'Hannah Montana' Star: I Do Everything for Jesus

'Hannah Montana' Star: I Do Everything for Jesus

“Hannah Montana” star Miley Cyrus and her best friend Mandy Jiroux have dedicated their Easter installment of "The Miley and Mandy Show" on YouTube to Jesus, saying everything they do is for him.

In the video, Jiroux, 20, who performs as a back-up dancer for the popular teen star, reads a question from a fan who asked if the girls were Christian.

The squeaky-clean duo emphatically respond, "Yes!"

"Yes! We love Jesus!" says Cyrus, 15, as she nods her head in agreement. "Happy Easter, by the way. He died for our sins. That's how awesome he is.

"Jesus rocks! That's why we do what we do," the Hannah Montana star adds. "She (Mandy) dances for Jesus. I sing, dance and act for Jesus! ... Now that I think about it, I do everything for Jesus. We make the YouTube videos for Jesus. We’re all about it."

Her comments should come as no surprise to fans who have been following her career.

http://www.christianpost.com/article/20080325/31677_%27Hannah_Montana%27_Star%3A_I_Do_Everything_for_Jesus.htm

Jesus said "I appreciate the sentiment, but please, stop."

:spray:

:rofl:

:rofl: :spray:

:toast: :beer:

cause that is what I am doing for him right now :)

If I were him, I'd take over from you.

nt

:smoke:

And yes, I'll listen to the sermon first.

showing off my youthful catholicism.

...for JESUS!


:toast: right back atcha, DoloA!

I want to feel his salvation all over my face."

the word of Jesus for free just like Jesus did? :dem:

:)

It's rare to hear his name mentioned.

Jesus doesn't need that.

cause the dollar ain't worth a shit anymore :)

Best answer ever!

Lights, camera, silence on the set
Tape rolling, 3-2-1 action
Welcome to the Church of Suicidal
We'll have a sermon and a wonderful recital
But before we go on there's something I must mention
An important message I must bring to your attention
I was in meditation and prayer last night
I was awakened by a shining bright light
Overhead a glorious spirit, he gave me a message and you all
need to hear it
"Send me your money," that's what he said
He said to "Send me your money"
Now if you can only send a dollar or two
There ain't a hell of a lot I can do for you
But if you want to see heaven's door
Make out a check for five hundred or more
"Send me your money," do you hear what I said?
"Send me your money"

Now give me some bass, um yea that's how he likes it
Now give me some silence, for all you sinners
Now give me some bass, yea that was funky
Now take them on home Brother Clark, send me your money
Here comes another con hiding behind a collar
His only god is the almighty dollar
He ain't no prophet, he ain't healer
He's just a two bit goddamn money stealer
Send me your money
Send it, you got to send it
Send me your money
You hear what I'm saying?
Send it, send it
Send me your money
How much you give is your own choice
But to me it is the difference between a Porsche and a Rolls Royce
I want you to make it hurt when you dig into your pocket
Cause it makes me feel so good to watch my profits rocket
Send me your money
Now dig in deep, dig real deep into your pocket
I want you to make it hurt!
We'll take cash, we'll take checks
We'll take credit cards, we'll take jewelry
We'll take your momma's dentures if they got gold in them
So whose gonna be the next king of the fakers
Whose gonna take the place of Jim and Tammy Faye Bakker?
See my momma, she didn't raise no fool
Couse you can't put a price on a miracle
Amen

What a couple of loonies.

Aly & AJ, one of their singing sister duos (and at least one of them acts on a Disney show as well) have professed disdain for the concept of evolution in interviews.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Eisner CEO of Disney

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_Upsilon Eisner belonged to a secret frat group. The elite really do think they own the world?

ΔY is hardy a "secret frat group." The link you posted states that it is the "first non-secret fraternity ever founded." Perhaps next time you should read the page before you link to it.

were secret. They are probably still there.

I said...it was when I meant it wasn't.

Now that I have your attention...what about those secret frat groups at the elite universities? William & Mary and then Yale (Skull & Bones). I never really thought about other top universities having them but Yale.

Yale has hired Tony Blair to talk about religion and globalism. They are training Neo Cons?

Shouldn't we as tax payers, living in a modern democracy, remove all student grant and research...etc. from these few institutions who still discriminate and appeal to the few in our society? They have to know about these "secret groups".

Years ago...in the "Golden Ages" or the land of Oil and Banking Barons, did Jewish students and Afro-Americans form their own college frats since they were barred from some? I find this subject interesting. When they talk about the elite it would make sense they would tend to keep to themselves.

At the start of the last century, the top 500 kept all the wealth and power within a small group.

The Rockefeller's (especially David) with their wealth even today belong to those elite trade and government groups. They graduate and take leadership positions in our society. They betray us for the few.

And, like any good CEO, he's only good at one thing. He rescued Disney, but he sucks at running a successful company.

And it raises an equally interesting philosophical dilemma: Is it possible to do a good thing for a bad (as opposed to "wrong") reason?

It would seem the answer is yes, absolutely...but is the action really untainted by its less-than-honorable genesis?
If we say it is, aren't we then agreeing that the end justifies the means?

When does it and when doesn't it?

Hmmmmmmmmm

working people, I'll recognize the social value of a person's deeds before I'm ready to pontificate needlessly about the moral justification of those deed.

:D


moi aussi
yo tambien
;-)

and it seems that Jesus showered just as much God-given talent on Miley Ray as He did on Billy Ray.

Have they helped at a soup kitchen or maybe counseled a gay or even straight youth group there are a whole shitload of actions these two could complete but all they want to do is worship GAWD, I hate fucking fundies and I don't apologies for it.

I have stood beside self-described born again Christians in soup kitchens, and park cleanup days. I have marched alongside them in Pride Parades.

They are not all Robertson-esque hate machines. With maturity comes the realization that there is good and bad in every group. I had a massive hate on for born agains for a long time because of the shit they put me through at the megachurch my family went to. I will not get into it, it's really not relevant, but I will say I am probably the last person on earth with anything good to say about that particular belief system and really generally not one to defend it.

That said, there is good and bad in every group. Every group has its share of hypocrites, slanderers, and outright freaks. I have no issues with born agains until they start expecting me to get born again (been there, done that, got the haterade), or they start trying to make their religion the law of the land, infringing on my rights to worship as I choose, marry, and so on.

It takes a special kind of insecure, douchey asscarrot to paint an entire group by the most batshit insane members, and be offended by its very existence.

...when I wish I could recommend a single post. :) Beautifully stated, Chovexani. :toast:

she'll be doing that for Jesus as well? Is this another Britney and Lindsay Lohan in the making? Didn't both of them profess to be Christians as well?

oh, gawd, I can't believe I just wrote that




:crazy:

doing something she should not be.

...to gIg peepz whn they're being hIp0critz.

Cause, like, we wouldn't wanna judge people, or anything like that.

Duke

i never got that...
:shrug:

for him...God?

:shrug:

earth.

Christ was hung on a cross which is of the worst forms of death to suffer hence its emphasis in later NT letters... Also keep in mind that Christ is the *one* man in history who was uterly without sin and thus not deserving of any punishment..

and even if it were- dying isn't really dying if you know that you're going to be back on your feet in a couple days, is it?

Secondly, I get it you dont follow my faith feel free to keep spitting on my beliefs with every post..

You have to consider that many peple here consider it their duty to spit upon religion of all kinds. It used to get under my skin, too, until I realized that it wasn't my problem, it was theirs. Besides, I always think of the religion trashers as the enemies Jesus commanded us to love.

Any person will run afoul of Biblical law simply by being human. And for all we know the Biblical Jesus, if he existed, could have been the L. Ron Hubbard of his day.

Of course a loving god would just say repent and you're forgiven without having to kill anyone.

Anyway I don't follow Miley's career and I couldn't care less about her faith as long as she keeps it in the personal realm. Miley seems harmless enough.

Although if she starts labeling herself as a role model then it is inevitable that something decidedly unChristian will surface. Celebrities (and 'family values' politicians) never seem to learn that important lesson.

"Of course a loving god would just say repent and you're forgiven without having to kill anyone."

God is loving, graceful, holy, and just...

--

and why would it condemn you to an eternity in hell for relatively minor infractions...? :shrug:

and why does a supposedly supreme being have so many undesirable human traits? jealousy, vindictiveness, insecurity, cruelty, etc...

it's actually pretty easy to understand, when you realize that a god didn't create men, but rather it was men who created a god.

it's actually pretty easy to understand, when you realize that a god didn't create men, but rather it was men who created a god. :thumbsup:

1) Again some hold to innate sin in humans which from conception prohibits us from any claim to grace and mercy but that aside Slaves in the OT were to be released after 7 years..

2) You are condemned to hell for any sin because Gods holiness will not suffer our sin. Christ served as the method though which our sin is covered by grace.

--

Its grace and mercy that had Christ who knew not sin not only die for our sins but to do so in one of the most painful and humiliating ways know at that date..

-if, after all they were to be released in 7 years time? :shrug:

and you would think that people who had supposedly just escaped from slavery would be a little less than likely to endorse the practice for themselves, wouldn't you...? :shrug:

you really took some big gulps of the kool-aid, didn't you...? :shrug:

referring OT laws in the first four books of the Bible, the ones from God not the ones under which Israel suffered. The slavery of the Jews was racial, generational, and without end not the slavery which you implied 'God endorsed'.

My faith is not 'kool-aid', Im sorry that you disagree with it and I will refrain from insulting you your position...

:hi:

type of slavery endured by Israel at the hands of Egypt? Seems to me he pretty much refuted that but smacking Egypt (the super power of its day) around. Then after that a form of indentured servitude was licensed by Moses in Duet (I think, may be been Levi.). And as Christ explained in the NT much of OT laws regarding things like Divorce and, (my presumption) slavery, where put there because of the sinful nature of mens hearts *not* because it was the ideal.

one for what happened TO the jews, and one for what the jews did to others and each other.

how utterly duplicitous of the chosen ones.

One is know as indentured servitude, the other is slavery as we think of it..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indentured_servant
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery

--

Many societies in history have had many different forms of slavery / indentured servititude..

---

Deu 15:12 if thy brother, an Hebrew man, or an Hebrew woman, be sold unto thee, and serve thee six years; then in the seventh year thou shalt let him go free from thee.
Deu 15:13 And when thou sendest him out free from thee, thou shalt not let him go away empty:
Deu 15:14 Thou shalt furnish him liberally out of thy flock, and out of thy floor, and out of thy winepress: wherewith the LORD thy God hath blessed thee thou shalt give unto him.
Deu 15:15 And thou shalt remember that thou wast a bondman in the land of Egypt, and the LORD thy God redeemed thee: therefore I command thee this thing to day.

---

Servants in Isreal were not property, they had rights, they could own their own property it was a social contract which did not convey ownership of a human being. I'm sorry if this is too complicated for you as it seems you more seek conflict than understanding.

i just don't see a supposedly loving god condoning the buying and selling of human beings- ESPECIALLY among those that it had supposedly helped to free from their own bondage situation.

btw- that verse about letting the slave go in the seventh year(or rather the 'year of jubilee') ONLY applied to fellow hebrew slaves- it did not apply to slaves who WEREN'T hebrew.

Its in a document thousands of years old...

Also in the old law debts after 7 years were forgiven including land debts..

who has no interest in hearing any side other than their own, yes? QA is only yanking your chain hoping to get a response...any response...so that it can be ridiculed...

if you're up for it...plunge ahead...otherwise, you might harken to the scripture reference of pearls before swine...

sP

you on the shoulder to point it out..

Thanks and regards..

religion wise or not. people frequently are here just to harass and that seems to be the case here. when i get someone who listens i am all for good discussion as it appears you are...

have a good one!

Sp

"secular law"...mostly Roman before the leader became Christian.

But believe as you will...that's why it's called faith. Not fact.

They call the bible the "greatest story ever told" for a reason...great fiction.

You know...he who has the gold rules.

I'm Jewish...from where I come from the New Testament is just a best seller. The Old Testament made for a great DeMille movie.

and he was a pagan at the time.

Today the Bibles are written mainly by King James. Rulers who are both political and religious heads should be questioned as to their motives.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_James_Version

The 1611 Bible is known as the King James Version in the United States. In the United Kingdom, it is commonly known as the Authorized Version. King James did not personally translate the Bible, but his advance authorization was legally required for the Church of England to translate, publish and distribute the Bible in England. James and the Bishop of London wrote the brief that guided the translation; it prohibited the marginal notes found in the Geneva Bible and ensured the position of the Church of England was recognised on various points...

Who is fluent in modern and ancient Hebrew (she teaches both)... it's not a very good translation at all.

why people seem to have this pathological need to be sure to crap on the beliefs of others here is really getting old...

And as to extra biblical evidence of his existence (like the 'he really did'nt exist' line does not get played enough here)

Cornelius Tacitus (55-120 AD), "the greatest historian" of ancient Rome:

"Consequently, to get rid of the report, Nero fastened the guilt and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judaea, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their centre and become popular. Accordingly, an arrest was first made of all who pleaded guilty; then, upon their information, an immense multitude was convicted, not so much of the crime of firing the city, as of hatred against mankind. Mockery of every sort was added to their deaths. Covered with the skins of beasts, they were torn by dogs and perished, or were nailed to crosses, or were doomed to the flames and burnt, to serve as a nightly illumination, when daylight had expired. Nero offered his gardens for the spectacle, and was exhibiting a show in the circus, while he mingled with the people in the dress of a charioteer or stood aloft on a car. Hence, even for criminals who deserved extreme and exemplary punishment, there arose a feeling of compassion; for it was not, as it seemed, for the public good, but to glut one man's cruelty, that they were being destroyed."

Flavius Josephus (37-97 AD), court historian for Emperor Vespasian:

"At this time there was a wise man who was called Jesus. And his conduct was good and he was known to be virtuous. And many people from among the Jews and other nations became his disciples. Pilate condemned him to be crucified and to die. And those who had become his disciples did not abandon his discipleship. They reported that he had appeared to them three days after his crucifixion and that he was alive; accordingly, he was perhaps the messiah concerning whom the prophets have recounted wonders." (Arabic translation)

The Jewish Talmud, compiled between 70 and 200 AD:

"On the eve of the Passover Yeshu was hanged. For forty days before the execution took place, a herald went forth and cried, 'He is going forth to be stoned because he has practised sorcery and enticed Israel to apostacy. Anyone who can say anything in his favour, let him come forward and plead on his behalf.' But since nothing was brought forward in his favour he was hanged on the eve of the Passover."

have been historically authenticated and far predate Christianities acceptance in Rome.. There was no reason for a Roman historian to pen, within a generation and at a time when Christians were not popular in Rome by any stretch, that Christ was (1) a real person and (2) a good person..

Argue the Deity of Christ if you so choose I can not prove that to anyone (after all many who saw his works still did not believe) but to try and say with a straight face that historical evidence of Christ is lacking is just spitting into the historical wind..

I'm not "crapping" on your faith. Believe as you see fit...if anything I stand up for your right to do so. My relatives in Eastern Europe who ended up wearing stars and going to consentration camps never had such a luxuary.

Quote all the passages you like, fact remains there is no evidence that Jesus ever existed, period. No physical evidence, just speculation, like what you cited.

Peace...

"Quote all the passages you like, fact remains there is no evidence that Jesus ever existed, period."

There is no evidence anyone existed from that time frame by your standards..

If periodical, extra-biblical, and verified sources of documentation verifying his existence than a time machine would not do it for you..

Well, I've been to Israel, and saw plenty of evidence of others who lived in that period. There's sure evidence that Herod existed, and even for Pontius Piolte...not just old Roman Records, but documentable artifacts. "Biblical Archeology" is nothing more than an answer in search of proof.

Now one would think that if Jesus was such a powerful force or whatever at the time of his crucifixion, there would be Roman records of this...just like there were for other important Roman actions or conquests. When the Jews were defeated in 135 AD, the Roman erected Hadrian's Arch. One would think that if Jesus had made such an impact, there's be some kind of contemporary documentation. There isn't.

And does it really matter? Not to me. I'll gladly take a different viewpoint if some proof materializes...and then just on the fact the man existed. All the rest is pure faith...yours to believe, but also to respect those who don't believe the stories you believe as fact.

1) Jesus committed no crimes
2) He was unknown to Piolte

Are tehre records of every thief that was crucified?

I'm just curious...and again, no offense intended here. I always find these type of topics as a "chase your tail" one. Again, I respect your right to believe, but this type of topic is steeped in the "need to believe" and somehow that the concept of a god or icon somehow gives a religion a credibility and thus must be supported by some "fact" that is more speculation than credible.

My friend, the issue here is not to prove me. I'm not a Christian, never have been nor ever will be. It means nothing to me as to if a human by the name of Jesus existed...or any biblical character for that matter. It is obviously more important for you to have some need to have your religious faith in a mortal form...with some "historical" relevence. Sorry, my life experience have taught me to be skeptical of religion and how its been used to divide rather than bring people together.

By many who abide organized religion's doctrines: the story of Jesus is one of a peace espousing, social malcontent who was compelled to speak truth to power, to stand up to bullies, gained a following for doing so, and was ultimately killed to shut him up and set an example for others.

Now, I'm a believer, although I have zero 'faith' in any organized religion. I point this out as I've spent time around church goin' types, and it's always amazed me how such devout believers miss such crucial aspects to Jesus' story ...and instead usually display an obedient servitude toward Power/authority and its aims, which haven't a thing to do with the tenets of Christianity.
==============================

Airline To Heaven, Lyrics by Woody Guthrie, performed by Wilco

There's an airline plane
Flies to heaven everyday
Past them pearly gates

If you want to ride this train
Have your ticket in your hand
Before it is too late

If the world looks wrong
And your money's spent and gone
And your friend has turned away

You can get away to heaven
On this aeroplane
Just bow your head and pray

Them's got ears, let them hear
Them's got eyes, let them see
Turn your eyes to the lord of the skies
Take that airline plane
It'll take you home again
Yeah, to your home beyond the skies

Well a lot of people guess
Some say no and some say yes
Will it take some and leave some behind?

But you will surely know
When to the airport go
To leave this world behind
Just leave this world behind

Oh a lot of speakers speak
A lot of preachers preach
When you lay their salary on the line

But to bow your head an pray
It's the only earthly way
You can fly to heaven on time
You can reach heaven on time

Your ticket you obtain
On this heavenly airline plane
You can leave your sins behind

You've got to take this flight
It may be daytime, might be night
But you can't see your way if you're blind
You can't see your way if you're blind

Them's got ears, let them hear
Them's got eyes, let them see
Turn your eyes to the lord of the skies
Take that airline plane
It'll take you home again
Yeah, to your home beyond the skies

My line of discussion was based on historical and documented facts. The messages of the Old and New Testiment have a very valid and practical purpose for the human experience and those messages and stories offer straight-forward common sense ideas and ideals. In my world, I see the need to help others and not be judgemental as being just plain common sense and that I don't need a "moral justification" for those beliefs. Others do.

I've also seen the need of some for the certainty and community of organized religion. It's comfort in a world of instability. It answers questions that can't be answered and structure for those who see free will as a problem not a "blessing". The option is to be able to believe as you see fit and that there isn't one way to see or view any facet of faith and religion.

Cheers...

of a mass peace movement
preforming miracles.


the romans would have had some record of it.

And the actual peace movement of Christ lasted *only* a short time and was contained within only a small corner of the province.

Add to that Jesus told people to not rebel against rome and you have a complete indifference by the Romans.

He was an itinerant preacher, basically. No armies, no legions, no threat to Rome. Why would Rome have cared?

Just a message of peace and brother/sisterhood.

The few historical records that survive (see upthread) are pretty remarkable in themselves, all things considered.

Bake

"Just a message of peace and brother/sisterhood."

He also preached non rebellion against Rome... Render unto Cesar, my kingdom is not of this earth, ....

But you are spot on that the historical record is pretty clear in the person of Christ did exist I happen to believe in his deity but that I am not capable of proving to anyone..

Tolerance is in such short supply when touching on this nerve. It's so personal and its easy for those to get offended when a contrary view is presented...not in spite, but in honest curiosity. I really don't consider it an argument as much as perspective as this is such a personal issue.

and its "speculation" about Jesus existing.

I consider myself culturally Jewish...taking great pride in the history of my realatives and the struggles they've had to endure. However, I have always questioned the absolutism of the "spiritual side"...seeing the writings as guidelines rather than fact or history. They're great stories, and for some it's the word of a diety, but I've always seen it as a "how-to" book than a dead-fast guide to how one should live. Words of men written by men...not a god. Until I get a postcard from the edge, I remain very skeptical in the existance of what George Carlin calls "the invisible cloud being". But I don't nor ever will condmen or judge others who do want to believe.

Yep...this topic sure hits nerves as so many have been indoctrinated into one organized religion or another and the thought to question it is literally heretical.

The church I attend encourages you to questio, and qustion everything. And oddly, I find the more I question my beliefs, the stronger they become

there is also ample evidence to suggest that several folks claiming to be Jesus existed around the same time period. There is no particulae evidence to confirm that any of them were God. it is just a question of belief.Some believe, others don't.

I see Jesus being into Classic R&B, funk, and dance music. Think George Clinton, Stevie Wonder, and maybe a little Prince.

Yeah, I think Jesus would be a P-Funk fan! :headbang:

:shrug:

considering her daddy. Billy Ray's got like 8 or 9 kids, and a huge RWer he is, too. His TV series, Doc, even had a religious theme, even though it was not pushed very much (I actually enjoyed the series, because it was amusing).

"...yes it was fun, but it was wrong...
...only sex with Jesus from now on, from now on..."

- National Lampoon: Godspeak Suite
from the album Sex, Drugs, Rock n Roll and the End of the World

http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/B0001XAL3W/103-7925147-0948611?SubscriptionId=0TX0FBYECD04H3M636R2/103-7925147-0948611

:evilgrin:

That's the way it goes.

The one and only!

Remember Britteny used to be the clean cut teen girl..

You could almost feel the fakeness radiating off those comments.

My guess is it will take less time with Miley than it did Britney.

I know next to nothing about her, my girls are too young to be into anything but 'Super-Why' and many fun pre-shcool songs..

--

It makes me sick when people like musicians and athletes give it up 'to Jesus'... For their accomplishments.. Live a Christian life and if you also happen to be a a famous athlete let your testimony speak for itself..

Like when Carmen Electra married Denis Rodman and talked about how seriously she took marriage meanwhile everyone in the world was like wth?

it always does.

Sid

:popcorn:

I don't think he would let this musical travesty exist.

to do everything for coke, like other stars.

Honestly, I think it's a little silly, but then again, she probably thinks my religious beliefs (Celtic Pagan) are a little silly as well.

As long as she's not using it as a justification to say hateful things or support infringing on people's human rights, I don't see any problem with what she believes.

(Edit: yeah, it does seem a little fake, which is sad. But what the heck do I know?)

Sorry but I find celebrities who use their faith and access to the media to do over the top proselytizing wrong, simply wrong on many levels. It goes against the doctrine of their faith, it is crass and self serving also. I don't demonize anybody's faith, that's their business. But when they push it in my face and space, then I'm going to respond:shrug:

Trust me, I can't stand born agains cramming religion down people's throats, as I used to be one and am decidedly not anymore, but I'm not sure how you could construe anything she said in that article as proselytizing. She was asked about her beliefs, and she discussed them. I didn't see anything hateful, offensive, or obnoxious about that. And being a queer, polyamorous Pagan I am very well tuned to when a born again is being a prat for Jesus at me, considering I deal with it daily.

If you seriously think that was somebody pushing their faith in your face, I humbly invite you to one of my family reunions so that you can experience some actual pushing of people's faith in your face. If you're one of those people who thinks no one should ever talk about their beliefs (or lack thereof) ever in the most innocuous, non-offensive of ways even when asked, then...well, you're kind of a douche.

Misconstruing what I had to say, and gratuitously insulting me for no other reason than to make yourself feel like a big person.

Oh, and a hearty fuck you too. Next time if you want some sort of clarification, explanation or conversation with me, try making the approach without the ad hominem attack, OK.

It's not her beliefs I am making fun of here, it is her using them in the method she did.

Most the bible is God (or others) telling believers they are doing something wrong :) Lord knows I know that because those same messages to those folks back in the day apply to me all too well....

Read the ninth beatitude.

Why do 99% of christians do the opposite of what Jesus said to do, like, ALL the time?

:shrug:

There aren't enough of you to make a market difference?

Cut her some slack

wait till her career tanks, because it will, then we will see how happy for jesus she really is.

jesus is just a another name for money.

Much as I personally am not into people "witnessing" to me, I have to admit that I'm glad to see my kid listening to Hannah Montana rather than Brittany. At least Miley Cyrus is trying to set some sort of positive image out front.

Is her image a real one? Only time will show, however, at least she isn't the headline on the tabloids for some meltdown, overdose, crime or other drama like Brittany. I don't think anybody other than a parent should be a kids' role model, but we all know full well that kids DO idolize famous people (So do adults, but that is for another day...)

Miley or Brit--you decide...



Laura

Won't always agree with her though (just like some here won't always agree with our candidates).

except I have a seven year old daughter. I'd prefer Miley or Raven over Britney/Lindsey/Paris or even Vanessa/Ashley from High School Musical.

than mention Jesus in a subject line. Some of you are so pathetic it isn't even amusing anymore.

the christians at DU are.

Sid

Christians in other countries are persecuted. It's a capital C by the way. Proper noun and all that.

but I also think as a Christian myself I should able to argue that I think Christ is being used poorly by some, without thinking that the ideas of Christianity are wrong (after all, Paul spent a great deal of writing calling fellow Christians to the carpet, and we see the same thing in the OT with prophets chastising fellow Jews).

In the end times we see a falling away of the church, and I think there is no other time in history we have seen that more than now. Calling them on it is not hatred, it is honesty.

You make a perfectly valid point, but look what the topic brings out. Normally I'd be first in line to lament airy and shallow pop theology, but there is such a singular attack mentality against anything Christian here that I find myself forced to defend Miley bloody Cyrus. Distasteful on all sorts of levels.

"Jesus and a suitcase full of money that is."

Money is one of the nets we're supposed to cast down.

Sooner or later, you find yourself having to manage all that money. Unless your business is giving it all away (and thereby not being rich anymore), let's not confuse it with the ministry of Jesus.

There is a difference between the prosperity gospel and wealth..

The prosperity gospel: (1) Assumes youre due wealth because you're a Christian (2) financial hardships are a sign that youre doing something wrong (3) stuff for stuffs sake is ok..

John Piper is a Christian Author who has spent time destroying the propserity gospel

"When I read about prosperity-preaching churches, my response is: “If I were not on the inside of Christianity, I wouldn’t want in.” In other words, if this is the message of Jesus, no thank you.

Luring people to Christ to get rich is both deceitful and deadly. It’s deceitful because when Jesus himself called us, he said things like: “Any one of you who does not renounce all that he has cannot be my disciple” (Luke 14:33). And it’s deadly because the desire to be rich plunges “people into ruin and destruction” (1 Timothy 6:9). So here is my plea to preachers of the gospel. "

"The great tragedy of prosperity-preaching is that a person does not have to be spiritually awakened in order to embrace it; one needs only to be greedy. Getting rich in the name of Jesus is not the salt of the earth or the light of the world. In this, the world simply sees a reflection of itself. And if it works, they will buy it."

"Finally (v. 18), the rich must use their money in good deeds and must be liberal and generous. Once they are liberated from the magnet of pride and once their hope is set on God not money, there is only one thing that can happen: their money will flow freely to multiply the manifold ministries of Christ. Hungry will be fed, sick will be healed, ignorant will be taught, and frontier peoples will be evangelized. And as with Zacchaeus of old, love will bore the gold lining out of the Christian pipeline of grace and replace it with simple, durable copper."

Its ok to be Rich but not for the sake of being rich and to those to whom much is given there will (1) be much asked of and (2) much to be accounted for..

I can't for the life of me understand why someone's personal beliefs offend you so much on a personal level. Whenever there is a thread about Christ or Christianity in general you always chime in with something condescending and rude to posters who profess to be believers.

The strange thing is that you don't reserve the snide comments for statements of belief of other religions like Islam or Buddhism. It's as if you have some trauma in your past concerning the topic of Jesus Christ that makes you really uncomfortable whenever the topic is mentioned. You may want to consider doing some serious examination as to why you have such knee-jerk reactions to this topic.

I'm not saying you have to believe what Christians believe as that is ultimately your private decision. But why get all up in arms about it, especially when these are people who have not done anything negative to you in the first place?

After all, you asked this question in a very respectful way - you could have flamed and you didn't - and I respect that.

When I was about 12 I was sent to an Evangelical Junior High. They weren't strictly fundamentalist - but that shouldn't matter. These were your Dobson-esque Republican "WE ARE FIGHTING A SPIRITUAL WAR" hate the world type Evangelicals. A strain of thought I've seen throughout Evangelical Christianity.

To say the school was abusive would be an understatement - these folks saw any type of dissent or questioning as evil, backtalk and it warranted beatings. These were the Reagan 80's, so as long as you didn't punch the kid in the face, anything else was permitted. Questioning and dissent are in my blood - and are definitely not in the blood of these folks. Needless to say, I was in the principals office often. At the end of my Junior High years, I was labeled "Rebellious and world-thinking" and denied entrance to their high school, but I felt glad to get out.

Over the next several years I still had to go to church and face the Evangies everywhere I went, however. They would speak their gobbledygook often, and knew you weren't one of them if you didn't recite the pablum back to them. I tried to be a part of their world, fearing the flames of hell and eternal damnation. Like Elliot Smith said "All religion did is make me scared to death of hell." I would have nightmares that because I couldn't believe the BS around Christianity, I was hellbound. I started to study the bible itself, and that led me to study its origins. I learned that the Bible was put together by a very corrupt Roman Government at a time when they needed control. Christianity as we know it, the bible and Nicene Creed were all a result of this merging with the current pagan traditions. "Ah hah!" I thought - the bible must be wrong, and that's why it doesn't make any sense. So I started studying the Christian Apocrypha. That makes even LESS sense, especially the new age favorite "Gospel of Thomas." IN addition to all the Buddhist leaning passages (drink from my mouth and you become me, I drink from your mouth and I become you) it also has a host of really weird stuff, like a Dante-esque hell for Abortionists, Perverts and Homosexuals. So this had to be wrong too.

Soon after, I really studied Evolution and science - as well as Philosophy. Nietzsche really appealed to me - not so much the Ubermensch stuff (he was going senile by this time, I think) but the idea of God is Dead. If all these Evangies REALLY truly had faith, then they wouldn't drive cars, see doctors, watch TV, etc because they are not of this world, remember? God will provide.

I also have a big problem with Christianity's assumption that man is somehow flawed. We aren't. We're perfectly evolved creatures just like any other animal on this planet. "Original Sin" doesn't just irk me - it pisses me off. To tell people that they are broken from birth, and they only way they can be fixed is with their particular book is infuriating to me. Of course, advertisers do this all the time with beauty creams and whatnot - and that's bothersome, except that most people understand that its advertising and take it with a grain of salt. Christianity is taught from birth. Imagine if your mom, from day one, told you you were ugly and you could only be made beautiful with product X? Same rule applies.

The real kicker, however, was living in Thailand for 3 years and seeing missionaries at work. These were the most hypocritical, condescending, arrogant culture-wreckers in the world. They would lie to the locals straight up about how God rewards his followers with wealth and power.

I don't so much have a chip on my shoulder with the Mainline and Liberal Christians, because they will be the first to admit God is Dead (without using those words.) Anytime I hear a Christian say "God As I understand him" I know they are afraid to say God is Dead. But the meaning is all the same.

But when I hear "Jesus is #1" it really bothers me. Have these people ever met Jesus? Absolutely not. They instead have talked to a part of their own psychology they have molded into how they see Jesus. Once again, "God as they understand him." When I hear "Praise Jesus" do they have any idea what this really means? Of course not. They think it means "Jesus Rocks" - it doesn't. It means to bow down in subservience - slavery, really. Slavery to something that does not exist, and is instead a creation of their own imagination.

Of course there is the argument that Christians go through a "spiritual moment" when they are "born again" and that is how they "meet" Jesus. Ask any Christian for details, and they go off in mumbo jumbo again. Try and nail them down to "Exactly what was Jesus wearing, what did his voice sound like, what color were his eyes, etc" - you know, the kind of questions I'd ask if you told me you met Barack Obama or Hilary Clinton - and they accuse you of mocking them. I just want a straight answer, or them to admit "OK - I didn't really meet him, I felt something different that I don't usually feel."

The reason I don't mock Islam or other religions is because I don't have any history with them. And to be honest, the Muslims in this country already get mocked enough by other Christians. I would love to be an equal opportunity mocker, but considering you get labeled a terrorist if you have a name that just sounds Muslim I thought I'd sit those out. Now in other countries (the whole Sudan Teddy Bear story comes to mind) I mock away. That's pure delusion on a grand scale.

I have a question for you - how familiar are you with Evangelical or Fundamentalist Christians (there is a difference)? I'm sure you have some familiarity with some of them - its hard not to in this country.



Anyway....Sorry to go on for so long. I get a little soapboxy about this issue. And again, thanks for being respectful.

Accidentally hit post prematurely...will update soon...

I thought it was a Koan at first - My head was about to explode :)

Although I still think your condescension is a bit out of line sometimes, I can sympathize with your experience growing up with intolerant and rigid people. It is unfortunate that you have come to associate Christianity with these types as my personal negative experiences on the subject are not nearly in the same league.

To answer your question regarding my personal experiences here is what I can tell you:

I was raised in a very devout Roman-Catholic family (I'm Italian and most are Catholics). Several members of my family were priests and/or nuns and obviously this caused me to be exposed to such beliefs from a very young age. Like you, it was emphasized to me that there was a hell and non-believers were in danger of spending eternity there. That is some scary stuff for a youngster to swallow so I obediently accepted these beliefs without question.

I had a Catholic education through high school but during college had a major crisis of faith. Though I never became an atheist I was agnostic for quite a bit. To make a long story short, I came to a realization one day that my problem was not with Christianity per se but with Catholicism in general. The whole belief system and rules/rituals just didn't jive with me. Furthermore, throughout all my Catholic education I never did any serious bible study and instead only mostly memorized Catholic doctrine. I don't want to turn this into an anti-Catholic screed as I know there are many Catholics on this board and I respect their beliefs and don't want to denigrate them. It just didn't work for me.

Anyway, as cliche as it may sound, once I did some serious bible reading and study, I came to some deep realizations as to what Christianity is truly all about and had that oft-described "born again" experience. I fully realize as you said above that such terminology defies any scientific scrutiny, but I guess it's only something one can experience subjectively. I have no proofs to offer only a personal sense of having a life changing moment that has stayed with me since. I will be the first to say that there is no way to prove the experience I had in terms of logic and science.

Do I thus now eschew science and believe in Creationism? No. Do I think that the reason people are poor and disenfranchised is because they are not Christians? Hell no. Do I think that people who claim to have the authoritative interpretation of Scripture are way out of their league? Yes I do. And do I believe in the doctrine of original sin? Not in the literal Adam & Eve sense, but in the broken humanity sense yes indeed I do. The mere fact that it is impossible to live a life without transgression against self or other is proof enough for me that we are imperfect beings.

Also, I'm well aware of how the canonical bible purposely omitted some books because it was subversive to power at the time. Yet I do not think that takes away from the greatness of those books. Likewise, there are just as many arguments and historical evidences that attempt to prove Jesus's existence as there are that attempt to disprove it. The question simply comes down to faith and that is even emphasized in the bible itself.

I think I'll wrap this up here as it is uncomfortable for me to divulge my personal beliefs on a board that most likely will mock them in the first place. I am however a hardcore Democrat and believe in the vast majority of the tenants of this party. My parting words to you are that I really do sympathize with your negative experiences growing up and hope that you at least try and see that not all Christians are hate filled people who turn to religion as a means of nurturing their hate and bigotry.

And I realize anyone can use anything to justify hate and bigotry. Eugenics used science to nurture hate and bigotry, as has every religion in the world. Even the Buddhists aren't exempt - take a look at Bhutan.

I guess one of my biggest gripes is that of Faith. Faith is belief without evidence, in a nutshell. To me, that means belief without questioning. But I don't want to jump into that bag of cats if I can help it.

But when I ridicule Miley Cyrus for saying "I do everything for Jesus" I mock something that many people aren't analyzing critically. They let a statement like that pass, saying "oh its just faith." Well it isn't - Ms Cyrus is stating her reason for doing whatever she does to be for the benefit of someone she has never met, has no proof ever existed, and in all likelihood, she never thought about. She was given that belief by her parents, had no choice in the matter and accepted it blindly, hook line and sinker. They, as well as her church, were the architects of her "personal" Jesus. Heck, that term "personal Jesus" kind of speaks for itself. It's not Jesus, the person, but Jesus, the crafted addition to her consciousness.

Anyway - my brain hurts.

"Faith is belief without evidence,"

Respectfully I think the classical definition is, "trust in that of which you do not have full knowledge" (as per the Apologists I've read, McDowell, Lewis, Cornelius, etc)). And if that is indeed the case, I think we all use faith in almost every aspect of our lives.

We can provide evidence.

I use the Dead Moon as an example because none of us have seen the core of the Moon, so we don't know for sure. But we can look up evidence as to why we know its dead, and does not have a molten core.

They might think twice about forking their allowances over "for Jesus".

And they probably are, even if they're kids.

I am Pagan, though I am far from a Hannah Montana fan (I'm too old for it but even as a kid I wasn't into this kind of bs), but if a celeb I like turns out to be Christian, I don't give a shit unless they specifically start talking crap or supporting people/organizations with their fan-earned loot that are fascist.

If I had conniptions every time someone I like turned out to be Christian, I'd be having seizures pretty much 24/7.

She is a good kid.

on edit: My cubicle neighbor just got back from taking a poo...for the lord of course.

;)

we took my little sisters to see her show. not my type of music, but she definitely doesn't lip-sync and she's got a good voice.

I know it's in poor taste but...

Last I checked, Miley Cyrus was not issuing fatwas against her LGBT fans, or preaching evolution is the devil's lie or anything.

I don't mean to go all Chris Crocker up in here, because I loathe Hannah Montana and pretty much everything associated with Disney manufactured "brands" like her. But who cares if she believes in Jesus? I'm not the kind of person to constantly talk about my religion (I am Pagan) because I feel it's none of anyone's business, but as long as she is not trying to push it on people or using it as an excuse to hate, who cares?

I think a bunch of people need to grow the fuck up.

she's sings "Kill the homos! ... But only after they do my hair"!

You give me drinking problems. I just about choked on my soda. :spray: :rofl:

to a 15 year old girl, ya know.

knows who her demographic is.

How are those millions she's making "serving Jesus"?

Someone might suggest that reflects a certain level of "intolerance" :shrug:

It is sad indeed.

So knee-jerk in their vitriol that they can't wait to pile on a 15-year-old who only responded to a question about her religious beliefs.

This is the flip side of "towel head." Six of one, half-dozen of the other.

These are the first people to go on a thread for a pile-on of "Bigot!" "Racist!" "Sexist!" but when jesus is mentioned they decide it's ok to shit on christians as much as they want.

A true atheist doesn't care what the god-people do. Sitting there hating on christians means you're just an anti-religious fool.

If only the god-people would return the favor.

and for anyone to assume there is, is extremely close minded.

my little sisters love hannah montana, and quite frankly i think she is a great little role model for them.

:sarcasm:

"Wanted--for sedition, criminal anarchy, vagrancy, and conspiring to overthrow the established government. Dresses poorly. 'Said' to be a carpenter by trade, ill-nourished, has visionary ideas, associates with common working people the unemployed and bums. Alien...believed to be a Jew. Alias: 'Prince of peace, son of man, light of the world.' Professional agitator, red beard, marks on hands and feet the result of injuries inflicted by an angry mob led by respectable citizens and legal authorities."



"respectable citizens" ...ugh. Funny though.

It saddens me how the fake church/right wing has so effectively smeared the message of the Great Spirit. People see those assholes wrap themselves in the flag and bible as a vehicle of coercion/domination and think that's all it represents. My beliefs lean toward Gnosticism due to this, and a Catholic upbringing that allowed for many early lessons in hypocrisy.


===============================

After Forever, by Black Sabbath

Have you ever thought about your soul - can it be saved?
Or perhaps you think that when you're dead you just stay in your grave
Is god just a thought within your head or is he a part of you?
Is christ just a name that you read in a book when you were in school?

When you think about death do you lose your breath or
Do you keep your cool?
Would you like to see the pope on the end of a rope
Do you think he's a fool?
Well I've seen the truth, yes I've seen the light and I've changed my ways
And I'll be prepared when you're lonely and scared at the end of our days

Could it be you're afraid of what your friends might say
If they knew you believe in god above?
They should realize before they criticize
That god is the only way to love

Is your mind so small that you have to fall
In with the pack wherever they run?
Will you still sneer when death is near
And say they may as well worship the sun?

I think it was true it was people like you that crucified Christ
I think it is sad the opinion you had was the only one voiced
Will you be so sure when your day is near, say you don't believe?
You had the chance but you turned it down, now you cant retrieve

Perhaps you'll think before you say that god is dead and gone
Open your eyes, just realize that he is the one
The only one who can save you now from all this sin and hate
Or will you still jeer at all you hear?
Yes! I think it's too late

That makes me want to puke.

I love it when self absorbed, over-paid kids do everything for Jesus.

"Happy Easter, by the way. He died for our sins. That's how awesome he is."

:shrug:

That's how awesome I am.

What about that Dolly Parton on American Idol with her Jesus and Gravity number. Afterwords she was just yacking on and on and you could tell everyone wanted her to just stop already. She seemed to be flying high on some drug, every single Idol singers were just "great, fabulos, wonderful, talented, etc." I for one would never set foot in Dollywood.

Everyone get on the Jesus bandwagon now. Sometimes you gotta think these people are just faking it for points or popularity since it's hip to dig Jesus. Not that I'm an atheist, but geez..it gets to be too much syrup.

Don't mess with Dolly! She's one of the only christians I know who walks the walk! She loves EVERYONE! Plus, the original version of "I Will Always Love You" is 10 times better than that overwrought Whitney Houston nightmare. Hah!

And I certainly believe she is a beliver, but it just got on my nerves.

Just as long as we're clear that Dolly's great. Otherwise, there'll be trouble!

:toast:

Her nephew was my best friend in High School, so I had the opportunity to get to know most of the family.

She is one of the most genuine, beautiful, and truly Honorable people I have ever had the pleasure to meet.

so give him a good show. Well, at least try your best anyway.

fuck'en nutters.:puke:

:rofl:

How retarded are these people?

So in a few years she will be in full control of all that money. Lets see if she uses her wealth to help others or to just get high and date famous guys and generally follow in the footsteps of most of the rest of the young, famous and wealthy people. If she turns out like most of the rest the words about Jesus will ring pretty hollow.

:patriot: