeland, said he was stunned by Frost's analysis.

"From what I gather by reading his opinion alone, this is bad for the state of Florida and there doesn't seem to be any real reason behind it," Ross said. "Even if CSX was at fault, it would be protected according to this interpretation. That's just incredible - using tax dollars to hold harmless a private company."

Ross said the proposed legislation was not even known among most lawmakers until it was discovered and then sent to Frost to be reviewed.


I am alarmed as well. This was a deal which other Florida Republicans say is a harmful deal brokered by Jeb Bush in secret.

This is from an op ed written by C. C. (Doc) Dockery, the husband of Paula Dockery, a Florida senator.

Whether it is the good fortune of having your buddy Gov. Jeb Bush honchoing a deal for you or whether CSX CEO Michael Ward is simply a good negotiator, it pays handsome dividends.

In November 2004, CSX executives made a half-billion-dollar pitch to Bush's Florida Department of Transportation. That pitch is now being played out in an impending agreement to pay CSX $491 million of taxpayers' money to move some of its freight trains off what they call the A Line, running down the east central part of Florida to Orlando over to the S Line, running down through west central Florida: Gainesville, Ocala, Plant City and Lakeland. The terminus is Winter Haven, where CSX wants to build a huge intermodal logistics center.


The payoff for CSX's Ward was $36 million in salary and benefits paid to him in 2005 and 2006.


This deal should be brought out into the bright sunshine right away. It is going to disrupt several cities in Central Florida, and CSX was given the freedom to start their project even before municipalities had a chance to do planning for it. It was done by the state in that secret deal.

CSX told it can begin its project even before any regional planning is done.

WINTER HAVEN - State planning officials have told CSX it can begin building a rail transfer center before planning reviews of the massive project are completed. In a letter sent to CSX this week, the state Department of Community Affairs said it would consider an agreement with the company that would allow CSX to begin construction on the Winter Haven project while a comprehensive planning review known as a development of regional impact is under way."


I have often said we will likely never know the impact of all that Jeb Bush did to this state...not for a very long time. It will come out in pieces just like this CSX deal.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
OzarkDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 12:28 AM
Response to Original message
1. That doesn't sound right
There are plenty of other agreements out there for operating rights that can be researched for comparison. At the least they should follow the standard agreement guidelines from pre-deregulation days. There's really no good reason to throw away the standard legal guidelines.

Heck most of those agreements are based on transportation law from the days before Abe Lincoln was president. Lincoln specialized in transportation law before he was president and most regulations today were based on his work. WTF? What happens if there's a derailment w/ a toxic spill? Deregulation has gone too far.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 12:33 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. If Dennis Ross and Doc Dockery are alarmed...and just finding out...
then it is one pretty bad deal. Done covertly. We keep finding out stuff about it daily.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cassandra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 09:27 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. It sounds familiar to me.
Amtrak is stuck with the same deal with CSX for using their tracks. If there's an accident and CSX loses a lawsuit, CSX hands Amtrak and the taxpayers the bill. Classic big business socialism; privatize the profit, socialize the risk.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-25-08 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #6
18. "privatize the profit, socialize the risk" The battle cry in the Class War
against the American People.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
elleng Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 06:08 AM
Response to Original message
3. Keep this in mind:
'President George W. Bush nominated John William Snow to be the 73rd Secretary of the Treasury on January 13, 2003. The United States Senate unanimously confirmed Snow to the position on January 30, 2003. He was sworn into office on February 3, 2003 and served until June 29, 2006. As Secretary of the Treasury, Snow worked closely with President Bush to strengthen economic growth and create jobs.

Snow was Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of CSX Corporation, where he successfully guided the transportation company though a period of tremendous change. During Snow's twenty years at CSX, he led the Corporation to refocus on its core railroad business, dramatically reduce injuries and train accidents, and improve its financial performance.'>>>

http://www.whitehouse.gov/government/snow-bio.html
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sam Ervin jret Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #3
7. Keep this in MIND. It only take one. ONE spill. ONE explosion in a place where you KNOW
your damn trains are not supposed to be, carrying things they are not supposed to carry into places they have no business going, and are carrying things that are unmarked, unregulated, and traveling in populated areas that have no assessment.

Are they upwind of a school? Down wind of a hospital? What do we need to know that stuff for?

You irresponsible apologist for the most money grabbing family and friends of family that have ever darkened the doorstep of this country

Skulls and crossbones indeed. Very appropriate as you are all TOXIC!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
elleng Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. jret [Sam Ervin],
are you suggesting that I am an apologist?

I was providing information which might, at some time, prove useful.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 09:08 AM
Response to Original message
4. Secrecy is their trademark. I wish we could all sue Jeb Bush for
using this approach.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
gratuitous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 09:15 AM
Response to Original message
5. The question is . . .
Now that these good men and true are aware of this secret deal, what are they going to do about it? Will they let Chessie back out of the deal, no harm, no foul? Will they try to change the terms of the deal? What if CSX says, "Suck it. The deal's done." Will they demand any accountability from their former governor Jeb! Bush? Or will they hang the people of Florida out to dry with a rueful shake of their little pin heads saying it's too late to do anything and go ahead with the deal as written?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sam Ervin jret Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. You need an environmental impact study NOW!
Railroads are great! But they are DANGEROUS. They carry toxic and explosive material. Where are these tracks being placed? What is the projected freight on this line meant to be? Why? How can you be sure of that? Check all this out? take no one and nothing at their word or for granted.

One spill. One explosion. Near a school, a hospital, a water source. And they want to go ahead "without the ususal assesments" LIKE HELL!!!

Hide the shovels. Lie in front of the bull dozers. Get the information your state NEEDS.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. Well, look who the House speaker is...Marco Rubio.
This kind of play is right down his alley. I don't know if enough would be alarmed to do anything about it.

Our Democrats here are not known for their fighting spirit except against their own....and there are not that many of them.

I would say the deal will probably happen.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
10. at least we will never have to face a jeb bush presidency...
unless the mainstream media wants it so, that is.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Retrograde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 07:19 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. wait until 2012
The repubs will blame everything wrong on the incumbent Democratic president, and run Jeb on a nostalgia platform.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-25-08 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. we can only hope that they do something that stupid.
the name "bush" is going to be political poison for a few generations or so.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
12. Florida has been paying for CSX crossing maintenance and for its flagmen?
Where have I been? Doesn't CSX pay for anything?

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/jan/24/na-proposal-axes-pay-for-csx-flagmen/?news-nationworld

"TALLAHASSEE - State Rep. Ed Homan said Wednesday that he plans to file legislation to stop Florida from paying CSX Transportation for railroad crossing maintenance and flagmen on public road projects.

The Tampa Tribune reported last year that CSX charges state and local governments millions to station flagmen on road projects near the company's rails. The flagmen are there to monitor train traffic and warn road workers when trains are coming, even when the workers are far from the rails for weeks at a time.

The Tribune also reported that the state pays CSX hundreds of thousands every year for routine crossing maintenance, despite federal laws that require rail companies to maintain their own crossings. The laws spell out in detail the railroads' responsibility to make sure that lights flash and gates go down when trains approach a public road crossing.

Homan, a Tampa Republican and chairman of the House Committee on Audit and Performance, questioned the spending, especially at a time when lawmakers are facing a $2.5 billion shortfall this fiscal year and next."

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 10:14 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. More costs for the state and counties....I did not know this.
"Florida pays half of what the railroads say it costs them to keep up their crossing signs, gates and lights, Wise told Homan's committee. That came to more than $625,000 last year, with most of the money going to CSX, the state's largest railroad.

The state also hires its own inspectors, in addition to federal inspectors, to make sure crossing signals work.

"That's another responsibility we take very seriously," Wise said. "It's something the Legislature weighed in on in the mid-1970s" because of railroad companies' lack of attention to maintenance.

In addition to the state, some local governments pay for maintenance on the crossings over their city and county roads. Hillsborough County, for instance, paid more than $250,000. Officials said they were following the state."

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/jan/24/na-proposal-axes-pay-for-csx-flagmen/?news-nationworld
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
KnaveRupe Donating Member (700 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 06:46 PM
Response to Original message
13. This is EXACTLY what they want to do with the FISA "compromise".
Absolve the telco's from liability and instead put the liability on the gov't.

Make sure you frame it that way to all of your pissed-off Florida friends, neighbors, and relatives.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 06:51 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. I had not looked at it that way....something to think about.
I am very angry about the way Reid is handling this issue.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Mon May 06th 2024, 06:31 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC