Is DU tolerant?

I don't mean of conservatives or republicans. I'm not talking about politics. Is DU tolerant of non-conventional or non-politically correct opinions? Progressives are, by nature, tolerant. Its what differentiates us from conservatives, who don't tolerate anything that doesn't conform to their narrow, backward view of the world.

However, I can't count how many times i've seen people pounded down with "enjoying your stay?", or other threats to their progressive credentials just because they're not in lock step with the conventional DU opinion on matters that have nothing to do with politics.

Therefore, I would say no. Am I alone?

Tell them you believe in angels.

At least that was the case in my experience. In my short time on these boards, I've not been disappointed by disagreements (frankly, it would make pretty uninteresting reading if everyone agreed on every topic and just said, "What he said" or "I agree with her." I have been disappointed, however, at how little some posters respect a difference in opinion, ascribing a different point of view to ignorance, not being a true progessive, or having some nefarious antiprogressive motive. That being said, I'm also impressed by the number of posts that indicate lots of DUers really care about other people (which is sort of the foundation on which progressive liberalism is built).

who is working with fellow angel Tim Russert to protect Bush from impeachment.

first show you want to help yourself and I'll help you but I'm not gonna carry you kind of reply :)

Unfortunately, the extreme voices seem to set the perception.
I think most people here are pretty accepting of one-another.

I think some- sometimes, me included, vent our frustrations on situations that don't merit the kind of response they receive. Not good- not acceptable, yet not necessarily an indication of our true feelings. ???


peace~

So they're being intolerant of your intolerance. Or something like that. It gets confusing sometimes around here.

:rofl:

Bake

:hide:

I feel a little sorry for this single-digit contributor:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3364819&mesg_id=3365300

I don't agree with him or her, but the brow-beating and borderline posting rule violations being thrown in response are a little over the top.

:eyes:

As regards individuals, some are; some aren't. Obviously, you're more likely to hear from people when they're not being tolerant!

Personally, I sometimes wish there was LESS tolerance for quoting right-wing people and websites on DU; but that may be just me.

is in the eye of the beholder. Any post that does not: promote an immediate withdrawal from Iraq (as opposed to a phased process), a universal health plan (no questions asked about details), demand impeachment, trash Israel, trash corporations, trash main stream media, trash Pelosi - falls into being a troll or a "supposed" Democrats.

:)

We're human, aren't we? Besides, tolerance suggests the idea of putting up with what we don't like. Most people don't do that well.

:evilgrin:

Many times, I feel like I'm TOO progressive for this site(The number of DLCers here is surprising). Regardless, I like being able to read real news and I make good use of the ignore filter.

DU is not what it thinks it is, but I still thank Skinner for putting up with all of us and giving us a place to exchange information.

It's like a minefield - just expressing your opinion can be seen as intolerant. Like you're an atheist? If you say anything about it, you're an elitist who hates Christians. If you don't watch TV, you're an intellectual snob. If you don't drive a Hummer, you're a snotty "purist". If you don't smoke, you obviously hate all smokers.

Your every choice is interpreted by others as a comment on their choices.

But that's not a DU specific thing - it's a human thing. And if human history shows anything, it's that humans are not tolerant.

And eh - as for the "enjoying your stay" thing - usually when I see it it's in response to a very obvious troll.

If you post here on DU, you should expect that someone else will come along and post a different point of view.

That is what makes DU so interesting and addictive. I think it would be a mistake to take it personally.

However, I've noticed that when someone logically presents their position (even if it is non-conventional) then sticks around to non-emotionally debate the facts, then DU is very tolerant.

DU is not tolerant for those who jump in, post some crap without reasoning and then run away.

for lies.

I'll add I don't take bait or walk blindly into ambushes...

:eyes:

for the most part... my general rule in life and politics is don't f with me and I won't f with you.

I've seen some hostility but I've also seen some approval.

If you're used to not marching in lockstep with any particular dogma, you grow a thick skin or go home.

Progressives are by nature absolutely certain that they are right in every nuance of every belief they have, and anyone of a slightly different shading or inflection of that nuance is the most vile heretic, if not outright traitor, the world has ever produced, and must be destroyed. That's the opposite of tolerant, even if their dogmatism is about tolerance.

And yeah, me, too, on that. :)

:)

a bit of projecting and reverse psycology doesn't impress me. You generalized to turn the tables.... so much effort for a lie.

have a lot of intolerance for folks who believe in god or are religious, i have found over the last 4 months since i visited and then joined DU

This thread is nothing new -- acting as if those who post here somehow represent the intent of the board as a whole or, alternatively, that a few assholes somehow epitomize everyone.

If you look for problems, you'll find them.

That I'm not convinced that global warming (which is no doubt happening) has been influenced by man? That the earth has warmed and cooled over the millenia, and that natural cycles and the sun make up 99%+ of any change in climate? Would DU be tolerant of that alternate point of view?

(not that this IS my opinion.......... just IF it was)

I know this because, even though I am convinced the anthropogenic global warming is coming, I am similarly convinced that the current trends in temperature are not likely caused by humans. I have been screamed at and called "morally bankrupt" for saying it.

DU was quite tolerant of my point of view, but a few dickish (and fucking ignorant) DUers were a bit less than tolerant.


EDIT: There are a lot of very intelligent, insightful people here. There are also a lot of morons here.

Is that accepting and tolerant?

Very much so.

Civil discourse is always accepting and tolerant.

Global climate change is more accurate, or some say catastrophic global climate change.

Some posters get tired of posting replies like that, or may assume that someone who posts such is doing so just to bait them, and be less than civil.

Because it seems to me that many people who want to bring the "aren't progressives supposed to be tolerant" thing up often time want nothing more than acceptance for some truly egregious opinions and actions. (racism, sexism, homophobia, foisting religion on others..just for example)

and a progressive would never be "tolerant" (or accepting) of such things....

And, seriously, charges of "politically correct" do little but arouse suspicion ...a favorite of bigots is to claim that people who aren't "tolerant" of their prejudices are being "politically correct"

and, unfortunately (considering the chosen topic), another tactic of the bigot is to play the "but gee, I thought progressives were supposed to be tolerant" game

Now, I'm not saying you are guilty of any of the above...but I will say I can't even begin to count the times this particular opine has been presented at DU...just far too many times to remember them all. Though a few do stand out...

But, you're probably relatively new and aren't aware of the many, many, many, many, many, many, many (well, you get the point) times this topic has been offered up for consumption.

And, of course, my apologies for any offense caused for certainly none was intended...tolerance and all that.

For instance?

"I think we should crack down on illegal immigration because its holding down wages and hurting the American working class" (a union opinion)

"I think global warming isn't caused by man. There were trees in Greenland 1000 years ago." (a non-political opinion)

"I'm opposed to abortion" (re: Jimmy Carter, Martin Luther King Jr., David Bonior, and many other liberal democrats)

who defines egregious?

but I can repeat them again if it would help

(racism, sexism, homophobia, the foisting of religion)

People can have opinions...mind you...I said opinions....and those opinions not be based on some truly warped ideas...and then there are those opinions that are rooted in things like racism, sexism, bigotry and oppression in general... and I don't have to be tolerant of those opinions at all..especially since such opinions are against everything that makes me not a right-wing piece of shit.

Did that help?

Do you consider the opinions I used as examples based on truly warped ideas?

Fortunately, people talk long enough so as to give themselves away... and some trolls find it impossible to put the shovel down...they so want to prove their point, they give themselves away with their eagerness and the language used to justify their position

No one else has the right to make major life decisions for me. If you personally don't want to have an abortion, good - don't have one if you accidentally get pregnant. I am perfectly capable of making my own decision on the matter should I ever find myself in that situation.

And that is how I feel about guns.

Don't like them, don't have one. But if anyone tries to tell *ME* what I should or shouldn't do unless it actually and directly effects their life they've proven to be a fascist twit by definition.

There is a difference between being intolerant of other views, which is bad, and being intolerant of someone else trying to restrict your actions, which should be met with a response ranging from scorn to 'any means necessary'. Anti abortionists and gun control advocates have the right to express reasoned opinions about why those things should be considered wrong, and why an individual should not have a gun or an abortion; but should expect vitriol and active, even violent resistance when their opinions cross over into restricting the actions of others by force of the State

If we were tolerant of oppression, in all its forms, we wouldn't be so pissed off at the current administration and those who enabled it.

Social justice is not a synonym for tolerance, and many people are offended by the word tolerance itself used in that way - as if, for example, gay marriages are something to be "tolerated." (I know you don't need that explanation, Solly Mack, it's for the benefit of the OP.)

you beat me to it!
Whenever I see someone use the phrase "politically correct" a little red flag of suspicion immediately goes up in my head that says "Danger, Will Robinson! A bigot may be lurking here" -- not *always* the case, but it holds true more often than not.

Don't get hung on those labels in my reply's title (<---- in anticipation of intolerance)

This is **Democratic** Underground. Like it or not, that includes a very broad swath of the left/right spectrum. We've seen people proudly claiming to be all manner of self-identified flavor of Democrat. Anarchists come here as do communists. We get a good bit of the very bluest of the blue dogs and the yellowest of the yellow dogs. And everything in between.

There is often a chasm of difference between two people who both claim to be Democrats.

But then, common here (and I would guess on any internet discussion board) is the herd instinct. Louder is often seen as 'righter'. 'Loud' is often made "Leader" by popular acclamation. It certainly happened in the primary wars, with one loud yahoo posting some tripe abut this one or that one and all the yahoo's acolytes dutifully nominating it to the greatest page, no matter how inane. Enough of that and we get the likes of dog packs roaming DU's back alleys looking for a fight.

Then are those among us (your truly included) who don't suffer gladly what are perceived as fools, no matter their political bent. Sometimes the ire goes to real fools and sometimes it is egregious in its misdirection. Rarely are apologies forthcoming. Not as rare, but rarely admitted, is the learning that takes place from such encounters, so it ain't all bad.

Intolerance is simply the nature of the beast ...... even on a supposedly tolerant Democratic message board.

We're each, after all, merely human.

Read into my sourcing of that quote what you will...

I've only been here since last Sept, and frankly, it's usually pretty chilly, in my estimation.

I'll get the occasional friendly pm, just to say hello, and that they agree with something I said or posted ... but can't really name anyone specifically who has befriended me here, the way it usually works after one spends any amount of time at a blog/forum.

Try discussing issues such as illegal immigration and/or compliance with federal immigration laws or discuss anything that is anti-marijuana. Don't even mention the notion that perhaps the "gangsta" lifestyle culture popularized by mainstream rap/hip hop is destroying the African American youth much more so than white American youth. But, overall DU is much more tolerant than most other similar boards.

Myself, I don't really hold "tolerance" to be a virtuous position. It implies a willingness to accept every idea that comes along without analysis.

To use your global warming example -- Tolerance suggests that we should just try to get along with people who don't think there's a human influence. But if the broad consensus among climate scientists is that there is a human influence, then we should try to convince dissenters of that, not merely tolerate their ideas.

Same thing about gods. If there's no evidence for gods, then people should speak out against the belief that gods exist instead of quietly tolerating that belief.

People who constantly try to mold opinions on a democratic/left leaning site more to the center using techniques we've seen numerous times by other conservatives? Not a chance....

Also, trying to guilt folks won't work either.

:rofl:

A winner. I didn't think it would take 39 posts before I was accused of being a conservative troll, but I knew you wouldn't let me down :)

I wasn't going to accuse you of being a rule breaker ;) (I thought you were on a roll!! No need to retract!!)

there is a larger world out there. Honesty is too important to me to follow rules all the time.

So, although you managed to bait someone into snarling at you, they violated the rules in doing so.

Not there.

That is, democrats who honestly perceive themselves to represent the best ideal, that they typify a majority, and consequently take offense to those "kooky" liberals they relegate over being too "negative:" conspiracies, concern over dire global matters, find aspects of socialism/anarchism favorable, are demanding impeachment, etc

but some, not so much

and I've seen a steady downturn in tolerance and quality of posts. I seem to recall this as a much smaller community whose members I more or less recognized and knew I could have good discussions with even if -- and maybe especially if -- we disagreed.

But with growth has come problems. These days far to many duplicate threads are started. Rarely are there carefully reasoned arguments and stances. And too often someone gets jumped on harshly for what is simply an alternative opinion. I still log on and read and occasionally post, but too many times I find myself not even bothering.

Certain forums are worse than others, certain posters are worse than others. I don't actually have anyone on Ignore myself, but I frequently think I might be on a lot of Ignore lists, given how often I post something and never get a response.

was so much more open and tolerant and allowing. last ouple years du has gone the way of the right. they lack tolerance. horribly. in all ways. it seems to be indicative of the nation as a whole.

too many people too angry too often over too many things. myself included. it tends to happen, the smaller group feeds and the hatred and anger grows.... dems, du held out for a while but last couple years they to have gotten caught up in the hate and anger mode.

i can no longer seperate du from the extreme right and their anger and lack of tolerance

fortunately one thing to remember in the heat of verbal battle here is that the wisest ones aren't saying anything at all.

That's a corollary of "he who argues with idiots is an idiot".

:P

Seriously, if you have a contrarian opinion, your own tolerance will be tested.

Acceptance is a much better way of looking at things.

when you're new to the forum? Is there any point besides sitting back and watching the LIEberals and DEMONcraps become the stereotype you imagine them to be? I can't really imagine it.

And I'm not talking about any threads that confess lack of love for Carlin. I don't think we have to march lock step in our tastes. But some people are not very good at hiding their funny business.

"One of the most striking traits of the inner life of a crowd is the feeling of being persecuted, a peculiar angry sensitiveness and irritability directed against those it has once and forever nominated as enemies. These can behave in any manner, harsh or conciliatory, cold or sympathetic, severe or mild---whatever they do will be interpreted as springing from an unshakable malevolence, a premeditated intention to destroy the crowd, openly or by stealth." ~ Elias Canetti, Crowds and Power

I can tolerate any opinion just fine...I won't hurt you, kill you, or shut you up. Doesn't mean that you are not wrong and that you're opinion isn't bullshit.

NB: plenty of DUers are great people. Unfortunately, the loud subset whom I like to call "lefty freepers" are so assured of their impeccable logic and reasoning on every single issue that anyone foolish enough to challenge them is condescended to in a very snide and patronizing manner. Read just about any thread on religion here; there are plenty of people who aren't content to say "I don't believe in a god because I see no evidence for one." No, they MUST harangue and browbeat YOU for persisting in your "delusion" because they are "reasonable" and therefore, since you do not believe as they do, you are not, and, being not reasonable, your beliefs are not to be accorded any respect. It's circular logic at best ("You are wrong because I am right, and I am right because I say I am") but that doesn't stop the "progressives." It's not just religion, either; there are a whole host of both political issues and cultural arguments which receive the same unthinking militancy from the same group of self-righteous locksteppers.

The problem isn't that people here hold passionate beliefs about issues. That is a good thing, when done properly. The problem is that too many people here possess no capability for self-reflection and no ability to turn inward and truthfully explore how good-hearted, reasonable people could arrive at a much different conclusion than they. Rather, anyone who disagrees is WRONG - and not just wrong, but stupid, hateful, irrational, a bigot, etc. Such self-righteousness closes the mind and leads to mental atrophy, because it never allows for honest self-reflection or examination of all considered points of view.

...automatically, simply because their view differs from their own. That's a trait, straight from the talk radio/right wing mainline media, that has sadly impacted the collective consciousness. It eliminates any common ground, and can serve to de-humanize others.

I am all for vehement disagreement about any topic - there are precious few things about which good, intelligent people can't stridently disagree. It's the, as you said, dehumanizing dismissals of your opponents as delusional, feeble-minded, or innately evil that destroys any possibility for discourse. No meaningful debate can occur in such a poisonous atmosphere.

written. The topic is at

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x6380979

My longer reply there (#26) comments on this.

... and a dying cause crushes dissent out of fear that its house will collapse.

We saw this in the early 90s where the GOP had a vibrant and lively debate and the Democrats were locked in stifling forced agreement... and we see this again today, only the situation is reversed. Just compare the reception of the respective parties to Kucinich and Ron Paul. Neither one could pull a large enough percentage of the vote to be a true contender, but Kucinich was treated with a LOT more respect.

Anonymous internet boards are, by definition, not very tolerant, kind, or thoughtful places when you look at individual posts.

However, DU is very well run. It has consistent rules that are applied as consistently as human endeavor can achieve. DU is a reliable site. That is saying a lot.

You mean bigoted opinions.

No, we're not tolerant of those. It's in the rules.

opinions that are not bigoted at all. In Fact have nothing to do with race gender or sexual orientation.

:rofl:

:shrug:

No, we're not "tolerant" of those.

:sarcasm:

DU is an internet forum. It consists of people posting ideas; many of them are rude people posting silly ideas rudely. If you post anything remotely controversial, you will get people being rude to you. So in that sense it's intolerant.

OTOH, the mods are generally much less likely to react hostilely than other posters, and I've never seen anyone do anything more extreme in response to a post than post a rude responce.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

and :puke:

LIBERALS are, by nature, understanding.

Not by most, but by a few.

If it hasn't been proven and replicated in a double-blind study, it doesn't exist.

and as a member of the biotech industry, I have never ever been called a nasty name.(NOT)..Health professionals are treated like SHIT in this place.....

Biotech is important - I am a believer in research. Many a broad brush has been stroked across the DU fench, no? I'm sorry to know that you too have been painted.

and cheer for a real baseball team while you are at it!

or smoking or breast feeding in public or your deep belief in Jesus.


I'd say many DUers are not tolerant of anything that doesn't conform to their specific beliefs.

Or the economic cost to the working poor of unregulated immigration.

:popcorn:

Tolerant of bigotry? Tolerant of those who would ignore the constitution or especially the individual rights outlined there? Don't have to be, shouldn't have to be.

I think it's safe to say that there's a variety of opinions on some topics. But this is Democratic Underground, so it is rather the expectation that the ideals which identify the Democratic party will be mostly shared. So yeah, if your opinions take you far out of that mainstream, you're likely to hear about it.

What matters having nothing to do with politics are you talking about?

...from posts which were of a non-political nature. I'd be interested in reading them.

Thanks in advance.

That thing got my blood a boil'n.

just kidding. The actual answer to your question is no.

It is a moderated website with rules though. I do not come here to be tolerant of conservative jargon or viewpoints. I can get that on many other forums.

I think you confuse being tolerant with being open minded.

Because I represent and agree with everything that's correct in this world.

Feel free to consult me.

I have no desire to be "tolerant" and "politically incorrect" is conservate nonsense. What does that mean "oh I tolerate your awful idiocy?" I know how wrong you are but I'm a better person than you so I smugly let it slide? Why would "intolerance" equate having "backward views"?

Listen. If folks say that they think that 'in their humble opinion and this is how they see things yada yada" but they just think that 98% of poor people are lazy and jealous of those who work hard" I will call them on their racist, ignorant, crap no matter how elegantly and inoffensively they cloud their rancid ideas. When people say things like that--ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY SAY IT POLITELY--they are smug and well-mannered enemies.

That being said if someone who I know is a little on the unaware side when it comes to gay folks and they blurt out an awkward stupid stereotype while trying to joke with one of us I try to calmly explain why the comment has a demeaning component and give them a little food for thought.

I have all the patience in the world for someone who is rough around the edges and doesn't know the 'lingo'. I have ZERO TOLERANCE for politely worded inequal crap. In other words:

in GD: "Gosh the stuff gay people have to put up with is so wrong! All those assholes are just in the closet anyway!"

That's a good-natured person whose a little confused about the reality of anti-gay violence. I will gladly take the time to try to explain why these comments are offensive in a non-angry way becasue this person wants to be an ally.

in GLBT forum: "I just want to say to everyone here that while I support your rights and I am very tolerant of you, I just think that there is something special about a relationship between a man and a woman that should be protected by law. I know that this may offend some of you, but that is just my opinion and I hope you'll respect my right to it."

No. Fuck you. I don't respect your right to discriminate against me no matter how nicely you put it. Save your sugar. You are my enemy and I will fight you to the end. Your opinions have no relevance in my world and you are the scum of the earth.

Being on the left and being a wimpy sack of shit that stands for nothing are no where near the same ball park.

:hug:

:hug:

Folks are tolerant of that. They're also pretty tolerant of going to Iran and FISA.

Tolerance (noun)

1. a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices, race, religion, nationality, etc., differ from one's own; freedom from bigotry.

2. interest in and concern for ideas, opinions, practices, etc., foreign to one's own; a liberal, undogmatic viewpoint.

This little guy, for instance, was famous for being tolerant:



In fact, when you start being intolerant, or having "zero tolerance," then things are a problem.

during WWII.

Tolerance for hate and inequality has another word for it: complicity. Intolerance is not the root of all evil. Communitarian hatreds and the economic violence--those are the roots.

Conservatives are plenty tolerant: they tolerate black people so long as they're rich, they tolerate gay people in the closet, they tolerate emails from organizations that accuse them of all kinds of things. They tolerate inequality. They tolerate injustice. The Germans tolerated camps in their midst and the French tolerated the Germans. So much tolerance! So much human sympathy!

Fuck, man, all our problems come FROM tolerance: tolerating elected officials who think FISA is worth a yea vote, tolerating the WH floating the notion of an attack on Iran. Oh we tolerate a whole lot of shit, all right.

God, I hate that sonofabitch so much!

'intolerant' of British rule.

Courage, honor, equality, solidarity, fidelity, commitment: those are all virtues. Tolerance? It's kind of in the middle of apathy and rationalization. "Mommy that science man said gay people are made of germs!" "Now, now dear, settle down, everyone has a right to their opinions. Be tolerant of others."

Thanks.

:thumbsup:

:)

The greatest strength of the democrat party is our diversity. Democrat will argue about everything under the sun. Right up until it's time to walk into the booth and vote Democrat. It seems that there are some that want to do away with our diversity to make us kool aid drinking talking points parrots. It won't happen.

Why ask when you already know the answer? Just leave. You know the rules.

I detest whiners. I detest those who insist on wasting others' time and energy with specious "arguments" and non sequitors.

I'll "tolerate" any point of view that is backed up by logic and critical thinking. I WON'T "tolerate" appeals to emotion and broad brush generalizations.

Intellectual honesty and coherent arguments are always "tolerated" on DU -- I, who am NO lockstep "liberal" -- would never had lasted on this board since 2001 were that not the case.

sw

Many individuals on the site, not so much. Disagreeing is one thing, but many here are extremely intolerant of any view that does not conform to their own. The name calling and personal attacks are startling sometimes.

..pretty much the Lockstep Brigade.

I don't come here to be bombarded by anti-democratic values. I get that crap all day at work and school. I don't understand those that seem to confuse DU with the United States. There is no such thing as "free speech" on a private message board. Further, those that hate the message board (those that compare it to Nazi Germany, etc.) are free to leave at any time.

very tolerant of different opinions. Some are though.

My wife drives a Navigator. I am also an avid shooter. I supported Hillary and now support Obama because he is the standard bearer for my party. People have taken issue with all of these things, while I care little about the choices others make as I believe their choices are their own. Such tolerance is not extended all of the time here.

:hi:

JUST KIDDING!

;-)

What the heck is that? The only consensus I find on DU is:

The Iraq war is wrong

Republicans are destroying the country

Obama is almost always right (90% of DUers seem to believe this, not 100%)

Other than that, there is no "conventional DU opinion". There are far right wing neo-con whack jobs, and then there's everyone else. DU is made up of everyone else.

You will find some very deep-seated bigotry and a frightening level of authoritarianism.

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Where the fuck did you get that idea?
Certainly not here.

mark

However it's the pompous gasbags that seem to get the most attention. Ya' know it's the squeaky wheel gettin' the grease type thing. Good calm tolerance just does not stand out like good ol' windbagish pomposity.

"Is DU tolerant ... non-politically correct opinions?

If Political Correctness is defined as (as I understand it), doing one's best to not offend another person and/or group, then it seems to me that tolerance of non-PC attitudes/positions is a tacit endorsement that that person is indeed not a Progressive.

As an aside, conventional wisdom may appear to be "lock-step", but if examined further, I'm sure you'll see the difference.

See what kind of tolerance you get.

I have said I support most of their platforms in the past. I do support most of their platforms currently. I voted for Nader in 2000. I support PETA-- and while I realize that these are some rather unpopular positions to take at DU, I stand by them and have yet to feel abused or picked on any manner (except I'll never admit to eating at Olive Garden...)


For my part, I've always found it's just as critical in how one says something as what's actually being said.

I maintain: POlitical Correctness is simply the conscious act of avoiding hurting any one person or group. When I was growing Io, it went by other names though-- 'manners', 'being polite', 'civility', but as language constantly evolves, so must I keep up to date with it too...

edited: spelling

What's your beef?

i consider myself progressive but that doesn't mean i suffer fools gladly

most consider jesus to be progressive in his concern for the poor but i notice he was intolerant of the bullshit from the money changers at the temple

we don't have to tolerate all ideas at all times, it's fine to be intolerant of stupidity, for example, i'm going to call bullshit and be intolerant of global warming denial claptrap for just one example

there are a million places on the internet for people to espouse non progressive views, to be upset that they can't have DU too is their problem